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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:42 AM

 

Me Too Founder Tarana Burke Calls Biden's Response 'Disrespectful And Inexcusable'

Tarana Burke, founder of the Me Too movement, spoke out Friday in support of the women who have come forward to accuse Joe Biden of inappropriate behavior, calling out the former vice presidentís joking response to the scandal as ďdisrespectful and inexcusable.Ē

In a Twitter thread, Burke argued that the seven women who say they received unwanted physical contact from Biden were right to speak up and that the likely 2020 contender appears be deeply missing the point they are trying to make.

ďItís about bodily autonomy, itís about power and leadership,Ē wrote Burke, who first started using the phrase ďMe TooĒ to raise awareness about the pervasiveness of sexual misconduct in 2006.

...

Burke reiterated in her tweets that nobody is ďcalling for [Biden] to be incarcerated or sent away.Ē But just because his behavior isnít as extreme as that of disgraced film producer Harvey Weinstein ― who is facing rape charges ― that doesnít mean it should be ignored, Burke said. Doing so, she argued, will only ďhelp deepen a culture of silence around all sexual harassment and violence.Ē


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I stand with Tarana Burke on this.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 184 replies Author Time Post
Reply Me Too Founder Tarana Burke Calls Biden's Response 'Disrespectful And Inexcusable' (Original post)
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 OP
secondwind Apr 2019 #1
MadDAsHell Apr 2019 #3
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #62
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #71
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #75
Chemisse Apr 2019 #182
helpisontheway Apr 2019 #4
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #8
greymattermom Apr 2019 #27
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #76
bitterross Apr 2019 #126
LW1977 Apr 2019 #153
helpisontheway Apr 2019 #2
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #9
lapfog_1 Apr 2019 #14
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #19
lapfog_1 Apr 2019 #39
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #45
lapfog_1 Apr 2019 #57
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #61
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #84
helpisontheway Apr 2019 #15
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #20
John Fante Apr 2019 #152
Lazy Daisy Apr 2019 #167
Chemisse Apr 2019 #183
democratisphere Apr 2019 #5
WeekiWater Apr 2019 #6
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #10
Cha Apr 2019 #140
George II Apr 2019 #12
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #21
R B Garr Apr 2019 #30
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #34
R B Garr Apr 2019 #36
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #38
R B Garr Apr 2019 #43
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #47
R B Garr Apr 2019 #107
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #109
R B Garr Apr 2019 #120
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #121
R B Garr Apr 2019 #130
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #131
True Blue American Apr 2019 #176
brush Apr 2019 #122
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #123
COLGATE4 Apr 2019 #29
Indygram Apr 2019 #7
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #11
Indygram Apr 2019 #16
hlthe2b Apr 2019 #22
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #23
Indygram Apr 2019 #32
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #41
Indygram Apr 2019 #50
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #51
padah513 Apr 2019 #129
flotsam Apr 2019 #124
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #125
flotsam Apr 2019 #128
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #132
flotsam Apr 2019 #136
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #137
Cha Apr 2019 #158
BannonsLiver Apr 2019 #166
Cha Apr 2019 #174
Demsrule86 Apr 2019 #169
quickesst Apr 2019 #148
Desert grandma Apr 2019 #155
Lazy Daisy Apr 2019 #171
Chemisse Apr 2019 #180
hlthe2b Apr 2019 #13
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #25
hlthe2b Apr 2019 #28
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #31
hlthe2b Apr 2019 #40
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #53
Merlot Apr 2019 #33
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #79
hlthe2b Apr 2019 #81
WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2019 #17
karynnj Apr 2019 #18
Polly Hennessey Apr 2019 #24
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #26
Indygram Apr 2019 #42
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #46
Indygram Apr 2019 #52
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #55
True Blue American Apr 2019 #177
Polly Hennessey Apr 2019 #35
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #37
Polly Hennessey Apr 2019 #58
Cha Apr 2019 #141
True Blue American Apr 2019 #178
Cha Apr 2019 #184
awesomerwb1 Apr 2019 #44
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #48
awesomerwb1 Apr 2019 #54
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #56
Polly Hennessey Apr 2019 #64
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #68
OilemFirchen Apr 2019 #144
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #146
OilemFirchen Apr 2019 #159
stonecutter357 Apr 2019 #49
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #59
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #60
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #63
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #65
LexVegas Apr 2019 #67
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #69
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #72
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #74
Lordquinton Apr 2019 #149
LexVegas Apr 2019 #73
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #70
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #87
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #88
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #95
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #96
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #101
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply .
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #103
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #105
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #104
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #106
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #108
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #110
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #111
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #133
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply .
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #143
Lordquinton Apr 2019 #150
LexVegas Apr 2019 #90
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply .
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #98
LexVegas Apr 2019 #99
Autumn Apr 2019 #115
Go Vols Apr 2019 #147
Autumn Apr 2019 #151
LexVegas Apr 2019 #66
Drifter Apr 2019 #77
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #78
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #80
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #82
BannonsLiver Apr 2019 #162
guillaumeb Apr 2019 #83
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #85
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #86
guillaumeb Apr 2019 #93
jalan48 Apr 2019 #89
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #92
jalan48 Apr 2019 #100
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #112
athena Apr 2019 #91
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #102
athena Apr 2019 #113
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #116
athena Apr 2019 #119
ProudMNDemocrat Apr 2019 #94
LanternWaste Apr 2019 #97
BannonsLiver Apr 2019 #114
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #117
BannonsLiver Apr 2019 #160
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #118
BannonsLiver Apr 2019 #164
bitterross Apr 2019 #127
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #134
bitterross Apr 2019 #172
tonedevil Apr 2019 #135
BannonsLiver Apr 2019 #161
tonedevil Apr 2019 #163
EveHammond13 Apr 2019 #165
NoMoreRepugs Apr 2019 #138
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2019 #139
NoMoreRepugs Apr 2019 #173
JI7 Apr 2019 #181
Post removed Apr 2019 #142
katmondoo Apr 2019 #145
Mme. Defarge Apr 2019 #154
katmondoo Apr 2019 #157
Indykatie Apr 2019 #156
Demsrule86 Apr 2019 #168
True Blue American Apr 2019 #179
Demsrule86 Apr 2019 #170
Martin Eden Apr 2019 #175

Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:46 AM

1. Oh for crying out loud. Enough already.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to secondwind (Reply #1)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:49 AM

3. Exactly. These women need to learn their place...

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to MadDAsHell (Reply #3)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:12 AM

62. zzzzzzzzz

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to MadDAsHell (Reply #3)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:17 AM

71. EVERYONE - THIS IS AN OLD ARTICLE THAT IS BEING POSTED FOR OBVIOUS REASONS ********

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
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Undecided

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #71)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:18 AM

75. GARBLEBRFLFGGDL!

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to MadDAsHell (Reply #3)

Thu Apr 11, 2019, 05:37 AM

182. Oh right. If you criticize a woman you must be sexist.

 

And because she started a movement, she speaks for all women everywhere who support MeToo.

