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merrily

(45,251 posts)
3. It is a problem for all the reasons you stated and also for the reason that Hagel himself
Fri Jan 4, 2013, 11:35 PM
Jan 2013

stated about Hormel, namely these kinds of appointment reflect our values as a nation.

I don't buy his uber conveniently timed apology anymore than Hormel does.

As for Obama on gay issues, that has been a mixed bag, starting with statements Obama made in Rick Warren's church during the 3008 campaign, the converted gay singer, etc. It took long enough to repeal DADT; Obama came out in favor of gay marriage only after (1) a lot of pressure from his campaign donation bundlers and (2) (supposedly) Biden's slip; and DOMA is still the law of the land, even if D of J is no longer challenging it in certain circuits with horrific comparisons to incest and bestiality.

I never believed that Obama was a homophobe. I always believed it was about political caution. Each person needs to decide for himself or herself whether that, if true, would make Obama's actions and statements more acceptable or only more cynical.


Let's assume, though, just for the sake of discussion, that Obama has a perfect record on gay rights and always did. That still would not make me comfortable as to Hagel.

In general, I have not been unhappy with many of Obama's appointments, starting with Rahm, Geithner, Gates, Goolsbee, Summers, etc. , though I did approve of some of his choices to one degree or another.

As to whether Hagel is now truly penitent and would champion equal rights in the military and in the embassy, I very much doubt it. I can't recall ever seeing anything but self-serving, convenient penitence from Republican politicians on matters of this nature. And Obama has no super power that enables him to assess Hagel's heart better than anyone else can.

As to trusting Obama, Obama is President, so that is not the issue. Obama won't be sitting on the shoulder of the Defense Secretary 24/7, like the angel/conscience in one of those "angel on one shoulder, devil on the other shoulder" cartoons. So, for me, trusting Obama is far from enough for me to be comfortable with Hagel.

In all, I would much rather have someone who was not so "agressively" verbal about his belief that gays do not belong in the service of this nation or reflect his values.


Last but not least, what in hell is wrong with appointing Democrats?



kick dsc Jan 2013 #1
I trust the President's decision and he knows what the hell he is doing and it is his call to make. Purveyor Jan 2013 #2
The Senate has been given a role dsc Jan 2013 #4
Yeah. That is the only issue that is important in this day when it comes to this country's defense Purveyor Jan 2013 #7
well if we can't find dsc Jan 2013 #11
As I said previously, I trust the President's judgement on this. eom Purveyor Jan 2013 #13
I don't trust any politician's judgement and I did not support Democrats in order to put sabrina 1 Jan 2013 #15
Well then don't vote for President Obama again... lol. eom Purveyor Jan 2013 #16
If the Dem Party is going to turn into the Republican Party on issues such as gay rights sabrina 1 Jan 2013 #18
You've got it backwards--a conservative Republican is coming around to the Democratic TwilightGardener Jan 2013 #19
Politicians have a habit of apologizing when they want something and that is sabrina 1 Jan 2013 #24
No, actually, I've never heard an apology like this one from a Republican. TwilightGardener Jan 2013 #26
It is a problem for all the reasons you stated and also for the reason that Hagel himself merrily Jan 2013 #3
I agree with much of what you say dsc Jan 2013 #5
I did not perceive the OP to which I replied as making that point. merrily Jan 2013 #21
I like the nomination LittleBlue Jan 2013 #6
I would hope we could find a non homophobic war skeptic dsc Jan 2013 #12
You're okay with a homophobic Republican in a position of power like this? sabrina 1 Jan 2013 #17
Here are the two alternatives most mentioned LittleBlue Jan 2013 #37
Congress and the President make war decisions. merrily Jan 2013 #22
In 2006, here's how anti-gay Hagel was: TwilightGardener Jan 2013 #8
actually Brownback voted to confirm the ambassador in committee dsc Jan 2013 #10
Actually, Hagel must have voted for him in committee, too, according to the Wiki page TwilightGardener Jan 2013 #14
Hagel to this day is at best a mixed bag on these issues. merrily Jan 2013 #23
You likely won't find someone who ISN'T a "mixed bag" on some issues. TwilightGardener Jan 2013 #25
Sorry, "everyone has flaws" is false equivalency, at best. merrily Jan 2013 #27
Hormel accepted the apology. Obama wouldn't tarnish one of his proudest Presidential TwilightGardener Jan 2013 #31
To the contrary: Behind the Aegis Jan 2013 #32
Nobody is defending Hagel in terms of his past relationship TwilightGardener Jan 2013 #34
I didn't say they were defending Hagel, I said they were defending the recommendation. Behind the Aegis Jan 2013 #36
What in heaven's name does Bush floating a name mean? Nothing. He did not choose him. merrily Jan 2013 #39
To the contrary, Hormel said Hagel never even apologized to him directly. merrily Jan 2013 #38
if Barney Frank is appointed to Kerry's seat JI7 Jan 2013 #9
May be that he evolved when Obama did. sammy27932003 Jan 2013 #20
I don't believe either of them evolved. I believe that obama was always fine merrily Jan 2013 #28
We did not elect Obama to appoint ignorant conservatives to any post whatsoever. Zorra Jan 2013 #29
+1 I feel the "it's just one prayer" all over. Behind the Aegis Jan 2013 #30
Thank you. Why does this even need saying? merrily Jan 2013 #40
President Obama lurves appointin' him some Republicans! nt Poll_Blind Jan 2013 #33
Would be nice if he had the same love for Liberals and Progressives stultusporcos Jan 2013 #42
Well, then, Hagel is going to have to suck it up and serve cliffordu Jan 2013 #35
replace gay with muslim dsc Jan 2013 #43
Chuck Hagel can't be all bad, Blue_In_AK Jan 2013 #41
I doubt they would want Ron Paul either dsc Jan 2013 #44
The same DUers who excuse Hagel in many cases were also wailing against John McCain for Bluenorthwest Jan 2013 #45
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