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Undecided 44%
Elizabeth Warren22%
Joe Biden14%
Bernie Sanders8%
Pete Buttigieg6%

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:28 PM

 

This is not, in any way, a good thing


?s=19


Charles P. Pierce

@CharlesPPierce
As of the moment, there are no people of color in this monthís Democratic debate. This is not in any way a good thing.

530
1:14 PM - Dec 3, 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

119 replies, 5479 views

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Arrow 119 replies Author Time Post
Reply This is not, in any way, a good thing (Original post)
mcar Dec 3 OP
msongs Dec 3 #1
WhiskeyGrinder Dec 3 #3
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #2
mcar Dec 3 #5
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #10
MerryBlooms Dec 3 #14
sheshe2 Dec 3 #81
myohmy2 Dec 4 #112
stonecutter357 Dec 3 #4
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #6
mcar Dec 3 #11
Demsrule86 Dec 3 #12
IluvPitties Dec 3 #16
redqueen Dec 3 #7
Indykatie Dec 3 #8
mcar Dec 3 #13
madville Dec 3 #50
RhodeIslandOne Dec 3 #66
squirecam Dec 3 #90
Amimnoch Dec 3 #9
squirecam Dec 3 #91
Retrograde Dec 3 #15
DrToast Dec 3 #18
Demsrule86 Dec 3 #19
DrToast Dec 3 #17
mcar Dec 3 #20
Cha Dec 3 #77
mcar Dec 3 #78
Cha Dec 3 #80
TCJ70 Dec 3 #21
mcar Dec 3 #22
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #23
TCJ70 Dec 3 #24
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #30
TCJ70 Dec 3 #32
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #42
TCJ70 Dec 3 #49
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #61
TCJ70 Dec 3 #63
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #67
squirecam Dec 3 #92
SaschaHM Dec 3 #35
mr_lebowski Dec 3 #36
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #40
tishaLA Dec 3 #45
mr_lebowski Dec 3 #48
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #62
mcar Dec 3 #54
crazytown Dec 3 #82
Codeine Dec 3 #33
TCJ70 Dec 3 #34
mr_lebowski Dec 3 #53
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #70
mr_lebowski Dec 3 #100
cwydro Dec 4 #115
mcar Dec 3 #52
TCJ70 Dec 3 #56
mcar Dec 3 #59
TCJ70 Dec 3 #64
spicysista Dec 3 #75
TCJ70 Dec 4 #109
Kurt V. Dec 3 #83
blm Dec 3 #101
loyalsister Dec 3 #103
TCJ70 Dec 4 #110
Skya Rhen Dec 3 #25
ismnotwasm Dec 3 #43
Tarheel_Dem Dec 4 #107
treestar Dec 3 #26
mr_lebowski Dec 3 #47
Salviati Dec 3 #65
LenaBaby61 Dec 3 #27
getagrip_already Dec 3 #28
mcar Dec 3 #29
getagrip_already Dec 3 #31
Hassin Bin Sober Dec 3 #41
mcar Dec 3 #55
ritapria Dec 3 #37
tishaLA Dec 3 #46
underthematrix Dec 3 #38
tritsofme Dec 3 #39
DrToast Dec 3 #51
Name removed Dec 3 #44
mcar Dec 3 #58
BannonsLiver Dec 3 #84
mcar Dec 3 #86
Algernon Moncrieff Dec 3 #57
mcar Dec 3 #60
Algernon Moncrieff Dec 3 #68
mcar Dec 3 #73
Bernardo de La Paz Dec 3 #69
Mr.Bill Dec 3 #72
demmiblue Dec 3 #71
mcar Dec 3 #87
BeyondGeography Dec 3 #74
mcar Dec 3 #76
evertonfc Dec 3 #79
Polybius Dec 3 #104
ancianita Dec 3 #85
mcar Dec 3 #88
ancianita Dec 3 #94
flibbitygiblets Dec 3 #89
squirecam Dec 3 #93
killaphill Dec 4 #108
squirecam Dec 4 #113
killaphill Dec 4 #114
squirecam Dec 4 #116
ancianita Dec 3 #95
totodeinhere Dec 3 #98
KayF Dec 3 #96
obliviously Dec 3 #97
jalan48 Dec 3 #99
dflprincess Dec 3 #102
jalan48 Dec 3 #105
stopdiggin Dec 4 #106
mcar Dec 4 #111
stopdiggin Dec 4 #117
LongtimeAZDem Dec 4 #118
brooklynite Dec 4 #119

Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:29 PM

1. harris was not included in dec. debate? nt

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to msongs (Reply #1)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:33 PM

3. She qualified, but she's dropped out.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:30 PM

2. Yeah I'm pissed

 

Not surprised, but pissed.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #2)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:35 PM

5. I am angry, ism

 

Just saw that Steyer has qualified, again. Seems the rich white men can get into the race late and buy their way up, while the far more qualified POC get nowhere.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Reply #5)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:37 PM

10. I feel you

 

Thatís WHY Iím pissed. I donít have the energy to argue with people who wonít factor in race and gender unless itís their outrage de jour.


Race and gender are always factors.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #10)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:40 PM

14. You said it! So disappointed and ticked off.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Reply #5)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 04:04 PM

81. I hear ya, mcar.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to mcar (Reply #5)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 09:52 AM

112. it's sad...

 

...that money plays such a large part in our elections...

...but like everything else in our country, money always plays a dominant role and people with it get their way...

...we may rue the day we factor money into so many of the decisions we make as a society...

...may people like Bernie help change this...
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Bernie Sanders

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:33 PM

4. why did Kamala Harris drop out ?

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to stonecutter357 (Reply #4)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:35 PM

6. Not enough funding

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to stonecutter357 (Reply #4)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:37 PM

11. Here's her notice on medium - money, of course

 

https://medium.com/@KamalaHarris/i-am-suspending-my-campaign-today-6dca8cefb252

My campaign for president simply doesnít have the financial resources we need to continue.

Iím not a billionaire. I canít fund my own campaign. And as the campaign has gone on, itís become harder and harder to raise the money we need to compete.

In good faith, I canít tell you, my supporters and volunteers, that I have a path forward if I donít believe I do.

So, to you my supporters, it is with deep regret ó but also with deep gratitude ó that I am suspending my campaign today.


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to stonecutter357 (Reply #4)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:37 PM

12. She was not going to win the nomination so why continue...others should follow her

 

example.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Demsrule86 (Reply #12)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:43 PM

16. Exactly. The race is, in reality, down to 4.

 

Biden, Warren, Sanders and Buttigieg.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to mcar (Original post)


Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:36 PM

8. Starting Our Primaries in IA and NH is Responsible For Some Of This

 

It's unfair to the base of the party to continue with the current primary calendar which starts in 2 states that are 90% White.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Indykatie (Reply #8)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:39 PM

13. This is true

 

Also holding women to a higher standard than male candidates.

I find it odd, to say the least, the brouhaha over a Harris staffer leaving when campaign staffers leave other campaigns all the time and it barely gets mentioned. Funny, isn't it, how that staffer who published her bitter, blistering letter, got all that attention on her way to work for Bloomberg?
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to Indykatie (Reply #8)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:39 PM

50. She was performing poorly everywhere else though

 

She was polling 4th in her home state and at or below that in S.C.

People everywhere just didnít like her candidacy, regardless of race, sex, etc.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Indykatie (Reply #8)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:01 PM

66. And an old white man is pulling over 50% with African American voters

 

So thereís a few things that really werenít going well for Harris and it wasnít Iowa or New Hampshire ( which by the way, some guy named Barack had no problem using to his advantage).
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Amy Klobuchar

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Response to RhodeIslandOne (Reply #66)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 04:58 PM

90. Yes

 

Obama won AA voters.....after he won white Iowa.

Harris was down nationally. It wasnít like she had states where she was winning, as opposed to Biden, who has NV and SC to rely on.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Amy Klobuchar

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:36 PM

9. Heh, and I'm really wishing it was already narrowed down to 1 person..

 

Incumbent election year.
Economy has managed to survive Trump so far thanks to President Obama.
No real Republican primary.
No 3rd party effect on Trump.

