What's the tell that lets you know you are dealing with an MRA?

[boston bean]

Number one for me is denial of the patriarchy.

Let's make a list. Please add one at a time per post, put in subject line if it fits.

[BainsBane]

1. Basically insisting that men are oppressed

more than women. Even if they don't claim membership, if they advanced that view, they adhere to the key tenet of MRA ideology.

[eridani]

94. Men actually are oppressed--just not for being men

For race, class, sexual orientation, or other.

[xulamaude]

97. This idea always compels me to ask:

who/what is responsible for these classifications?

Not women and certainly not feminists.

[eridani]

106. But there's no such thing as patriarchy, right?

[seabeyond]

2. nice guy argument. expecting hot gal and denied.

[boston bean]

3. was that one per post? lol

[seabeyond]

4. sorry. i am getting bad not reading all a post. nt

[boston bean]

24. I was just kidding around!

Hope you feel better soon.

[seabeyond]

26. lol. so you do not want them all in individual posts? cause i can keep going. lmao

so confused....

[seabeyond]

5. false rape claim 45-75%

[seabeyond]

6. rape decline 80% in last two decades. now hearing 60%

[Tuesday Afternoon]

7. patronizing.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

8. using the tone card.

[Demeter]

9. Pardon the question, what is MRA?

I've been alarmed by the misogyny blooming here and elsewhere.

[seabeyond]

10. men right activist that is spreading pretty hard, fast. a lot of the net, but getting into RL. nt

[Demeter]

22. The response posted is not viewable by me...I have that person on Ignore

[seabeyond]

27. lmfao. you have me on ignore and you come in here for a chat on mra. lol. so

friggin interesting.

[Sheldon Cooper]

28. How lovely for you.

[Demeter]

29. Actually, most of the posts on this thread are blocked by my Ignore list

and for very good reasons, I expect. There must be tremendous amounts of abuse: personal and/or intellectual, and very little productive discussion.

[Sheldon Cooper]

30. Which of course thoroughly explains why you are here in the first place.

[Squinch]

69. I have to disagree with you there. I have learned a lot from the members of this group.

[ismnotwasm]

74. Good

I don't use ignore, but I have personally preferences as to who I'll interact with as well. DU has a great search function.

[xulamaude]

75. Ooooo lookie! It's all about Demeter now!!

As long as we're at it.... Can you hear me?

[Demeter]

77. You are right, I'll fix that immediately

[xulamaude]

84. Just saying that all of the attention turned to you

as soon as you arrived.

Because of this:

There must be tremendous amounts of abuse: personal and/or intellectual, and very little productive discussion.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

32. to answer you question - MRA = Men's Rights Activist (male or female)

as in one who argues that men's rights are being taken away by feminists.

that last part is how I see it and could be institutionally wrong.

Would like edification and/or clarification from one of the more educated in the group.

[Demeter]

34. Thanks!

I should have been able to figure that out...maybe with a little context.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

35. yw, Demeter. Good to see you in here. I value the contributions you make in our

Economy Group.

I edited to add more definition. I hope that I got it right. I am learning, too.

[Sheldon Cooper]

42. I think maybe Demeter is in the wrong group.

Based on his/her comments below. He/she seems to feel there's a tremendous amount of 'abuse...and very little productive discussion.' I have trouble believing that someone who is ignoring so many members of this group would really be happy here. So perhaps welcoming him/her to this particular group is a bit premature.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1255&pid=33372

Demeter 29. Actually, most of the posts on this thread are blocked by my Ignore list

and for very good reasons, I expect. There must be tremendous amounts of abuse: personal and/or intellectual, and very little productive discussion.

[seabeyond]

44. me thinks... lol. nt

[Tuesday Afternoon]

48. yes, I saw the post. ugh. it was not "nice". I agree. Trying to give a benefit of doubt here ...

peace. let it start here.

Perhaps we might see a coming together happen right here, right now.

I would rather Demeter hash it out with sea (I am thinking that is the only one on ignore since sea has made the most posts in this thread).

Maybe something good can come of this. I don't know. But, it would be "nice" if it did.

