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OhNo-Really

(3,985 posts)

98. 😂😂😂"..there's no room for civil society..". Spit coffee laugh. You surprised me

Sun Dec 22, 2019, 05:02 PM

Dec 2019

I think we can take your wonderful analysis to a new article. Definitely very well presented and worthy of discussion.

AA saves lives. Keeping the focus on AA

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This message was self-deleted by its author [View all] OhNo-Really Dec 2019 OP

There is a simple reason many have strong negative opinions about AA SCantiGOP Dec 2019 #1

AA has a subgroup for atheists, or for those who just don't want to bring God into it. Aristus Dec 2019 #4

not really SCantiGOP Dec 2019 #8

AA doesn't work for all. Even for those who do believe in God. Kaleva Dec 2019 #12

How did you succeed? OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #21

I just got sick of the taste and quit cold turkey. Kaleva Dec 2019 #106

You are truly one of the lucky stars. So happy for you 💕 OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #111

It saved me,38 years ago. virgogal Dec 2019 #88

Wonderful! Merry Christmas ✨✨❤️ OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #94

It has saved a number of people. I don't knock AA Kaleva Dec 2019 #107

I'm glad you did. Dorian Gray Dec 2019 #186

This message was self-deleted by its author Nature Man Dec 2019 #29

You can't keep the concept of powerlessness out of it, and that's what many object to. pnwmom Dec 2019 #69

Addiction is a power. The group power can help overcome the temptation of addiction OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #112

But AA isn't the only group and its practices aren't the only practices. pnwmom Dec 2019 #113

Of course it isn't. It's just a worldwide 24/7 one OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #124

I'm glad that worked for your relative. Sobriety isn't easy, Dorian Gray Dec 2019 #187

Me, too. An older relative swore by AA, but the young one just couldn't connect with it. pnwmom Dec 2019 #196

Diarrhea is a power Nature Man Dec 2019 #121

The power of logorrhea aside, I do hope you found something that works for you, personally. Hekate Dec 2019 #147

Sorry (IMHO) Timewas Dec 2019 #73

So right for so many addicts. OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #84

I think that a lot of resistance to AA is from people who don't want to drink Dorian Gray Dec 2019 #188

Agreed Timewas Dec 2019 #195

That kind of argument leaves me cold. Igel Dec 2019 #91

Well said! OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #102

More like, "Caveat Emptor" Nature Man Dec 2019 #127

It's free to all. Active addicts sometimes lack discernment OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #137

Where, exactly, did the poster imply that AA shouldn't exist? nt. Mariana Dec 2019 #171

It's "higher power" and for those who aren't religious, higher power is AA LeftInTX Dec 2019 #159

There's also other reasons Major Nikon Dec 2019 #173

Who makes those claims? Dorian Gray Dec 2019 #189

I already told you. AA makes those claims. Major Nikon Dec 2019 #194

You don't have a problem with alcohol so you go with a closed mind and negativity towards AA. Were demosincebirth Dec 2019 #184

The religious aspect of it triggers fescuerescue Dec 2019 #2

Glad you mentioned the triggering aspect. Lars39 Dec 2019 #58

The poster calls those people "non-religious fundys" [sic] and "extremist" [sic]. Mariana Dec 2019 #172

Yes. They expect and demand conformity. Lars39 Dec 2019 #174

I would have no problem with it if it weren't state-mandated. X_Digger Dec 2019 #63

A professional addresses this issue below. There is a choice OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #77

A professional addresses this issue below. There is a choice OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #78

"Take what you want" isn't what AA says jmowreader Dec 2019 #110

Read comments from The addicts AA saved. OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #135

personal comments are anecdotal evidence Nature Man Dec 2019 #136

Good point. Although attributing 17+ years of sobriety to AA is a tad more than "casual" OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #141

Back up for a second jmowreader Dec 2019 #175

Depends on the locality. There are courts today, that only allow AA. (Because it's free.) X_Digger Dec 2019 #148

YES Timewas Dec 2019 #90

Affordable is a word needed as well OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #151