Not the best year to have such a large and contentious primary. The sooner we're down to 1, and can ramp up the fight against Cheeto the better.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Amimnoch (Reply #9)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 04:59 PM

91. Ok

 

But not him. ^
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Amy Klobuchar

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:41 PM

15. Booker's not in it?

 

Heís in my top tier
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to Retrograde (Reply #15)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:44 PM

18. His polls don't make the cut

 

Heís qualified based on donor threshold.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Amy Klobuchar

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Response to Retrograde (Reply #15)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:44 PM

19. There are four candidates who theoretically could win...Biden, Sanders, Warren

 

and Buttigeig. Personally, I think Biden is the nominee by super Tuesday. Candidates other than these four should drop out.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:43 PM

17. Yang and Gabbard will qualify

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Amy Klobuchar

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:49 PM

20. HRC speaks

 


?s=19


Hillary Clinton

@HillaryClinton
To all the candidates, staff, and volunteers who have worked their hearts out for presidential campaigns that have endedóremember that fighting for what you believe in is always worth it.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Reply #20)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:52 PM

77. Excellent inspiring tweet from Hillary!

 

Thank you, mcarSorry, about Kamala dropping out.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Cha (Reply #77)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:54 PM

78. Thanks Cha

 

A bit of a shock and I'm very disappointed. We still have a number of good candidates for whom I will happily volunteer in the GE.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Reply #78)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:57 PM

80. I know.. and I know how it feels..

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:52 PM

21. Only if you think there HAS to be a person of color on the stage.

 

Which to that my question would be: who cares? Have good ideas that appeal to a good number of Americans and you'll most likely make it to the debates. If someone got their ideas out there first or got their supporters together more quickly/efficiently, that's how it goes.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #21)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:53 PM

22. ...

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #21)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:54 PM

23. Who cares? Whoa..

 

Holy Fucking Shit.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #23)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:58 PM

24. Yes...who cares? What matters more: how someone looks or their ideas? n/t

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #24)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:09 PM

30. Sweet Jesus

 

I canít even.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #30)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:15 PM

32. Obviously. n/t

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #32)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:29 PM

42. Oh my.

 

You got me.


Perhaps you should use an MLK quote as well.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #42)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:39 PM

49. I could...but given your response to them below...

 

...I'm not sure what value you place on them.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #49)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:51 PM

61. Always depends on the source and context

 

Quotes from warriors are valuable, but itís disingenuous to use that particular one when the argument is literally saying, ďThe color of the skin doesnít matter, only the content of characterĒ. That particular quote was from a man with a dream of that happening. Someday. It didnít happen in his lifetime, because he was murdered fighting for his dream

You clearly believe that we have reached that point. Racism either doesnít exist, or doesnít influence thoughts and decisions and institutions enough for it to be a factor anymore.

You and I, literally have nothing in common on this topic.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #61)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:55 PM

63. I don't think we've reached that point as a society...

 

...but we can each reach that point individually.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #63)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:01 PM

67. That's how life works for you huh?

 

Good for you.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #61)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 05:02 PM

92. I'm sorry

 

Was our last president not a black man? And our last nominee a white woman?

Life isnít perfect. There are still issues. But Harris didnít drop out due to racism or sexism. She lost on her own merit. Get out of here with that BS.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Amy Klobuchar

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #30)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:20 PM

35. This is funny.

 

Someone supporting Elizabeth "I just took a DNA Test" Warren would spend time diminishing lived experiences as "looks" to prop up "ideas".

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #30)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:21 PM

36. Maybe it's not THAT foreign an idea ... I would submit that

 

It takes putting oneself in a particular mindset ... one in which we don't see people in terms of the color of their skin.

But rather, what one is judged by ... is the content of their character.

You can at least imagine having that mindset, I would guess?

I suspect at least ... that is what the poster you're responding to is alluding to. FWIW.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mr_lebowski (Reply #36)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:28 PM

40. Honey, don't use quotes from a murdered black man to try and erase racism

 

Itís a bad look.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #40)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:33 PM

45. +1000

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #40)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:38 PM

48. Oh, so Kamala is no longer in the race because 'racism' and no other explanation is possible?

 

I guess 2008 and 2012 never happened.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mr_lebowski (Reply #48)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:51 PM

62. Not what I said.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #40)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:45 PM

54. Boom!

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #40)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 04:12 PM

82. +!

