General Discussion

underoath

(269 posts)

93. so its still up to the business and its workers to decide if they want to unionize, right?

Reply to erinlough (Reply #90)

Fri Dec 7, 2012, 04:35 PM

Dec 2012

this law doesn't make unions illegal, does it?

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I Am Surprised That Michigan Defeated The Pro Union Amendment. [View all] TheMastersNemesis Dec 2012 OP

Michigan politics is a little strange xoom Dec 2012 #1

It seems that way... underoath Dec 2012 #65

The anti-union propaganda is very effective for some reason gollygee Dec 2012 #2

I agree -- the anti-union propaganda has been very effective. LisaLynne Dec 2012 #4

I dunno Union Scribe Dec 2012 #8

I want to watch the channel you watch. It was intensely anti-Prop 2 here. Barack_America Dec 2012 #11

I saw them all the time. Union Scribe Dec 2012 #21

I don't blame the unions. I blame the Supreme Court for allowing endless $... Barack_America Dec 2012 #24

Endless SECRET $. So one wonders what kind of deals have been bought with the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ patrice Dec 2012 #28

BUt clearly, they weren't effective. nt LisaLynne Dec 2012 #12

That's because people here are anti-union. Period. Union Scribe Dec 2012 #19

I'm hoping someone tries to collect that naturalistic information about "WHY?" patrice Dec 2012 #32

This message was self-deleted by its author putitinD Dec 2012 #88

Actual union corruption hasn't helped Recursion Dec 2012 #18

Go gloat somewhere else. nt Union Scribe Dec 2012 #20

WTF? That's what I'm talking about Recursion Dec 2012 #25

Full story for linemen nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #26

Yes, I know that, but optics are important Recursion Dec 2012 #27

Unions do nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #30

Please see #32. I'm not sure the WHOLE thing can be explained as ir-rational hate. & It does NO patrice Dec 2012 #33

Your claim about Sandy line workers has been falsified. longship Dec 2012 #39

I was one of the first ones to point that out in the original thread; you're missing the point Recursion Dec 2012 #44

Nice straw man there. longship Dec 2012 #51

Well, non-union workers *were* turned away, but not for being non-union Recursion Dec 2012 #53

So I expect you will edit your earlier post to reflect that fact. longship Dec 2012 #56

No. I said "alleged" and I meant it Recursion Dec 2012 #57

Alleged by FOX News, and their fellow travelers. longship Dec 2012 #58

This is a pretty good example of the anti-union propaganda gollygee Dec 2012 #41

Really, which part? Recursion Dec 2012 #46

neither of these things are facts Triloon Dec 2012 #62

Sorry, non-"union members", not "non-union" members. (nt) Recursion Dec 2012 #63

What about the corruption geardaddy Dec 2012 #103

Republican governor - Help needed from DNC & Act Blue fadedrose Dec 2012 #3

LOL, just checked out Candice Miller on Wikipedia, her daughter is a member of thr Fla Dem Dec 2012 #6

And she was endorsed by the Teamsters. ForgoTheConsequence Dec 2012 #29

If Democrats were only 1/2 as much Pro-Union... Teamster Jeff Dec 2012 #5

+1 Union Scribe Dec 2012 #7

Absafreakinglutely!!! I am sick and tired of scaredy-cat Dems!!! In our state they're so WEAK patrice Dec 2012 #35

This latest assult in Michigan makes me sick to my sufrommich Dec 2012 #9

Citizens United. The ad campaign against Prop 2 was intense. Barack_America Dec 2012 #10

I watched all day, I was a union member all my working life. erinlough Dec 2012 #13

We also have gerrymandered districts drawn by sufrommich Dec 2012 #14

It was a huge mistake to push for collective bargaining in the Michigan Constitution. Romulox Dec 2012 #15

I think the push was because the word got out that the GOP sufrommich Dec 2012 #16

The result was sort of an "anti-referendum", imo. It gave the Repubs the cover needed. Romulox Dec 2012 #17

They didn't need cover. They strong-armed it in one day. Union Scribe Dec 2012 #22

Could it be any clearer that this was Snyder's plan from square one? Romulox Dec 2012 #23

