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Member since: Fri Jul 13, 2012, 12:38 PM
Number of posts: 653

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Looks like I stand corrected

Convicting Darren Wilson Will Be Basically Impossible
But generally, we expect situations of justified violence and legal killing to be the rare exception, and most people would probably imagine that policemen and citizens raising claims of justifiable homicide must meet a substantive burden of proof. But in Missouri, these justifications barely require any evidence at all.

In other states, claims of self-defense need to be proven as more likely than not, or in legal speak, to a “preponderance of the evidence.” It’s still the state’s obligation to prove “beyond a reasonable doubt” that the defendant actually killed the victim. But once that’s established, the prosecution doesn’t also have to prove “beyond a reasonable doubt” that the killing wasn’t justified. That’s because justifications—like self-defense—require the accused to make an active case, called an “affirmative defense,” that the circumstances were exceptional. The logic here is simple: As a rule, homicide is a crime and justification is reserved for extraordinary cases. Once the state has proven that a defendant did in fact kill someone, it should be the accused’s obligation to prove his or her actions were justified.

Not in Missouri. Instead, as long as there is a modicum of evidence and reasonable plausibility in support of a self-defense claim, a court must accept the claim and acquit the accused. The prosecution must not only prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant committed the crime, but also disprove a defendant’s claim of self-defense to the same high standard. Under Missouri law, all a citizen claiming self-defense or a police officer claiming to have fired while pursuing a dangerous criminal need do is “inject the issue of justification.” In other words, he only needs to produce some evidence (his own testimony counts) supporting the claim. Once he does so, “any reasonable doubt on the issue requires a finding for the defendant.” In Missouri, the burden doesn’t budge an inch, even after we know that the defendant has killed the victim. It doesn’t matter that there is certainty that Darren Wilson shot Michael Brown. As long as there is still the slightest possibility that Wilson acted in his own defense, Missouri law favors Wilson.

Not only is the Ferguson police force a disgrace. So are the Missouri laws that protect it.

If they go through with this as laid out above, I fear people will die. Rodney King II

I didn't look at how long it took to cover the bodies

I did look at EMS for Brown. The police logs show them being called at 12:04 - right after the shooting. And there is video of them attending to Brown, checking his pulse, etc.

The outstanding question I have is why EMS did not arrive sooner than they did. They arrived fairly shortly/minutes after the shooting - it wasn't hours later. But when they arrived, police tape was already up all around the crime scene so it was more than a couple of minutes. The EMS guy walked to Brown - no jogging or rushing.

It's possible EMS were told it was kind of a formality because Brown was dead and his brains on the road. That was apparent to a number of the bystanders who shot the crime scene videos. They yelled out at the EMS guy "he's dead!" or something to that effect.

For me, I'm beyond merely thinking about justice

I'm way beyond revenge.

150 years after the Civil War. 50 years after MLK. And so many others who died or sacrificed.

We have a man as president who I think is absolutely wonderful, the best president ever to me and a racist congress who won't work with him - putting their ignorant hatred ahead of their country and it's people. Some of the ugly things they've said or lied about him make me cringe and feel wounded for him. And from a distance, the blacks in places like Ferguson see this.

I could fill in with so many more examples like Trayvon Martin - not only with the injustice of letting his murderer go free but with the awful racism that sprung up to belittle the victim and "his kind". Makes me sick.

And tonight in Ferguson, unarmed Mike Brown lies dead. Henry Davis is having to appeal his case against four officers who wrongfully arrested him and after they beat him because he wouldn't accept sleeping on a concrete floor, charged him with getting blood on their uniforms. The city government, school board & police force are almost 100% controlled by a white minority who issue more warrants per year than they have people and 50% more court cases than households disproportionately against blacks. And that drives the blacks deeper into poverty, depriving them of their right to vote because there's a warrant or a felony conviction against them. That leads to taking "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" away from them. Makes my head spin.

Maybe overwhelmed with disdain for this situation, I'm reading this wrong and overreacting but it sure looks like blatant oppression to me. 14,160 blacks live in Ferguson - in something that resembles a police state ... "in the land of the free". And this appears to have been happening ALL THEIR LIVES!!!

It's outrageous. Unbelievable in this day and age. A terrible disgrace and stain on this country.

I feel embarrassment, shame, disgust, frustration, anger, contempt, sadness, disappointment .... my heart aches for these people and what they've been put through. Many must feel hopeless.

We can't waste our time on revenge. Getting some justice may help to deter others and provide some healing but there may not be enough courts and judges to get all that done in our lifetimes. Look at all the effort it's going to take to deal with one cop who shot an unarmed man.

