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Obama should rethink Buffalo Bull Mar 2013 #1
"with no police officer or civilian in danger" jberryhill Mar 2013 #67
Pearl Harbor? Buffalo Bull Mar 2013 #212
No, I am not justifying any conclusion jberryhill Mar 2013 #214
mea culpa Buffalo Bull Mar 2013 #216
Only an extraordinary circumstance MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #2
Except that Holder does tell you about three concrete examples. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #4
Are we not as a nation STILL engaged in responding to 9/11? I think we are. HereSince1628 Mar 2013 #7
But he won't be able to tell us, or a court, why it's been done MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #9
"Freedom Mist" That would be funny if it wasn't so sad n/t green for victory Mar 2013 #16
It's still kind of funny. randome Mar 2013 #119
US democracy=Freedom Mist or vice versa. SammyWinstonJack Mar 2013 #168
Exactly. ProSense Mar 2013 #13
Yes, but... jberryhill Mar 2013 #82
Who knows? G_j Mar 2013 #125
Could I ask you one question? jberryhill Mar 2013 #130
I wasn't thrilled. nt G_j Mar 2013 #139
"Wasn't"? jberryhill Mar 2013 #143
So it would not be an attack "on Americans" treestar Mar 2013 #179
and i don't recall the us government assassinating anybody at will in any of those either. HiPointDem Mar 2013 #24
And just whom does AG Holder think should/could have been so targeted in those events? WinkyDink Mar 2013 #189
Jesus Christ, why don't you and Ted Cruz go ask him? n/t Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #206
Oh, definitely, there should be a list jberryhill Mar 2013 #78
In your case, what's illegal is (or should be) subject to some sort of judicial review MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #196
No it's not jberryhill Mar 2013 #197
But the renting party can go to court and show that what they were doing was not illegal MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #198
It's worth noting that this is the same team that recently redefined "imminent attack" Marr Mar 2013 #191
absolutely GRENADE Mar 2013 #3
Yep... K & R !!! WillyT Mar 2013 #5
And HERE... Is The Actual Letter (.pdf file): WillyT Mar 2013 #11
Thank you... n/t Fire Walk With Me Mar 2013 #21
You Are Quite Welcome !!! WillyT Mar 2013 #150
"... We have a long history of using the criminal justice system to incapacitate individuals struggle4progress Mar 2013 #199
This scares the crap out of me LiberalEsto Mar 2013 #6
Fuck Rand Paul...nt SidDithers Mar 2013 #8
Yeah! The President should be free to explodify anyone he wants. MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #10
Third Party Manny strikes again...nt SidDithers Mar 2013 #12
Should Lincoln have been impeached for ordering the US army geek tragedy Mar 2013 #18
They were actively engaged in a capital criminal act. MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #23
So, how are you disagreeing with Eric Holder then? nt geek tragedy Mar 2013 #25
The President has reserved the right to kill anyone who he just kinda suspects might do something MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #42
Manny, maybe you should read the letter instead of Rand Paul's press release geek tragedy Mar 2013 #44
I did. MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #48
Here's what Holder wrote: geek tragedy Mar 2013 #141
Good! And *who* determines when "well-established law enforcement authorities" MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #142
he's stating that law enforcement *IS* the better way of dealing with it. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #144
I understand. But what's the answer to my question? nt MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #146
I don't follow you. Holder is stating that the admin has decided geek tragedy Mar 2013 #148
So terror plots will only ever be disrupted by law enforcement, working with the courts? MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #164
Holder won't be in office past January 19, 2017. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #167
"Not to excuse it, but in the context of a world war, it's somewhat more forgivable to me." ProSense Mar 2013 #20
Exactly... SidDithers Mar 2013 #32
Terra! Terra! Everywhere! Terra! MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #33