Clearly she must be in line for canonization!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to secondwind (Reply #1)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:50 AM

4. +1 Agree 100%...So sick of this crap..nt

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to secondwind (Reply #1)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:58 AM

8. Hmmm. Interesting take on the founder of the movement.

 

You don't think attitudes toward things that make women uncomfortable is important?
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to secondwind (Reply #1)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:36 AM

27. I get that.

 

My boss used to put his hand on my shoulder. I hated it, not because it was sexual, but because it was a dominance gesture. Real hugs are totally different.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to greymattermom (Reply #27)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:18 AM

76. THIS IS AN OLD ARTICLE BEING POSTED AS IF IT JUST HAPPENED **********************************

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to secondwind (Reply #1)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:51 PM

126. Right! We did this whole thread already DAYS ago.

 

We've been here and done this. Reposting it is just bad for everyone.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=56182
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Response to secondwind (Reply #1)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 03:54 PM

153. This!!

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:49 AM

2. Gosh I wish these people would drop it and leave Biden alone

 

He might have invaded their personal space but he did not sexually assault them. He apologized and now they want to take everything he says and disect it. Beyond sick of all of it. Thiscaused us to lose someone like Al Franken too. We needed people like him to help us take down the orange asshole.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Response to helpisontheway (Reply #2)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:59 AM

9. So they should not talk about what makes the uncomfortable

 

because it wasn't sexual assault? How close to sexual assault does it need to be before it's OK for them to say something?
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #9)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:12 AM

14. did they do so at the time?

 

did they remove his hand from their shoulders and say "your physical expression of either support or sympathy is not needed or wanted"

did they say anything at the time at all?

Did they complain when others (especially those who they now support for POTUS) did the exact same thing as Joe?

If they didn't complain about Bernie Sanders putting HIS hands on their shoulders either then or now... why the dual standard?
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to lapfog_1 (Reply #14)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:29 AM

19. So there is a timeline?

 

There is no reason why they might feel like they can't say anything at the time?

They can't feel uncomfortable with one person but comfortable with another for their own reasons?

Maybe Biden gave them a creepy feeling for a multitude of options and Sanders didn't? I don't know. That would be something that would be up to them to decide.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #19)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:44 AM

39. so how would one know that a physical touch is unwanted?

 

and if the standard is... "don't invade personal space because you don't know what the person wants" then why would there NOT be a complaint about other prominent politicians touching these women in the exact same way (just because they feel now that the physical expression is OK from some but not others).

Neither of these male politicians (and why would a woman who doesn't like to be touched need to restrict the complaints to only men who touched them?) knew before hand if the touching was unwanted... so they both acted inappropriately... but only one (who is potentially running against the other one) is called out as a #metoo criminal bad person.

#metoo will lose support if it is used as a tool to discredit good men who did "nothing different" that others that the "victims" now support in politics. This will let the real offenders (like our current "grab them by the pussy" president) off because "how is what Trump did different than Joe Biden?" in the minds of many...

Witness Al Franken and what it did to his career... and he was one of our best Democrats.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Joe Biden

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Response to lapfog_1 (Reply #39)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:48 AM

45. So when I'm talking to a woman, I don't touch her.

 

I can still be next to her and not put my hands on her. Why is that so hard?

And if I feel like it is appropriate, why can't I just ask? Is that some burden to me?

All of these male politicians assumed that the touch was wanted and was OK. That's the problem. Maybe sometimes it is. Sometimes it isn't. The problem is that males often just assume that it is OK and don't make sure and are pretty crappy at reading the signs.

This can't just be about saying that "grab them by the pussy" is bad but anything less than that is fine. We need to have a discussion about males putting their hands on the small of the back of women as they pass them. We (males) need to learn that that is pretty shitty, too. Nobody is saying that an unwanted hand on the shoulder is the same as "grabbing their pussy." But it's still shitty and we should still talk about it.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #45)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:08 AM

57. I don't either

 

but then when a woman I used to work with now tries to sell me and my new company computer equipment... she hugs me "hello" on every sales visit. Should I care? She does it without asking me if it is ok for her to do so. Should I call my previous employers HR and make a complaint? These sorts of "offenses" against one's personal space are innocent in nature... no one is offering me sex in exchange for me purchasing something for which she would be granted a commission (we are talking about millions of dollars on revenue for her company). No one is sexually harassing me. I am not going to wait for years and when she is up for promotion then I will register a complaint with her HR department, sue her for sexual harassment or complain on a twitter channel about her behavior.

Because it isn't a big deal.

I think these women who are complaining about Joe Biden right now are doing so purely for political purposes and to try to remove him from the field of candidates for President... because they have either been told to do so by another candidate they support or they thought of it themselves. And I believe that to be despicable.

It's not like this is new behavior for Joe... and why didn't the complaints come when the #metoo movement started and everyone was outing truly gross behavior including rape or attempted rape. Why wait until Joe is about to announce a run for President.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Joe Biden

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Response to lapfog_1 (Reply #57)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:11 AM

61. If you don't want a hug, then you can tell her.

 

And are there women that might make claims to hurt someone? I'm sure there might be. But I'm going to continue to live my life with the assumption that those are pretty far and few between. That when a woman tells me that something makes her uncomfortable, I'm going to listen, believe her, and not tell her that she is wrong about that and that it is OK that that guy touched her. I'm not going to dismiss it. I'm not going to make it OK for others to dismiss it either so that we get more of that "culture of silence" that the article in the OP talks about.

