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Sun Aug 23, 2015, 07:58 PM

So minority voters have to be "appealed" to then? The candidate must be "appealing"?

...?



Maybe it's an Americanism. I don't know.

The only reason I ask is that I've seen this phrase emerge elsewhere on the site, and it sounds deeply patronising to me...

It's just that, in Scotland, where I live, if someone said that they wanted to "appeal" to me or any of my fellow countrymen I'd be like: "Uh, WHUT, sir/ma'am? No I don't need cuddles, I want to know what you intend to do. Could you tell me what you intend to do, please?"

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Reply So minority voters have to be "appealed" to then? The candidate must be "appealing"? (Original post)
sibelian Aug 2015 OP
nadinbrzezinski Aug 2015 #1
sibelian Aug 2015 #5
nadinbrzezinski Aug 2015 #8
sibelian Aug 2015 #13
nadinbrzezinski Aug 2015 #16
sibelian Aug 2015 #19
leftofcool Aug 2015 #2
sibelian Aug 2015 #3
leftofcool Aug 2015 #4
sibelian Aug 2015 #6
leftofcool Aug 2015 #9
jfern Aug 2015 #7
sadoldgirl Aug 2015 #10
sibelian Aug 2015 #11
leftofcool Aug 2015 #12
sibelian Aug 2015 #14
leftofcool Aug 2015 #15
sadoldgirl Aug 2015 #17
leftofcool Aug 2015 #18
sibelian Aug 2015 #20

Response to sibelian (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:02 PM

1. Scottland has shorter campaigns

 

and you guys STILL want to know what your politicians want at a policy level In the states it has become, partly, a beauty show. Oh and you are right, I do not want them to appeal to me... I want them to tell me what the fuck they intend to do. But I have come to realize I am a rare bird indeed.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #1)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:13 PM

5. Well, we've actually got even worse, now we have armies of people reading policy docs!


Since the referendum, if you go online these days and look at arguments about Scottish politics everyone's chucking links to actual Scottish Goverment publications instead of swapping stereotypes!

We've gone funny. We're all politics mad over here, now.

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Response to sibelian (Reply #5)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:17 PM

8. I covered one of the Bernie rallies

 

the launch party... and gad the man was giving them policy after policy and they loved it.

I turned to one of my regulars who also goes to City Council often... we are wondering if we can get them to read the city budget? I feel lonely. At times I feel like I read it, the staffers who wrote it read it, and that's it.

Yup, I have asked detailed questions from a city document, and I have gotten a few deer in headlights looks from people who voted to approve it. Don't get me started with the Federal...

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #8)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:31 PM

13. This is one of the reasons I think he's such a great idea.

I am almost bound by personal faith that ordinary people are vastly more intelligent than politicians realise and only pay no attention because they feel they have no investment in the outcome. If you involve them at the local level it results in a different kind of politics. For me, it's just a case of the right person at the top opening the door.

The SNP consult like crazy. They will not move with asking people first what they actually want.

It's like actual democracy. The only real problem with it is that it drives stereotype collectors into apoplexy because they've spent their entire political lives/careers ignoring policy and cultivating election tactics. The stereotype collectors then go on wrecking rampages because they don't get to play and weird rhetoric from them starts to creep in at the edges, there's this bizarre idea they get, this weird feeling that something "unfair" has happened, somehow... words like "sabotage" and "hijack" start appearing...

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Response to sibelian (Reply #13)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:45 PM

16. It's like actual democracy

 

GASP... no wonder a few central bankers are ... holding their breath!!!!

You know, neoliberals cannot have ...democracy. Now go to your room and no dinner for you!! You might give ideas to people.



(I just love it, but no wonder the UK reacted the way it did with the vote... some of the shit I get to read)

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #16)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 09:01 PM

19. Oh, it was a HOOT! Everyone was SO freaked out


Every stereotype of Scottish people imaginable, practically in alphabetical order!! From the national press that prides itself on impartiality and good sense!

You should have seen the stuff they came out with about Nicola Sturgeon, you think Hillary gets it because of her hair? "Viper", "Poisonous", "witch", all sorts of revoltingly sexist stuff.

The Guardian was no better than anyone else!

Anyway, our eyes are opened and we now observe Westminster with a mix of wry amusement and withering contempt, biding our time.

