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patrice

(47,992 posts)
43. One of the biggest mistakes made about postmodernism is that it isn't as nihilistic as some people
Tue Sep 25, 2012, 11:24 PM
Sep 2012

try to make it. It's also over, btw, anyway, but one of the things that postmodernism lead to, the absurdists, pointed an accusatory finger at what was going on, in effect, shining a light on the absurdity of absolute relativism, e.g. Derrida. Personally, I refer to the observation that there are no absolutes and that statement is so true that not even it is an absolute.

The POINT of Estragon sitting there waiting for Godot is that we realize that WE ARE SITTING THERE WAITING FOR ESTRAGON WHO IS SITTING THERE WAITING FOR GODOT, i.e. that whatever it/anything "means", that isn't the thing itself; it's a construct that is supposed to be ABOUT the thing itself, which is life. AS a construct, it can be taken apart, which is what Absurdism, and most notably Waiting for Godot was an example of, i.e. taking the construct apart, but because, once you have it all apart, you notice that there's something else, you notice there's this unidentified (unidentified, because you have just deconstructed meaning) event going on.

That event is life and because it no longer has constructed meanings, not even the meaning known as "The Enlightenment", because it no longer has constructed meanings, it is free and it can be met for what it is IN ITSELF and it is in that meeting that one discovers the authentic universalities, not the constructed ones that you refer to, that is, the universalities that come from an event that we have labeled "life" itself FOR itself and for NO other reason or justification.

Personally, it is that realization that gives me a passion for science, because science is about that non-constructed event. Science is open-ended; all it has is a process. This is also one of the reasons that it is said that authentic deconstruction leads to authentic re-construction and that's the result of personal identification that is possible because it accepts no meanings, it deconstructs all acquired meanings, in order to re-construct them out of organic authenticity.

You may have seen me refer to this around here, "Don't mistake the words, any words for that matter, for what the words, any words, ONLY refer to." Think of what it all was before the words, or what it would be without the words. That's where postmodernist relativism lead us and that is a WHOLE phenomenon, not the fractured self-serving nihilism of Derrida et al.

