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* 99Forever Jun 2013 #1
People praise FDR, LBJ and complain that Obama should be like these presidents... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #19
But It's Not About RobinA Jun 2013 #48
I would argue that it is not the Obama supporters who make it all about Obama the man. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #62
The buck stops in the Oval Office sulphurdunn Jun 2013 #72
Come on, the original post made it specifically about the man JayhawkSD Jun 2013 #117
That's right. It was about "the man" because the post is in DIRECT response to those Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #142
Couldn't have said it better myself. Jamaal510 Jun 2013 #139
Excellent post. nt Bobbie Jo Jun 2013 #173
Well, that's not going to happen, LS.. as far as seeing the whole picture of Cha Jun 2013 #196
Take it up with the guys who wrote this: 99Forever Jun 2013 #61
"Unreasonable" searches and seizures says to me that it's not a perfect right... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #68
Already did, more than once. Have you? 99Forever Jun 2013 #81
Actually, I have. I am very active in politics. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #97
I agree with you, thanks for expressing your point of view here & the OP Voice for Peace Jun 2013 #122
When This Started RobinA Jun 2013 #166
Amazing, isn’t it … 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2013 #195
This is a red herring. sulphurdunn Jun 2013 #64
I'm not sure which DU you're reading... Bucky Jun 2013 #82
I haven't heard it. And I've not heard any criticism of FDR either. I'm on DU daily... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #100
That's not true. caseymoz Jun 2013 #98
Actually it IS true. If I had a dollar for everytime I heard someone complain that Obama Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #99
That's not the part I was talking about. caseymoz Jun 2013 #113
your FDR claims are partisan give-aways sigmasix Jun 2013 #205
I didn't say Obama is an FDR, nor did I claim that he should be. Again, read carefully... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #212
I'm certain they would be partisan giveaways caseymoz Jun 2013 #216
So, what you're saying is that enlightenment Jun 2013 #159
No. Please read carefully. I've heard many complaints, particularly from the political left, Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #177
FDR and LBJ deserve praise & I guess I shouldn't be surprised at your citing only the negatives whathehell Jun 2013 #115
You therefore prove my point that these are good men who just happened to make bad, Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #136
I don't think so, but let's get one thing out of the way first: whathehell Jun 2013 #158
Of course every president--hell, every politician--has to deal with people who hate him. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #174
Ok, I'm glad we see eye to eye there, and I thank you whathehell Jun 2013 #184
The "hate him" charge was definitely not directed at you. I've read your posts and they are Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #193
Well, thanks so much, Liberal_Stalwart.. whathehell Jun 2013 #194
You Are Comparing RobinA Jun 2013 #169
I'm only responding to the complaints that Obama is NOT like LBJ or FDR. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #171
This message was self-deleted by its author mother earth Jun 2013 #125
I agree, and you make good points. However, I have seldom heard anyone on the left Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #134
This message was self-deleted by its author mother earth Jun 2013 #140
I wasn't born in the 60's or around then, but I do get your point. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #141
This message was self-deleted by its author mother earth Jun 2013 #144
I agree with you, but I also think we have a responsibility to hold elected officials accountable... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #152
This message was self-deleted by its author mother earth Jun 2013 #168
Yep. Yep and yep Number23 Jun 2013 #206
Then you will have no basis to complain about methods when evil again resides in the White House Fumesucker Jun 2013 #2
Maybe not. But I stand by my statement. Flame on... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #6
Oh but you will complain, bitterly Fumesucker Jun 2013 #24
You don't know me. Don't lump me into a category that you think I ought to be. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #31
I was in my twenties when Nixon was forced from office in disgrace Fumesucker Jun 2013 #105
Har, Har, Har RobinA Jun 2013 #170
Then don't elect Jeb, elect Hillary or Cory Booker or Deval Patrick or Michelle or Janet or Kathleen graham4anything Jun 2013 #11
"Hillary is a monster" -Samantha Power, Obama's designate for UN Ambassador Fumesucker Jun 2013 #25
Well, she was during the 2008 Democratic parties. When Samatha Powers called Hillary that, Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #35
