General Discussion

H2O Man

(73,536 posts)

43. Context is everything.

Fri Nov 29, 2019, 10:50 AM

Nov 2019

Many of us grew up during the time that Hoffa vs RFK was an intense, on-going fight. As you know, the two hated each other, with an intensity that the movie could only hint at. It's worth reading RFK's 1960 book, "The Enemy Within," to get a fuller picture of those times. In every sense, when it came to those two, it was a struggle betwee good and evil .....but it was played out internally as well as externally.

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Jimmy Hoffa [View all] Yavin4 Nov 2019 OP

I'm having some of the same feelings MaryMagdaline Nov 2019 #1

My mom said the same thing.. mountain grammy Nov 2019 #75

Smart lady! MaryMagdaline Dec 2019 #86

This was before my time JonLP24 Nov 2019 #2

i wonder how much of that is propaganda? rampartc Dec 2019 #102

Like you said, Hoffa and unions in general were racist and corrupt. I doubt he would have Hoyt Nov 2019 #3

Most of society was "racist and sexist" back then, business whathehell Nov 2019 #48

Unions should have led the way, instead the membership was openly hostile to minorities. Hoyt Nov 2019 #49

Whatever they "should" have done, the fact is they were just as human, whathehell Nov 2019 #54

Not an excuse. Unions and some candidates continue with "Amerca First," "Economic Patriotism," etc. Hoyt Nov 2019 #55

Don't move the goalposts.,.The"excuse" you mention refers whathehell Nov 2019 #57

A Union's foremost job is to serve its members. MicaelS Nov 2019 #58

Thank you. You are correct. n/t. whathehell Nov 2019 #59

Yep, unions were racist well into 1980s and now they've turned their attention Hoyt Nov 2019 #60

You are just a one-trick pony. MicaelS Nov 2019 #62

Truth hurts. And a lot is the fault of racist white people, not just men. A whole lot. Hoyt Nov 2019 #63

i was a union member in mississippi in the 1970s rampartc Dec 2019 #103

Greedy vs. greedy. moondust Nov 2019 #4

Collective bargaining is not a bad thing at all and in general I don't consider labor the greedy one JonLP24 Nov 2019 #5

No doubt most labor moondust Nov 2019 #7

I think there is less union solidarity JonLP24 Nov 2019 #8

Yes, and BOTH sides negotiate the contract whathehell Nov 2019 #33

No, that would amount to false equivalence whathehell Nov 2019 #50

The means of production Bluethroughu Dec 2019 #84

No doubt the tough-guy persona helped. nt Laffy Kat Nov 2019 #6

Hoffa was deeply connected to Nixon and so was the Mafia at that time rockfordfile Nov 2019 #9

Nixon would be considered a Berniecrat by today's conservative standards. n/t Yavin4 Nov 2019 #12

What would RFK, who went after Hoffa, be considered to be by today's standards? Kaleva Nov 2019 #26

Shortsighted. Haggis for Breakfast Nov 2019 #27

Bingo! mountain grammy Nov 2019 #76

RFK was anti-Hoffa, not anti-Union whathehell Nov 2019 #30

OP was asking for union leaders LIKE Hoffa Kaleva Nov 2019 #41

I responded to your post, not his. whathehell Nov 2019 #46

Well, the discussion is about the OPs post Kaleva Nov 2019 #51

Then why did you bring up RFK? whathehell Nov 2019 #52

Because of RFK's handling of union leaders like Hoffa. Kaleva Nov 2019 #53

To my knowledge, RFK handled no other union leader BUT Hoffa whathehell Nov 2019 #56

I never said RFK was anti-union. Kaleva Nov 2019 #66

..And I never said I was pro-corruption. whathehell Nov 2019 #67

Where would you get the idea that I ever said you were? Kaleva Nov 2019 #68

Where would you get the idea I said you were anti-union? whathehell Nov 2019 #69

Can you provide a quote where I said such a thing? Or even implied it? Kaleva Nov 2019 #70

You can answer my question first. whathehell Nov 2019 #71

I already did with post #53. A response to your post #52 Kaleva Nov 2019 #72

Yeah, sure whathehell Nov 2019 #73

Sorry to see you go. I was enjoying our exchange. Kaleva Dec 2019 #79

I dig your malarkey. LanternWaste Dec 2019 #91

I think i just saw a thread about malarkey. Kaleva Dec 2019 #92

Don't forget DumpTrump20202020 Feb 2020 #106

RFK was a practitioner of RealPolitic Kaleva Feb 2020 #107

Hoffa senior TEB Nov 2019 #10

People were KILLED fighting for a 40 hour work week, safety standards whathehell Nov 2019 #31

