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totodeinhere

(13,038 posts)
122. I would not go that far. It is not reasonable to expect the jury to understand the complicated
Mon Jul 15, 2013, 02:50 PM
Jul 2013

nuances of the law and in most cases any jury will take a judge's instructions at face value. The fault here lies with the judge and I hope that she is sanctioned for malfeasance on the bench.

WOW! is right. That omission in the instructions to the jury is criminal snappyturtle Jul 2013 #1
mis-trial? leftyohiolib Jul 2013 #9
Doesn't work that way... Pelican Jul 2013 #16
So will you be rooting for Dunn this fall? Kingofalldems Jul 2013 #23
I certainly hope... Pelican Jul 2013 #57
Is anyone here surprised by this response? Dunn's not getting justice? Wow! Anansi1171 Jul 2013 #177
There ya go... Pelican Jul 2013 #184
Yup, that's why now that we have confirmation that OJ killed Nicole, he can't be retried tavalon Jul 2013 #174
How do we have confirmation that OJ killed Nicole? loudsue Jul 2013 #235
Last month Kaeto Kailen tavalon Jul 2013 #247
Nope. A verdict of "Not Guilty" ends the matter. GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #17
There have been cases legally reopedn and retried Blackford Jul 2013 #45
Yeah, didn't Bernhard Goetz get convicted on his third trial? nt freedom fighter jh Jul 2013 #191
Goetz had one criminal trial. nsd Jul 2013 #249
They could bring you up on a different set of charges. caseymoz Jul 2013 #207
Good thought donnasgirl Jul 2013 #39
The only way a mistrial can be declared is if there is found to be jury misconduct... Spazito Jul 2013 #47
What about this route? Half-Century Man Jul 2013 #87
Won't work ExCop-LawStudent Jul 2013 #96
Too damn bad. Half-Century Man Jul 2013 #103
You can try anything ExCop-LawStudent Jul 2013 #130
He can be tried in a civil court, and he can't take the Fifth. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #196
The Judge's ruling would not be considered judicial misconduct... Spazito Jul 2013 #108
Thanks for the skinny Half-Century Man Jul 2013 #166
You're welcome! n/t Spazito Jul 2013 #167
No, but if the judge committed gross malfeasance she can be totodeinhere Jul 2013 #118
Yes, the instructions required the jury to be mind readers to come up with a "guilty" verdict Warpy Jul 2013 #170
How would the mistrial thing-ee be declared? truedelphi Jul 2013 #251
No, once acquitted, it isn't reversible. X_Digger Jul 2013 #252
Because the judge didn't tell them the legal standard for self defense Warpy Jul 2013 #254
Jimmy's daddy was not a judge naaman fletcher Jul 2013 #253
"That omission in the instructions to the jury is criminal" bvar22 Jul 2013 #206
I wonder if that could be considered a reversible error. 11 Bravo Jul 2013 #2
No naaman fletcher Jul 2013 #5
OJ knows that too PatrynXX Jul 2013 #109
Even if it were anomiep Jul 2013 #61
The judge was in the tank for the prosecution. rl6214 Jul 2013 #3
Which is why the defense won. COLGATE4 Jul 2013 #11
You mispelled "defense" -eom gcomeau Jul 2013 #27
When people donnasgirl Jul 2013 #58
Whoosh... see post 71. -eom gcomeau Jul 2013 #72
My head donnasgirl Jul 2013 #90
I am so sorry for your loss. premium Jul 2013 #100
Thank you donnasgirl Jul 2013 #113
So sorry vankuria Jul 2013 #149
You replied to the wrong post, premium Jul 2013 #151
Oops! vankuria Jul 2013 #211
I'm so sorry about your dog CitizenLeft Jul 2013 #102
Thank you donnasgirl Jul 2013 #114
That's the worst thing about dogs warrant46 Jul 2013 #117
sorry for your loss sending hugs your way skeewee08 Jul 2013 #175
I am sorry for your loss Gothmog Jul 2013 #127
I'm very sorry about your pal. reusrename Jul 2013 #146
I want to thank you all donnasgirl Jul 2013 #180