During that Primay cycle, Obama employed ex gay hate preacher McClurkin as his surrogate Bluenorthwest Jun 2013 #129
this is your reasoned response? burnodo Jun 2013 #3
Deal with it. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #9
why should we "deal with it"? demwing Jun 2013 #51
I'm not the one who can't deal with criticism. I started this thread. "Deal with it" Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #65
The powers you give Obama zipplewrath Jun 2013 #4
That is not the question and you know it...eom Kolesar Jun 2013 #5
Yes it is! And you know it! n-t Logical Jun 2013 #13
No, it's the answer zipplewrath Jun 2013 #133
again, there don't have to be another Bush if voters keep Jeb out. graham4anything Jun 2013 #14
A bush by any other name zipplewrath Jun 2013 #49
The election every 4 years controls the power. The voters decide. nt. graham4anything Jun 2013 #54
No, it doesn't zipplewrath Jun 2013 #57
Yes it does. The US Supreme Court decides what is or isn't. Don't like the 5 bad ones? Why graham4anything Jun 2013 #58
Establishing the precident zipplewrath Jun 2013 #132
that's why it's a mistake to call Bush and Cheney evil Enrique Jun 2013 #7
On the contrary: I haven't defended everything Obama has done. I defend him here Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #17
if you think evil is a supernatural construct demwing Jun 2013 #59
That's your opinion. Don't call names. You don't know me or anything about me. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #71
To quote you..."deal with it" /nt demwing Jun 2013 #80
Deal with what? You're not making sense. Snarky comments don't count. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #103
Your Post #65: " 'Deal with it' means that you'll have to accept opinions demwing Jun 2013 #123
I don't have any problems whatsoever with your opinions. We agree to disagree. I'm good with that. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #137
partisan politics are not good vs. evil Enrique Jun 2013 #164
So drawing a distinction between good and evil rests in the demesne of extreme ideologues? demwing Jun 2013 #165
President Roosevelt wasn't evil, yet under a lawful program, he imprisoned SlimJimmy Jun 2013 #8
LBJ wasn't evil either and yet he gave us the Gulf of Tonkin which led to the Vietnam War (conflict) Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #12
It might be lawful, but it's very wrong. As wrong as what Roosevelt and LBJ did. SlimJimmy Jun 2013 #16
It might be wrong, but I need more facts first. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #18
We'll see. But I don't have a good feeling about this one. SlimJimmy Jun 2013 #21
We need to find a way to get Congress to repeal the Patriot Act. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #23
Rather than repeal it wholesale, I think we should look at each provision and make SlimJimmy Jun 2013 #89
If you believe that Bush is evil then you have to also believe that LBJ was evil JW2020 Jun 2013 #33
And yet, so many on the so-called Political Left, argue that Obama should be like LBJ. Go figure... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #36
Obama may suffer a similar fate zipplewrath Jun 2013 #55
Did LBJ sanction torture? ProSense Jun 2013 #63
Guess you've never heard of the Phoenix Program. JW2020 Jun 2013 #75
It wasn't a law, it ProSense Jun 2013 #60
I didn't say it was a law, I said it was *lawful*. The executive order he issued falls SlimJimmy Jun 2013 #87
The internment of the Japanese was done for economic reasons, not military necessity. OnyxCollie Jun 2013 #175
Three Obama supporters recommend this thread , and the "non donors" Kolesar Jun 2013 #10
Of course. I expected the response. We have so many Obama hate threads... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #15
Bunch of wankers multitasking at infowars and the Ron Paul forum, I expect Kolesar Jun 2013 #20
It's the defense of Ron Paul, in particular, that scares the shit out of me. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #22
the defense of Ron Paul and the love for Greenwad, who loves Ron Paul. Whisp Jun 2013 #32
You nailed it. That's the source. freshwest Jun 2013 #209
Can you guarantee that nobody involved is evil? Savannahmann Jun 2013 #26
Call your members of Congress. Demand a repeal of the Patriot Act!!! Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #38
I have. Savannahmann Jun 2013 #50
I am very politically active. In fact I work for the federal government. If anyone should be worried Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #73
Obama is irrelevant. You have to alsame Jun 2013 #27
I agree with you. Obama is irrelevant. Call members of Congress. Demand a repeal of the Patriot Act! Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #39
They passed it, they fund it to this day. Despite Rand Paul's circus, he didn't stop it. freshwest Jun 2013 #210
I don't trust ANY politician. There are some I distrust less than others. hobbit709 Jun 2013 #28
You make a good point. Politicians are politicians, but I definitely trust Obama more than most. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #40