I saw The Irishman and loved it... Upthevibe Nov 2019 #11

I just saw it and it was excellent lunatica Nov 2019 #34

Since the movie is based on a book about a guy who claims he killed Hoffa I doubt that would... Hassin Bin Sober Nov 2019 #37

Thanks. lunatica Nov 2019 #39

The book author interviewed Sheeran before he died. Hassin Bin Sober Nov 2019 #40

I just discovered this today. LeftInTX Nov 2019 #65

Who knows? LeftInTX Nov 2019 #64

I liked the movie but I had a problem with Pacino playing his usual self. Hassin Bin Sober Nov 2019 #38

Getting to Hoffa's character now LeftInTX Nov 2019 #74

I'm almost halfway finished reading the book eleny Nov 2019 #13

".. the companies were so greedy and used such ruthless tactics to keep their workers at low pay and Yavin4 Nov 2019 #14

Yeah, for sure eleny Nov 2019 #16

Not only that, companies used 'Goon Squads' to beat up workers. whathehell Nov 2019 #61

film bored the stew out of me. Brainstormy Nov 2019 #15

Me too .. whathehell Nov 2019 #47

I have had to turn it off twice mnhtnbb Dec 2019 #82

Great movie. H2O Man Nov 2019 #17

I started watching it this morning and was interrupted CatWoman Nov 2019 #18

A few friends H2O Man Nov 2019 #19

I got very caught up in that scene lunatica Nov 2019 #35

One of the many H2O Man Nov 2019 #42

We can thank Scorsese for the younger generation not saying Ok Boomer lunatica Nov 2019 #44

At least the younger generation May get an inkling that we are MaryMagdaline Dec 2019 #87

They might have to give in and admit the Boomers lived in lunatica Dec 2019 #90

Context is everything JonLP24 Dec 2019 #93

Every generation has its 'draggarts', people who drag lunatica Dec 2019 #94

I was just trying to explain where the phrase comes JonLP24 Dec 2019 #95

If you can't make up your mind whether it's some flattering thing or lunatica Dec 2019 #96

The only negative reactions I see are on DU JonLP24 Dec 2019 #97

On DU you're punching at your allies not your foes lunatica Dec 2019 #98

I'm not using OK Boomer JonLP24 Dec 2019 #99

Thanks for clarifying that! lunatica Dec 2019 #101

I thought it was stunning. tavernier Dec 2019 #85

Hoffa and men like him were racist and sexist. Blue_true Nov 2019 #20

Yeah, but the answer to the corruption, racism, sexism of the unions is to get better leaders Yavin4 Nov 2019 #21

Your OP celebrated Hoffa. I pointed out what he and men like him were. Blue_true Nov 2019 #22

Hoffa does deserve some praise. Yavin4 Nov 2019 #23

He fought for only a fraction of workers in America, he was perfectly ok with Blue_true Nov 2019 #25

I'm a retired Teamster lunatica Nov 2019 #36

Context is everything. H2O Man Nov 2019 #43

Union Sister Here! Tink41 Nov 2019 #24

The mob killed the Kennedy's and Hoffa effectively dividing and conquering... pbmus Dec 2019 #80

Terrific film with PCIntern Nov 2019 #28

+1 myohmy2 Nov 2019 #29

The entire Society, business, government, was "racist and sexist" whathehell Nov 2019 #32

I think you missed the boat re Sheeran's 'labor activism' on behalf of Hoffa. Mc Mike Nov 2019 #45

Thanks for this background. Helps to sort through history MaryMagdaline Dec 2019 #88

2 different things are going on with this movie. Mc Mike Dec 2019 #104

Haven't seen the film yet, but plan to. mountain grammy Nov 2019 #77

I was thinking the same thing. You don't hear those strong union voices anymore. SweetieD Dec 2019 #78

Can't view Hoffa in the lens of today. Xolodno Dec 2019 #81

Proud Union home, right here. Bluethroughu Dec 2019 #83

Salute to you and your family! MaryMagdaline Dec 2019 #89

Something tells me... TidalWave46 Dec 2019 #100

Working-Class Hero DumpTrump20202020 Feb 2020 #105