Thank you for defending AA so well. As the child of an alcoholic who had stayed sober Atticus Dec 2019 #3

Agree...The Serenity Prayer" is simple, and easy to know and understand... Stuart G Dec 2019 #81

When a court requires you to enroll in a religious program, there is a problem jberryhill Dec 2019 #5

AA isn't a religious program ismnotwasm Dec 2019 #7

This message was self-deleted by its author Nature Man Dec 2019 #30

AA is absolutely a religious program. bitterross Dec 2019 #51

Similarly, failings of AA are like failings of religion. X_Digger Dec 2019 #67

Exactly! "You didn't work your program hard enough." bitterross Dec 2019 #158

Thank you for your post. SunSeeker Dec 2019 #83

No, it isn't ismnotwasm Dec 2019 #101

Awesome comment. Thank you OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #114

It's kind of a concept ismnotwasm Dec 2019 #130

Thank you! I have someone to share your story with. OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #143

Sounds like my son's group! LeftInTX Dec 2019 #164

I beg to differ and so do the courts. bitterross Dec 2019 #160

Good post... SidDithers Dec 2019 #117

Those last three paragraphs should be required reading Bradshaw3 Dec 2019 #155

Not familiar with court order laws OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #9

In general, the court orders H2O Man Dec 2019 #34

The whole history is interesting as is the structure ismnotwasm Dec 2019 #37

Very interesting. H2O Man Dec 2019 #49

Excellent addition. Thank you! OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #68

AA is the original CBT. Comatose Sphagetti Dec 2019 #99

Thank you! Found an interesting link. Anti-AA began around 1994 OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #71

"Stay in your lane." Igel Dec 2019 #95

😂😂😂"..there's no room for civil society..". Spit coffee laugh. You surprised me OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #98

That seems to be more of a problem with the judges then with AA itself. Kaleva Dec 2019 #13

and there are medical treatments like Naltrexone which are used in other countries dawg day Dec 2019 #19

Well said. Chantix is helping with smoking addiction OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #22

My wife, who rarely cries, could not stop crying when she was taking rzemanfl Dec 2019 #48

That is interesting. Some smoking-cessation treatment is the same as an antidepressant- dawg day Dec 2019 #57

Yes, I've heard of different reactions OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #61

My husband is an addict and alcoholic Bluesaph Dec 2019 #41

That's a beautiful testament. Thank you bluesaph. erronis Dec 2019 #66

AA teaches powerlessness over alcohol specifically Nature Man Dec 2019 #125

Yup. Knew a guy who failed rehab 2x, AA a few more times. Antabuse did the trick Arazi Dec 2019 #64

Those are good for crises. Igel Dec 2019 #96

When I was asked to sign the attendance slips for court, I hesitated irisblue Dec 2019 #38

Exactly. n/t X_Digger Dec 2019 #65

A friend of mine, sober for over 40 years, says majdrfrtim Dec 2019 #70

Good for him jberryhill Dec 2019 #100

I was under the distinct impression that AA PoindexterOglethorpe Dec 2019 #6

We are all 100% in control. OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #16

Zealots prey on people's weaknesses Nature Man Dec 2019 #31

Yes they do. Some pray & prey OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #36

AA says "take what you want and leave the rest." rzemanfl Dec 2019 #17

This. Iggo Dec 2019 #27

Except when you get shamed and "love-bombed" Nature Man Dec 2019 #126

As I read thru this thread & your contributions, it is clear you despise AA. Can you at least... Hekate Dec 2019 #156

You are projecting Nature Man Dec 2019 #179

Not hardly Hekate Dec 2019 #180

So. Nature Man Dec 2019 #181

Speaking as one who has 2 family members (in other parts of the country) who are... SWBTATTReg Dec 2019 #203

Alcoholism runs on my mom's side of the family: her dad, one brother, one sister, is a fair sample. Hekate Dec 2019 #209