This message was self-deleted by its author seaglass Jun 2013 #29
Thanks. I can appreciate that. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #41
It's been a while since a decent person was in the Whitehouse. Whisp Jun 2013 #30
I agree. Carter is an amazing man. A man before his time. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #42
I don't think he's evil. I think it's stupid to overuse the word evil, however cali Jun 2013 #34
The defenders have finally dropped their pretense Puzzledtraveller Jun 2013 #45
I don't trust him at all Ter Jun 2013 #37
This is not about Obama. Call members of Congress. Demand a repeal of the Patriot Act!! Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #43
Yet, you ProSense Jun 2013 #66
Yeah, and? Ter Jun 2013 #221
Evil? lol leeroysphitz Jun 2013 #44
Call your members of Congress. Demand a repeal of the Patriot Act. It's not funny. Never was. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #46
I'd like to ask you to call my members of Congress and thank them for keeping these issues Bluenorthwest Jun 2013 #167
I've done what you have suggested. For instance, I am very lucky to have two fairly progressive Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #176
Sure. I don't think Obama is evil, neither do most Democrats. Laelth Jun 2013 #47
So our failure is our poor application of circular logic. GoneFishin Jun 2013 #52
No. Your failure is ascribing supernatural powers to a human being. Your failure is failing Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #76
You don't need super powers to nominate agency heads that advocate for the people rather GoneFishin Jun 2013 #163
Yes, that is how I feel.. plus the fact that what President Obama is doing is actually legal DCBob Jun 2013 #53
Giving the Government this power does not end with Obama. You are trusting all future Presidents. dkf Jun 2013 #56
So then let's put our energy into doing something about it. First, give the president an OVERWHELMIN Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #78
Many Democrats have become part of the problem. dkf Jun 2013 #83
And that's why I emphasize that we should elect more *progressives*... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #104
It doesn't matter whether or not he is "evil". sibelian Jun 2013 #67
Agreed. That's reasonable. Let's agree, then, to stay active. Give him overwhelming majorities Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #79
I think that's an excellent idea. sibelian Jun 2013 #110
Whether Obama is evil is irrelevant. He will not be president forever. morningfog Jun 2013 #69
Agreed. And if that is so, call Congress. Demand a repeal of the Patriot Act. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #86
All that says is that you are gullible. n/t Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #70
Nah. It says that I wait for the facts before I condemn people. It says that I am reasonable. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #84
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #88
Well, I'm sorry you feel that way. What are you going to do about it? Vote Third Party? Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #95
We've been working on our solution for years and it's almost ready. Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #102
Ah the glorious revolution then. emulatorloo Jun 2013 #121
LOL! You couldn't be more wrong. Egalitarian Thug Jun 2013 #126
He won't be president forever. We must stop this. nt LaydeeBug Jun 2013 #74
What a terrible defense. Hissyspit Jun 2013 #77
Your opinion. If you care about protecting your rights, call members of Congress. Demand a repeal Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #85
Of course Obama isn't evil, He's a good man. Autumn Jun 2013 #90
No, and that's why we need a Congress who will exercise oversight and reduce these Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #145
Nobody is evil. G_j Jun 2013 #91
You give the government that type of power, ... CRH Jun 2013 #92
No, WE give government that type of power. If you want to change it, call members of Congress... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #101
A clarification about why I started this thread addressing the premise of "evil vs. good" Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #93
Can you support that assertion? Got any examples of that which you see all the time for Bluenorthwest Jun 2013 #135
I will take a while for me to search for that, but I guess I could do it if I had enough time. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #138
The way to clarify is to support your claims about others, claims you made and expanded Bluenorthwest Jun 2013 #153
What you said, what I responded to: Bluenorthwest Jun 2013 #154
Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2013 #94
Now, let's all light up lame54 Jun 2013 #96
I need it right about now. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #106
Don't let Obama catch you lame54 Jun 2013 #109