Holder's comments are nothing like the dramatic and hyperbolic spin. ProSense Mar 2013 #43
Are we at war? nt MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #52
Wait, ProSense Mar 2013 #64
Um... I thought *you* mentioned war? MannyGoldstein Mar 2013 #147
Amazing, at first glance I thought this to be parody of people like you whatchamacallit Mar 2013 #14
Fuck Rand Paul. Cha Mar 2013 #58
I agree whatchamacallit Mar 2013 #70
No, the answer is not "unacceptable".. it's perfectly reasonable Cha Mar 2013 #89
Well that's good enough for me whatchamacallit Mar 2013 #103
Made me laugh. enlightenment Mar 2013 #138
LOL, like cops only shoot people under extreme cases! Logical Mar 2013 #154
The "blind" support is strong in this one!! n-t Logical Mar 2013 #153
He's right on this issue. WinkyDink Mar 2013 #190
", he said, shaking his fist defiantly in his comfortable room in Canada. Marr Mar 2013 #192
... SidDithers Mar 2013 #193
Holder's response is entirely right on all points, and those hyperventilating geek tragedy Mar 2013 #15
"under armed attack"- missed that part. Where? n/t green for victory Mar 2013 #17
Did you miss the examples cited by Holder? 9/11 and Pearl Harbor, geek tragedy Mar 2013 #22
Well, for one, neither were caused by Americans demwing Mar 2013 #136
Shooting down the hijacked planes would have meant the US geek tragedy Mar 2013 #140
Unavoidable civilian casualties is not the issue demwing Mar 2013 #161
Unavoidable civilian casualties? That would have involved shooting a missile geek tragedy Mar 2013 #162
Look at the examples Holder gave Mutiny In Heaven Mar 2013 #35
well it's not fucking explicit either demwing Mar 2013 #134
Because that is not a do-able task jberryhill Mar 2013 #145
key words: "under armed attack". not the power that is being claimed. HiPointDem Mar 2013 #27
What power is being claimed? Did you even read the letter? nt geek tragedy Mar 2013 #31
yes. i did. and the wording is broad & misleading. HiPointDem Mar 2013 #54
You are making a factual misrepresentation. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #62
it's not *explicit* at all. HiPointDem Mar 2013 #85
Because he was answering a direct question from Rand Paul. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #87
Okay, so jberryhill Mar 2013 #88
in this context, which is the ongoing use of *preemptive* force, on the basis of secret evidence, HiPointDem Mar 2013 #105
Ah okay jberryhill Mar 2013 #109
"lethal force" is also too broad a term, because it's *targeted assassinations* that's going on. HiPointDem Mar 2013 #114
Missed the point jberryhill Mar 2013 #115
the special circumstances that holder mentions clearly *have* happened before, as he lists 3 HiPointDem Mar 2013 #123
Actually, we did try to use preemptive targeted assasination against Bin Laden jberryhill Mar 2013 #131
not targeted at bin laden, but at supposed 'terrorist bases' in afghanistan and sudan. HiPointDem Mar 2013 #172
Blame Rand Paul for the use of the term "lethal force." nt geek tragedy Mar 2013 #170
"And so it begins..." Fire Walk With Me Mar 2013 #19
Began 200 years ago with the Whiskey Rebellion. nt geek tragedy Mar 2013 #28
i don't recall the US preemptively killing the leaders of the whiskey rebellion either. HiPointDem Mar 2013 #36
I don't recall this letter claiming the authority to do that. I've read it--have you? geek tragedy Mar 2013 #39
if this letter were *not* claiming that by implication, there would be no controversy. presidents HiPointDem Mar 2013 #61
There's nothing new here. You're being trolled by Rand Paul. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #66
Fucking nailed it. "You're being trolled by Rand Paul"... SidDithers Mar 2013 #73
then it seems it's holder who's being 'trolled' by paul, not me. the wonder is that he does not HiPointDem Mar 2013 #91
Fuck it, I'm moving to a country that doesn't need to kill it's citizens to protect them. whatchamacallit Mar 2013 #26
Yeah, fuck that Abraham Lincoln! geek tragedy Mar 2013 #34
He should have had his soldiers link arms and sing Mutiny In Heaven Mar 2013 #38
We're not fighting each other aka Civil War whatchamacallit Mar 2013 #49
Ummm, who was on board those airplanes? geek tragedy Mar 2013 #55
So it's not about declaring Americans enemy combatants whatchamacallit Mar 2013 #68
If it meant saving 3000 other human beings, I would have geek tragedy Mar 2013 #72
