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2016 Postmortem
In reply to the discussion: The Bernie or Bust blackmail is not going to work. [View all]Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)120. Primaries and generals are two different things
One is totally controlled by party functionaries who can do all sorts of things to put their thumb on the scale.
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Sanders platform definitely ignores the last 20 years of neoliberalism, but that means its closer to
Baobab
Mar 2016
#192
If their consciences tell them to help elect Trump, I'm sorry, I can't support that.
DanTex
Mar 2016
#8
No, it isn't half a vote for Trump. It's the lack of a vote for Hillary. Nothing more, nothing less.
cherokeeprogressive
Mar 2016
#16
Mathematically, it's equivalent to half of a vote for Trump. Doing that is facilitating a Trump
DanTex
Mar 2016
#18
We'll have to see the outcome before any blame is assigned. In 2000, there is no doubt
DanTex
Mar 2016
#67
Nah, going by what you wrote, all those indenpendents who don't vote for Clinton would . . .
brush
Mar 2016
#66
Regardless of which candidate you support, this is true. For instance if Bernie were to be the
Jackie Wilson Said
Mar 2016
#51
Absolutely. If Bernie were the nominee and there was a Hillary or Bust movement,
DanTex
Mar 2016
#54
Right, and that is how liberals are. I know a liberal who hates Hillary so much
Jackie Wilson Said
Mar 2016
#61
Which is quite a lot if millions of Sanders supporters carry through with not voting
brush
Mar 2016
#58
If all of them did that, it would be a problem. Thankfully most Sanders supporters aren't idiots.
PeaceNikki
Mar 2016
#63
Well, the math is on my side. There are two outcomes, and not voting for the D is
DanTex
Mar 2016
#78
I'm saying that not voting for someone is not the same as voting for the other person.
revbones
Mar 2016
#208
Why would you vote for some third party candidate who has no chance of winning and...
CajunBlazer
Mar 2016
#146
Not voting for Hillary is not voting for Hillary. A vote for Trump is a vote for Trump.
ThePhilosopher04
Mar 2016
#118
I think if you have to ask voters to vote against their consciences for HRC to win in the GE...
aikoaiko
Mar 2016
#11
I think there is a fundamental problem with people whose consciences tell them that
DanTex
Mar 2016
#13
Agreed. LGBT rights, equal pay, healthcare and abortion rights are fucking toast
PeaceNikki
Mar 2016
#14
You don't have to. People are going to vote the way they want to and they I suppose
bkkyosemite
Mar 2016
#107
There's zero difference between Trump and Hillary. They are best of friends. Everybody knows this.
ThePhilosopher04
Mar 2016
#236
You don't want us lefties to sit out? Fine. All we ask is that you vote for Bernie.
Dynamite Dave
Mar 2016
#38
No if she had any beliefs, she'd make concessions and amplify those beliefs to win over voters
Armstead
Mar 2016
#135
I guess the damning women to hell if they didn't vote for her isn't working?
VulgarPoet
Mar 2016
#245
I am not acting like the primary is over. Go lecture someone who is if that bugs you.
PeaceNikki
Mar 2016
#127
I think the Bernie or Bust tactic is done here by gop trolls and green party voters.
hrmjustin
Mar 2016
#15
Same here! I know several Bernie supporters in real life, and NONE of them ...
NurseJackie
Mar 2016
#21
Well get working on the GE then! Why are you wasting your time with BoB people?
JimDandy
Mar 2016
#161
With due respect you just got here so you are not in a position to make that judgment.
hrmjustin
Mar 2016
#44
The math is simple. Voting third party directs half as many net votes to the GOP
DanTex
Mar 2016
#28
I think the discrepancy comes from counting non-votes as if they were votes.
Buns_of_Fire
Mar 2016
#187
That it is. My only point is that, statistically, non-votes don't usually count one way or the other
Buns_of_Fire
Mar 2016
#198
Right, it only has an effect of (-1 or -0.5) if you are typically a (D) voter.
PeaceNikki
Mar 2016
#29
Stomp your feet, call people names or insult them as being selfish all you want.
revbones
Mar 2016
#42
And if millions of BS supporters do what you suggest, there will be millions fewer votes for . . .
brush
Mar 2016
#75
You keep twisting yourself into pretzels with the 0+0=0 formula but in actuality . . .
brush
Mar 2016
#141
Bernie joined the party 8 months ago. He should have joined years ago and he would have gotten . . .
brush
Mar 2016
#168
Don't feel sorry for me, feel sorry for Bernie as that (I) for so many years obviously hampered . .
brush
Mar 2016
#171
Why do you feel sorry for me? I had nothing to do with Bernie not having made the switch . . .
brush
Mar 2016
#174
I feel sorry for neither of you, and I have an engineering degree with a major in math..
