What a marvelous idea!! (Reply #107) - Democratic Underground

In the discussion thread: In defense of the need to post blasphemous caricatures [View all]

Fri May 8, 2015, 06:30 PM

guillaumeb (42,204 posts)

107. What a marvelous idea!!

So by mocking a religion, that mockery will lead to greater dialogue and understanding? Please!

This issue, most especially as it relates to the Pamela Geller inspired/incited crime in Texas, has nothing to do with free speech, and everything to do with incitement. And incitement is NOT protected speech. Case law is quite clear on that. Google Brandenberg v. Ohio, 395 US 444 (1969) for a short lesson in non-protected speech.

So the premise of your post is faulty. If you were talking about protected speech, which does enjoy First Amendment protection, I would agree that protected speech is lawful speech.

As to Islam and blasphemy, no reputable Muslim cleric is calling for religious law to replace the Constitution. Unless you are a Fox watcher living in Oklahoma you should be aware of that. I feel your post is thinly disguised Islam hate.

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235 replies	Author	Time	Post
In defense of the need to post blasphemous caricatures [View all]	Yorktown	May 2015	OP
Fuck her and the train she came on!	trumad	May 2015	#1
Sorry, not buying it	marym625	May 2015	#2
I don't care about her, I care about freedom.	Yorktown	May 2015	#5
I am 100% for the right for people like her to be swine that they are	marym625	May 2015	#28
For Pete's sake, forget Geller. The problem is the ban on blasphemy	Yorktown	May 2015	#32
You have too much in your post to ignore it	marym625	May 2015	#35
No, the initial confusion due to the misleading original title is fading	Yorktown	May 2015	#44
Yet you target only one religion.....	daleanime	May 2015	#43
Refer to the original text PS: no religion is blameless	Yorktown	May 2015	#46
While I personally will always take the chance to mock any religion...	Oktober	May 2015	#75
In the same way that you do not care about her	kcr	May 2015	#30
did she announce or post something to inform the attendees of her hateful event	notadmblnd	May 2015	#53
UNREC	CrawlingChaos	May 2015	#3
There's nothing about her I can see or care to defend.	babylonsister	May 2015	#4
Again, this post says: let's forget about her. She is not the issue.	Yorktown	May 2015	#6
Then change your title. nt	babylonsister	May 2015	#7
OK, in defense of blasphemous caricatures	Yorktown	May 2015	#9
You gotta right to defend haters.	99Forever	May 2015	#8
OK, OK, I'll change the title	Yorktown	May 2015	#10
Your post, your choice.	99Forever	May 2015	#13
Well, de facto, you defend the censors.	Yorktown	May 2015	#14
Hey, if that's what you wnat to believe, enjoy.	99Forever	May 2015	#49
No, no, no. There's no defense of her.	kcr	May 2015	#11
I changed the thread title, not the text	Yorktown	May 2015	#12
Okay, but the discussion has been about Pam Geller and what she did. n/t	kcr	May 2015	#18
only due to a misleading original title	Yorktown	May 2015	#20
Um. But aren't you the OP? n/t	kcr	May 2015	#21
The OP stands. The text is unchanged.	Yorktown	May 2015	#23
Ok. Then my post stands unchanged, too.	kcr	May 2015	#24
Well then, we disagree. I refuse stealth blasphemy laws.	Yorktown	May 2015	#47
Yeah, having brushed aside Geller	kcr	May 2015	#56
LOL. The "little beef I have with Islam"	Yorktown	May 2015	#58
Lets just go around insulting people and call it free speech	LeftInTX	May 2015	#15
Good idea...	Fumesucker	May 2015	#17
ideologies are not people. religious demands deserve no respect.	Yorktown	May 2015	#22
Muhammad can't be insulted. He's dead.	Coventina	May 2015	#60
If only religious types could agree with you	Yorktown	May 2015	#63
She insulted Muslims	LeftInTX	May 2015	#93
She may have insulted Muslims, but not with cartoons of Muhammad.	Coventina	May 2015	#94
In point of fact, one can. Have you ever read the Rude Pundit, e.g.?	WinkyDink	May 2015	#103
+1000	beam me up scottie	May 2015	#136
It is - we have the First Amendment right to insult people	treestar	May 2015	#204
You must respect religion or you deserve eternal torture!	Fumesucker	May 2015	#16
I hope you are not suspecting me of unbelief?	Yorktown	May 2015	#19
Emo Philips naiils it..	Fumesucker	May 2015	#25
A very 'moving' story (with a downward direction)	Yorktown	May 2015	#26
I am Catholic. When piss Jesus	840high	May 2015	#27
Exactly the point I was trying to make	Yorktown	May 2015	#33
These events do not occur in a vacuum	CrawlingChaos	May 2015	#34
The Muslims are doing their share - I don't	840high	May 2015	#39
unbelievably ignorant statement	CrawlingChaos	May 2015	#50
You must live in a cave if	840high	May 2015	#54
I know right? And have you heard???	CrawlingChaos	May 2015	#65
there is no 'muslim' anger	Yorktown	May 2015	#40
Well sure, what could they possibly have to be angry about?	CrawlingChaos	May 2015	#51