I'm having trouble deciding what is dumber LARED Sep 2012 #1
That was exactly my thought after reading this. cbayer Sep 2012 #7
One end threatens death, the other doesn't. trotsky Sep 2012 #20
Yeah, and drug pushers aren't responsible for the crimes committed for & with their motivators. nt patrice Sep 2012 #26
That's a lovely red herring. trotsky Sep 2012 #31
Oh you're free to do so alright, but let's just call it what it is, self-aggrandizing bullshit, not patrice Sep 2012 #33
Who the hell said people couldn't believe what they want? trotsky Sep 2012 #34
Read OP you are supporting scorn & contempt for those who think/believe differently from you.nt patrice Sep 2012 #36
So? trotsky Sep 2012 #38
You are the one who equated having religious ideas with murder. OP lumped all religion together & patrice Sep 2012 #40
I did no such thing. trotsky Sep 2012 #49
OP advocates contempt for religion & you equate the religious with murderers. nt patrice Sep 2012 #37
No, cbayer equated that author with people who want to murder others for blasphemy. trotsky Sep 2012 #39
Perhaps I mis-understood. What does #20 mean? patrice Sep 2012 #42
cbayer is equating the "extremism" of a person who says blasphemy is to be encouraged... trotsky Sep 2012 #48
So then, is strong criticism of radical atheism a form of pseudo-blasphemy? nt humblebum Sep 2012 #64
See post 5. And while you're at it... 2ndAmForComputers Sep 2012 #9
Not sure I understand your point. but there is a world of difference between LARED Sep 2012 #12
"SUPPOSED" right? 2ndAmForComputers Sep 2012 #17
I was not addressing the aforementioned right. LARED Sep 2012 #71
You applied an adjective to a noun, but were not addressing the noun. Uh-huh. 2ndAmForComputers Sep 2012 #76
You don't believe me? LARED Sep 2012 #78
You didn't answer the question. 2ndAmForComputers Sep 2012 #79
I did answer your question, that you don't like my answer is not my problem. LARED Sep 2012 #83
Still waiting for clarification on that "supposed." 2ndAmForComputers Sep 2012 #54
Still waiting. Why "supposed?" 2ndAmForComputers Sep 2012 #68
Translation of continued silence skepticscott Sep 2012 #69
Back to the ironic I see. LARED Sep 2012 #70
Back to more lame, passive-aggressive dodging, I see skepticscott Sep 2012 #72
Not passive aggressive, just pointing out the obvious. nt LARED Sep 2012 #77
Really? A Tie. edhopper Sep 2012 #16
LARED and cbayer are engaging in the same rhetorical dishonesty. trotsky Sep 2012 #19
It is triangulation, but you are are quite wrong about my position LARED Sep 2012 #46
So what other ideas do you think we should be off-limits from criticizing? trotsky Sep 2012 #47
When did I say anything was off limits to criticism? LARED Sep 2012 #53
You're just arbitrarily drawing lines then. trotsky Sep 2012 #55
No, but saying blasphemy is a "civic duty" and "moral obligation" is bigotry Fortinbras Armstrong Sep 2012 #74
Define bigotry, then demonstrate why your claim is true. n/t trotsky Sep 2012 #84
Huh? LARED Sep 2012 #82
I'm glad you were able to clear that up. trotsky Sep 2012 #85
Blasphemy is not LARED Sep 2012 #89
So is it your position that one can be bigoted against ideas? trotsky Sep 2012 #91
That's kind of mean-tempered... a geek named Bob Sep 2012 #2
Aside from this being from examiner.com (with a link to a facebook page), it poses a poor question. rug Sep 2012 #3
+1 Tiresome indeed, because it makes absolutist claims in the name of "rationalism" that rationalism patrice Sep 2012 #28
I disagree. Sort of. Blasphemy is not a duty, but it damn sure is a right. Speck Tater Sep 2012 #4
A right that's never exercised out of fear is no right. 2ndAmForComputers Sep 2012 #5
+1 freshwest Sep 2012 #6
Anti-theist jerkwaddery. The author is no better than those he condemns. cbayer Sep 2012 #8
"No better"? Really? trotsky Sep 2012 #11
So you support censorship and are an enemy of Enlightenment values? Odin2005 Sep 2012 #14
Say what? No, I just think the guy is a bigoted, elitist jerk. cbayer Sep 2012 #15
Yet he threatens no one. trotsky Sep 2012 #18
Fine, but that makes him no less of a bigot. Fortinbras Armstrong Sep 2012 #75
Respect has to be earned skepticscott Sep 2012 #80
How? trotsky Sep 2012 #86
I'm not trying to silence anyone Fortinbras Armstrong Oct 2012 #97
So you admit your "quote" isn't really a quote... trotsky Oct 2012 #107
Which part of "look in the thread title" do you have difficulty understanding Fortinbras Armstrong Oct 2012 #109
Nice personal attacks. trotsky Oct 2012 #114
I alerted the post Oregonian Oct 2012 #116
Doesn't surprise me. trotsky Oct 2012 #117
Meanwhile Oregonian Oct 2012 #118
Or as Skinner is on record as saying, "You take your chances." trotsky Oct 2012 #119