I also don't feel I need to hold all women to a timeline that makes me feel better about things. If a woman wants to talk about her reality right now, then that is a good time for her to talk about it. If she wants to do it X days from now, that's a good time, too.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to lapfog_1 (Reply #14)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:29 AM

84. +1

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #9)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:12 AM

15. They said it! He apologized and said he would be more careful. End of story..

 

What else do they want from him? For him not to run?
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to helpisontheway (Reply #15)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:30 AM

20. His joking about it after the apology was pretty tone deaf.

 

And, I'm guessing they want a discussion and not to be dismissed.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #20)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 03:52 PM

152. These women had their 15 minutes.

 

They don't like physical contact of any kind. We get it. Move along.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Joe Biden

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #20)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 06:11 PM

167. Ding Ding Ding

 

Here's a kewpie doll.

If I were to vote in a presidential
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Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #20)

Thu Apr 11, 2019, 05:44 AM

183. This is so ridiculous. How can you pretend that they seriously 'want a discussion'?

 

If they really wanted a discussion about being uncomfortable about a moment of having their space invaded, they would spend 10 minutes talking about it to their therapist, or their spouse.

Or they would forget about it in an hour like the rest of us do when uncomfortable things happen - like all the time!

These women don't 'want a discussion' about their tender little feelings. They just don't want Biden to be president. Or possibly they were paid to not want him to be president.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:50 AM

5. Joe Biden did nothing wrong. Joe Biden's actions had nothing to do

 

with sexual harassment. Burke needs to stop relating the two in the same breath.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:55 AM

6. We know.

 

https://www.democraticunderground.com/128756182
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Response to WeekiWater (Reply #6)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:59 AM

10. Sorry

 

I searched the last couple of pages and didn't see it.

My bad.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #10)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:22 PM

140. Yeah, your "bad".. try putting it in the

 

search engine the next time.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Joe Biden

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Response to WeekiWater (Reply #6)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:02 AM

12. Yeah but, that was LAST week. We have to see this at least once every week until spring 2020......

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
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Joe Biden

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Response to George II (Reply #12)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:31 AM

21. That's rich

 

We still hear about Sanders having more than one house. And a million other things that he did 4 years ago.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #21)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:38 AM

30. Thanks for making it clear that your concern really

 

isnít about MeToo.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Response to R B Garr (Reply #30)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:42 AM

34. Of course it is.

 

But when people complain that we shouldn't talk about it because it's *GASP* a whole week old, that rings of some serious hypocrisy that should be pointed out.

I supported Sanders in 2016 but do not this time around. I don't think he's right for the time. Nor do I think Biden is.

But the level of dismissiveness toward the MeToo concerns on DU is troublesome at the least.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #34)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:43 AM

36. LOL

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to R B Garr (Reply #36)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:44 AM

38. Hard to argue with that well thought out retort.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #38)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:46 AM

43. Your MeToo concern isn't that well thought out.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to R B Garr (Reply #43)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:52 AM

47. Thank you for dismissing concerns about what women have to deal with.

 

It is important that we talk about this. YMMV, I guess.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #47)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:46 AM

107. You made it clear this isn't about women or MeToo.

 

Itís about Sanders.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to R B Garr (Reply #107)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:52 AM

109. I don't even support Sanders this time around.

 

My response about Sanders was that someone complained about this being brought up AGAIN when it's *GASP* FIVE DAYS OLD. How many posts a day do we have to see about Sanders and his stupid tax returns? Those that take part in those kind of threads don't get to say that this shouldn't be posted after 5 days.

But, yeah, you go ahead and keep saying this is somehow magically about Sanders. When I've clearly shown support for a different candidate (it's not even like I'm "undecided" to hide something)
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #109)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:20 PM

120. Your post 21 speaks for itself, as does this little change

 

confession. This isnít about MeToo.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Response to R B Garr (Reply #120)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:23 PM

121. Post 12 gives the context for post 21. Post 21 didn't just happen out of the blue.

 

What "change confession"? As to why I'm not supporting Sanders? It's actually pretty much the reason I'm not supporting Biden who I liked as VP (hint: it has nothing to do with the point of the OP).

But, again, if it makes you feel better to think something, then I guess you have at it.
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #121)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:53 PM

130. This isn't about MeToo

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to R B Garr (Reply #130)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:56 PM

131. This subthread has kind of devolved, for sure.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #47)

Thu Apr 11, 2019, 05:14 AM

176. I am a woman.

 

A Clerk put his hand on my shoulder at the grocery yesterday. I have had a couple of conversations with him.

I took it as a gesture of friendship.

Good God, this is getting ridiculous and my fellow Dems and those wanting attention have gone off the rails!

The MeToo movement is supposed to be about sexual harassment! Not idiotic space years later!
If I were to vote in a presidential
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Joe Biden

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #21)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:24 PM

122. A million other things being dollars. Oh the hypocrisy...the one who rails at...

 

millionaires and billionaires is one himself.
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Response to brush (Reply #122)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:27 PM

123. If you start a thread about that

 

you might want to be careful because I'm sure the double posting police that came after me here will go after you. As will the "old news" brigade.

Actually, I know they won't, but, you know....

But, yeah, I'm not pulling for Sanders to win this time around. I'll clearly vote for him if he does, though.
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Response to George II (Reply #12)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:38 AM

29. Amen!

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:57 AM

7. I was raped and I'm really sick of the bastardizing of MeToo

 

I can't even begin to express how distressing and hurtful it is to see a genuinely GOOD person being pig piled on as if his well meaning gestures were even REMOTELY comparable to me being violently beaten and raped. People are not mind readers. If someone's well meaning gestures make you feel uncomfortable then SAY SOMETHING right then. Don't decide to use your discomfort with an innocent gesture to try to destroy and demonize another person.

This feels like being violated all over again at how MeToo is being minimized and now people trying to speak out about sexual assault won't be taken as seriously anymore.
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Response to Indygram (Reply #7)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:00 AM

11. I'm sorry that happened.

 

But I don't know how it is minimizing the movement when it is the founder of the movement talking about it. She puts it into perspective of her movement.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #11)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:13 AM

16. Including innocent gestures under the same umbrella as VIOLENT RAPE minimizes MY trauma

 

I don't know how much more clear I can be. It's deeply insulting and hurtful.