[Sheldon Cooper]

51. All of that may be true, and wouldn't it be nice?

But, I am sick and tired of people abusing sea, and I think she's entitled to one fucking place on this board where she can post and not be attacked. If Demeter wants to make nice and behave appropriately for this group, fine. But I have a problem with him/her coming in and trashing one or more members of this safe haven group, and then expecting to be welcomed with open arms.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

57. I agree, Sheldon. but, Demeter did not so much as attack as stated the fact that someone is on

ignore. Now, it might be disingenuous and obtuse to come in here and NOT expect to see sea here (! say that 3 times fast)

and that is why I am giving the benefit of doubt.

I am cautiously optimistic that something good could happen here.

I understand it looked like I was "open arms" but, it is the truth that I do value Demeter's contributions else where on DU and I really am happy that Demeter is curious enough about this subject to ask questions.

I do think it is not good form to "call out" that one has someone on ignore. ugh.

yes.

[seabeyond]

58. i apprecaite sheldon saying there should be one place, but i demand, INSIST that you always be true

to yourself and know we can handle a differing opinion in respect and appreciation for all you bring. saying. you want to approach it in this manner. i respect that also. cause i have listened to you enough, i know why you approach in this manner. and you will be true to yourself.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

66. thank you, sea. -

I understand this is a safe haven and (trust me after what has happened to me on DU in the past few weeks) I appreciate having a Safe Haven.

It would be nice to see some healing and positive energy come from all this and I know that if anyone can take it you can.

You are a Warrior Woman, for realz.

[seabeyond]

40. when you friggin have everyone on ignore, how would you expect content. lol. oh my.... nt

[boston bean]

36. obviously you dont have me on ignore.

An MRA is a mens rights activist, who believe feminism is the reason for any problems they have.

[Demeter]

37. Thanks!

No, I don't. Should I?

[boston bean]

39. that would be up to you.

I don't normally advocate for people to put me on ignore.

[seabeyond]

11. virgin/whore argument.

[seabeyond]

12. all women are prostitutes (and they do not use that word) one way or another

[seabeyond]

13. no rape culture

[seabeyond]

14. it is biological/dna. evo psych

[seabeyond]

15. feminists has feminized men

[Deep13]

54. I see you had the same idea before I did. nt

[nomorenomore08]

141. Yeah, I'm not a meathead but I feel I'm plenty "masculine" despite any feminist influences

on my thinking. I hate to sound so cliched, but I like football and beer and loud music and my libido is perfectly healthy. I try my best not to make anybody uncomfortable but that doesn't mean I don't take notice of good-looking women.

So when MRA's make the "feminization" argument, all I can do is pretty much shake my head and laugh at these poor, pathetic, deluded little boys...

[seabeyond]

143. i was thinking about this. watching both boys walk into manhood. one is 19, well on his way.

certainly in a feminist home. i was strongly the primary parent. defining their masculinity was theirs to do. not mine. not their father. not society and media. and not peers. but theirs. they have done such a good job.

there is nothing that could make them feel feminize. reading your statement.

maybe why these men are feeling masculinity is being feminized is because they are literally threatened in the manliness with an empowered female. has nothing to do with others. has nothing to do with women. has everything to do with these men loose their identity with a strong, confident, secure, competent woman.

my boys never would. a woman is not tied to their identity of gender. nor you

so most men are saying huh....

it is very real to these men.

[seabeyond]

144. or looking how gender is become more fluid, they are not seeing enough john waynes out there.

meh...

pondering

[nomorenomore08]

145. Other people gaining strength and power doesn't diminish anyone else. The opposite if anything.

Weak people have the constant need to lean on others, strong people only from time to time. Weakness builds more weakness, strength builds more strength.

[seabeyond]

16. feminists want to rule over men

[seabeyond]

17. feminists are man haters

[seabeyond]

18. feminists are frigid, prudes, anti sex, jealous, hairy, ugly, fundamentalists,

[seabeyond]

19. feminists say all men are rapists.

[seabeyond]

20. women teachers side with girls making it a hostile environment for boys in school.

[seabeyond]

21. no men elementary teachers cause they are afraid of being accused of pedophilia

[seabeyond]

23. women have 60% of the wealth

[seabeyond]

25. women only want rich men to take care of them

[Scuba]

31. Well, around DU it seems they spend more time advocating against women than for men.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

38. the negative energy ... Against Women as opposed to positive energy For Men. yes.