You mean, don't let his Justice Department catch me. It's not always about Obama. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #143
The crackdown has been a lot harder under this pres than the last... lame54 Jun 2013 #178
Expanding the already-largest spy program in history far beyond what Bush did DisgustipatedinCA Jun 2013 #107
See my response, #146. Demand a repeal of the Patriot Act and support Adam Schiff's bill... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #148
So, you can't possibly be duped? caseymoz Jun 2013 #108
If you're concerned, please support Adam Schiff's bill and demand that Congress Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #150
Since that's changing the subject caseymoz Jun 2013 #202
"I truly believe that the president is NOT an evil man" Great. What about the NEXT president panzerfaust Jun 2013 #111
Again, if we all care so much about this "unlimited power," then let's pressure Congress to Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #146
Obama is a prisoner of the "monster" Gman Jun 2013 #112
Then why did he go for re-Election caseymoz Jun 2013 #114
Not run and what? Gman Jun 2013 #118
So, he did it for us? So Mitt wouldn't win? caseymoz Jun 2013 #120
In a world where this is the sole issue, I guess you're right Gman Jun 2013 #181
I think I was telling you the exact thing about your view. caseymoz Jun 2013 #200
Very well could be Gman Jun 2013 #218
no only that, but the left can't say it ever got obama's back, nor that of most dem reps certainot Jun 2013 #116
Of course he's not evil. JoeyT Jun 2013 #119
I totally agree with you. Reread my OP. Thanks. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #149
OK but existentialist Jun 2013 #124
I didn't say Obama was perfect. Even if you reread my OP, I clearly state that I do not believe that Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #182
I understand existentialist Jun 2013 #189
Your argument is ridiculous - Hell Hath No Fury Jun 2013 #127
I repeated this several times: Demand that Congress repeal the Patriot Act Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #183
that's generally called a "cult of personality...." mike_c Jun 2013 #128
tssk... ForeignandDomestic Jun 2013 #130
I've addressed your snarkiness upthread. Read if you're curious for my answer. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #151
Tssk.. ForeignandDomestic Jun 2013 #160
Tssk... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #180
You're following a fallacy. OnyxCollie Jun 2013 #131
If you insist on using faith terms I'll debate in those terms...can you? Bluenorthwest Jun 2013 #147
I can't help but be surprised at Jamaal510 Jun 2013 #155
You're a bit closer to the educational system than many posting here, I suspect Jamaal. freshwest Jun 2013 #211
Haters gonna hate but I have Obama's back. hamster Jun 2013 #156
Tssk... ForeignandDomestic Jun 2013 #161
Ok.... now that was fucking funny!!! SomethingFishy Jun 2013 #172
President Obama's got this hamster Jun 2013 #188
Fine. Trust him. But do you trust the next President? Or the next? TalkingDog Jun 2013 #157
Agreed. I've explained throughout this thread. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #191
precedents and systems will be used in the future alc Jun 2013 #162
Good and evil are too simple as categories. BlueCheese Jun 2013 #179
Then, there's other things we can do. Start by supporting Adam Schiff's bill to Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #185
Part of it is drumming up public support for such a thing. BlueCheese Jun 2013 #187
It is very important for people to remember he is on our side. Rex Jun 2013 #186
Thanks. Exactly my point. We can argue that he should make better decisions... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #192
Nah. It's just that Bush was a Republican and Obama is a Democrat npk Jun 2013 #190
Yummmmy ...good Kool-aid. L0oniX Jun 2013 #197
I don't think Obama is an evil , orwellian ruler octoberlib Jun 2013 #198
Your post is well reasoned. Thank you! Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #199
How do we know the next president won't be evil... HooptieWagon Jun 2013 #201
Why in hell isn't Obama doing ANYTHING to eliminate the Bush/Cheney surveillance state laws???? Fire Walk With Me Jun 2013 #203
sorry but that is juvenile, naive, simplistic thinking. liberal_at_heart Jun 2013 #204
Your opinion. Read the entire thread for context. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #213
What get me is that some dots, in my opinion, is leading to.. Lady Freedom Returns Jun 2013 #207
And whistle blowing only works if a law has been broken. A law hasn't been broken. ;) Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #215
Yep. Lady Freedom Returns Jun 2013 #217
When someone stabs you in the back in life, you'll have noone to blame but yourself AZ Progressive Jun 2013 #208
I'll take my chances, but thanks for your concern. ;) Liberal_Stalwart71 Jun 2013 #214
How can you be so sure he's not evil? limpyhobbler Jun 2013 #219
Do you trust the next president? Fearless Jun 2013 #220
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