 

Yes.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #21)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:18 PM

33. I am the whitest guy on the forum

 

and that shit just made ME cringe. Goddamn.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Codeine (Reply #33)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:20 PM

34. The majority of presidential elections I've been eligible to vote for...

 

...have had Democratic nominees who weren't like me. I voted for them anyway. If I can do it, so can everyone else.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #34)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:44 PM

53. Agree ... eyes on the prize here ...

 

We don't need to give the media an anti-Democrat talking point to harp about for days on end. ZOMG WHAT HAPPENED TO THE PARTY OF OBAMA?!?

Not helpful.

If enough PoC's had united behind a PoC candidate, even if it was JUST THEM ... that candidate would still in the race. They'd have the money, they'd have the polls. The candidates are being decided on merits, as best it's possible under our system.

It's unfortunate, I'd dig it if every candidate was a Nigerian-Born Gay Trans Female Refugee Muslim Vegan who spoke Swahili and 20 other languages ... as long as they had the money and the polls needed to continue.

But that's not the situation, at least not at the moment.

Maybe without Harris in the race, folks will coalesce around Booker?

I hope so, he's one of my favorites, easily.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mr_lebowski (Reply #53)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:28 PM

70. Dude I mean...

 

ďNigerian-Born Gay Trans Female Refugee Muslim VeganĒ

What the actual fuck
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #70)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 10:09 PM

100. Seems you want to take everything I say in the worst possible way ...

 

I'm saying I PERSONALLY would completely support and indeed love ... an incredible diversity in our choices in the folks our party puts forward. So I went over the top to attempt to make this point, which would've thought to be obvious, but ...

Unfortunately there are certain realities that come into play. Money. Polls. The agreed-upon rules of the Party to decide who makes the debates.

Not everything comes down to racism. Kamala wasn't really even popular with PoC, she didn't catch fire or capture imaginations. It happens. It's not cause she's dark-skinned, or it's very little of the equation.

Look, I'm from teh Bay Area, born in Oakland, I've been to SF 1000 times probably, used to work there ... twice. I like Kamala, I've known who she is for quite some time. I wanted her voice in this contest and I'd have been happy to vote for her.

She didn't make it. It's unfortunate. I say we don't let our party be divided over it. Maybe Booker will pick up enough of the support she had to continue?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #70)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 01:20 PM

115. Good lord. No shit.

 

Yikes.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #21)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:44 PM

52. Are you seriously suggesting that only the white people have good ideas?

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Reply #52)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:47 PM

56. No. That wouldn't make sense as we've already nominated and elected Obama twice. n/t

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #56)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:51 PM

59. Huh?

 

So all the candidates of color this time are just no good, have no good ideas? But the white candidates all have good ideas, thus they are on the debate stage?

What are Steyer's good ideas? How do they compare to Harris's?
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Reply #59)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:57 PM

64. "Good ideas" is a relative term...

 

...the definition of which depends on who you're talking to. If Harris wasn't able to adequately get her ideas out there and build up the financial and polling support needed to stay in the race, that's how it goes. I think you're getting hung up on a term that really shouldn't be the focal point of the post.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #21)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:45 PM

75. I don't think you mean to convey...

 

...the insensitivity that is coming across in your post. "Have good ideas that appeal to a good number of Americans" is a part of the problem. Whom, exactly, comprises these "good number of Americans"? The answer to that can be very different depending on the room. In Iowa, it's going to look a certain way. At the "She The People" forum, it's going to look another way.
If the press and the pollsters focus heavily on places that look like Iowa, a particular narrative will form. This will push the priorities of campagins, press coverage, and pollsters to reinforce that narrative formed by and for people who look like those in Iowa.
If you have a moment, check out these video clips. It may help you to see why you sound a bit tone deaf to some.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to spicysista (Reply #75)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 09:10 AM

109. Harris dropped out due to insufficient campaign finances. Also, I think people are getting...

 

...hung up on the "good ideas" portion of my post. That isn't to say she didn't have good ideas (which is a relative term depending on who you're talking to). It's that others were able to get those ideas out there in apparently a better/more efficient way which helped them better fund their campaigns into the future.