CajunBlazer
Mar 2016
#189
Dan - If You Want To Vote - For A Member Of The 1% - A War Hawk - And A Corporatist - Go Ahead
cantbeserious
Mar 2016
#226
Caucusing with the dems with an (I) next to your name and being a self-avowed socialist . . .
brush
Mar 2016
#157
"Bernie or Bust" isn't going to work because "Bernie or Bust" doesn't exist
brooklynite
Mar 2016
#56
The Bernie or Bust movement seems to be very popular on DU, judging from the number of
DanTex
Mar 2016
#64
Yes, it is an OP written in response to all the Bernie or Bust posts I've been seeing.
DanTex
Mar 2016
#70
Voting for 3rd party when you say you are a Democrat is selfish-esp when the SC
riversedge
Mar 2016
#126
How do you read this thread as blackmail? I'm simply pointing out that as a strategy for
DanTex
Mar 2016
#88
If you don't see it I can't explain it. It's rather like describing color to the blind.
Kalidurga
Mar 2016
#91
Umm, I didn't call Sanders' supporters bullies. I said that Bernie or Busters (which is a small
DanTex
Mar 2016
#104
It is not blackmail to refuse to vote for a candidate whose values you find repugnant.
Kalidurga
Mar 2016
#108
What I mean is the arrogant assumption that people have no other choice...
highprincipleswork
Mar 2016
#110
I agree on the parliamentary representation and much of what you say. And yet...
highprincipleswork
Mar 2016
#138
Whether I see anything wrong with what Hillary does or represents is irrelevant.
DanTex
Mar 2016
#147
Well, good luck to that, good luck to you, good luck to the "Democratic" Party...
highprincipleswork
Mar 2016
#149
Agree. I vote for the canidate whose interests most closely mirror my own.
Katashi_itto
Mar 2016
#95
It's not about "pushing the party to the left." It's about pushing America to the left. If Democrats
ThePhilosopher04
Mar 2016
#116
And Bernie or Bust is not going to push the country left. President Trump is not going to
DanTex
Mar 2016
#117
If you don't want President Trump, you need to get on board the Bernie Bus. He's our only hope.
ThePhilosopher04
Mar 2016
#233
I'm not a Clinton supporter, still hope for a Bernie miracle, and am tired of
forjusticethunders
Mar 2016
#124
Sheeeeit, There are so many Republicans that will be voting for Clinton this election,
seabeyond
Mar 2016
#151
Neither is the "You have to vote for Hillary or Trump will be president" blackmail
Doctor_J
Mar 2016
#158
That's not blackmail, it's reality. We have a winner take all two party system.
DanTex
Mar 2016
#160
If we have a President Trump, you'll only have yourself to blame. You have a choice
ThePhilosopher04
Mar 2016
#234
If people refuse to vote for Clinton the prefer what Republicans will give them.
Agnosticsherbet
Mar 2016
#166
But Clinton2 will be just as republican as Clinton1 was, so how is this helping your family?
RiverLover
Mar 2016
#238
If you believe Naderite crap, then you will be happy with what the Republicans give you.
Agnosticsherbet
Mar 2016
#242
It's a good thing you are neither an undocumented immigrant, nor a woman in a red state
DanTex
Mar 2016
#202
None of that matters if you're willing to sit by and let Trump become president.
DanTex
Mar 2016
#212
The test of leadership will occur soon, the ability of the candidates to lead their supporters
Thinkingabout
Mar 2016
#230
Then why do we see these same threads that we must vote for Hillary or the "Bernie Or Bust" won't
Katashi_itto
Mar 2016
#239
Well thats great then right for you types. Plus if she a shoe in she certainly dosent need my vote
Katashi_itto
Mar 2016
#247
Just the people that view Hillary as a corupt corporative operative who see her presidency as a slow
Katashi_itto
Mar 2016
#253
That doesn't mean I will vote for Hillary in the slightest. After all, if more people want Trump as
Katashi_itto
Mar 2016
#259