When someone tries to hug me and I don't want a hug I just say, "I don't like hugs." Then they don't try to hug me. I don't wait a few years and then go to the press and try to intimidate them into not applying for a job they want and are qualified for.
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Response to Indygram (Reply #16)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:31 AM

22. Well said, Indygram...

 

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Response to Indygram (Reply #16)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:33 AM

23. I don't think the #metoo movement is about violent rape only.

 

And I don't think anyone is saying that what these women are talking about is the same as what you experienced. One of the paragraphs I quoted says explicitly that it isn't the same.

There myriad reasons why one might not feel they are able to tell someone they don't want physical contact from someone else. I think that is the discussion that is trying to be had here.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #23)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:41 AM

32. "Support survivors and end sexual violence"

 

That is what the MeToo movement is SUPPOSED to be about. It doesn't say "Coddling for people unwilling to speak up and set boundaries."

https://metoomvmt.org/
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Response to Indygram (Reply #32)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:45 AM

41. There is also this from the website

 

Many of us are survivors, too; so we know that empowering others through empathy is often a part of our own healing journeys.


I don't see a lot of empathy here sometimes.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #41)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:55 AM

50. Are you a survivor? I am

 

Have you been violently beaten and raped? I have.
Have you been groped against your will multiple times through your lifetime? I have.
Have you been sexually harassed dozens of times? I have.

All of the things I mentioned have one thing in common...the perpetrator sought or got sexual gratification from what they did. THAT was the CLEAR intent. Joe Biden's uninvited and sometimes unwelcome hugs were NEVER anything other than an attempt to provide comfort, support and encouragement. Trying to group it with something dirty and disgusting is beneath contempt and needs to stop.
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Response to Indygram (Reply #50)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:01 AM

51. I am not.

 

And, again, I am sorry that you are.

And neither I nor the article I quote are comparing what Biden did to what you experienced. I'm sorry if I gave that impression.

But do you not think that she is right that the attitudes we have toward these women help to perpetuate a culture of silence? Do you think that by having empathy toward what these women have gone through we can help with creating a better culture for the healing of people who have gone through what you have? That empathy is always better? That we can be better at empathy?

And I would also reiterate that if you want to continue this discussion elsewhere in the event that this overall thread is triggering, I am fine with that. I do want to know your viewpoint on it all.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #51)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:53 PM

129. Dude...

 

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Joe Biden

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #23)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:41 PM

124. Really-Because your heroine said this on Twitter:

 

"We canít only get up in arms when itís a Weinstein situation. These lesser talked about, often ignored violations and indignities are what help deepen a culture of silence around all sexual harassment and violence."

So she either conflates what Biden did with sexual harassment and violence or is just using #metoo to advance her politics. Either way she can Fuck off.
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Response to flotsam (Reply #124)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:46 PM

125. Pretty much what she says in the article in the OP. Which you COMPLETELY misunderstand.

 

She is not saying they are the same crime. She is saying that reacting to these women that have accused Biden like people on here are is just going to entrench this culture of silence. Women that have a truth to tell are going to see how these women are treated for just saying they were uncomfortable with what Biden did and they are not going to tell their truth for fear of being treated the same or worse.

And she's right. And you telling her to fuck off because she makes that point doesn't help, either. And isn't something I would expect on a liberal web site. But, yeah, the woman of color that started a social movement to empower women can fuck off because you support some old white guy for president. Jesus.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #125)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:53 PM

128. Really

 

You don't expect a democrat on a democratic discussion board to defend the democratic front runner from a spurious attack against his character while she is supporting a different democrat. And yes-she can fuck off!
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Response to flotsam (Reply #128)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:58 PM

132. So fuck women's issues--IT'S PRIMARY TIME!

 

Seems like a shitty position to take.

And neither I nor the article in the OP are saying Biden shouldn't run. Just that we need to have the discussion and make women feel like they can tell their truth when they want to.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #132)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:02 PM

136. Fuck the Frankening and those who spread it...

 

I'm done with you.
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Response to flotsam (Reply #136)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:04 PM

137. Oooh man, whatever am I going to do without you?

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #137)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 04:30 PM

158. Whatever are you going to do

 

that you can't bring Joe Biden down?
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Response to Cha (Reply #158)


Response to BannonsLiver (Reply #166)

Thu Apr 11, 2019, 12:58 AM

174. So blatantly

 

desperate.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #132)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 06:15 PM

169. Your primary pick would benefit from Biden being out. Have you consider as great as Mayor Pete is

 

and I like him, he won't win a general. Biden can and will hence all the attacks.
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Response to Indygram (Reply #16)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 03:07 PM

148. it is unfortunate....

 

.... that they are those who cannot grasp the wisdom in your words. A genuine voice of reason born out of a tragic event. Thank you
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Response to Indygram (Reply #16)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 04:12 PM

155. Thank you for saying

 

What many of us women are thinking.
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Response to Indygram (Reply #16)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 06:46 PM

171. I'm sorry for your tragedy

 

But know you are not alone. 1 in 4 women have been raped. In varying degrees from passed out and raped to full on violent beating and rape. Include sexually assaulted and that number goes up a great deal. Many women don't report their rapes. I didn't report mine.

Talking about the trauma of feeling uncomfortable when somebody you hardly know shows too familiar of affection, then feeling loss of control about what can be done about it because that person holds some sort of sway doesn't diminish your trauma in any way. We don't measure a woman's trauma by the severity. This isn't a contest. There are no medals given for having a gun held to your head while your drunken spouse does what he wants to your body, repeatedly. Nor do we tell a women who had her ass grabbed on the bus to just get over it, it wasn't that bad.

Joe Biden is an affectionate person. That's great for the people he calls friends and loved ones. But this isn't the first time his affectionate ways have been brought to his attention. In the past it's been called out and the person in question gave him cover, as women have been taught to do for generations. So Joe, being a man with power and prestige listened to all the people telling him it was OK and he's a great guy, because society told him it was OK and he's a great guy.

Now we have women speaking out. Speaking truth. It's not OK. This is my life, my personal space, my voice. You don't get to be overly familiar with me because YOU like to be affectionate. You don't get to be a great guy at my expense.

When the story came out, I gave Joe a pass because society has been telling him his whole life his actions were OK. When he apologized and said he's listening and learning I thought he was FKN awesome. Then he made fun..............................

