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karynnj

(59,501 posts)
23. Absolutely agree
Wed Sep 13, 2017, 01:55 PM
Sep 2017

In fact, every election that was close, means almost anything could have made the difference.

In HRC's case, consider something not her fault at all. Had she not gotten pneumonia, there would not have been that essentially negative story (ranging from raising health concerns to images of HRC almost collapsing to taking "too long" to satisfy everyone in explaining what happened) and it likely might have caused her to prudently cut back on her personal appearnces. This was pure bad luck. Also, someone on her staff likely wrote that "basket of deplorable" line - imagine if someone had red flagged it and she did not give Trump that gift, that rallied many to Trump who might have not voted for him. (consider she was targeting women - including those married to many, who even if they were not who she meant by deplorable, saw themselves labeled thusly.)

This is not an attack on HRC. Imagine that someone in Ohio had identified that fewer voting machines allocated to Democratic strongholds a few weeks before the election and challenged it. The number of votes lost by people who had to abandon the effort to vote because they could not stand in 4 hour plus lines because of work or family is unknowable, but likely enough to move Ohio to Kerry's column. Not to mention, if the unusually patient and polite Kerry had simply said - "I just answered that, next question" - rather than saying that he just explained his votes - and that he had "voted for it before he voted against it" -- or if he had answered with his more careful response - maybe appreviated to say he voted for a version of the funding that rolled back future tax cuts for the wealthiest 2% because they were no longer affordable with the costs of the war and then made a protest vote against the Bush approved version that added the cost to the deficit and the debt. That original answer was actually quite good. We all know what happened with the second answer he gave rather than just cutting the questioner off. Not to mention, the media and many important people in the party pushed him to pick Edwards, who had received undeservedly positive press in the primaries. In teh general election, he was a prima donna, promised to do things and then didn't and essentially acted as if he would almost prefer losing 2004 and setting himself up for 2008. Kerry was said to have not been impressed with Edwards, preferring Durbin or Gephardt, both of whom would have been better advocates and had ties in the rust belt. Here, Kerry should have gone with his own gut, though the media had already set up a negative narritive that suggested that if Kerry did not pick him it was because he thought Edwards (who lost to him by far more than Bernie did to HRC) would outshine him.

With Gore, imagine if when a FL county found that the felon list had major problems - when someone found her own husband (not a felon) on the list had not just refused to use the list, but took the problem to the Clinton justice department. Now, the Clinton/Gore administration would have had to deal with this carefully, but remember that claims that it was political were easily countered. The Secretary of State was high in the Bush campaign and the governor was Jebb ... and the company that produced the list was tied to Republicans and was from Texas. I know that Gore really won -- but those lost votes, almost all of AAs were mostly for Gore. Not to mention there are many many reasons this should have been dealt with for reasons of racial justice.

Agree- the polls show it as a big dent. bettyellen Sep 2017 #1
Considering how close the election actually was the "I will say no" answer doesn't seem to be... PoliticAverse Sep 2017 #2
Absolutely agree karynnj Sep 2017 #23
Yeah the "deplorable" comment was clearly a strategic mistake (which is why she walked it back) PoliticAverse Sep 2017 #24
The difference is that Comey dramatically overhauled an election that was looking like a big win. StevieM Sep 2017 #29
Yep. nt SunSeeker Sep 2017 #3
Hillary just can't turn the page Jersey Devil Sep 2017 #4
You're certainly welcome to do what YOU need to do. oasis Sep 2017 #9
I just don't think that dwelling on why Hillary lost can be at all productive Jersey Devil Sep 2017 #10
I'm willing to wait and see what, if anything, is accomplished oasis Sep 2017 #14
So exploring the effects of sexism and racism are not productive? ismnotwasm Sep 2017 #18
Comey has exactly what to do with racism and sexism? Jersey Devil Sep 2017 #22
Seems I've been observing a different reality: JHan Sep 2017 #27
What about holding Comey accountable? yallerdawg Sep 2017 #11
Point taken Jersey Devil Sep 2017 #13
Nothing that happened in this election should be allowed to repeat! yallerdawg Sep 2017 #17
"What about holding Comey accountable?" - by doing what? (He's already been fired). n/t PoliticAverse Sep 2017 #25
"Let's move on" is NOT holding Comey accountable. yallerdawg Sep 2017 #26
Well said. Comey is reprehensible. (eom) StevieM Sep 2017 #30
Many people believe that analysis of recent history is no real help LanternWaste Sep 2017 #21
The reasons for the loss are essential to moving forward. delisen Sep 2017 #33
Wrong. Justice Sep 2017 #36
Yes.. definitely a contributor....We can't ignore the media failure too... FarPoint Sep 2017 #5
I agree. It was like a punch in the gut when Comey's letter announcing the investigation came out. Hoyt Sep 2017 #6
It actually served no purpose either... FarPoint Sep 2017 #12
Speaking of terror attacks, I am convinced Kerry would have won in 2004 if a Bin Laden video Hoyt Sep 2017 #15
I would argue that it wasn't too close. Comey completely overhauled the race with his stunt. StevieM Sep 2017 #31
There's evidence. All repugnicant 'acquaintances' sprinkleeninow Sep 2017 #34
Strange she doesn't mention decades of anti-Hillary media attacks leftstreet Sep 2017 #7
She ranked them in the correct order... NurseJackie Sep 2017 #8
I disagree somewhat.... Raster Sep 2017 #16
Yes, Comey's attack worked so well because the media had set up her emails Johonny Sep 2017 #28
She was a brittle public figure Cosmocat Sep 2017 #37
I don't agree that Comey moved the needle "just enough." I think he moved it a whole lot. StevieM Sep 2017 #41
Matt Lauer is asking her this question? tavernier Sep 2017 #19
K&R Gothmog Sep 2017 #20
It's a ridiculous question because it sets up the implication that we are debating whether or not StevieM Sep 2017 #32
Thank you! eom sprinkleeninow Sep 2017 #35
It's both Cosmocat Sep 2017 #38
I think she got a lot of air in September and October. More than enough to win the race StevieM Sep 2017 #39
I agree as well that Hillary had a big enough lead to easily win until Comey's letter andym Sep 2017 #40
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