In the discussion thread: Quotes from the Greatest Progressive to Ever Live. [View all]
Response to Chathamization (Reply #42)
Fri Oct 3, 2014, 03:46 PM
The Magistrate (93,923 posts)
44. You Can Say Whatever You Want, Sir
Unfortunately, you do not seem to be able to support what you say.
First, it would be nice to have some support for the assertion you are basing your engagement on, namely this parenthetical " ![]() Second, your over-facile 'isn't anti-war under the wrong president' is nonsense based on a mis-reading ( were I to be in a kind mood ) or a deliberate distortion ( were I to be in my more usual mood ) of the comment you are replying to with it. This is what I wrote: "I have noticed he ( Gov. Dean ) spends very little time denouncing President Obama as a war-monger and fabricator of enemies...." It is quite possible to oppose military engagement in Iraq and Syria without claiming President Obama is a war-monger who is telling lies about the situation to have an excuse to go to war. It would be possible for even Mr. Greenwald to do this, were he a person of different character and temper. But he seems to have an inability to express or hold any view without descending to vitriol and hyperbole, and in short order coming to treat his exaggerations for effect as statements of fact. I did not bother to comment much on his rantings when Bush was in office, but I considered him an embarrassment, and someone who was of no help at all in any project to move the mood of the public in regard to the policies in Iraq. To say he preached to the choir only would be to greatly over-state the reach of his comments, and I suspect that, among people who did not already agree with his views who were exposed to his fulminations, a good many more were moved to contempt for him and his views than were moved to agreement and support. Mr. Greenwald's main problem is that he is against whoever is wielding government power at the moment. It is like the teenager who, asked what he is rebelling against, answers 'What have you got?' People who have any interest in seeing anything achieved, in terms of law and policy, make a great mistake if they conceive of people like Mr. Greenwald as allies because, at some moment when persons who oppose the laws and policies they desire are in office, they share for a time a target. Mr. Greenwald's target is government, though he veils this somewhat in the posture that he is attacking only corrupt and corrupting people in government. Since in his eyes virtually everyone who actually wields any power in government is corrupt or corrupting, lawless, a liar, a tyrant, in embryo if not yet in full flower, the effect is the same. The result is to inculcate a feeling in people that nothing can be done through government, which, protestations and hopes to the contrary, is to say in fact that nothing really can be done. Government is the only tool available by which people have any chance to rein in private power and achieve any degree of balance or redress in economic life. That government at present is far too much under control of private wealth and most responsive to the interests of private wealth does not change this. What Mr. Greenwald does is act as a sort of 'left auxiliary' to the right wing in this country. He works to discredit government among the young on the left, to convince them government, the people who hold office in government, are unworthy, and so cannot be used as a tool for anything that might benefit people. Without a feeling that government is there to be used, the commitment of the young to fairness, to social justice and economic equity, will be as seed fallen on rocky ground. Private economic power, the engine of inequality and iniquity, which ensures life is not and will not be fair, is the only beneficiary. I am willing to do the man the courtesy of considering him intelligent enough, and possessed of sufficient self-awareness and understanding of the world around him, to be aware of this. |
Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
![]() |
Author | Time | Post |
geek tragedy | Oct 2014 | OP | |
NYC_SKP | Oct 2014 | #1 | |
Scootaloo | Oct 2014 | #2 | |
geek tragedy | Oct 2014 | #3 | |
Scootaloo | Oct 2014 | #4 | |
Autumn | Oct 2014 | #5 | |
DisgustipatedinCA | Oct 2014 | #6 | |
geek tragedy | Oct 2014 | #10 | |
Capt. Obvious | Oct 2014 | #17 | |
Eleanors38 | Oct 2014 | #7 | |
scarletwoman | Oct 2014 | #8 | |
SidDithers | Oct 2014 | #9 | |
freshwest | Oct 2014 | #11 | |
geek tragedy | Oct 2014 | #14 | |
The Magistrate | Oct 2014 | #12 | |
stevenleser | Oct 2014 | #15 | |
The Magistrate | Oct 2014 | #23 | |
freshwest | Oct 2014 | #26 | |
stevenleser | Oct 2014 | #28 | |
freshwest | Oct 2014 | #29 | |
Chathamization | Oct 2014 | #34 | |
The Magistrate | Oct 2014 | #35 | |
Chathamization | Oct 2014 | #37 | |
The Magistrate | Oct 2014 | #38 | |
Chathamization | Oct 2014 | #42 | |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
The Magistrate | Oct 2014 | #44 |
Chathamization | Oct 2014 | #50 | |
The Magistrate | Oct 2014 | #52 | |
Chathamization | Oct 2014 | #54 | |
Capt. Obvious | Oct 2014 | #13 | |
stevenleser | Oct 2014 | #16 | |
Savannahmann | Oct 2014 | #18 | |
hootinholler | Oct 2014 | #21 | |
stevenleser | Oct 2014 | #24 | |
Savannahmann | Oct 2014 | #30 | |
stevenleser | Oct 2014 | #31 | |
DisgustipatedinCA | Oct 2014 | #32 | |
stevenleser | Oct 2014 | #33 | |
elias49 | Oct 2014 | #53 | |
hootinholler | Oct 2014 | #19 | |
Ichingcarpenter | Oct 2014 | #20 | |
hootinholler | Oct 2014 | #22 | |
randome | Oct 2014 | #25 | |
Union Scribe | Oct 2014 | #27 | |
Chathamization | Oct 2014 | #36 | |
geek tragedy | Oct 2014 | #39 | |
Capt. Obvious | Oct 2014 | #40 | |
The Magistrate | Oct 2014 | #45 | |
geek tragedy | Oct 2014 | #46 | |
The Magistrate | Oct 2014 | #47 | |
geek tragedy | Oct 2014 | #48 | |
Chathamization | Oct 2014 | #49 | |
The Magistrate | Oct 2014 | #51 | |
Chathamization | Oct 2014 | #56 | |
The Magistrate | Oct 2014 | #57 | |
NCTraveler | Oct 2014 | #41 | |
Blue_Tires | Oct 2014 | #43 | |
Cali_Democrat | Oct 2014 | #58 | |
Cali_Democrat | Oct 2014 | #55 |
Edit History
Please login to view edit histories.