So now we're back to Joe Biden getting to enjoy being an affectionate person to whomever he chooses cause he's a great guy and damn it, he's entitled to feel good about giving affection to people he barely knows.
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Response to Indygram (Reply #7)

Thu Apr 11, 2019, 05:33 AM

180. I totally agree. I think it's an insult to women who have been raped.

 

When the MeToo Movement started, I was really emotionally moved to be able to say - out loud, in public - 'me too' about being raped.

The realization that most women had suffered some kind of significant sexual assault in their lives seemed to give us all strength, and forge it into a movement.

Suddenly every shoulder touch - even those that are admittedly nonsexual! - are condemned by MeToo? That is an insult to all the women who have been raped to be equated with those who have 'suffered' a kiss on the head.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:11 AM

13. Your article was posted: 04/05/2019 06:52 pm--- FIVE days ago: You just won't let it go...

 



The backlash you are seeing is from those who may well have given all the accusers every benefit of the doubt, (as did I) had sympathy for them (as did I), but after weeks of the rehash, Biden's repeated mea culpas, and most of all, their total lack of grace in accepting, has turned many of us off, totally. I no longer hold any neutrality towards those who keep rehashing over and over and over and over. To me (and many others), that just SCREAMS agenda. I'm not even supporting Biden (at least yet), but damn, this just pisses me off daily.

Maybe it is time for some of these individuals--who proclaim they are so "offended" and remain so weeks later-- to go scream at their elderly grandparents for deigning to HUG THEM! OMG! Get it out of your system!
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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #13)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:34 AM

25. I just saw it today.

 



It resonated with me after his tone deaf joke about asking for consent less than 24 hours after his apology. Those jokes lead me to believe that he really doesn't get the point of the discussion.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #25)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:38 AM

28. Really? Have you never committed a nervous faux pas? Boy some here are really exceptional

 

and far less human than the rest of us... I don't think I or much of anyone I know could endure that level of "judgment".
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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #28)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:40 AM

31. Of course I have.

 

But if someone asked me to stop, I didn't then turn to the next person and make a joke about it. I was sorry for my mistake and tried to do better.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #31)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:45 AM

40. ahh, so than you do understand and belive in the concept of forgiveness...

 

Too bad more apparently do not.
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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #40)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:03 AM

53. I thought Biden's video apology was fine. And then he made his joke.

 

And that cut against the apology pretty hard.

And if I were on his campaign staff, I would have had him make the video apology earlier rather than issuing a statement through a spokesperson because I don't think that helped him as much.

But we still need to talk about it. Nobody--not I nor the article in the OP--are saying Biden shouldn't be "forgiven." But the article in the OP and I both agree that we need to continue this discussion.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #25)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:41 AM

33. Agreed, he doesn't get the point

 

A lot of people don't seem to get the point.

I don't think this is about disqualifying Biden from running. Better for Biden that these stories come out now than closer to the election.
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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #13)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:21 AM

79. Nice edit of your title.

 

Doesn't change anything about my response to the original.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #79)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:23 AM

81. Edited Title??? I took out the ET for Eastern Time Zone because it was superfluous

 

What on earth? Geebus
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:13 AM

17. I agree with her.

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:15 AM

18. I think that the ME Too movement was mostly organic -- not really led by anyone

 

That said, I think that she is going too far here. This episode did the OPPOSITE of "deepening a culture of silence around all sexual harassment and violence"

First of all, Biden's actions, inappropriate as some of them were, were not violence or even sexual harassment. In the years he was in the Senate, there were some senators on each side whose actions DID rise to that level. That was never Biden's reputation. If there was anything that rose to that level, it would have discovered when the Obama team vetted him - and if they missed it it would have been an issue in 2008.

So, at this point, you had a man who most people who actually know him call decent, compassionate ... and too demonstrative. He has acknowledged that and says that he will change his behavior.

The magnitude in the change in the Democratic half of the population on this can be measured by the fact that Joe Biden is being called out on this by many of the same people who were huge fans of Bill Clinton, who had far bigger problems - though not the Republican exaggerations.

Some of this might be simply a desire to nominate a woman, but it is clear that - even with everything shown - the majority of Americans do not see this as disqualifying for Biden.





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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:34 AM

24. Ok, women on one side of the room,

 

men on the other side and no looking across the aisle. Now, the only space women can/will/may invade will be each otherís space.
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Response to Polly Hennessey (Reply #24)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:35 AM

26. Or, and I know this might be a radical thought, maybe men (which I am)

 

could actually start paying attention to what they are doing and not assume that everyone wants to be touched by them.

Shocking, I know.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #26)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:46 AM

42. Do you mean like paying attention to rape survivors

 

Who express that minimizing their trauma by lumping unwanted hugs under the same umbrella as violent rape is deeply distressing?
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Response to Indygram (Reply #42)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:51 AM

46. I'm sorry that you went through that.

 

I've said that before.

But I also read a lot from other survivors (like on the MeToo website) who say that this type of discussion is important, too. That a society which dismisses the "small" violations like Biden committed is part of creating a rape culture. So I have contradictory messages. I'm empathetic to what you are saying. I am. If you want to bow out of this conversation and trash this thread because it triggers you, I fully understand that. If you want to have this conversation through messages so that you don't need to read the rest of the thread, I'm happy to do that. I would love to listen to your thoughts on this whole mess.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #46)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:03 AM

52. I don't believe you are

 

You minimized my trauma again with this post.

Intent matters and I think yours on this thread has become quite clear.

I support Biden 100% and the more this agenda is pushed the more I find his accusers motives to be highly suspect.
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Response to Indygram (Reply #52)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:07 AM

55. I didn't even know you as a poster on DU when I made the OP.

 

So, I clearly had no intent to minimize your trauma.

I have offered to continue this discussion more privately (on several occasions) so that you wouldn't have to have the trauma of this thread. I'm not sure what more I can do.

I have friends who have experienced the trauma you have and they have indicated that this type of discussion is necessary. So, as I mentioned earlier, I have conflicting views on whether this should be discussed, now. So I don't know how you would tell me to proceed in that reality. I both should and shouldn't talk about this. Which is why I have offered to have a discussion about that without away from this thread that bothers you, and I have indicated you can trash this thread so it doesn't continue to trigger you. I'm sorry that it is.
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Response to Indygram (Reply #42)

Thu Apr 11, 2019, 05:19 AM

177. Yes!

 

Real Trauma is being ridiculed by these silly accusations!