Well whatchamacallit Mar 2013 #80
He specifically cited Pearl Harbor and 9/11. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #92
Well he was intelligent enough not to say whatchamacallit Mar 2013 #100
Yeah, I'll go ahead and stick to what he said. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #101
Please let me know when you find a country that will let me immigrate green for victory Mar 2013 #46
Adios. Cha Mar 2013 #65
why is it Rand Paul asking this? G_j Mar 2013 #29
Its good politics. napoleon_in_rags Mar 2013 #63
GOOD FUCKING GOD. woo me with science Mar 2013 #30
Nope not even close- look upthread n/t green for victory Mar 2013 #37
court jester, Gravel Democrat...nt SidDithers Mar 2013 #45
Forum tourettes syndrome? green for victory Mar 2013 #50
Oh, I'm sure you know exactly what those names mean...nt SidDithers Mar 2013 #56
You are quite sure of lots of things. n/t green for victory Mar 2013 #83
Yup. Some things I'm completely sure of...nt SidDithers Mar 2013 #86
What's wrong with being a ''Gravel Democrat''? Octafish Mar 2013 #210
Nothing wrong with being a Gravel Democrat...nt SidDithers Mar 2013 #211
Same familiar names. Same shameless "arguments." woo me with science Mar 2013 #176
Speculative outrage is the best outrage...nt SidDithers Mar 2013 #40
Knee Jerk is neck and neck. Cha Mar 2013 #60
Occupy, I hope you're paying attention. MadHound Mar 2013 #41
More fact-free bullshit. n/t ProSense Mar 2013 #47
So you're comfy with this power being in the hands of, oh, say Jeb Bush? MadHound Mar 2013 #53
First ProSense Mar 2013 #71
OK, are you comfortable with this power in the hands of any Republican in the future? MadHound Mar 2013 #77
I am ProSense Mar 2013 #84
LOL! Don't have the courage to answer the question. MadHound Mar 2013 #94
Courage: I'm comfortable with all President's exercising the Constitutional powers Holder cited. ProSense Mar 2013 #98
So you're comfy with Jeb Bush, Marco Rubio, or Paul Ryan having this power? Yes or no, no dancing. MadHound Mar 2013 #104
They'll never be elected President, ProSense Mar 2013 #113
Well thank you, you finally gave a straight answer, MadHound Mar 2013 #121
Like I said ProSense Mar 2013 #124
Like I said, MadHound Mar 2013 #129
Clearly ProSense Mar 2013 #132
Oh, so now you're going back on your answer above, MadHound Mar 2013 #135
I'm not in favor of a Republican president being elected in the first place jberryhill Mar 2013 #137
"Every American has the right to know when their government is allowed to kill them." HiPointDem Mar 2013 #173
No republican will ever roxy1234 Mar 2013 #106
LOL, I was waiting for the White House response! n-t Logical Mar 2013 #156
LOL! ProSense Mar 2013 #158
We get it Pro, Obama is perfect, Obama never makes mistakes, Blah, Blah, Blah. n-t Logical Mar 2013 #165
No ProSense Mar 2013 #166
Please quote the language from Holder's letter you find objectionable. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #51
I'll ask you the same question I asked ProSense above, MadHound Mar 2013 #57
Yes. Every president in US history has had the power to geek tragedy Mar 2013 #59
OMG, so that's how far you'll go to defend this unConstitutional bullshit, MadHound Mar 2013 #69
You clearly ProSense Mar 2013 #76
You are making a sad spectacle of yourself trying to defend this unconstitutional act. MadHound Mar 2013 #81
You make a ProSense Mar 2013 #90
Killing a person without due process, simply on the secret orders of a President, MadHound Mar 2013 #96
That has nothing to do with Holder's point. n/t ProSense Mar 2013 #99
No, it looks like the Constitution is no longer relevant, MadHound Mar 2013 #102
Nonsense. n/t ProSense Mar 2013 #118
So, your position is that the president can never authorize the geek tragedy Mar 2013 #171
What part of due process don't you understand? MadHound Mar 2013 #177
Lincoln didn't get Congressional authorization. He relied on a 1792 statute. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #178
I just love people who rely on the intertubes to get their history lessons, MadHound Mar 2013 #180
Eric Holder's letter did not claim or assert the power to kill US citizens on US soil geek tragedy Mar 2013 #181
Took one huge step towards that, MadHound Mar 2013 #183
It didn't take any step--it just recited what everyone already agreed upon. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #184