So they have to find a way to fix this problem faster.

When I see this problem, it leaves me wondering "where else is this happening?" Maybe there are things like arrest stats by race or ratios of white vs black government leaders vs mix of race in the population that could help identify them.

And then Ferguson can be used as a model of empowerment to solve the broader problem. Maybe the "fix" could be a series of steps that other communities or cities can execute.
- pardons for a bunch of the warrants or laws that ignore felons/warrants to allow them to vote
- recall the city government, school board, etc and hold a new vote
- dismiss the worst offenders on the police force - those with the most complaints or something like that
- hiring freeze on whites for all positions in city government, police, fire dept, etc until the racial imbalance is corrected
- implement body cams for the police force

The black community leaders should be consulted and involved to help design what is effective and appropriate.

To me, something like that is what is needed here. And needed soon.

The thing that blew me away is

They've raised $30 mil more than last year in only three weeks.

I'm sure it will peter out but it's still seems to going strong. My daughter went to a special local event last night with a change of clothes to do it. It seems to still be growing.

Very, very sad about Cory. But when folks find out, that may give it a big boost. When Terry Fox had to stop his run for cancer because he'd developed lung cancer, it triggered more publicity and an enormous boost to his cause.

It wouldn't shock me if they hit $60-$100 mil with this amazing effort.

It is a horrific disease. Hopefully, this money will deliver some meaningful treatment.

You've really misunderstood my post. Big time.

I never said a bunch of what you allege nor do I believe the things you allege.

Since you've misunderstood, then maybe I didn't make myself clear so I'll try to clarify.

Wilson shot an unarmed man. He has a big problem. He has to justify his actions or he's going to jail. It's pretty hard to justify shooting an unarmed man.

To justify his actions, Wilson is alleged to take the position that Mike bum rushed him and when Mike allegedly did, according to Wilson, Wilson felt threatened that Wilson's life or well being was in danger. It's about the only thing I can imagine Wilson can say to try to save his butt. But to be clear: I'm not saying that. I'm just repeating roughly what has been alleged as Wilson's position.

I'm saying in my prior post that even if one believed Wilson (again, I'm not saying I believe Wilson), Wilson's still not out of the woods because following Wilson's alleged story and the ballistics/autopsy, Wilson's actions very arguably could be construed as he provoked Mike to act desperately. So Wilson's still not off the hook.

Wilson isn't saying "Yeah, I chased the unarmed the black SOB down and exterminated him - throw away the keys". He's going to fight it. In response, I'm kicking around the expected debate to counter with "here's one way to fight back".

No race has a monopoly on stupidity or brilliance.

Although the autopsy report is formally "inconclusive", so far, I have real trouble reconciling Wilson's account with the autopsy. I fully appreciate what the witnesses who have come forward and said in front of a camera that refute Wilson's account. Although I reserved final judgement until I've head all the evidence, I find those witnesses more credible.

Ferguson is a another disgraceful example in a string of way too many unacceptable examples of over-the-top outrageous and heinous white privilege.

Hopefully, that clears up your misunderstanding of what I was trying to say in my prior post.

$31.5 Million in Donations to The ALS Association

Washington, D.C. (August 20, 2014) — As of Wednesday, August 20, The ALS Association has received $31.5 million in donations compared to $1.9 million during the same time period last year (July 29 to August 20). These donations have come from existing donors and 637,527 new donors to The Association.


I posted in the autopsy thread with some lengthy reasoning/conjecture

that I suspected the lower forearm wound was quite possibly obtained when Mike was running away and that's what caused him to stop.

In other words, not only did Wilson shoot while Mike ran away ... it's quite plausible he hit him. He just didn't hit him where Dorian Johnson thought he'd been hit - in the back.

Again, that's somewhat speculative on my part but I don't think it's unreasonable to point out it is quite possible Mike got hit by a bullet while he was running away.

On the subject of conjecture, I'll do a Star Trek and go "where no man's gone before":

Cop backs his cruiser up, jumps you and you're shot in the cruiser.
You try to run and get shot
You stop but the cop keeps coming at you still popping
Are you going to stand there and let him finish you off?
Maybe not.
Maybe you'll take a crazy run at that cop to try to save your life.

In other words, even if the cops supposed claim that Mike ran at him were to be believed, he may well have arguably provoked it and left Mike, an unarmed man with the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, little choice.

