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The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,674 posts)
7. Interesting. And consistent with what I'd been hearing
Fri May 4, 2012, 08:05 PM
May 2012

when I was working in a major airline's training department (I'm also retired now). An awful lot of pilots don't want their kids to follow in their footsteps because being an airline pilot just isn't what it used to be. Many have had to take deep pay cuts and/or have lost their pensions, and with all the bankruptcies, mergers and reorganizations lately the stability isn't there any more.

Additionally, the cost of becoming a pilot has become incredibly high: about $200 an hour just for primary flight training in a single-engine airplane. If you go to one of the college aviation programs like ERAU or UND, you'll graduate with a crushing debt comparable to medical school, only to qualify for a job at a regional airline that pays about $20K a year to start. I know a guy who graduated from one of those programs and is making $800/month student loan payments, and will have to do so for years and years. On a regional pilot salary. And if he ends up at a major airline someday, he still won't have the kind of stability that a pilot used to have. He might be furloughed or lose seniority in a merger; he might have to commute for hours or move to an unaffordable base like JFK. And still stuck with a ginormous student loan.

So who wants to go into aviation any more? Unless you or your family has buckets of money, you probably can't afford it, so you go into another line of work where you can afford to live well and fly recreationally. Maybe the reason the email writer is seeing so many lazy, unmotivated tools is that they are the wealthy, entitled children of the 1% who are used to skating through school on Daddy's money instead of the kids who wanted so badly to be pilots that they'd wash airplanes at the FBO in exchange for flight lessons. Can't do that any more.

I don't fly any more at all myself because I can't afford it - and it's really hard to find a job as a CFI (so someone else pays for my flying) because people can't afford flying lessons at $200/hour. Half the flight schools in my area have gone out of business in the last 5 years or so.

It will be interesting to see what the new 1500-hour rule does to the industry.

Aren't most commercial pilots recruited out of the military? They can't fly or read guages? leveymg May 2012 #1
problems Slammer May 2012 #6
No, not any more. The Velveteen Ocelot May 2012 #8
No longer. trof May 2012 #9
They can't fly cross-country with just a compass, alt, speedo, map, watch and a radio frequency? leveymg May 2012 #15
trof, did you see the 60 minutes piece last night on the new Raptor? Bake May 2012 #48
No, but I've read about it. Also...Military pilots: Dying breed? trof May 2012 #49
+1 DearAbby May 2012 #17
I know a retiring military pilot Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2012 #28
point #5 Whisp May 2012 #2
Thats confidence inspiring. Ruby the Liberal May 2012 #3
Yup, you read those stories of airline crashes and the pilots are on food stamps riderinthestorm May 2012 #12
This article is too funny. peace13 May 2012 #4
I wouldn't call it 'funny'. trof May 2012 #10
wow. that pretty much explains the situation right there. $17K starting pay for a pilot? unreal. HiPointDem May 2012 #36
I'm 70 years old and I have one eye tularetom May 2012 #5
Well, I am 73 years old and still only have my learner's license. RebelOne May 2012 #18
Interesting. And consistent with what I'd been hearing The Velveteen Ocelot May 2012 #7
I'll bounce it off my beau, trof Skittles May 2012 #11
No Body Wants To Sit In a CREW Room.... rsmith6621 May 2012 #13
Probably not many people are. The working conditions suck and the pay is worse than Taco Bell. Edweird May 2012 #14
The airlines have ensured the pilot position has been downgraded to bus driver. CK_John May 2012 #16
probably before your time, but bus driver used to be a decent job as well. decent wages, HiPointDem May 2012 #37
I doubt it, I was born in 1940. nt CK_John May 2012 #43
well, then: HiPointDem May 2012 #44
I've kicked around daydreams of starting a new life as a pilot at 35 Blue_Tires May 2012 #19
Spent the last 10 years of my career flying cargo. It was heaven. trof May 2012 #42
another point to consider: Blue_Tires May 2012 #47
I can fix this with one word.... A HERETIC I AM May 2012 #20
Flight training is mega expensive. Where I took my flight training it costs $88/hr for a Cessna 152 neverforget May 2012 #21
It cost me $35/hour, wet, with instructor. The Velveteen Ocelot May 2012 #23
It's the same all over. In a paroxysm of stupid we radically shifted or entire national Egalitarian Thug May 2012 #22
I believe this is the video you are talking about eqfan592 May 2012 #29
To me as well. This video is a clip from a much longer piece. Egalitarian Thug May 2012 #41
+1 HiPointDem May 2012 #38
7. the airlines pay shit wages and suppress unions. provis99 May 2012 #24
Too expensive for too little return johnd83 May 2012 #25
And yet I keep seeing airline deregulation cited as one of Carter's pscot May 2012 #26
I know a couple of ex-airline pilots Sen. Walter Sobchak May 2012 #27
I guess that old joke is becoming less relevant these days... pinboy3niner May 2012 #30
I think your (1) pretty much says it all and can be plugged into any career classification. cherokeeprogressive May 2012 #31
It is a little different with the airlines Major Nikon May 2012 #33
I absolutely defer to your experience. Having spent 10 years in Naval Aviation cherokeeprogressive May 2012 #34
so you picked up all the slack from the slackers? why? HiPointDem May 2012 #39
I'm completely convinced that the safety record of US air carriers is almost wholly dependent... Major Nikon May 2012 #32
Excellent. A day of reckoning is at hand. Zalatix May 2012 #35
Why is having no airline industry a good thing? MrSlayer May 2012 #50
There'll be an airline industry. It will simply have to reform itself. Zalatix May 2012 #52
this thread makes me glad i don't have to fly anywhere anymore. i was already glad because HiPointDem May 2012 #40
My sister's fiance is a pilot Nikia May 2012 #45
I had a6 digit income during my last 10 years, '89-'99. trof May 2012 #46
Where do NetJets and the other executive jet services get pilots? FarCenter May 2012 #51
The same place the airlines do Major Nikon May 2012 #53
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