[seabeyond]

41. that is a good one. nt

[Warpy]

85. Well, that's the defining characteristic as I see it here on DU

The rest that's been posted is merely symptomatic of that main characteristic.

It's really too bad. If they concentrated on righting some very real wrongs out there, like getting the small end of custody arrangements even when they're good parents, instead of just organizing woman bashing sessions that spill onto GD, most of us would have a very different opinion of them.

[etherealtruth]

136. Yep

[xulamaude]

33. What sea said. All of it. nt

[seabeyond]

61. redq is the one that knows... she can tick them off with articulate, concise thought. nt

[seabeyond]

43. women start the violence more than men or they provoke the man to violence

[seabeyond]

45. rape laws are picking on mens rights. (for real)

[seabeyond]

46. feminism is dead.

[seabeyond]

47. which is a contradicition to feminism is causing all the world ills. but contradictions are thru MR

[Tuesday Afternoon]

49. If we are not Third Wave, we are not True Feminists.

Thanks boston bean

[boston bean]

50. close

3rd wave. They dislike second wave.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

52. yes, Third Wave. Thanks. I will edit my post.

[Sheldon Cooper]

55. It's funny but I didn't even know about waves until I started reading about it here.

I'm definitely second wave. I came of age in the 70s, and the new freedom for women was a tonic to my young adult soul. I was dying to shake the dust off my one-horse town, ultra-Catholic upbringing, and I must say I had FUN! Jeeze, did I have fun.

The 3rd wave is a bit confusing to me, but I think that's a product of my privilege. I struggle to understand much of it. I've heard rumors of a 4th wave and that will be even more interesting to learn about.

[seabeyond]

60. that is why i differeniate the argument from MRA. they probably do not even know. i too,

learned on du. and it is one our "feminist" men continually throwing it in our face to dismiss what we say and prude shame us.

[xulamaude]

73. It may not actually be a product

of your privilege. It seems to me that the "3rd wave" women are attaching 'privilege' to a lot of life-experiences (intersectionality) that don't necessarily deserve it.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

110. can you expand on this, please ... I am not understanding what you are saying:

It seems to me that the "3rd wave" women are attaching 'privilege' to a lot of life-experiences (intersectionality) that don't necessarily deserve it.

What does all that mean, exactly?

[xulamaude]

112. RQ says most of what I meant

in her post #93 downthread.

In addition to what she says, I'd add that many of the 'current' 3rd wave feminists are young white women who are indeed rather 'privileged' themselves calling out other white women on what they see as 'privileges' they themselves do not have. I'd also venture to say that they do this because they like to think they are sticking up for WOC (women of color) which is commendable but somewhat misguided.

For instance, an older married woman may be called out on her 'privilege' because she is perceived to have more assets, has a husband as a back-up, that she is 'cis', etc. However, simply because a woman may be white, older and married it does not necessarily follow that she is privileged/gains by these things in any way. Well, except for the white part...

ETA - except for being white in a country where "white is right"

[Tuesday Afternoon]

114. Third Wave is too complicated and schizo. Ugh. Fragments and divides us.

[xulamaude]

115. It's interesting that you say that -

I was raised as a feminist (mom was an ERA activist) and grew up around a lot of primarily lesbian feminists in the 70s and all of whom were white or Jewish. I remember my mom complaining that WOC were none too happy about the way in which they were not being very well represented in the movement and she had some rather petty things to say about that.

Back then though, iirc, 'privilege' wasn't a concept that was widely understood. That is, I think, the one truly good thing that came from the 3rd wave - the mainstreaming of the concept of privilege.

But, like with a lot of things, it's become over-used and mis-placed and thereby becomes watered down and confusing.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

116. It is like where racism and sexism intersect, or something. I am not sure I am grasping the

full concept of it all ... and, that cartoon sea posted does not help matters for me.

In hindsight, it is confusing and I can see why a Fourth Wave is developing.

[xulamaude]

118. I'm not familiar with the 4th wave.

Do you know anything about it?

