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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

peggysue2

(11,082 posts)
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 04:18 PM Sep 2019

The Ground Has Shifted

Interesting Op-Ed over at TPM by Josh Marshall. From Marshall's concluding remarks, I think he sees (as I do) a head-to-head primary match ultimately between Joe Biden and Elizabeth Warren. This from the beginning of the piece:

For months now I’ve been in a back and forth with readers over what many have wrongly interpreted as support for Joe Biden. That’s not really right. It’s more like Biden Realism, which I’d describe as a focus on Biden’s apparent strengths despite many people’s wish that they weren’t strengths. The primary polls themselves are inherently volatile and heavily driven by perceptions of electability. That’s not the case with general election polls, which focus on voters who by definition don’t care about “electability.” Those polls have been very, very consistent all year. Specifically, Joe Biden is the only Democrat who consistently bests President Trump by big margins. Most of the others are closer to a tie. The exception is Bernie Sanders who has usually been between Biden and the rest of the pack.

Some people claim those numbers mean next to nothing more than a year from the general election. They’re wrong. When one candidate consistently does significantly better, it suggests they pull an electoral coalition that is different and larger than the others. The fact that things can change does not mean they will change or (more importantly) that they will change to conform to your hopes. But something has shifted over the last month.


Biden Realism. I like that. Seems spot on, too.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/prime/the-2020-dynamic-is-shifting

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
21 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
The Ground Has Shifted (Original Post) peggysue2 Sep 2019 OP
I do think it's going to come down to Biden and Warren. Or a joint ticket. AtheistCrusader Sep 2019 #1
Warren would make a great president. Joe too. Eliot Rosewater Sep 2019 #2
That's how I see it shaping up as well. peggysue2 Sep 2019 #4
Not joint DownriverDem Sep 2019 #9
Thx for posting! I have always liked josh marshall.. he was always well liked by the Obama WH Thekaspervote Sep 2019 #3
I agree on Marshall peggysue2 Sep 2019 #7
Many folks DownriverDem Sep 2019 #10
Absolutely agree, Downriver peggysue2 Sep 2019 #14
Nevertheless, the fantasies will persist. Some don't REALLY believe the foolish arguments they... Tarheel_Dem Sep 2019 #5
Peggy we are a two candidate household.. Biden for me.. Warren for hubby Peacetrain Sep 2019 #6
That is a surprising split peggysue2 Sep 2019 #8
Thank you for this from Josh Marshall, Peggysue! Cha Sep 2019 #11
I have long admired Josh. He's smart, honest and fair. nt Kahuna7 Sep 2019 #12
So have I, Kahuna! Cha Sep 2019 #13
Most welcomed, Ma'm peggysue2 Sep 2019 #17
Yes, most Refreshing! Cha Sep 2019 #18
I Subscribe to Several Online News/Political Sites - Josh's TPM is the Best Indykatie Sep 2019 #15
Agreed! peggysue2 Sep 2019 #16
KICK! Cha Sep 2019 #19
I agree with Josh Gothmog Sep 2019 #20
Here is why I like Joe Gothmog Sep 2019 #21
 

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)
1. I do think it's going to come down to Biden and Warren. Or a joint ticket.
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 04:22 PM
Sep 2019

I think who leads the ticket is up in the air at this time.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Eliot Rosewater

(31,458 posts)
2. Warren would make a great president. Joe too.
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 04:24 PM
Sep 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

peggysue2

(11,082 posts)
4. That's how I see it shaping up as well.
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 05:00 PM
Sep 2019

We shall see.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

DownriverDem

(6,356 posts)
9. Not joint
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 05:25 PM
Sep 2019

Biden is our best candidate to win the Electoral College and beat trump. Biden has wide support. trump does not want to run against Biden. I don't see Warren as VP. She is more needed in the Senate and she does that job well. I see Biden running with a strong, progressive, Dem woman. They would make a winning team. Beating trump is all that matters.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Thekaspervote

(33,479 posts)
3. Thx for posting! I have always liked josh marshall.. he was always well liked by the Obama WH
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 04:24 PM
Sep 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

peggysue2

(11,082 posts)
7. I agree on Marshall
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 05:11 PM
Sep 2019

He writes well and is politically astute. As I read the op-ed, I found myself shaking my head. And I can well imagine the readership comments because the community is liberal to very liberal. Biden is gauged--by and large--at the site as being far too moderate and old school. I don't agree with that assessment; I see Biden as a pragmatic liberal. With years of experience, he understands how the legislative system works--its strengths and limitations.