No, it didn't prevent Obama from doing anything, or any future president for that matter, MadHound Mar 2013 #187
Do you really think if Obama was going to start murdering people on US soil geek tragedy Mar 2013 #188
What part of what Holder wrote offends your understanding geek tragedy Mar 2013 #169
Exactly what power do you mean? struggle4progress Mar 2013 #201
Enemies of the State, Beware! Octafish Mar 2013 #74
Don't worry, Octafish. From all indications, you'll never make the list. n/t Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #75
Knowing you're there to report me makes me feel so much more secure, boloboffin. Octafish Mar 2013 #93
Good Lord, if I had the power to put you on a list like that, I never would. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #97
I'd sleep better knowing that no one was above the law, including the president, boloboffin. Octafish Mar 2013 #107
You know Octafish whatchamacallit Mar 2013 #111
You have a citation for that purported quote of mine, whachamacallit? Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #117
It hurts to laugh. Octafish Mar 2013 #127
Yes. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #151
As is being pointed out here, Octafish, this power is something Presidents have always had. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #116
Hadn't noticed that. Octafish Mar 2013 #120
Inherent in the commander in chief powers, Octafish Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #149
No, the president does not have an 'inherent' power to execute American citizens at will. Octafish Mar 2013 #207
Who the fuck said "at will"? Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #208
I did. Because that's what the president does now. Octafish Mar 2013 #209
No. He does not. The idea that he does is the most despicable BS you've come up with yet. Bolo Boffin Mar 2013 #213
What a nice thing to say! And what 9/11 conspiracy theories of mine have you debunked, Bolo Boffin? Octafish Mar 2013 #215
Of course he can. Any president can. Look at what happened at Kent State University. liberal_at_heart Mar 2013 #79
did the president or governor order those shootings? no. they ordered the national guard out, HiPointDem Mar 2013 #110
Misreading? jberryhill Mar 2013 #112
Was there a "shoot" order from the president, governor, or commander of the unit -- or not? HiPointDem Mar 2013 #122
"misread something in the situation" jberryhill Mar 2013 #128
This very thread illustrates the real divide in this country green for victory Mar 2013 #95
It's been said, but... sagat Mar 2013 #108
But of course it will only be used on really, really bad people! n2doc Mar 2013 #126
This is NOT News People Benton D Struckcheon Mar 2013 #133
They should say: "This authority does not apply unless the nation is experiencing an ongoing attack" limpyhobbler Mar 2013 #152
I agree that the authority can be better defined. And have a review process in place. randome Mar 2013 #159
I don't think a review process would really be that good. limpyhobbler Mar 2013 #163
Hell, even the Inquisition went to the trouble of holding trials before executions. Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2013 #155
Nice to see Democrats propagating RAND PAUL'S rhetoric. Comrade_McKenzie Mar 2013 #157
F the lying repugs, this is a real issue with devastating consequences just1voice Mar 2013 #175
Chief Executive or Chief Executioner? Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2013 #160
Ordered assassination of Americans is A-OK with loyalists from both parties just1voice Mar 2013 #174
No, you're misreading those posts just as you're misreading the Holder letter. geek tragedy Mar 2013 #186
It's important for the government to be able to murder me Nevernose Mar 2013 #182
One Crazy Question Here.... Jasana Mar 2013 #185
agreed G_j Mar 2013 #195
the libertarians question Buffalo Bull Mar 2013 #205
This should not be allowed to fall off of the first page. Fire Walk With Me Mar 2013 #194
Im defenetly dissapointed. in most thats happening right now. darkangel218 Mar 2013 #200
Huh. That's hardly encouraging. ellie Mar 2013 #202
Kick. Ignoring it does not make it go away. woo me with science Mar 2013 #203
Unrec. Ridiculous spin doesn't make it true. FSogol Mar 2013 #204
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