The majority of the presidential campaigns I've been eligible to vote in have had Democratic nominees who don't match my demographics. I voted for them anyway. If I can do it, so can everyone else.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #21)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 04:21 PM

83. There are systemic issues at play also. not just merit. That's why I'm not happy about this.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #21)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 10:24 PM

101. Well THAT was kind of abrupt and insensitive.

 

This exit hurts. If you canít feel it yourself then at least respect the feelings of those who do.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to TCJ70 (Reply #21)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 10:48 PM

103. I care

 

Reverting to white supremacy is a problem to me. Kamala Harris and Joe Biden have similar problems with having close ties to our racist criminal justice system. I think more people are more forgiving of Biden, and it has everything to do with the fact that he is white.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to loyalsister (Reply #103)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 09:11 AM

110. Harris being out "reverting to white supremacy"? OK. n/t

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 01:59 PM

25. I'm glad that the preferred choice of the majority of AAs is still standing and that our voices

 

actually matter - that we actually have a say...
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Skya Rhen (Reply #25)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:30 PM

43. There is that

 

Biden is polling high among Black men especially.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to Skya Rhen (Reply #25)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 04:59 AM

107. Thank you Skya. Everyone keeps pointing to Obama in IA, and how black people came around...

 

after his win, but AFAIC, there's no Obama in this election cycle. I can't speak for other POC, but I'm sorry, I wasn't feeling Kamala after she went after Biden in that debate. And I've never felt Cory Booker, and still don't.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:00 PM

26. there wasn't last time though

 

older white women and old white man and that was it.

We don't want to make it all about that because that plays into the right wing arguments. The Presidency isn't the only office in the world.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to treestar (Reply #26)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:36 PM

47. Agreed ... last thing we need is a day of hand-wringing across the media ...

 

ZOMG LOOK TEH PARTY OF OBAMA HAS NO POC CANDIDATES!

I know! Let's present an endless litany of upset pundits bashing the Democratic Party? Someone call Sharpton & Jesse, lets get them on!

That would NOT be helpful.

It's unfortunate, but none of the PoC's actually captured the imagination of Voters of Color ... or enough of anyone else. They didn't have the polls, they didn't have the money, to continue. It's not BECAUSE they were PoC's, I do not believe. Not in our Party.

All one needs do is look at 2008 and 2012 to confirm this, IMHO.

I think if Stacey Abrams had jumped in the Race ... she might VERY well still be in it. But she didn't.

JMHO.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mr_lebowski (Reply #47)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:00 PM

65. Agreed. We shouldn't feed the media driven Democratic party bashing narrative

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:03 PM

27. Not shocked ....

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:06 PM

28. deval patrick just got in... no chance to qualify, but he is in the race..... nt

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to getagrip_already (Reply #28)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:07 PM

29. He will not be on the December debate stage

 

which is the point of the OP.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Reply #29)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:11 PM

31. yup, just pointing out he is in the race...

 

he got in too late to qualify. Bloomberg did also, plus he isn't collecting contributions so he won't be in any debates; but that is his plan anyway.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to mcar (Reply #29)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:29 PM

41. Kamala qualified for the debate. Why drop out now?

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to Hassin Bin Sober (Reply #41)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:46 PM

55. ...

 

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=366146
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:25 PM

37. The voters have decided to whittle the race to a Final Four

 

Biden , Buttigieg , Bernie and Warren ÖÖ.I'd like to see the next debate limited to these 4 Semi- finalists ..It would be great service to the American people to hear them have a serious discussion of the great issues confronting the nation - and the world ÖÖ The other candidates simply have little or no chance of being our nominee Ö.. They have been given ample opportunity tp make their case to the voters Ö.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Bernie Sanders

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Response to ritapria (Reply #37)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:35 PM

46. Thus far there have been no voters for 2020

 

So they haven't whittled it down to anything.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:27 PM

38. I understand but here's the thing as Monk would say

 


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:28 PM

39. So what exactly is the ask here, tokenism?

 

Candidates that did not reach the ridiculously broad standards for inclusion cannot participate, there is no racial animus.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to tritsofme (Reply #39)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:40 PM

51. Harris should be forced to participate!

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Amy Klobuchar

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Response to mcar (Original post)


Response to Name removed (Reply #44)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:49 PM

58. Lots to blame

 

Media coverage of the primaries solely as a horse race; media holding women and candidates of color to a higher standard (over-accentuating their mistakes, ignoring their policies - just like they did with HRC); the money required to successfully run a campaign; the entrance of two white, male billionaires who are blanketing the airwaves with ads; first voting in predominantly white states.