So sad to hear about your loss.... People need to stop fighting with each other and start midnight Jul 2013 #197
not if colgate is English, Canadian, Australian treestar Jul 2013 #62
They spell defense... gcomeau Jul 2013 #71
eh? SammyWinstonJack Jul 2013 #82
HUH? PSzymeczek Jul 2013 #115
Please explain YarnAddict Jul 2013 #195
Florida seems to have a low conviction rate compared to other large states. JDPriestly Jul 2013 #199
And the prosecution was in the tank for the defense. Anansi1171 Jul 2013 #178
Sounds like a mistrial to me... TheProgressive Jul 2013 #4
Nope. Zimmerman can never be tried for the same crimes again. Lochloosa Jul 2013 #8
I am well aware of double jeopardy. TheProgressive Jul 2013 #10
I'm not sure you know what mistrial means then. ag_dude Jul 2013 #31
Mistrial: A trial rendered invalid through an error in the proceedings. TheProgressive Jul 2013 #40
Post removed Post removed Jul 2013 #44
There was a time when Duers did not find it necessary to insult fellow posters. TheProgressive Jul 2013 #65
Yes, there was. Igel Jul 2013 #124
Dude, it's okay to be wrong. You can admit it. Dawgs Jul 2013 #75
Exactly - and since this trial can't be rendered invalid by that, there will be no mistrial. n/t whopis01 Jul 2013 #133
Where and how are judges held accountable? marions ghost Jul 2013 #33
The state bar can sanction her. But you are right. It is seldom done. n/t totodeinhere Jul 2013 #121
Yes, she can be sanctioned for it and I hope she is. But that won't totodeinhere Jul 2013 #119
And the problem here is that if our justice system fails us, "Street justice" will happen more... cascadiance Jul 2013 #41
I disagree and I'll tell you why. 60 years ago there never would have been a trail. Lochloosa Jul 2013 #105
+1 n/t LarryNM Jul 2013 #226
Not in Florida. Control-Z Jul 2013 #107
There is a possibility of trying him for violation of TM's civil rights. Lochloosa Jul 2013 #152
There is probably a very, very slim chance that the DoJ will file civil rights charges. premium Jul 2013 #160
Nope, trial is already over premium Jul 2013 #14
I watched the coverage of this case on MSNBC senseandsensibility Jul 2013 #6
That is so messed up! City Lights Jul 2013 #7
Here is the applicable FL statute Lurks Often Jul 2013 #12
Isn't Zimmerman's uncle a judge in Florida who works with that police dept? DonRedwood Jul 2013 #13
No. George Zimmerman’s uncle is a Deputy Sheriff in Orange County, California GreenStormCloud Jul 2013 #21
Ah! Thanks for that. I've been telling my friends that his father was truth2power Jul 2013 #76
His daddy was FarPoint Jul 2013 #208
WOW is right.... fadedrose Jul 2013 #15
I said it yesterday nadinbrzezinski Jul 2013 #18
****BINGO**** The judge ROYALLY SCREWED UP!! Not only that but they weren't allowed to even uponit7771 Jul 2013 #19
I'm telling you JustAnotherGen Jul 2013 #24
Prosecution wasn't arguing negligence Morganfleeman Jul 2013 #26
thx uponit7771 Jul 2013 #138
I read that article and it got me to thinking... Spazito Jul 2013 #20
That's not true at all naaman fletcher Jul 2013 #37
No, they did not in terms of evidence, not in terms of testimony... Spazito Jul 2013 #43
so you want them to consider non-evidence? naaman fletcher Jul 2013 #46
It was only non-evidence because the Judge ruled it inadmissible... Spazito Jul 2013 #51
I did read it, naaman fletcher Jul 2013 #55
Yes, in essence, it is. If it is not in the jury instructions on what to consider... Spazito Jul 2013 #60
Betcha JustAnotherGen Jul 2013 #22
This is news? We've been discussing that all along, with the relevant statute. X_Digger Jul 2013 #25
Correct Morganfleeman Jul 2013 #38
Well, no, in that case, it would be during the commission of a crime X_Digger Jul 2013 #56
Change the hypothetical to a simple assault onenote Jul 2013 #139