[Tuesday Afternoon]

120. just what I have read on here. sea has posted about it and here is a link from MadrasT

Welcome to the fourth wave of feminism. This movement follows the first-wave campaign for votes for women, which reached its height 100 years ago, the second wave women's liberation movement that blazed through the 1970s and 80s, and the third wave declared by Rebecca Walker, Alice Walker's daughter, and others, in the early 1990s. That shift from second to third wave took many important forms, but often felt broadly generational, with women defining their work as distinct from their mothers'. What's happening now feels like something new again. It's defined by technology: tools that are allowing women to build a strong, popular, reactive movement online. Just how popular is sometimes slightly startling. Girlguiding UK introduced a campaigning and activism badge this year and a summer survey of Mumsnet users found 59% consider themselves feminists, double those who don't. Bates says that, for her, modern feminism is defined by pragmatism, inclusion and humour. "I feel like it is really down-to-earth, really open," she says, "and it's very much about people saying: 'Here is something that doesn't make sense to me, I thought women were equal, I'm going to do something about it.'"

more at link:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/125531146

[seabeyond]

122. ha ha. i just posted the same article. but... i am leaving mine cause it has pictures. lol.

otherwise i would be considerate and self delete.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

125. well then, can you tell me if I am understanding Third Wave -at all- ??

ugh. It should not have to be so complicated. Should it?

[seabeyond]

126. yes. but my son is home and all he does is talk, lol lol. be back in a moment. all morning

talk talk talk

[xulamaude]

123. Thanks :) nt

[Tuesday Afternoon]

127. yw ... and now it is here With Pictures!

thanks to sea ... lol ...

[seabeyond]

121. The fourth wave of feminism: meet the rebel women

The women's movement may have been in hiding through the 'ladette' years, but in 2013 it has come back with a vengeance. Introducing the new feminists taking the struggle to the web – and the streets

Welcome to the fourth wave of feminism. This movement follows the first-wave campaign for votes for women, which reached its height 100 years ago, the second wave women's liberation movement that blazed through the 1970s and 80s, and the third wave declared by Rebecca Walker, Alice Walker's daughter, and others, in the early 1990s. That shift from second to third wave took many important forms, but often felt broadly generational, with women defining their work as distinct from their mothers'. What's happening now feels like something new again. It's defined by technology: tools that are allowing women to build a strong, popular, reactive movement online. Just how popular is sometimes slightly startling. Girlguiding UK introduced a campaigning and activism badge this year and a summer survey of Mumsnet users found 59% consider themselves feminists, double those who don't. Bates says that, for her, modern feminism is defined by pragmatism, inclusion and humour. "I feel like it is really down-to-earth, really open," she says, "and it's very much about people saying: 'Here is something that doesn't make sense to me, I thought women were equal, I'm going to do something about it.'"

They demonstrated outside the Sun headquarters, organised by Yas Necati, 17, in a protest against Page 3, the biggest image of a woman that appears each day in the country's biggest-selling newspaper – a teenager or twentysomething smiling sunnily in her pants. Necati, a student at sixth-form college, laughed shyly as she told me about the mocked-up pages she has sent Sun editor David Dinsmore, suggesting feminist comedians, artists and writers to appear on the page instead. One of her favourites showed a woman flashing bright blue armpit hair. The the No More Page 3 petition started by Lucy-Anne Holmes, 37, in August 2012,, has been signed by 128,000 people.

Ikamara Larasi, 24, started heading a campaign to address racist and sexist stereotypes in music videos, just as students began banning summer hit Blurred Lines on many UK campuses, in response to its sexist lyrics. Jinan Younis, 18, co-founded a feminist society at school, experienced online abuse from some boys in her peer group – "feminism and rape are both ridiculously tiring," they wrote – and wasn't deterred. Instead, she wrote an article about it that went viral. When I spoke to her in September, she was juggling shifts in a call centre, babysitting for neighbours, preparing for university, while helping out with a campaign to encourage feminist societies in schools countrywide. UK Feminista, an organisation set up in 2010 to support feminist activists, has had 100 people contact them this year, wanting to start their own school group. In late August, their national day of action against lads' mags included 19 protests across the UK.

