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Response to frizzled (Reply #9)

Wed Oct 28, 2015, 05:37 PM

14. Your terf biology is full of crap, is denialism, and the real pseudoscience

[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]It has been shown repeatedly that transsexuals do indeed have transgendered brains. The most famous study being Zhou:[/font]

https://pure.knaw.nl/portal/files/515234/15106_285_swaab.pdf

[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]Further, studies of intersex children who were surgically forced into one gender as infants confirms this. Most notably, the case of David Reimer.[/font]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Reimer

[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]To claim otherwise is denialism.[/font]

As a gay man, I don't accept that "transphobia" is a useful word, or that it's comparable to homophobia. When people say "transphobia" they usually mean simple common sense skepticism. Just because a man says he is a woman doesn't make him one, and doesn't rate comparison with anti-gay hatred.


[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]It is a useful word, and just because you are gay doesn't mean you can't be a transphobe. And your skepticism is on the level of climate change skepticism....in that it is not skepticism at all, but denialism. Yes it does make them one, and not only does it compare perfectly, anti-trans hate is even more extreme. The majority of anti-LGBTQ hate crimes target the transgender.[/font]

The fact men and women are pure biological categories implies NOTHING about the way men and women can or should behave. As I said, male and female are simple facts about a person. We SHOULD be fighting stereotypes about what it means to be male and female, and as a gay man, that's intrinsically bound to ending homophobia.


[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]First off, no men and women are not pure biological categories. If you understood biology you would know they make no such claim. Rather, biology breaks things into genotype and phenotype, and knows that one can have a male genotype but a female phenotype and that there are many cases where the phenotype or genotype are abnormal. CAIS women have male genotypes and female phenotypes. De la Chapelle Men are the opposite. Transsexuals have a female phenotype with regards to that portion of their brain.

Further, science does show SLIGHT differences between the genders with regards to behavior. Men tend to have higher sex drives for instance. It only makes sense as there are differences in the brain structure of men and women. Overall, these differences are averages and there are people who vary but overall it is well understood that there are in general differences in behavior between men and women.[/font]

http://www.sexscience.org/PDFs/Gender%20Differences%20and%20Similarities%20in%20Sexuality%20Final.pdf
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/hope-relationships/201402/brain-differences-between-genders

[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]Finally, part of breaking the stereotypes against men and women includes fighting for transgender rights and acceptance. Nothing challenges those stereotypes more than men and women who want to be the other gender.[/font]

LGB activism is about expanding and re-defining concepts of gender; but transgender activism is about re-asserting and codifying traditional gender.


[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]Bullshit. Only a person who has no understanding of transgenderism thinks that. There are feminine transwomen and then there are transtomboy and butch translesbians, there are manly transmen and then there feminine transmen. For instance:[/font]

http://everydayfeminism.com/2013/04/i-will-never-straighten-out-my-wrist/

When you look at what the trans activists are saying online, it's nothing but vitriol and death threats, especially towards women. The word "TERF" is a slur. Online, nothing but thousands of the vilest kind of threats to "TERFS". To women, not to men who actually are violent to transgenders.

Come on now: let’s be real. Who’s the one inciting violence?

Never in the history of social movements has there been such public and casual calls to kill other humans as there is with Trans.


[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]You tell me:[/font]

http://www.transadvocate.com/50000-deaths_n_8926.htm
http://www.transadvocate.com/intro-to-the-sexing-the-body-is-gender-series_n_14019.htm
http://www.transadvocate.com/that-time-terfs-beat-radfems-for-protecting-a-trans-woman-from-assault_n_14382.htm
http://theterfs.com/2014/09/02/the-michigan-womyns-music-festival-the-historic-radfem-vs-terf-vs-trans-fight/


This is neurobabble and non-science. There is no science I'm aware of that proves "gender identity" has an objective existence. I am qualified in science, and I've looked into it. "Gender identity" is a supernatural claim. All the "brain studies" that get trotted out time and again simply do not prove otherwise. The brain is a flexible organ, and differences between men and women can be purely down to socialization. Moreover, gender identity disorder is diagnosed on subjective criteria.


[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]No it is not and I already showed this. You are engaging in denailism and pseudoscience.[/font]

We don't have the faintest idea in what way homosexuality, love of music, or preference for chocolate icre cream manifests in the head, and we're supposed to believe we have solid proof that "gender" exists and where it is localized in the brain, separately to biological sex? Come on, that simply isn't credible.

I find it bewildering that women fought so hard against the notion that women and men are somehow inherently different in ways that matter, who now support this claim when transgenders make it! It's just scientific sexism.


[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]Actually we do know it from studies of the brain which you are handwaving away. We also know that both these things are the result of genetics and exposure to hormones in the body during fetal development. But keep up with the RW arguments against both transpeople and gay people...it just reveals you for what you are.

It is not scientific sexism, as acknowledging that there are differences between men and women is not sexist. This is simply the reality of it, and you are trying to distort things to attack transpeople.[/font]

The John/Joan case does not prove otherwise; nothing about a single person can prove any general case, let alone a child who was sexually abused by Mengele-like psychiatrists. Mutilating a boy who then says he is not a girl does not prove that boys who claim to be female are ever female, let alone always female.


[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]Actually, there are other cases just like it, and it does prove otherwise. If I said there are no such things as birds, one needs only produce a single bird to prove one wrong. Same here, Reimer did prove that gender goes beyond socialization.

But you don't like that so you want to hand wave it away to justify your bigotry.[/font]


We are supposed to believe that Bruce Jenner who is the biological father of 6 children by 3 different wives is magically and mysteriously just like intersex people because of his special “lady brain”. This is bullshit and people know it.


[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]No, it is science. Sorry that science has gotten in the way of your hate fest.[/font]


We’re told “gender is not sex” like a mantra bereft of enlightenment. Well, what is gender? They never answer. Where did it come from? They never answer. Reality is that male/female sex dimorphism is how mammals reproduce. Define gender, I ask.


http://lmgtfy.com/?q=what+is+the+definition+of+gender%3F

[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]Your welcome!

Where does it come from? The brain.

And no, again your science sucks. There are hermaphrodites who reproduce, there are asexual beings that reproduce, and no matter how much you hate it, the world is not the black and white you want it to be.[/font]

Gender is a socially constructed hierarchy of sex based norms imposed onto bodies. There. That wasn’t difficult, was it?


[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]And gender identity is based in the brain. There. That wasn't difficult was it?[/font]

Now, it’s pretty obvious that such is absurd immaterialism. “Inner, transcendental gender essence” can’t hold under scrutiny, according to any understanding of self and subjectivity.

Transgenderists well know this.

So, to protect this essentialism, transgenderists bully anyone — women or transsexuals in particular — who know females (women) and male transwomen have differences. So that, recently, an American professor sought to ban the word female from the classroom, since it might hurt male feelings.

I kid you not: Biology is now considered offensive.


[font style="font-family:'Georgia','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=4 color=teal]Biology isn't considered offensive, your pseudo-scientific transphobia is.

I know this will get me a hide but it is worth it:

[font style="font-family:'papyrus','Baskerville Old Face','Helvetica',fantasy;" size=6 color=crimson]
  • Fuck Bigots

  • Fuck Transphobes

  • Fuck Terfs

  • Fuck Your Bigoted Apologia for Terfs and Transphobes
  • [/font]

    You should have been MIRT'd long ago.[/font]


    EDIT: Keep this my usual teal color instead of the indigo I have been using for Halloween because of all the links.

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LineLineLineReply Your terf biology is full of crap, is denialism, and the real pseudoscience
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