FAIL. Muggers don't ever get a free pass on killing their victims, no matter how hard they fight bac kestrel91316 Jul 2013 #98
2b is relevant, as well. pintobean Jul 2013 #50
Not to open up a can of SYG worms here, but it seems like the language about withdrawl in 2b... JVS Jul 2013 #78
Oops, I didn't see your post before I posted mine. JVS Jul 2013 #73
No worries. X_Digger Jul 2013 #83
o gawd... Whisp Jul 2013 #28
This is true? Xyzse Jul 2013 #29
Because following someone is not a provocation LittleBlue Jul 2013 #30
I would call it stalking and not following. kidgie Jul 2013 #88
The fact that you can call it stalking doesn't mean the judge can ignore the fact onenote Jul 2013 #134
Stalking someone doesn't give you legal right to beat them LittleBlue Jul 2013 #144
If someone is behaving in a menacing manner you have a right to defend yourself. reusrename Jul 2013 #157
We don't know that he behaved in a menacing manner LittleBlue Jul 2013 #159
It's always been this way. reusrename Jul 2013 #169
Following someone does not satisfy the definition of assault LittleBlue Jul 2013 #173
You've repeated exactly what I said in my post. reusrename Jul 2013 #185
The jury didn't think so LittleBlue Jul 2013 #192
Not true. reusrename Jul 2013 #194
You have a right to protect yourself. kidgie Jul 2013 #161
Zimmerman, by his own admission, also negelected to tell Martin he was neighborhood watch SirRevolutionary Jul 2013 #164
Trayvon did not know Zim was armed LittleBlue Jul 2013 #176
How is it not realistic? It is not unheard of a person trying to get the weapon out somebodies hand. kidgie Jul 2013 #181
The prosecution had a year and a half to prove. clffrdjk Jul 2013 #201
The only one person that could answer that is dead. kidgie Jul 2013 #213
I don't have any evidence clffrdjk Jul 2013 #217
The prosecution was a big failure. kidgie Jul 2013 #223
Your sentences are out of sync. Stalker and Stalkee are being confused. Tigress DEM Jul 2013 #233
This message was self-deleted by its author proverbialwisdom Jul 2013 #162
The people claiming following isn't a provocation JoeyT Jul 2013 #183
Not true Chico Man Jul 2013 #186
so if someone targeted, stalked and killed one of your loved ones Skittles Jul 2013 #202
The fact that the jury CHOSE to accept those terms means they're STOOPID. valerief Jul 2013 #32
I would not go that far. It is not reasonable to expect the jury to understand the complicated totodeinhere Jul 2013 #122
No. The buck stops with the jury. It's time we took responsibility for our criminal legislators shit valerief Jul 2013 #172
"Florida law states..." jmg257 Jul 2013 #34
That comes from the article. I haven't checked it out myself otherwise. Kablooie Jul 2013 #48
Figured that. Someone already posted this above: jmg257 Jul 2013 #63
Prosecution and Defense spent a full day arguing over the jury instructions. Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #35
No, the prosecution tried to get that in the instructions. X_Digger Jul 2013 #66
Prosecution can't require ctaylors6 Jul 2013 #68
So what you are explaining is that Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #79
What is and isn't included in jury instructions are argued by both sides. X_Digger Jul 2013 #86
Not at all ctaylors6 Jul 2013 #99
I am just really surprised that something codified Ruby the Liberal Jul 2013 #188
She also garbled on about Stand Your Ground. mzmolly Jul 2013 #36
Had nothing to do with the stand your ground statute. Morganfleeman Jul 2013 #42
SYG was used by Zimmerman at the beginning to attempt to avoid prosecution. Kablooie Jul 2013 #49
SYG law was included in the jury instructions rollin74 Jul 2013 #81
the so-called stand your ground statute Florida 776.013(3) was read word-for-word to the jury rollin74 Jul 2013 #74