You have every right to be angry! I am too, for you!
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:42 AM

35. Exactly, no touch, no speak,

 

no eye contact. Whew, now everyone is safe.
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Response to Polly Hennessey (Reply #35)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:43 AM

37. Why don't you just go full MAGA and call them snowflakes?

 

That's your response to MeToo concerns? Really? Maybe you are in the wrong place.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #37)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:08 AM

58. No, I am not in the wrong place.

 

Iíve been here since the beginning of DU. The MeToo movement is becoming a caricature of itself and, to that end, diminishing the impact of a serious problem in this country.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #37)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:25 PM

141. Why don't you stop insulting DU members

 

because they disagree with you?
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Response to Cha (Reply #141)

Thu Apr 11, 2019, 05:21 AM

178. Thank you, Cha!

 

A male who thinks he speaks for women!

I stand for the real victims!
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Response to True Blue American (Reply #178)

Thu Apr 11, 2019, 01:27 PM

184. Exactly, True Blue!

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:48 AM

44. "just because his behaviour isn't as extreme as Weinstein"

 

That sentence I quoted from....WTF?

Seriously? Biden's and Weinstein's behaviors are galaxies apart and there is no reason to use them together in a sentence unless....

I guarantee you more people are seriously considering Joe Biden the more these silly comments keep being made.
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Response to awesomerwb1 (Reply #44)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:54 AM

48. "help deepen a culture of silence"

 

You don't think that part is true? Even on this thread we have the "well they didn't say it at the time" responses. There are "they shouldn't say this about good people like Biden" on this thread. If you don't see that this attitude helps that culture of silence, I think you might want to consider it more.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #48)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:04 AM

54. No thanks, I'm good.

 

I refuse to be a part of this silly hugger vs rapist = similar...stuff in this case. C ya.









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Response to awesomerwb1 (Reply #54)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:07 AM

56. Nobody is saying that but you. That comparison is not being made.

 

I don't know why it makes you feel better to think that it is.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #56)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:13 AM

64. Hugger versus Rapist equates

 

to similar. I am saying it too. Diminish your cause and everyone loses.
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Response to Polly Hennessey (Reply #64)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:15 AM

68. "just because his behavior isn't as extreme"

 

The article in the OP makes it clear they are different.

It's about not continuing a culture of silence.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #48)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:35 PM

144. Hmmm...

 

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=62179

Cuthbert Allgood (1,814 posts)
61. If you don't want a hug, then you can tell her.


And are there women that might make claims to hurt someone? I'm sure there might be. But I'm going to continue to live my life with the assumption that those are pretty far and few between. That when a woman tells me that something makes her uncomfortable, I'm going to listen, believe her, and not tell her that she is wrong about that and that it is OK that that guy touched her.

My bold.
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Response to OilemFirchen (Reply #144)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:39 PM

146. Not sure of your point.

 

Perhaps I am wrong, but my assumption about the post I responded to was that the poster was talking about a woman giving hugs. Then, in the paragraph, I was talking about myself, a male, and how I would respond to what a female tells me--the point of the OP.

If you have any insight into what I'm missing, I can perhaps respond better.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #146)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 04:44 PM

159. Of course not.

 

Throughout this thread, and the myriad of others on the subject, posters have suggested that women should be encouraged to express their boundaries - in order to avoid those boundaries being violated. You've fought back against that, because, apparently, everyone should know in advance what those boundaries are.

Yet here you've recommended the same for both a woman (in the subject line) and a man (presumably) in the body of the response. That's because you've properly, albeit accidentally, defaulted to the appropriate manner in which this should be dealt.

It may not be human nature for you to touch other people without first obtaining permission, but it would appear that you're actually just posturing.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 09:55 AM

49. #facknews !

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:09 AM

59. HEY OP WHAT'S THE DATE ON THIS ARTICLE

 

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #59)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:10 AM

60. and you're posting it like it just happened. purposely hiding the date.

 

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #60)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:12 AM

63. I've been through that up there and I linked to the article.

 

So I don't know who I'm "hiding" the date. You can follow the link.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #63)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:13 AM

65. add the date to the top of your OP

 

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #65)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:15 AM

67. ...

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
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Response to LexVegas (Reply #67)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:16 AM

69. THIS ARTICLE IS A WEEK OLD since the OP refuses to post the date

 

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #69)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:17 AM

72. GET THE TORCHES AND PITCHFORKS FOR THE GUY THAT LINKED TO THE ARTICLE

 

Take some breaths. It'll be OK.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #72)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:17 AM

74. ATTENTION ALL - POSTER LINKING TO AN OLD ARTICLE PRETENDING IT IS NEWS**********

 

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #74)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 03:44 PM

149. Do you go through every post checking the date

 

and screaming about it, or just the ones you have a bias against?
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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #69)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:17 AM

73. So?

 

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #65)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:16 AM

70. No.

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #70)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:32 AM

87. Ok. I'll be posting about Pete later.

 

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #87)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:34 AM

88. OK. Sounds great.

 

If you want to know that thing that bothers me most about him, it would be his comment about SJW when he was in college. Feel free to start a discussion about that if you want me to contribute.

And, again, for the record, I linked to the original article and hid nothing about it. I gave full access to it in the OP. Had I not done that, you MIGHT have a point.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #88)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:39 AM

95. I'll leave it as a surprise I know you will enjoy!

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #88)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:40 AM

96. ,,

 

yeah your good faith is shown in your abusive smart-ass responses to me. lol.
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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #96)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:08 AM

101. I'm not the one doing the all-caps shouting on this thread.

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #101)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:39 AM

103. .

 

you're shit-stirring with an old article and trying to deny it
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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #103)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:43 AM

105. 1. It's like 5 days old. 2. I have not denied that.

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #101)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:39 AM

104. my research for future posts is coming along well

 

two-way street so you have fun with your little game.
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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #104)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:45 AM

106. At least you are admitting here that anything you post is not about the issue

 

but "getting back" at some perceived slight you have that I actually had the audacity to post a 5-day-old article about an important topic.

I will say now that my response to you, if I even see your post and care enough to click on it, will be a link to this thread where you make your intent clear.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #106)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:49 AM

108. what were your words "well I linked to the original article"!!!!