*

Southall Black Sisters protested outside the offices of the UK Border Agency against racist immigration laws and propaganda – including the notorious "Go Home" vans. They also marched in solidarity with protesters in Delhi, who began a wave of demonstrations following the death of a woman who was gang raped in the city last December, protests against rape culture that soon spread to Nepal, Bangladesh, Pakistan and Sri Lanka. The African LGBTI Out & Proud Diamond Group demonstrated opposite Downing Street after allegations emerged of the sexual abuse of women held at Yarl's Wood immigration removal centre

With so many pressing issues, feminists are fighting on several fronts, and the campaigns of the past few years have often been started by individuals or small groups, who have responded to issues they feel strongly about, and can usefully address. Holmes and Necati both grew up with the Sun at home, which has shaped their opposition to Page 3. Criado-Perez was outraged by all-male discussions of teenage pregnancy and breast cancer treatment on the Today programme, so set up a database of female experts, The Women's Room, with Catherine Smith in 2012. In the first three days of that year, seven women were killed by men, and Karen Ingala Smith, chief executive of the charity Nia, started counting the toll of misogynist murders. Her Counting Dead Women project puts names and stories to the statistics we often hear, and is asking the government to take an integrated approach to understanding violence against women.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/10/fourth-wave-feminism-rebel-women

i like rebel, describing what i am seeing with our young women. a big push in UK and really seems ot be ahead of the ball and a lot of what i am seeing come out. i think the u.s. has catching up and i am seeing that also. i think we got mired in the 3rd. but, htese women are educated, smart, confident, bold and.... LOUD. i like thsse women and excited to see what they do.

[xulamaude]

124. Thanks Sea :)

I remember now having seen this before, but didn't read it thoroughly...

Interesting.

[Deep13]

56. I get them confused.

Was E. C. Stanton 1st wave?

[seabeyond]

62. 1st wave the vote. for the most part. nt

[Deep13]

67. So that brings us to the 1920s in this country.

I guess 2nd wave would be 1960s and 1970s with workplace, reproductive, and educational equality.

Then in the 1990s, I'm guessing, we have Joan Scott, Judith Butler, and a move toward gender theory.

[seabeyond]

68. correct. though, they have pretty much turned their back on 3rd wave. they say it is a fail.

i had an excellent article on one of the shakers, how she shifted. saying a fail and ended up escalating womens issues to today. where the fourth are more badass and louder and smarter and more educated, more along 2nd wave. deciding that battle had not been fought and won. very exciting. and it seems like the big push is coming from the UK.

[seabeyond]

59. i almost put that. but.. why i did not is it is not so much the MRA argument but progressive male

argument. so i did not add that one. the dem men use that one. i think MRA lump all feminists and do not like any of them.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

76. really? interesting ... an MRA would not like a third wave feminist?

[seabeyond]

78. i have not heard of any mra distinguish between the two, nor suggest a preference for any

feminists one way or another. that has been exclusively coming from the liberal, feminist vowing men that luvs them there 3rd wave. have you seen this toon? a favorite.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

89. yes, I have seen that cartoon, funny. yes.

the liberal, feminist vowing men ... uhm ... they claim title but, it does not make them so. I doubt their Liberalness and call them Libertarians.

They conflate the two terms, imo.

[redqueen]

93. It depends on how you're using "third wave feminist" really.

The original third wave feminists were women of color who called out white feminists for not taking the issues faced by women of color into account during their discussions of feminist issues.

Since then, however, the term has been co-opted by what many refer to as 'fun feminists' - feminists who are pro-objectification, pro-pornography, and pro-prostitution.

Ironically, many if not most feminist women of color are none too pleased by the insistence of liberal white feminists that porn and prostitution are harmless if not empowering for women. (Of course, since it is women of color who are disproportionately exploited and abused in the sex industry as compared to white women.)

[Tuesday Afternoon]

111. thank you for clarifying

I think that helps answer the question I just asked xulamaude.

[Deep13]

53. society has been feminized--and not in a good way.

I assume MRA are reactionaries who oppose feminism or gender equality (same thing).

Anyway, the idea that we as a society are not as tough, brave, determined, aggressive as we used to be and that the cause is that men have become too much like women. "I agree with equal rights for women, but...."

[seabeyond]

63. men should not have to pay child support

[LanternWaste]

117. A friend of mine from high school says that very thing he's on his sixth marriage and has seven kids

A friend of mine from high school says that very thing... he's on his sixth marriage and has seven children. He's been paying child support since we graduated HS in 1984, and complains quite often about how unfair it is that he has to contribute to his own children's well-being.