Link? mzmolly Jul 2013 #135
Actual Florida Code wercal Jul 2013 #52
not sure what difference that makes hfojvt Jul 2013 #53
That would be for the Jury to decide. The fact it was decided by the judge doesn't seem appropriate. Kablooie Jul 2013 #69
The judge is ctaylors6 Jul 2013 #85
The judge was wrong John2 Jul 2013 #136
It would be for the jury to decide only if the prosecution had made an attempt to show it. onenote Jul 2013 #141
Much like many DUers will always be convinced he was ethically right to shoot an unarmed man, LanternWaste Jul 2013 #93
I don't know how John2 Jul 2013 #120
Only if you can prove that the Jets don't suck. meaculpa2011 Jul 2013 #123
This is what I've been trying to tell people. It was the judge who commanded that Liberal_Stalwart71 Jul 2013 #54
I don't think it was the prosecution's entire case. onenote Jul 2013 #147
I don't think you explained very well. The prosecution seemed to be arguing Liberal_Stalwart71 Jul 2013 #158
If that is what the prosecution was arguing then they deserved to lose the motion onenote Jul 2013 #168
Maybe they did deserved to lose, but Zimmerman deserves to be behind bars. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jul 2013 #171
Hopefully Holder/DoJ will ride into town on this horse? 99th_Monkey Jul 2013 #59
The DOJ might be able to bring civil rights violation charges or a hate crime charge. totodeinhere Jul 2013 #125
Why can't the prosecution file an appeal, to FL Supremes? 99th_Monkey Jul 2013 #132
The law does not allow the appeal of a not guilty verdict. That verdict is final totodeinhere Jul 2013 #140
Oops. nt 99th_Monkey Jul 2013 #143
After reading that link, I recall that exact moment when the Judge said that Duer 157099 Jul 2013 #64
I hope the Federal investigation will sort this out. Baitball Blogger Jul 2013 #67
Interesting, but if what she's referring to is section 776.041 of defense law, then she is making.. JVS Jul 2013 #70
Stop trying John2 Jul 2013 #91
Who is right: Burke's article, the blog she links to, or the FL website where the law is written? JVS Jul 2013 #101
I read the John2 Jul 2013 #106
You have not correctly described the standard for what it would take for Zimmerman to have been onenote Jul 2013 #150
I thought I followed the trial pretty closely... Bay Boy Jul 2013 #200
We can't know the details TorchTheWitch Jul 2013 #221
It's obvious to all ( I hope) Bay Boy Jul 2013 #237
Not according to Rachel or common sense TorchTheWitch Jul 2013 #238
Why assume that? sofa king Jul 2013 #241
That's the first I've heard of the GPS data... Bay Boy Jul 2013 #242
GPS probably cannot be shut off, either. sofa king Jul 2013 #243
It could have been lost Bay Boy Jul 2013 #244
Highly unlikely. sofa king Jul 2013 #245
Who are they protecting? Bay Boy Jul 2013 #246
They protected a judge's son. sofa king Jul 2013 #255
Oh come on... Bay Boy Jul 2013 #256
Unless he ain't. sofa king Jul 2013 #257
So you think this 'meter maid' was part of Bay Boy Jul 2013 #258
And yet everything broke his way. sofa king Jul 2013 #260
AYFKM? live love laugh Jul 2013 #77
By hook or crook, I believe that Martin was lynched. nt ladjf Jul 2013 #80
since the first sentence is a falsehood I quickly lost interest cthulu2016 Jul 2013 #84
My first thought was yellerpup Jul 2013 #89
Does anyone think that the fact that Zimmerman's dad was a judge has anything to do with this? Matariki Jul 2013 #92
I don't know how many times this has to be said, premium Jul 2013 #110
Perhaps you need to clearly define your terms then Matariki Jul 2013 #126
Here is a link. premium Jul 2013 #129
Correct. onenote Jul 2013 #154
Is anyone else disturbed by the number of DUers who claim to know enough about this case onenote Jul 2013 #153