You know that the SNP got a flat out INSANE number of Scottish seats, like, practically ALL of them? 56 out of 59!! We're going to have "One Party State" stuff thrown at us now for the remainder of human history, sigh...

So, basically, my feeling is that the ground is nowhere NEAR as stable as people think it is. Labour basically used to own Scotland. Never mind the Democratic Blue Wall, it was like a Scottish Labour Red Forcefield extending 500 miles straight up into space. And it fell completely flat, like, to NOTHING, in two election cycles! If that can happen in SCOTLAND, which is pretty much the most politically rigid populace on the planet it can happen ANYWHERE. That's what I think.

Or maybe Scottish people are just weird....

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Response to sibelian (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:03 PM

2. "appealing" to a candidate has nothing to do with "cuddling"

If you want the minority vote in this country, you have to A: earn it B: listen, learn and know what is expected of you as a candidate C: Sit down and talk and say what you can do what you might be able to do and explain what you can't do. That is what "appealing" means

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Response to leftofcool (Reply #2)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:07 PM

3. Yeah, which would be the "telling people what you're going to do" part.


It's the language I find bizarre. It sounds like people are expected to think of politicians in roughly the same way they think of soap powder.

And it only ever seems to be minorities that are supposed to be "appealed" to!

Weird. It's like a subconscious twitch implying that minorities are thick. Most minorities in almost any country are considerably more politically aware than the general population.

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Response to sibelian (Reply #3)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:10 PM

4. Minorities in the US are very aware politically.

You would need to understand US History ( a lot) to see why many minorities feel the way they do about our political system, our justice system, as well as why they look for certain things in candidates.

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Response to leftofcool (Reply #4)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:15 PM

6. The American political system is labyrinthine and *incredibly* stable.


Unfortunately, that stability makes it difficult to correct systemic problems...

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Response to sibelian (Reply #6)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:18 PM

9. I don't know about "stable" I would say "static"

And you are correct, it makes it difficult to correct problems.

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Response to sibelian (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:15 PM

7. Most politicians in the US do everything they can to avoid the issue

Sanders doesn't, and so he'd being attacked big time on anything other than the issues.

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Response to sibelian (Original post)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:19 PM

10. I don't see it as cuddling, and no it does not

apply to minorities only.

Look at Trump, he tries to appeal to a nationalistic
xenophobia, and seems to find it a successful
method.
Does he really believe his hateful message?
Who knows.

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Response to sadoldgirl (Reply #10)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:23 PM

11. Fair enough. It just sounds weird to me.


As for Trumpy the Troll, if that blithering idiot gets into the White House my diffidently belligerent little country might be in big trouble. He HATES us now.

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Response to sibelian (Reply #11)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:25 PM

12. Trump hates Scotland? What did ya'll do to poor Donald?

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Response to leftofcool (Reply #12)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:33 PM

14. He tried to build a big fat golf course


which would have included kicking people out of their homes and blocking a wind-farm which would have "spoiled the view". The residents and government eventually said, "forget it, they're staying and we're having our wind-farm" and he started bloviating, which had no effect whatsoever, because abandoning responsibility for managing your emotions appropriately and pretending it's your opponent's fault doesn't work in Scottish politics.

Anyway, he'll probably bomb us.

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Response to sibelian (Reply #14)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:38 PM

15. Or build a wall around your island and make you pay for it.

Trump is an ass and that is the nicest thing I can say about him.

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Response to leftofcool (Reply #15)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:55 PM

17. May I add an adjective to your description?

Trump is a cunning and cruel ass.

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Response to sadoldgirl (Reply #17)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 08:59 PM

18. See! You're just not as nice as I am but he is a cunning and cruel ass

Among other things.

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Response to leftofcool (Reply #15)

Sun Aug 23, 2015, 09:05 PM

20. We have someone vaguely similar...


Boris Johnson...



The stupid hair and everything! And he's a "maverick" and a "plain speaker" and all that shite.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boris_Johnson

Nasty piece of work. Slimy little mover, populist jerk that he is. Not as extreme as Donald, but he blurts out offensive "tee hee I'm non-PC" crud in exactly the same way as Donald and I don't doubt for a second he'd be as grotesque as Trumpy if the ground over here was as fertile for that stuff as it is over in your neck of the woods.

I'm beginning to think the stupid hair is actually quite a clever trick.

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