Yup. I knew the repukes were going to pull a fast one... frostfern Dec 2012 #48

$$$ krhines Dec 2012 #31

Such as? Recursion Dec 2012 #34

In Grand Rapids krhines Dec 2012 #36

I post this a lot krhines Dec 2012 #37

OK, so where is the propaganda she paid for? Recursion Dec 2012 #38

From my first reply krhines Dec 2012 #40

watch this video krhines Dec 2012 #42

I hate videos (they're an awful way to make an argument) but I watched it Recursion Dec 2012 #47

you win krhines Dec 2012 #49

Who? Recursion Dec 2012 #52

ok krhines Dec 2012 #54

Yes, I mentioned ads for specific ballot initiatives Recursion Dec 2012 #45

if you haven't noticed the 40-year-anti-union campaign, you've been in a hole somewhere. HiPointDem Dec 2012 #67

Then it should be very easy to give me an example (nt) Recursion Dec 2012 #68

it is. 30-second google: wsj 2012: "Overpaid Public Workers: The Evidence Mounts" HiPointDem Dec 2012 #70

I don't have a WSJ subscription Recursion Dec 2012 #73

disingenuous HiPointDem Dec 2012 #75

No, I seriously and sincerely don't think there's been any sort of propaganda campaign Recursion Dec 2012 #77

i agree krhines Dec 2012 #83

I got a TON TON TON mailed to me before the election gollygee Dec 2012 #43

I guess I live in the wrong place Recursion Dec 2012 #50

disingenuous -- you yourself passed along a piece of anti-union propaganda in this very thread. HiPointDem Dec 2012 #64

Ah, so when you say propaganda you're including urban myths Recursion Dec 2012 #66

of course someone paid someone to spread that story. HiPointDem Dec 2012 #69

No, really, nobody made money off of that (nt) Recursion Dec 2012 #72

Union Red Tape in N.J. Causes Alabama Recovery Crew to Head Home HiPointDem Dec 2012 #86

As long as it is illegal Sekhmets Daughter Dec 2012 #55

I'm afraid you're right PD Turk Dec 2012 #59

That's always the way with people Sekhmets Daughter Dec 2012 #102

what does this do to Unions in Michigan? underoath Dec 2012 #60

We'll see but having worked in a school without a union shop erinlough Dec 2012 #71

do the freeloaders not work as hard as the other Union workers? underoath Dec 2012 #74

Generally, it is about following the contract, not how hard you work. Let me explain. erinlough Dec 2012 #80

so who are the freeloaders you are referring to? underoath Dec 2012 #81

People who refuse to join the union who represents them. erinlough Dec 2012 #82

what if a person doesnt want a union to represent them? underoath Dec 2012 #85

If the place of work has negotiated with a union for a contract then erinlough Dec 2012 #87

can a non-union worker get hired into a job with a union? underoath Dec 2012 #89

See my last post. The place of work erinlough Dec 2012 #90

so its still up to the business and its workers to decide if they want to unionize, right? underoath Dec 2012 #93

There are big companies with partial organization, plus there are some "two-tier" industries Recursion Dec 2012 #95

The people they should be persuading but insist on calling "freeloaders" and "scabs" Recursion Dec 2012 #84

Free loaders might not be the right term. "Free riders" is a real economic term for people who Squinch Dec 2012 #106

wont this let the business and its workers decide if they want to be Union or no? underoath Dec 2012 #61

It means that union workers who pay thier dues, subsidize scabs who go to work there SoCalDem Dec 2012 #78

but the business and its workers still have the right to decide to unionize if they want to, right? underoath Dec 2012 #91

They always have and they still do erinlough Dec 2012 #94

thanks for you help and understanding!!! underoath Dec 2012 #96

not for long.. SoCalDem Dec 2012 #104

That question is more about card check. RTW is more about dues withholding Recursion Dec 2012 #79

but under this law, unions will still be able to organize, right? underoath Dec 2012 #92

Yes, this is an attack on already-existing unions. The attack on forming new unions... Recursion Dec 2012 #97

ahh ok. thanks!!! underoath Dec 2012 #99

Where is the EFCA? They never voted, right? Is it still somewhere in Congress? Killed in committee? patrice Dec 2012 #100

Stuck in the Senate Recursion Dec 2012 #101

But the free rider problem becomes a very large one here: Squinch Dec 2012 #105

Yes. This is totally fucked and its only purpose is to weaken unions Teamster Jeff Dec 2012 #108

Not weaken unions, eliminate them. Squinch Dec 2012 #110

By making union dues non-mandatory, it is effectively killing the union. Squinch Dec 2012 #107

As a Michigan resident I have to say Shadowflash Dec 2012 #76

Citizens' United. It can fund unions too, so as all of this crap about jobs works itself through patrice Dec 2012 #98

The Amendment was a classic case of having a good idea, but dramatically over-reaching. bluestate10 Dec 2012 #109