I'm disturbed by the lack of awareness of how racism makes injustice like this possible Matariki Jul 2013 #190
I always thought something must be missing AndyA Jul 2013 #94
I think that is the bottom line. To me it does not matter glinda Jul 2013 #203
This message was self-deleted by its author BainsBane Jul 2013 #95
Are judges appointed or voted for in Florida? avebury Jul 2013 #97
It varies, but this one is in an elected position. Her term is up 2019. Long wait. n/t whopis01 Jul 2013 #142
When the rule of law is a joke... sofa king Jul 2013 #104
Post removed Post removed Jul 2013 #218
I am clearly being inflammatory above.... sofa king Jul 2013 #222
I Have Posted Elsewhere DallasNE Jul 2013 #111
Why is it so hard to picture the State wanted to let him go? Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2013 #112
^^^^^THIS Blue_Tires Jul 2013 #248
Everyone of John2 Jul 2013 #116
I'm not so sure it was entirely the judge's fault Major Nikon Jul 2013 #128
Thom Hartman is addressing this on his show right now. nt rdharma Jul 2013 #131
YES! and doing a GREAT job. syg WAS... WAS involved in the Jury instructions!! uponit7771 Jul 2013 #137
Yes he is, premium Jul 2013 #145
The feds'll put a note in her file. sofa king Jul 2013 #239
This message was self-deleted by its author Lint Head Jul 2013 #148
You seriously don't understand the law. Seriously. onenote Jul 2013 #155
No he can't. premium Jul 2013 #165
But the Dept of Justice CAN (and hopefully WILL SOON)... bvar22 Jul 2013 #209
The DoJ would then have to dispute it's own FBI investigation. premium Jul 2013 #212
Sounds like the whole case vankuria Jul 2013 #156
If this is correct, a judge in Florida needs to be disbarred. perdita9 Jul 2013 #163
That clause is misleading taken out of context... PoliticAverse Jul 2013 #179
I think we should all take heed.... defacto7 Jul 2013 #182
That is what the NRA wanted. "Street justice/citizen cops". glinda Jul 2013 #204
That is Sickening. Justice4Trayvon didn't have a chance Cha Jul 2013 #187
Can't believe this person is supposed to be a law professor. dkf Jul 2013 #189
There was something 'funny' about this whole trial. matthews Jul 2013 #193
Yes...it was "fiction" and "advertising" broadcasted on Major Networks. glinda Jul 2013 #205
This message was self-deleted by its author davidn3600 Jul 2013 #198
Agreed. If ever there was a case of provocation, this was it. geckosfeet Jul 2013 #210
I doubt that it made that much of a difference customerserviceguy Jul 2013 #214
When the judge allowed a minimal amount of weed in Trayvon's system to be introduced in indepat Jul 2013 #215
Its just the law... The Prosecution can't claim that Zimmerman's legal actions were provocation Taitertots Jul 2013 #216
CROOKED blkmusclmachine Jul 2013 #219
I'm glad someone posted this davidpdx Jul 2013 #220
Are you kidding me? truedelphi Jul 2013 #224
That trial was a sick joke. NealK Jul 2013 #225
That's really fucked up. Judge cherry picks the law for the defendant. gtar100 Jul 2013 #227
A lot of judges, they just plain suck at their job. Enthusiast Jul 2013 #228
But was that point EVER brought out by the prosecution? AngryOldDem Jul 2013 #229
Not that it will make a difference to the close minded among us, but Soundman Jul 2013 #230
Hi MichaelKelley Jul 2013 #231
It wouldn't matter anyway Gman Jul 2013 #232
HERE IS THE ACTION STEP - IMPEACH the JUDGE for violating the Code of Judicial Conduct Tigress DEM Jul 2013 #234
He? At least you should know something about the trial before posting. LisaL Jul 2013 #236
Yeah, I saw "Nelson" and I thought male. I don't watch TV. Tigress DEM Jul 2013 #250
She had me fooled apples and oranges Jul 2013 #240
Fuck Florida. Zoeisright Jul 2013 #259
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