As an aside, he announced a few months ago that he and his newest wife are expecting a newborn in early spring.

There was a time when I felt bad for the guy, but these days I'm simply amazed by his dedication to making the same mistake over and over again.

[seabeyond]

119. ya know. i was just having a conversation with son about how... if listening to within,

we have the opportunity to change course. first with a gentle whisper. then a talking to. a yell. a nudge, then jab. finally a brick up side the head.

the opportunity is there.

it is amazing how man people ignore or dismiss that little whisper

[seabeyond]

65. men should have a say if a fetus is kept or not

[niyad]

70. stating "no mra's on du"

[seabeyond]

71. that one really made me laugh out loud. and...

it didnt hurt. good.

[Squinch]

72. "Feminists are the reason men are opting out of marriage"

Really?

[seabeyond]

79. follow up... brb

[redqueen]

80. Women's "value" declines as they age.

They say this because they perceive a woman's "value" is in her fuckability / childbearing abilities.

[seabeyond]

81. feminists are why men are opting out of life, live in basment eating cheetos, playing computer games

[redqueen]

82. Fewer men are getting college degrees because feminism.

They either claim it's because education has been 'feminized' or because there's a conspiracy in which women in academia are plotting against men. It's never due to socialization / culture. Nuh uh. Never.

[ismnotwasm]

86. You can get this on a tee shirt

11 signs you are a men's rights activist

Click Here
Text (would be legible on actual shirt):
1. You have no problem with the gender wage gap. But you hate having to pay for dates.
2. You insist that it’s a scientifically proven fact that men are stronger than women. But you complain about society believing that it’s worse for a man to hit a woman than for a woman to hit a man.
3. You believe that the age of consent is unfair and that there’s nothing wrong with having sex with teenage girls. But when you find out that a teenage girl enjoys sex, you believe she’s the biggest slut in the world.
4. You hate when a woman automatically assumes that a man is a douchebag before getting to know him. But when you like a woman who likes another man, you assume he’s a douchebag just because he’s not you.
5. You believe that if women want equality, they should be drafted into the military. But you also believe that the military is not a place for women.
6. You hate when women assume that men are like wild animals. But you believe that a woman who doesn’t cover up and make herself invisible to men is just like someone wearing a meat suit around wild animals.
7. You hate the fact that men are bullied for not conforming to their male gender roles. But when you find out that a man disagrees with your beliefs about women’s rights, your immediate response is to try to emasculate him by comparing him to a woman as an insult.
8. You hate when women assume that there are no nice guys. But you call yourself a nice guy and act like it’s a rare quality that should cause women to be all over you.
9. You hate when women assume that men just want to get laid. But when you find out that a man is a feminist, you assume that he’s just doing it to get laid.
10. You hate when women make generalizations about all men. But when a woman calls you out for being sexist, you claim that all men think like you.
11. You insist that women should be responsible for protecting themselves from being raped. But when they follow the one piece of advice that actually works, which is being aware of red flags, you complain about them assuming that all men are rapists.

http://theconcealedweapon.tumblr.com/post/43373729190/11-signs-youre-a-mens-rights-activist

[redqueen]

88. Also, manboobz.com has a glossary of MRA terminology

http://manboobz.com/wtf-is-a-mgtow-a-glossary/

[ismnotwasm]

92. Hmmm

I kinda like being an Evil Harpie. Looks badass to me.

Run, little rabbits run

[seabeyond]

95. evil harpie looks good on you. i go more for badass

i think we have already had this conversation, lol

[ismnotwasm]

96. Well-- in that case

[seabeyond]

100. showing her feminine side.

i love the song, it is the best.

[ismnotwasm]

103. Nice!

[xulamaude]

101. How about

[ismnotwasm]

105. I love that movie

Another switch in genre and one of my favorite all time movie endings

"Death Proof

[seabeyond]

90. excellent. that is what i metioned above. many of the talking points are contradiction. i like

this one that i heard the other day.

menz were biologically born with the male gaze cause they had to scan the horizons for a suitable woman to plant seed. men are biologically made to spread there seed.

if they are planting seed just ANYWHERE cause they were born this, then how can they be selective, too.