 

wah.
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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #108)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:53 AM

110. Because I did. Because I wasn't hiding anything about the article.

 

And I would never use four exclamation points (though you don't put that in quotation marks) because no self-respecting English teacher would.

It's good that you have found a way to turn off the all caps, though. Nice job.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #110)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:54 AM

111. your replies eroded all good faith in your intentions. just give it up.

 

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #111)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:59 PM

133. ....

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #133)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:28 PM

143. .

 

wow that black police chief story...
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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #104)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 03:46 PM

150. You're going all out

 

over an article that was written only 5 days ago. What's your actual beef here?
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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #87)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:36 AM

90. ....

 

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primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to LexVegas (Reply #90)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:45 AM

98. .

 

added to ignore
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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #98)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:47 AM

99. ...

 

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primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #59)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 12:16 PM

115. Not the OP but when you click on the link the date is right on top.

 

POLITICS 04/05/2019 06:52 pm ET. Right under the Zulily ad and above the Me Too Founder Tarana Burke Calls Bidenís Response ĎDisrespectful And Inexcusableí header. Can't miss it.
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Response to Autumn (Reply #115)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:49 PM

147. Yep

 

I have bread thats older than this article.
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Response to Go Vols (Reply #147)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 03:46 PM

151. I've never seen a requirement that any article can only be posted once

 

or that they have a expiration date.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:14 AM

66. Rec. nt

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:19 AM

77. Fuck you Tarana ...

 


You make a mockery of the me too movement by insinuating that the allegations against Biden are remotely similar to actual sexual assault. We have a president who openly bragged about his sexual predatory behavior. That's where your energy should be focused.

Cheers
Drifter
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Response to Drifter (Reply #77)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:21 AM

78. +1000

 

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Response to Drifter (Reply #77)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:23 AM

80. Tarana makes a mockery of her movement.

 

Interesting spin on that.

I'm sure she will take your direction on how to do a social movement with the seriousness it deserves.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #80)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:24 AM

82. she's power crazed. she wants to be king-maker and build her personal brand.

 

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #82)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 04:52 PM

162. And make money. Lots and lots of money.

 

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:29 AM

83. No matter that date of the article,

 

the behavior took place.

And questioning the motives of the women who complained is, in my view, part of the problem.
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Response to guillaumeb (Reply #83)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:31 AM

85. zzzzzzzzzzz

 

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Response to guillaumeb (Reply #83)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:32 AM

86. Look at us agreeing about something. And I honestly just saw this today.

 

I would add questioning the timing, too. Which I get is part of the motive, but we don't have to have a specific timeline for people to speak their truth. I didn't see people on here asking why women waiting for a specific time to talk about Harvey W. Or Trump. Again, not comparing the actions as equitable, but people feel the strength to talk at different times. My job at that point is to listen and have empathy.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #86)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:37 AM

93. And even if there was silence before now,

 

MeToo explains the why of the silence.

When someone accuses a powerful figure, or many someones, the tendency of the public and the media is to assume bad intent on the part of the accuser(s).


If anyone was a victim in the past, and they find the courage to speak now, they should be encouraged.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:35 AM

89. Unfortunately, this issue is going to follow Biden as far as he goes in the

 

Presidential race, if he declares himself a candidate. It will effectively neuter any talk about Trump and his sexual behavior or at best turn the race into a discussion of sexual behavior, pushing other issues about Trump's actions as President into the background.
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Response to jalan48 (Reply #89)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:36 AM

92. The 33% (or whatever) of Trump's base will never care about his sexual behavior.

 

Others might. Having this discussion is never a bad thing.

And neither I nor the article in the OP are saying Biden should be disqualified for this. Just that the discussion needs to happen.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #92)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:49 AM

100. I don't think having this discussion between Trump and Biden is a good idea.

 

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Response to jalan48 (Reply #100)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:57 AM

112. Nobody is.

 

The article in the OP is just admitting out front that they aren't saying they are the same. Which, apparently, was needed given all the hand wringing on a liberal website. Just imagine what the non-liberals are saying. The article in the OP wants everyone to know that they aren't the same. But that the reactions to the "lesser" of the offenses can help create/foster/continue a culture of silence, too.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:36 AM

91. Thank you for all your comments on this issue.

 

I just wanted to let you know that someone out there agrees with you and appreciates your clarity on this issue.

Iím not even young any more, but just last Friday, I was at a bar where a drunk older man my husband and I were talking to kept touching my back. It was behavior that is considered socially acceptable, but there was a definite sexual element to it, and I hated it. There was nothing I could do to stop it without making a scene, and Iíve since been dreading seeing this person again. I look back on all the times when I was a young woman and drunk older men at parties would touch my back or arm or hug me. Iím not a touchy-frely person, and I never liked what these men did, but I knew that if I didnít accept it with a smile, I would be seen as a trouble maker, as if the men were just being friendly and I was the one who had a sick mind for seeing something sexual in their behavior. When a man is all touchy-feely with young or attractive women but keeps a respectful distance from other men, he is committing low-level sexual harassment, and he knows it. Thatís not to say that an unwelcome touch is equivalent to sexual assault or rape, but it is sexist and disrespectful and should not be excused and celebrated as is being done here. I look forward to a time when women are not treated like pieces of meat, people stop assuming that young women like being touched by older men, and women are accorded the same level of respect as men. I fear I wonít be here to see it.

ETA: I fully expect to be flamed for not saying something to stop the manís behavior and coming here to complain about it instead. Because, of course, Iím the problem. A man couldnít possibly be expected to imagine that the women whose skin and body he likes touching donít enjoy the attention.
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Response to athena (Reply #91)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:14 AM

102. Thank you.

 

My wife and I are solidly in our 50s. She is an attorney. She tells me often of judges, other attorneys, etc that feel just fine putting their hands on here and there is very little she can say or do given the impact it would have potentially on her case. Like me, she doesn't think that this disqualifies Biden (though she also thinks his joke after the apology was seriously tone deaf and will hurt him), but she agrees we need to have this discussion so that men can realize what they are doing even when they don't have the intent of Trump to be "grabbing pussies."
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #102)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 12:12 PM

113. It's sad that even age doesn't bring respect.

 

Even if men asked for permission, as you note, in many cases there is a power differential that doesnít allow the woman to give a free answer. We need to start expecting men to treat women with respect, not ask for permission to treat women like objects.