But then, as Marshall states, the reality on the ground is reflected in the polling. It is what it is, aka Biden Reality.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

DownriverDem

(6,356 posts)
10. Many folks
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 05:28 PM
Sep 2019

lean more left than the country on DU. They don't like being told this either. We have to win the Electoral College to beat trump. That means state by state. We have to win the middle voters. I wish those more left would understand how to win elections. You have to win the most votes. You have to appeal to a wide variety of voters. You have to win the middle.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

peggysue2

(11,082 posts)
14. Absolutely agree, Downriver
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 06:03 PM
Sep 2019


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Tarheel_Dem

(31,322 posts)
5. Nevertheless, the fantasies will persist. Some don't REALLY believe the foolish arguments they...
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 05:01 PM
Sep 2019

put forth against Biden, they just like starting a fight. A very wise soothsayer has repeatedly told us "the polls are what the polls are".

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Peacetrain

(23,437 posts)
6. Peggy we are a two candidate household.. Biden for me.. Warren for hubby
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 05:07 PM
Sep 2019

You would think it would be the other way around but we had once talked about how great it would be if they were running mates.. but now I understand that can never happen because of the underlying ageism that has crept into our discord (both over 70).. even on the debate stage.. but so be it.. it is what it is.. but I think that the final will come down to the two of them..

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

peggysue2

(11,082 posts)
8. That is a surprising split
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 05:21 PM
Sep 2019

My husband and I are on the same page with our support of Joe Biden. That being said, if Warren were to take the nomination, we'd both vote for her. My only criticism of Warren is that I'm simply not convinced she can take down Donald Trump, that her reach and appeal simply isn't wide enough to pull in the numbers we'll need to clobber the Republicans and fully repudiate Trump and Trumpism.

We shall see!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(300,634 posts)
11. Thank you for this from Josh Marshall, Peggysue!
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 05:36 PM
Sep 2019

I see him on twitter standing up for reality a lot.

I'm not surprised by this "Biden Realism" piece.. and very much appreciate it.

For months now I’ve been in a back and forth with readers over what many have wrongly interpreted as support for Joe Biden. That’s not really right. It’s more like Biden Realism, which I’d describe as a focus on Biden’s apparent strengths despite many people’s wish that they weren’t strengths...

Thank you!
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Kahuna7

(2,531 posts)
12. I have long admired Josh. He's smart, honest and fair. nt
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 05:45 PM
Sep 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(300,634 posts)
13. So have I, Kahuna!
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 05:51 PM
Sep 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

peggysue2

(11,082 posts)
17. Most welcomed, Ma'm
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 09:12 PM
Sep 2019

Breath of fresh air, I'd say.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(300,634 posts)
18. Yes, most Refreshing!
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 09:13 PM
Sep 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Indykatie

(3,753 posts)
15. I Subscribe to Several Online News/Political Sites - Josh's TPM is the Best
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 07:34 PM
Sep 2019

I believe Josh hold History degrees and I think that infuses his view of life and politics. One which I rarely disagree with. His points here on Biden are spot on. Biden fares very well as the 1st or 2nd choice of the other candidates. That's indicative of his broad appeal within the party.

If you do twitter Josh's a must follow. People who are unfamiliar with his style sometimes miss the keen sense of irony or sarcasm.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

peggysue2

(11,082 posts)
16. Agreed!
Wed Sep 4, 2019, 09:08 PM
Sep 2019

I'm a prime member at TPM because I really enjoy Josh Marshall's slant and knowledgable approach. And the WAR discussions (all things Trump/Mueller related) in The Hive kept me half-way sane over the last 3 years. For the most part the discussions on various topics are lively, well-reasoned and offer a perspective from a variety of backgrounds and points of view.

Good stuff! DU and TPM are my first stops in the morning.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
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