Voters haven't had a chance to vote yet.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Reply #58)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 04:21 PM

84. And which of those things is the fault of the party, as Pierce insinuates?

 

I'm not sure how you go about making people vote for candidates they are otherwise not inclined to vote for. For example, if someone likes Warren, they're going to vote for her, they're not going to decide to vote for Harris because they think the debate stage is too white. The media's problems and biases, which I agree are real, are of their own making, not that party's. I guess you have a point with IA and NH, but both state legislatures and assemblies have made it clear they will keep those positions on the calendar by any means necessary.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to BannonsLiver (Reply #84)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 04:35 PM

86. When did voting start?

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:47 PM

57. So Yang isn't a person of color, or is he not in the debate?

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Tom Steyer

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #57)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 02:51 PM

60. He has not yet qualified for the December debate

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Reply #60)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:23 PM

68. Thanks.

 

I was under the mistaken impression that he had qualified.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Tom Steyer

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #68)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:41 PM

73. He still has a bit of time to do so, IIRC

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:26 PM

69. There were real people of colour in the RepubliCON debates? Not cardboard cutouts?

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #69)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:39 PM

72. There was Ben Carson,

 

but I think he slept through most of it.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:30 PM

71. There are some fucked up comments on this thread. That is all. n/t

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to demmiblue (Reply #71)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 04:36 PM

87. It's discouraging

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:43 PM

74. We're taking a major perspective hit. This was one of the best moments in all of the debates IMO

 

Itís the bottom clip after tweeting out the ammunition.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to BeyondGeography (Reply #74)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:49 PM

76. She is brilliant, and a fighter, and had great ideas and plans

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 03:55 PM

79. old and white.

 

not the idea in had 24 months ago. Our last the nominees that won a GE were under 54.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to evertonfc (Reply #79)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 10:56 PM

104. "Our last the nominees that won a GE were under 54"

 

Then it's time to change that. Republicans have proved that it's possible to win with old candidates like Reagan, Poppy Bush, and Trump, but also have lost (Dole, McCain). They seem to nominate older folks much more frequently than we do.

Besides Hillary, when it the last 75 years or so have we nominated someone over 65? We almost never nominate older candidates.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 04:29 PM

85. To Charles Pierce: Like it or not, it's not, as of the moment, in any way a bad thing, either.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to ancianita (Reply #85)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 04:38 PM

88. I disagree

 

It's nearly 2020. The base of our party is people, primarily women, of color. We have several highly qualified POCs as candidates. Now, one has dropped out, apparently solely because of money. Two others don't qualify for the debate stage. But, a white male billionaire who got into the race late has.

I hope the DNC is learning from this re setting up debates. I have no hope that the media will ever learn anything WRT covering campaigns.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Reply #88)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 05:13 PM

94. I hear you, I do. Everything you say makes sense. But we here need to make clearer sense of the

 

people supporting the rest of the candidates, rather than think it's solely a party problem.

I could have railed about debate structure, the makeup of the party, how not enough of the "right" candidates win on the merits and what's wrong with unqualified people making it to the stage while mine didn't. Or my second or third choice candidate didn't.

But at some point I also know that primaries whittle down the candidates. Mine and everyone else's.

It's NOT the whole party's problem every time a popular candidate gets whittled down for whatever reason.

Venting that "the party is the problem" just hands more ammunition to our opponents.

It's just not always about some shared fatal flaw of the party or party members. Because that's the implication here, which is neither logical nor fair. The other threads that bemoan realities of the party primaries are keeping up the same framing of our party.

There's more to any candidate's race or public electability that keeps them in or out, and we should acknowledge that. A big tent party has to stop the press for uniform outlooks on what the party "needs," and acknowledge that there are more in-house realities that each candidate faces, that we can't possibly know, that contribute to their decision to leave the primaries.

Everyone who is a Democrat must keep front and center that we have to win. We have to win. Not shoot ourselves in the foot by convention time, every presidential election cycle.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 04:52 PM

89. This thread is depressing on so many levels

 

For now, the only thing to do is support whomever wins the Democratic nomination.