I agree with you and your wife. I donít think Biden is a sexual predator. Heís just from a different time. I really liked his earlier response, which indicated that he understands and respects changing attitudes. As for the joking, I have a husband who loves to tease and crack unexpected jokes, so I imagine that Biden just wanted to be funny. He has an unfortunate tendency to make inappropriate comments, which is why I donít think he will last long as a candidate. I do like and respect him, but I think we have much stronger candidates running.
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Response to athena (Reply #113)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 12:17 PM

116. It's just sad, really.

 

And, yeah, I get that Biden is the fun uncle. The main reason I don't think he will do well is that when faced with Trump's usual insult tactic, Biden is going to want to roll up his sleeves and get into it with him and that is just going to mean Trump wins. We need someone that can approach it like AOC does to those that come after her. Quick FU and then back to the policy discussion. Main reason right now that I like Pete, though there are others for sure.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #116)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 12:49 PM

119. That's an excellent point.

 

After two terms of a given president, Americans tend to pick someone who has the opposite personality and demeanor. Thatís how Obama won after two terms of GWB. Trump hasnít had two terms yet, but heís so extreme that a lot of people are fed up with him. I understand that many liberals want someone who will express their anger, but the wise choice would be a candidate who is Trumpís opposite: civilized, deliberate, well-spoken, and thoughtful. Thatís why I think someone like Warren, who would normally seem unelectable in this macho country, might have a chance this time around.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:37 AM

94. Joe Biden is NO harasser or predator, Ms. Burke.......

 

Unlike the Orange Puke in the White House, who slammed the women who dared to stand up to him.

Ms. Burke can be upset with Biden's video, but he was contrite and will be more aware of his actions and surroundings. Put me in a room with a Joe and nothing will happen. I am a hugger too, and I will my consent to be hugged.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 10:44 AM

97. Lots and lots of people are only now discovering an awareness of physical contact?

 

Through Steubenville, Isla Vista and the genesis of MeToo, so many people were either silent, or defending actions taken against women.

But now... now that the the time is politically convenient, now that expediency compels us to take notice for the sake of a sacred cow candidate, now that it is to our advantage to speak out against the gray areas (and implicitly speak out against a different candidate) does everyday sexism become an issue.

The allegation will fly fast... "I've always stood with women!!!"


Imagine that.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 12:15 PM

114. Burke is a self important nut job

 

I stand with Joe Biden, not with people who are working their asses off to see Donnie gets another 4 years.
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Response to BannonsLiver (Reply #114)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 12:18 PM

117. Founder of MeToo is a "self important nut job."

 

I'll add that to the list of things I never thought I'd read on a liberal web site.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #117)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 04:48 PM

160. Good deal.

 

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Response to BannonsLiver (Reply #114)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 12:32 PM

118. it's gone to her head. she is now an abuser herself.

 

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Response to EveHammond13 (Reply #118)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 04:58 PM

164. +10000

 

Sheís basically like that hypocrite from Italy who slept with a 15 year old boy, and Rose McGowan who tried to make it all about Rose. Both did a lot more harm than good. .
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 01:52 PM

127. We did this thread already. This is OLD news.

 

Your re-posting this was completely unnecessary and makes me wonder about your motives.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=56182
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Response to bitterross (Reply #127)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:00 PM

134. It's a whole 5 days old. And I discuss it in depth above.

 

So if you have anything new to offer, let me know and I'll reply to that.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #134)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 08:35 PM

172. You had nothing new to offer in your "discussion" above.

 

I started reading your posts. You've offered nothing new that was not covered in the earlier thread.

So, you've done nothing to advance the cause of electing a Democrat in the next election. In fact, you've harmed the cause by being divisive.

NOTICE: I DID NOT say you've done nothing to advance the cause of electing Biden. No, I said "Democrat." Because all you've done is cause more bullshit fighting about something that was properly dying out.

I hope you're happy all you've accomplished is being divisive again. You probably are. Probably are very happy you have a thread with so many responses. You probably feel you've contributed to the discourse.

You haven't.
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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:00 PM

135. The flop-sweat...

 

from the desperate defense of VP Biden is getting deep enough to drown in.
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Response to tonedevil (Reply #135)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 04:50 PM

161. Real world data shows that to be merely wishful thinking

 

I know itís frustrating the plan didnít work.
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Undecided

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Response to BannonsLiver (Reply #161)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 04:53 PM

163. OK /nt

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to BannonsLiver (Reply #161)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 05:21 PM

165. +1000

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:14 PM

138. Putting Biden and Weinstein in the same sentence is complete bullshit.

 

This Burke woman should be ashamed of herself.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to NoMoreRepugs (Reply #138)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:16 PM

139. Even if that sentence says they aren't the same in what was done?

 

Seems like a reasonable sentence.

Do you have some insight into the claim that the reactions to the women who spoke their truth about Biden is helping to support a culture of silence? Because I think that claim is extremely valid.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #139)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 11:05 PM

173. "Just because it wasn't as extreme as Weinstein...."

 

It's not in the same fucking universe. I say again, its total bullshit.

Whataboutism and both sides do it horseshit and crap like this where the bar is set at Weinstein and Biden isn't quite that bad is a smear.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #139)

Thu Apr 11, 2019, 05:34 AM

181. should white women who touch black women's hair without their permission

 

be said to be less bad versions of Harvey Weinstein ?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)


Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 02:37 PM

145. I am a woman and I have had enough of Tarana Burke

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 04:01 PM

154. Fine. Don't vote for him.

 

And damage the credibility of Me Too while youíre at it.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Mme. Defarge (Reply #154)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 04:26 PM

157. Tarana is damaging the movement herself

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 04:14 PM

156. Then Stand On - Thankfully the Majority of Dems Don't.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 06:13 PM

168. A big who cares what she says...the me to movement is in shreds thanks to politically motivated

 

women such as herself. And I say as a sexual assault survivor...fuck off...Tarana-you don't speak for me.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #168)

Thu Apr 11, 2019, 05:26 AM

179. 100%+

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2019, 06:17 PM

170. why would you pretend this was new...make it look like there are further attacks on Biden...welcome

 

to ignore.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Original post)

Thu Apr 11, 2019, 05:03 AM

175. "sexual harrassment and violence"

 

Really -- that's what Joe Biden was doing?
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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