"...psychological, financial, and sexual predators..." Iggo Dec 2019 #176

AA is unique Nature Man Dec 2019 #178

You just described a shit-ton of support groups that are not AA. Iggo Dec 2019 #182

people in crisis are easy prey Nature Man Dec 2019 #183

sexual predators abound.... Dorian Gray Dec 2019 #191

AA is free LeftInTX Dec 2019 #161

Do you feel like you are an addict? Dorian Gray Dec 2019 #190

I have known atheists who AA helped. It's having support of others that seems to help. Hoyt Dec 2019 #10

Agree 100%. Thank you. Ppl have to do the work the OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #11

Yes. Spme atheists are helped by it but some are deeply opposed OregonBlue Dec 2019 #14

In the 1980s in Connecticut, 2nd DUI was 1 year in jail! OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #18

Success rate is very low. On the other hand, every success is a gift to be celebrated. OregonBlue Dec 2019 #197

Perhaps there's a third alternative OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #198

Sober 40 years. Thank God for AA. demosincebirth Dec 2019 #15

Thank you so much & SO Happy for you 👏❤️ OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #20

One of the traditions we have in AA is " we have no opinions demosincebirth Dec 2019 #177

Wonderful to hear Dorian Gray Dec 2019 #192

I've been to AA meetings and I'm an Atheist. The God shit didn't bother me. nt UniteFightBack Dec 2019 #23

Yes, If you want to quit.. McKim Dec 2019 #85

So happy for you! Thank you for commenting and giving hope to others OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #134

Some people rebel against the belief that it's the only way Orangepeel Dec 2019 #24

somebody FINALLY nailed it! stopdiggin Dec 2019 #72

Yes, people that AA has helped regain their lives from the tyranny of alcoholism are eager to share OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #82

If you quit on your own Nature Man Dec 2019 #118

Interesting. I take it you've had some bad experiences ismnotwasm Dec 2019 #142

Not so much a bad experience Nature Man Dec 2019 #144

AA has helped millions to stay clean/sober. My take on the higher power is that no one involved with jalan48 Dec 2019 #25

It's fueled by court systems mandating Phoenix61 Dec 2019 #26

Look around, "In God We Trust" is freaking everywhere. "Under god" rzemanfl Dec 2019 #40

AA began decades ago, long before court mandates. It's free to all OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #44

which does not excuse the court stopdiggin Dec 2019 #80

I'll defer to the comments in this stream written by sober AA atheists/agnostics proponents OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #105

Hanging out with sober people makes it easier to stay sober. Iggo Dec 2019 #28

It does. Good post. n/t rzemanfl Dec 2019 #43

Agnostic with 17+ years sober through AA. Comatose Sphagetti Dec 2019 #32

This is exactly right. tymorial Dec 2019 #35

That's me, with almost 30 years ismnotwasm Dec 2019 #39

Great story. Thank you. Merry Christmas 🎄 OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #109

+1. n/t rzemanfl Dec 2019 #42

May I add your comment at the beginning of the article? OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #46

Please do. Comatose Sphagetti Dec 2019 #76

Thank you ✨💕✨ OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #79

I strongly support AA and NA. tymorial Dec 2019 #33

AA forces you to admit you have no control over your addiction applegrove Dec 2019 #45

No no no. Good grief. Read comments above from those that AA has helped OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #47

You stopped reading at "forces", huh. Iggo Dec 2019 #54

Sober 30 years. One year in AA. Triloon Dec 2019 #50

The higher power can be nature or the spaghetti monster. Just so long applegrove Dec 2019 #56

AA can't force anyone to do anything. Kaleva Dec 2019 #52

But if someone is powerless, defeated, and incapable of anything until they do 90 in 90 Nature Man Dec 2019 #138

People tackle AA in all sorts of different ways. Dorian Gray Dec 2019 #193

There's this: An Atheist's Guide to 12-Step Recovery OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #59

That last sentence ... Geechie Dec 2019 #53

I agree 100%. No judgement, no pretense, no pressure OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #115

Is there a difference between those who drink too much and those who are physically addicted? Buckeyeblue Dec 2019 #55

Is there a difference between those who can't stop and those who can? Iggo Dec 2019 #62