Ironic you call someone stupid Oregonian Oct 2012 #115
Isn't Mary Madelene married to James Caravelle? n/t/n (no text necessary) socialindependocrat Sep 2012 #30
I can't see where the author is advocating execution of religious believers. MineralMan Sep 2012 #21
He makes no distinction between extremists and all the other religious people in the world. cbayer Sep 2012 #22
The difference is in whether there are laws against things. MineralMan Sep 2012 #23
I wasn't commenting on the issue of blasphemy at all. cbayer Sep 2012 #24
But I was commenting on the subject of the thread. MineralMan Sep 2012 #25
I was commenting on the 6th and 7th words in the subject. cbayer Sep 2012 #27
You clearly don't understand what the word "bigot" means. trotsky Sep 2012 #32
Allowing and encouraging blasphemy might be a civic duty Oregonian Sep 2012 #10
"Respect the religious, but ridicule the religion." - ridicule goes farther than mere criticism. humblebum Sep 2012 #65
Ridicule is the only response Oregonian Oct 2012 #96
Ridiculing isn't difficult. Any bully can do that. Open, respectful and honest debate is humblebum Oct 2012 #98
It's much more difficult with someone like you Oregonian Oct 2012 #101
"refuses to recognize simple facts" - at least I can back up my facts and don't humblebum Oct 2012 #103
Nah, you just can't remember who the Founding Fathers are Oregonian Oct 2012 #111
Like I said, I can back up my facts. nt humblebum Oct 2012 #124
These pro-censorship nuts are trying to roll back the Enlightenment. Odin2005 Sep 2012 #13
My goodness, how very authoritarian of you, practically Tea Party. Censoring "pro-censorship" is patrice Sep 2012 #35
Your post makes no sense. Odin2005 Sep 2012 #41
One of the biggest mistakes made about postmodernism is that it isn't as nihilistic as some people patrice Sep 2012 #43
In short, I'm saying you don't NEED The Enlightenment to know empathy & friendliness are universal patrice Sep 2012 #44
Utter unmitigated bullshit. nt patrice Sep 2012 #29
Well, you would know. mr blur Sep 2012 #45
No. But I do get tired of games, though, and that's why I'm not playing today, but don't worry, patrice Sep 2012 #50
Of course you and your ilk skepticscott Sep 2012 #87
We have an obligation to move people out of the stone ages. on point Sep 2012 #51
Agreed it is only when there are folks willing to challenege authority gopiscrap Sep 2012 #52
Would you agree that ridicule and contempt for non-religion is just as acceptable? Thats my opinion Sep 2012 #56
False-equivalency police? Oregonian Sep 2012 #57
Exhibit 1. rug Sep 2012 #58
Care to expound? Oregonian Sep 2012 #61
Bring it on. trotsky Sep 2012 #59
Precisely Oregonian Sep 2012 #60
If you spend much time on "religion" Thats my opinion Sep 2012 #62
That's kind of a smokescreen for Oregonian Sep 2012 #63
You just will not see on"religion" anyone referring to atheism as"insanity." Thats my opinion Sep 2012 #66
No, usually what we see is people making outlandish claims like... trotsky Sep 2012 #67
What shall we converse about? Oregonian Oct 2012 #92
If you only had the slightest understanding of Biblical scholarship! Thats my opinion Oct 2012 #94
I'm well aware of the "allegorical" truths Oregonian Oct 2012 #95
It's what he does skepticscott Oct 2012 #102
Would you agree that ridicule and contempt for evolutionary science skepticscott Sep 2012 #73
You really, really need to read this article. This is no snark. Click on this link and read. 2ndAmForComputers Sep 2012 #81
Wonder if this counts as blasphemy. onager Sep 2012 #88
This can be self defeating. ZombieHorde Sep 2012 #90
In my experience Oregonian Oct 2012 #93
Your brand of radical atheism has been around for many decades. humblebum Oct 2012 #99
I don't think you know what bigotry means Oregonian Oct 2012 #100
Oh, but you're doing a such great job at teaching me what bigotry is all about. nt humblebum Oct 2012 #104
Apparently not good enough Oregonian Oct 2012 #105
Well good. Then I will attack some of your ideas and characterize them with choice humblebum Oct 2012 #106
Take your best shot, punk Oregonian Oct 2012 #110
It's not necessary to get that low to debate a point. If your arguments cannot humblebum Oct 2012 #123
VERY astute QuantumOfPeace Oct 2012 #108
It certainly doesn't help you make any kind of alliance with them. cbayer Oct 2012 #112
So sacrifice your principles, suck up to a lie, and kiss ass Oregonian Oct 2012 #113
You had better go spread the word in all the DU groups. trotsky Oct 2012 #120
I wonder how many Republicans read DU. nt ZombieHorde Oct 2012 #121
Given how much this board is quoted elsewhere, it would seem to be a lot. n/t trotsky Oct 2012 #122
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