And as someone said higher in the thread, we have a lot of changes to make so that women and POC are not shut out by majority white primary voting schedule (Iowa and NH get to go first for what reason again?).
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to flibbitygiblets (Reply #89)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 05:07 PM

93. Um...

 

Our last three nominees were minorities.

Harris failed to catch on. It wasnít racism or sexism.

Obama won AA voters AFTER he won white Iowa.

Letís stop with this crap.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Amy Klobuchar

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Response to squirecam (Reply #93)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 09:01 AM

108. Hillary Clinton is a minority?

 

n/t
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to killaphill (Reply #108)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 10:02 AM

113. Yes

 

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/are-women-minorities_b_595a91a0e4b0f078efd98be3
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Amy Klobuchar

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Response to squirecam (Reply #113)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 10:36 AM

114. Jews are also a minority

 

Members of the LGBTQ community are also a minority.

Therefore, apparently 75% of the top tier of Democratic candidates are currently minorities.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to killaphill (Reply #114)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 02:26 PM

116. Correct

 

And the 4th has the majority of AA support.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Amy Klobuchar

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Response to flibbitygiblets (Reply #89)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 06:01 PM

95. What might those changes be. Who in the party is supposed to make them. That can be the party

 

discussion after we win. It's nearing time to present "the package" to the country.

Right now we're headed to the primary schedule that's set, and we need to see how the rest of the nation thinks about the candidates that make it to Super Tuesday. Save for those buying their way in, they're all strong, moral, experienced leaders.

The most constructive thing we here can do is watch what the public, through polls, votes, donations, etc. and not show internal turmoil that can arm our opponents' propaganda machine.

We have done a lot to be proud of historically. We need to start acting like the public should remember from now until Nov 2020, just what all that really is.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to flibbitygiblets (Reply #89)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 07:07 PM

98. It's only because of tradition.

 

But the problem is finding a way to change it. The same people who would need to step forward to change it are out there right now working their asses off to ingratiate themselves to those same people in those mostly white states.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Bernie Sanders

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 06:40 PM

96. she had very low support among black voters

 

I'm not a fan of this tweet by Pierce. I think a lot of people are asking good questions in response, in this thread on DU and in the twitter thread.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 06:59 PM

97. Seriously, pigmentation should be the deciding factor?

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 07:25 PM

99. I'm bummed to see Kamala drop out. Hopefully she will come back strong in 2024.

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to jalan48 (Reply #99)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 10:39 PM

102. Hopefully we will have an incumbant in 2024. nt

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Elizabeth Warren

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Response to dflprincess (Reply #102)

Tue Dec 3, 2019, 11:14 PM

105. Good point. Make that 2028

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 03:23 AM

106. the optics are not good. but why is the party at fault?

 

People keep pointing to IA and NH, but that is not something that the party engineered. As has been explained many times, the early dates are a result of the state's machinations, not the party's. And, as has also been pointed out numerous times, the first two states are hardly the whole ballgame -- and everybody that's in the contest is fully aware of that. SC and NV have much great representation of minorities, and you can be sure that the pollsters and professionals are paying close attention to that as well.

But the truth of the matter lies in that the party can't (and shouldn't) force people to vote for (or support or fund) candidates that they are not interested in. And, sadly -- Harris is/was not polling well in ANY state -- and THAT, rather than IA and NH exclusively, was the whole ball of wax. And I don't know what "the party" could (or should) do to "fix" that.

I'm open to ideas -- but I think it is a mistake for the party to be taking a pounding over what ultimately appears to be the will of the voters.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to stopdiggin (Reply #106)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 09:22 AM

111. Oh, has voting started?

 

I must have missed that.
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Reply #111)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 03:28 PM

117. there has been non-stop polling for close to a year

 

both nationally and state by state for those that are paying attention (like Democratic Primaries Forum). You thought these numbers were generated by Ouija boards? Your snark isn't relevant, or even particularly clever.
-
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 04:22 PM

118. Fourteen people have dropped out of the Democratic race; all but two are white, all but two are men

 

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden

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Response to mcar (Original post)

Wed Dec 4, 2019, 04:31 PM

119. Would it be a bad thing if she dropped out after being in the last four? The last two?

 

Should we artificially keep her in the race?
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Pete Buttigieg

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