Food for thought

Trayvon and Mike aren't the only blacks they've lied about


A few selections from the link above:
Obama has been the biggest spending President in history! FALSE. Year to year spending increases have been less than 1%. They’ve also been at their lowest rate of year to year increases since Eisenhower.

Obama is a Muslim!

Obama isn’t an American!

Obama is responsible for the immigration crisis!
FALSE. He’s actually just following the law signed in 2008 by George W. Bush dictating how we must treat immigrants from non-contiguous countries.

Obama is the reason why our troops were pulled out of Iraq! FALSE. Actually we pulled our troops out of Iraq because of a SOFA agreement that was signed by George W. Bush.

Obama has ruled like a dictator with his use of executive orders! FALSE. He’s actually on pace to issue fewer executive orders than both Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush.

Obama is a Communist/Socialist/Fascist! FALSE. They’re all different—it’s impossible to be all 3. Then with stocks setting new records and increasing by more than 100% since their lows in 2009 - he would be the worst Communist, Socialist or Fascist that has ever existed. -

Obama is always on vacation! FALSE. President Obama took 131 vacation days in his first 4 years in office. That puts him on pace for 262 days during 8 years in the White House. By contrast Bush took 1,020 days (including a 5-week vacation–the longest by any President in nearly 4 decades), and Reagan took 484 days. Once again for the mathematically challenged, Obama is on pace to take fewer vacations than both Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush.

The economy has gotten worse under Obama! FALSE. Are you insane ... We’ve also created 9.9 million private sector jobs for 53 consecutive months of private sector job growth.

Those jobs numbers are a lie! No, they’re from the same source which Republicans have used

Obamacare is unconstitutional! FALSE. The Affordable Care Act was passed by Congress, signed by the President and the Supreme Court ruled that it was in fact Constitutional.

Obama has been terrible for business! FALSE. Corporate profits are up 171% since President Obama took office and are at their highest levels, relative to the size of economic growth, since 1947.

Obama has waged a war on the rich! FALSE. We’ve set a new record for number of millionaires in the United States at 9.6 million.

On and on they go ..

Code of Ethics

I've been trying for a couple of days to get a copy of the code of ethics for Ferguson or St Louis county. Website links won't respond. Maybe under the circumstances, that's symbolic.

Here's one for Concoria, Missouri
As a law enforcement officer, my fundamental duty is to serve the community; to safeguard lives and property; to protect the innocent against deception, the weak against oppression or intimidation, and the peaceful against violence or disorder; and to respect the constitutional rights of all to liberty, equality and justice.

I will keep my private life unsullied as an example to all and will behave in a manner that does not bring discredit to me or my agency. I will maintain courageous calm in the face of danger, scorn, or ridicule; develop self-restraint; and be constantly mindful of the welfare of others. Honest in thought and deed in both my personal and official life, I will be exemplary in obeying the law and the regulations of my department. Whatever I see or hear of a confidential nature or that is confided to me in my official capacity will be kept ever secret, unless revelation is necessary in the performance of my duty.

I will never act officiously or permit personal feelings, prejudices, political beliefs, aspirations, animosities or friendships to influence my decisions. With no compromise for crime and the relentless prosecution of criminals, I will enforce the law courteously and appropriately without fear or favor, malice or ill will, never employing unnecessary force or violence and never accepting gratuities.

I recognize the badge of my office as a symbol of public faith, and I accept it as a public trust to be held so long as I am true to the ethics of the police service. I will never engage in acts of corruption of bribery, nor will I condone such acts by other police officers. I will cooperate with all legally authorized agencies and their representatives in the pursuit of justice.

I know that I alone am responsible for my own standard of professional performance and will take every reasonable opportunity to enhance and improve my level of knowledge and competence.

I will constantly strive to achieve these objectives and ideals, dedicating myself before God to my chosen profession . . .

In light of Mike Brown, Henry Davis, the massive number of warrants issued against blacks in Ferguson, media arrests and even this guy pointing his gun "I will f'in kill you", I thought reviewing the standards of behavior these officers are sworn to deliver and bolding a few phrases for emphasis might be of interest.

They could probably save some money too

They wouldn't be dishing out 3 warrants per household every year or whatever that crazy stat was - fewer cops required.

That might be offset by fewer fines but it has contributed to doubling poverty there so a bunch of those fines weren't ever getting paid anyway.

I hope Obama gives serious consideration to trying to help these folks with some pardons. It would be a wonderful gesture to these oppressed people that their president reached out directly to demonstrate to the country that they matter.

A bunch of these warrants stink and would be suffocating a bunch of innocent folks.
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