Unlike what you appear to think, 1.6Bn muslims are not an homogeneous body	Yorktown	May 2015	#57
the radicals are doing a lot in many countries	samsingh	May 2015	#45
"Where in the world are Catholics being subjected to the equivalent of what is happening to Muslims?	oberliner	May 2015	#68
No pockets of anti-Christian persecution can compare to Western Imperialism	CrawlingChaos	May 2015	#70
You have no idea what you are talking about	oberliner	May 2015	#72
OMG - try harder	CrawlingChaos	May 2015	#73
No pockets of anti-Christian persecution can compare to Western Imperialism?? Really???	Yorktown	May 2015	#77
Please describe where...	CrawlingChaos	May 2015	#82
Under jihadi rule!!! n/t	Yo_Mama	May 2015	#229
Guess how many billions of Muslims have never killed anyone. nt	greyl	May 2015	#67
However, they subscribe to a faith...	Oktober	May 2015	#76
Plus the fact many muslims only know their faith second hand	Yorktown	May 2015	#79
Most Muslims don't either.	treestar	May 2015	#201
IMHO, blasphemy is not only a freedom, it is obligatory.	longship	May 2015	#29
Blasphemy is obligatory IF someone tries to stop you from doing it	Yorktown	May 2015	#36
Well, there are plenty of people trying to stop blasphemy.	longship	May 2015	#48
True, but you also need to look at the event in context.	RandySF	May 2015	#31
Forget the context, forget Geller: my point is on free speech	Yorktown	May 2015	#37
So posting offensive caricatures ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#106
Yes, absolutely	Yorktown	May 2015	#125
There is no "need" to post blasphemous caricatures.	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#38
Were the Charlie Hebdo people Pamela geller?	Yorktown	May 2015	#42
One has a right ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#52
Well, some DU'rs here support tacit blasphemy laws.	Yorktown	May 2015	#59
We, as a nation ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#61
We, as a nation ...	Yorktown	May 2015	#62
...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#64
... but no cigar	Yorktown	May 2015	#66
Yr seething about the BBC choosing to be culturally sensitive??	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#78
I am not a nationalist	Yorktown	May 2015	#83
And I am not a British citizen...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#86
Fine then, you are in denial ..	Yorktown	May 2015	#123
Has it occurred to you that the entire world isn't obsessed with drawing fucking Mohammed?	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#150
Has it occured tyo you it's a topic of the week?	Yorktown	May 2015	#153
So's Pam Geller, but you've been demanding people forget about her...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#156
LOL what a deft discussionist you are	Yorktown	May 2015	#167
So I take that as 'nope, I never posted anything condemning the sacking of that cartoonist'	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#178
Well why don't you use the N word - don't you have to in order	treestar	May 2015	#205
the N word is directed to the nature of people, religion is not	Yorktown	May 2015	#232
People who want to see it can go and find it	treestar	May 2015	#206
"Let people find it elsewhere" is a nice cover for censorship	Yorktown	May 2015	#234
It's not censorship	treestar	May 2015	#235
What a straw man	treestar	May 2015	#203
"tacit laws" means unwritten rules which are enforced by fear	Yorktown	May 2015	#233
There is no need for any US citizen to disrespect anyone's political beliefs either	oberliner	May 2015	#69
One's religious beliefs ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#71
Politics and politicians are real...	Oktober	May 2015	#80
Whether you believe that another's deity ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#95
What is wrong with mocking folks who believe in something they've never seen...	Oktober	May 2015	#96
What's wrong with NOT mocking such folks?	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#100
Just trying to move humanity beyond the dark ages...	Oktober	May 2015	#108
And mocking the religious beliefs of others ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#110
Absolutely...	Oktober	May 2015	#111
So ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#113
Different categories...	Oktober	May 2015	#114
Well, you just go ahead and do that ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#116
I doubt I will see it...	Oktober	May 2015	#121
A thousand years from now ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#122
Hey, you're pessimistic...	Oktober	May 2015	#124
Hopefully, religion will be gone in one or two millenia	Yorktown	May 2015	#129
Yeah, that'll happen. n/t	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#172
Probably, and hopefully, yes.	Yorktown	May 2015	#177
Religion has existed since the dawn of time ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#179