I get there is a difference but are they lumped in the same category together? Buckeyeblue Dec 2019 #87

Nope. One's addicts and one ain't. Iggo Dec 2019 #93

The Big Book suggests going without drinking for 30 days to make that decision catrose Dec 2019 #166

The test: Is/are alcohol/drugs negatively affecting the quality of yours or others lives? OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #122

AA is more about the support from others. That's what helps. YOHABLO Dec 2019 #60

So it's like Weight Watchers meetings? nt SunSeeker Dec 2019 #86

Never been to a WW meeting. But people share their experiences. YOHABLO Dec 2019 #89

I got started in Overeaters Anonymous, then AA. Stuart G Dec 2019 #74

Thank you! Yes addiction kills & robs OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #163

Vodka sales must be down. MyNameGoesHere Dec 2019 #75

My two cents TlalocW Dec 2019 #92

"they convince you that you're lame, and then offer you a crutch."... SidDithers Dec 2019 #120

I prefer comments from recovered addicts quite frankly OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #201

+1000 smirkymonkey Dec 2019 #207

AA good program marieo1 Dec 2019 #97

Just eliminate the GOD bullshit, problem solved! nt USALiberal Dec 2019 #103

AA has one of the worst success rates of any rehab program Aquaria Dec 2019 #104

BINGO Nature Man Dec 2019 #119

Well said... SidDithers Dec 2019 #123

AA wrote in 1935 that there was a difference between heavy drinkers and alcohol use disorder ismnotwasm Dec 2019 #131

Let's hear from the addicts AA helps. People. OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #132

You're sounding like an evangelist decrying all the people prayer helped. X_Digger Dec 2019 #152

Thanks for the research and stats Bradshaw3 Dec 2019 #157

AA is 12 step program that requires adherence to its orthodoxy. YOHABLO Dec 2019 #165

I totally disagree with ..."a 12 step program that requires adherence to its orhodoxy" Stuart G Dec 2019 #169

FYI, there is Smart Recovery, which is not religious or spiritual TexasBushwhacker Dec 2019 #108

It's good that addicts have choices. OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #128

Cool! LeftInTX Dec 2019 #162

"The Small Book" is a good primer on the Smart Recovery principles TexasBushwhacker Dec 2019 #167

"Believe it if you need it... or leave it if you dare..." jcgoldie Dec 2019 #116

Rehab industry wouldn't exist without The Program Nature Man Dec 2019 #129

April 8, 1992 stillcool Dec 2019 #133

Fantastic. Merry Christmas 🎄 OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #154

Thank you. Your last sentence is the real kicker for me. Rehab is hellishly expensive. AA is free... Hekate Dec 2019 #139

There are prices to pay in life Nature Man Dec 2019 #140

A family member is more than 20 years sober with AA liberalguilt57 Dec 2019 #145

AA targets more than problem drinking; yortsed snacilbuper Dec 2019 #146

I can't recall any AAers who didn't accept all the medical help they could afford catrose Dec 2019 #168

I can't understand why it's being set up as AA vs. anything catrose Dec 2019 #170

I'm glad you're happy in AA. Arthur_Frain Dec 2019 #149

AA is OK Skittles Dec 2019 #150

we haven't had one of these threads in a while. Kali Dec 2019 #153

AA is a wonderful tool in an arsenal Dorian Gray Dec 2019 #185

Profiteers are stealing and trying to monetize the AA program live love laugh Dec 2019 #199

You are correct. $25k/month is a huge Greed incentive OhNo-Really Dec 2019 #200

My grandfather was a member back when it was still a "Fellowship" snpsmom Dec 2019 #202

I think there are people who are critical about most things.... Upthevibe Dec 2019 #204

It personally never worked out for me JonLP24 Dec 2019 #205

One modern addiction treatment/methodology is CBT (cognitive behavioral therapy.) Comatose Sphagetti Dec 2019 #206

Now sober for 30 years. A.A. was a terrific support group for me for 10+ years. SharonAnn Dec 2019 #208