[redqueen]

87. Men have a biological need to have sex with women.

The need for human contact is for touch. Not to use women's bodies as masturbatory aids. This fact is lost on MRAs.

[Demeter]

98. Men and Women have a need for Companionship

but so few men have any training or interest in being a companion to anyone, male or female, rich or poor, young, old, whatever, because the current, horribly dysfunctional US culture insists that all men are islands and cogs in an impersonal corporate machine, and shames men if they aren't.

It is this companionship that sustains marriages, families, parent-child relationships, communities, and democratic governments.

But modern male culture is fascist to the core: the Organization Man on steroids. There's no equality, there's dominant and submissive, up and down, and struggle. There's no co-operation.

You get one member in a marriage try to pull that dominance stuff off in an American marriage, and you have no marriage. Or in a family...it falls apart.

[xulamaude]

91. Inflated vocabulary and syntax -

in an effort to look 'smarter'.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

99. verbose, yes. a wall of text. ugh. ---

“If you can't explain it to a six year old, you don't understand it yourself.
– Albert Einstein, a German-born theoretical physicist

[BainsBane]

102. I think there is a conflation of MRA and sexism and misogyny more generally

in this thread. There are sexists and misogynists who are not MRAsmas, just as there are hawks who are not neocons. MRA is a particular-type of misogynistic ideology that seeks to make political their own feelings of inadequacy vis a vis women. A lot of the characteristics listed above are not specific to MRA adherents.

[seabeyond]

104. i do not think it is all mra that they put up in defining them. but the arguments they make.

but, i am curious what you are seeing. maybe open two windows, when you have time and list out what you think does not becessarily belong. i would be interested. BUT.... tomorrow. i am off to bed.

night woman

[boston bean]

107. I think I have to disagree, these are all arguments MRA's make.

You're right it's all misogynistic. The err.. more well known ones here are grabbing their arguments straight from the MRA playbook.

But if one prefers to call out MRA talking points, versus saying it is MRA, then that might be a better strategy. But even if one does say it is an MRA talking point you get the accusation flung back that you are calling someone an MRA. It's a catch 22.

[redqueen]

130. My take: Not all misogynists are MRAs, but all MRAs are misogynists,

hence the overlap.

[gollygee]

108. Obviously untrue statistics

about rape and domestic violence. They're getting those numbers somewhere.

[Phentex]

109. Women who are bothered by it probably are not the ones being hit on or ogled...

they must be unattractive and just bitter about not being hit on. Even if they ARE being ogled, they should be appreciative and not bothered by it.

[xulamaude]

113. Ah, yes, the 'you're just jealous' gambit.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

128. He don't like how femunists

keep posting about femunism in the House of Femunists group.

[seabeyond]

129. ha ha ha ha ha ha. food for thought, huh? actually i was just thinking about that

right here and now, as there are a couple posts i wuold like to get back to and reply. to have a nonhostile environment to discuss, in agreement or not, in respect.... the best

[redqueen]

131. !

Thanks for the belly laugh!

[Dash87]

132. Poor use of evopsych to mansplain something to us of inferior intellect.

[Dash87]

133. 'Women only like rich guys and assholes.'

This is of course due to evolution - muscly doods killing a mammoth is so hawt!

[seabeyond]

134. you are into this. you know what really gets me about this argument? they talk "hawt"

it is all about the evo of man wanting "hawt". can you imagine how unattractive ALL these people were? there was no "hawt". people are thinking of raquel welch in that costume "hawt". that is not who these people were are grown, educated people actually use this as an argument.

[Texasgal]

135. That I hate men and sex.

I think that sums it up for me.

I am still educating myself, but to be told that I must hate men and sex really makes me wonder what whackadoodle I am talking to.

Happy new Year BB!

[Agschmid]

138. Yup..

[cinnabonbon]

139. Oh yes

Especially when they unironically call themselves nice guys, and then go on a rant about how the b*tch friendzoned them, as you said.

[seabeyond]

140. oh, the friend zone is something we were missing. and fedora? i heard something about that

but not sure.

[Starry Messenger]

142. Saying that feminist organizations skew stats to pump up donations.