Cannibalism has existed since the dawn of time..	Yorktown	May 2015	#181
...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#182
You could choose to do that politely	treestar	May 2015	#208
You claimed that scientologists are inferior to other believers.	beam me up scottie	May 2015	#157
Where did I say ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#164
Most athiests I know declare them all equally "unreal".	PeaceNikki	May 2015	#166
If only that were true....	PeaceNikki	May 2015	#81
I didn't deny ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#97
It makes them fair game for criticism and mockery.	PeaceNikki	May 2015	#98
Religion is not something you fight ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#101
Oh bull. They politicize from the pulpit and fund issues and politicians to push their dogma.	PeaceNikki	May 2015	#102
Yeah, okay, whatever.	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#105
You just insulted scientolgists by saying they weren't part of a religion.	beam me up scottie	May 2015	#141
I didn't mock Scientology.	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#158
Is Mormonism "real"? Are there any other "not real" religions?	PeaceNikki	May 2015	#159
You judged all scientolgists because you met a few you didn't like.	beam me up scottie	May 2015	#161
Where did I say ...	NanceGreggs	May 2015	#162
You scolded people for mocking one religion but see nothing wrong with what you said?	beam me up scottie	May 2015	#169
If you think that's EXACTLY what Pammy Geller does you don't much much about Geller...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#163
I don't see much difference between her and other bigots.	beam me up scottie	May 2015	#168
Not every single religious person feels exactly the same	treestar	May 2015	#210
You must think I'm an idiot. As an athiest, I'm a minority. I know lots of religious people.	PeaceNikki	May 2015	#212
Your prior post did seem to apply a very broad brush	treestar	May 2015	#213
Who said anything about "refusing to speak or associate with" them"?	PeaceNikki	May 2015	#214
Well then I take that back	treestar	May 2015	#217
By the way, have you seen the laws being passed regarding reproductive choice?	PeaceNikki	May 2015	#215
Do you have to take everything at its most possible worst intent	treestar	May 2015	#218
"Nasty"? "Attack"? What the fuck?	PeaceNikki	May 2015	#220
geez I am on the same fucking side as you are	treestar	May 2015	#221
Are you completely unaware of the legislation restricting access to abortion?	PeaceNikki	May 2015	#223
Of course they read DU, PeaceNikki.	beam me up scottie	May 2015	#225
If we'd just stop being so hysterical we could see that Jesus only gives us what we can handle.	PeaceNikki	May 2015	#226
We should trust the religious to stop themselves from oppressing us.	beam me up scottie	May 2015	#227
Yes, you are right.	Yo_Mama	May 2015	#230
We are only guaranteed we will not be arrested and prosecuted for a crime	treestar	May 2015	#207
There are no blasphemy laws in the United States	treestar	May 2015	#202
you make good points	samsingh	May 2015	#41
Unrec	obnoxiousdrunk	May 2015	#55
America - the land where people NEED to draw Mohammed...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#74
Do not make a post like this ever again	oberliner	May 2015	#85
I'd make it my sig line, but it maxxed out the word limit n/t	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#87
Or what?	DisgustipatedinCA	May 2015	#117
Extremist Americans have been known to do some crazy things	oberliner	May 2015	#119
From your post, it seems like you were the person who felt incited.	DisgustipatedinCA	May 2015	#120
Yeah, I'm interested in being filled in on these consequences...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#185
The people who want to prevent speech they don't like scare me more	DisgustipatedinCA	May 2015	#222
The poster IMO was trying to make the point	treestar	May 2015	#209
I'm a failure as an American.	NuclearDem	May 2015	#88
Ever made fun of George W Bush?	oberliner	May 2015	#89
Yeah, but it's just not the same.	NuclearDem	May 2015	#90
All the time. What's that got to do with insulting minority groups? n/t	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#91
I find your attitude insulting to muslims	Yorktown	May 2015	#127
American Muslims would be offended that I see them as a minority group?	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#146
You live in dreamland	Yorktown	May 2015	#152
Yr not doing too well on the answering questions thing...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#160
Right. Perfect. Protect me then. I'm in the Moloch believing minority.	Yorktown	May 2015	#165
You do like trying to dictate what people can and can't discuss...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#171
I just try to stay on topic	Yorktown	May 2015	#175
No, you don't. Yr all over the shop...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#180
Again, you're dancing against the totem pole	Yorktown	May 2015	#184
Sorry, wrong on all counts...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#188
Nope, I'm dead on target	Yorktown	May 2015	#189
Maybe off in that dreamland place you spoke of, but not here...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#191
You are in denial or deluded	Yorktown	May 2015	#193
No I'm not. That post did NOT say you shouldn't 'mock' minorities...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#194
Do tell me what you think your post was saying	Yorktown	May 2015	#195
Click on it. Then click on the link to the post I was replying to...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#196
Crikey, you sure love going in circles. And you wrote a gem.	Yorktown	May 2015	#197
Fair lick of the lino, cobber!	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#198
1.6 billion people is NOT a minority group.	Binkie The Clown	May 2015	#128
They are a minority group in the US....	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#143
So, as an atheist, I truly AM a minorty, so	Binkie The Clown	May 2015	#145
Do you have a tendency to ask really bizarre and random questions?	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#148
Is being a minority a free pass? will you protect Moloch?	Yorktown	May 2015	#154
A free pass from what exactly?	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#155
Why are you discriminating against Moloch?	Yorktown	May 2015	#170
I'll try asking again. What do you think people are getting a 'free pass' from?	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#173
Making death threats against people not bound by their laws.	Binkie The Clown	May 2015	#190
Yr confusing me with someone else. I never said making death threats was okay...	Violet_Crumble	May 2015	#192
Religion doesn't deserve any extra respect or special rules.	Oneironaut	May 2015	#84
Damn! So many people have taken you to task here.	cbayer	May 2015	#92
There is no "need" to post such images.	Tommy_Carcetti	May 2015	#99
TWO incorrect words: "need" AND "blasphemous." There is no "need," and "blasphemous" is relative.	WinkyDink	May 2015	#104
What a marvelous idea!!	guillaumeb	May 2015	#107
What Geller did is no different than what Westboro Baptists and the KKK do.	beam me up scottie	May 2015	#133
she provoked, knowing well that violence might happen.	guillaumeb	May 2015	#138
How is her provocation any different?	beam me up scottie	May 2015	#142
So radicals threatening violence win	Yorktown	May 2015	#187
In a free society, the problem is not Geller but those who will respond with violence.	Yo_Mama	May 2015	#231
Mockery will force reform. Your attitude is patronizing of muslims.	Yorktown	May 2015	#135
calling names leads to dialogue?	guillaumeb	May 2015	#149
And you are perfectly within your rights...	99Forever	May 2015	#109
Riiiiight. And Voltaire was a stupid man.	Yorktown	May 2015	#147
News flash pal.	99Forever	May 2015	#199
How about voluntarily not mocking others' beliefs because you aren't an asshole?	6000eliot	May 2015	#112
How about recognizing there are sick fucks using religious texts to abuse women and minorities?	seveneyes	May 2015	#118
Beliefs are either right or wrong	Yorktown	May 2015	#130
Keep telling yourself that the actions of the Yahoos in Texas was non-violent in intent.	6000eliot	May 2015	#151
I still support the First Amendment. I support it for Nazis, and for Pamela Gellar.	DisgustipatedinCA	May 2015	#115
I stand with the ACLU.	beam me up scottie	May 2015	#131
The replies to this thread show clearly that some people	Binkie The Clown	May 2015	#126
Amen, brother	Yorktown	May 2015	#132
Man the parapets!	okasha	May 2015	#134
Are you mocking me?	Binkie The Clown	May 2015	#137
Don't cry, Binkie.	Yorktown	May 2015	#140
NO! Hoist the white flag of cartooning	Yorktown	May 2015	#139
Pick one: I will not mock Mohammed because...	Binkie The Clown	May 2015	#144
How is drawing Mohamed fighting this danger?	treestar	May 2015	#211
How is cowering and saying, "yes sir, Mr. Terrorist. We'll do whatever you say"	Binkie The Clown	May 2015	#216
BTW I always wanted to ask people	treestar	May 2015	#219
"You may only be as peaceful as your neighbor allows you to be."	Binkie The Clown	May 2015	#224
Imagine all the popular culture horror movies with pentagrams and covens....	Marrah_G	May 2015	#174
What do you believe in?	Yorktown	May 2015	#176
I believe in not harming others if they offend me :)	Marrah_G	May 2015	#183
You believe in not harming others if they offend you?? Shame on you.	Yorktown	May 2015	#186
I don't always blaspheme, but when I do...	aka-chmeee	May 2015	#200
WELL SAID: "Mrs Geller is the nasty knight of a just cause."	Yo_Mama	May 2015	#228

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