Let's say the Stein recounts reverse MI, WI, and PA

[ucrdem]

and the EC vote swings. Are we finally ready for Hillary?

[guillaumeb]

1. Certainly. But what would be the reaction of the Trump voters?

But at the moment, this is pure speculation.

[Beartracks]

3. That it's some kind of vast liberal conspiracy.

===================

[ucrdem]

4. Well, they had their big chance didn't they?

So far it's looking like their guy is every bit as horrible as predicted. Worse.

[guillaumeb]

8. Worse indeed. And he is not even the President yet.

Trump is the US version of the FN of LePen. A party of fascists led by a racist. And both leaders are equally Islamophobic.

[duffyduff]

25. She would have to be tightly guarded by the SS 24/7.

Many of these Trump people are absolutely deranged.

[guillaumeb]

26. I agree with you. Trump has enabled or emboldened the violent ones to feel

that violence is a valid response. And in a country with hundreds of millions of firearms the tools are easily available.

But the corporate media is ignoring the idea that there might be a problem with the voting process in some states. It detracts from the idea of free and fair elections.

[alfredo]

29. it's not violence, it is a "Second Amendment Solution."

[guillaumeb]

43. A solution that is only recognized when white people are carrying the guns. eom

[alfredo]

45. true.

[Adsos Letter]

57. He's already set them up for it.

Remember? "The election is rigged, folks" or words to that effect.

By the way, howdy.

[alfredo]

69. He failed to mention it was his supporters rigging the election.

[Cobalt Violet]

41. I hope we get to see that!

[guillaumeb]

44. Agreed. eom

[Beartracks]

2. I presume even if that happens...

... the media will go, "Hm, that was interesting..." and then go back to whatever Trump says he will do in his first 100 days.

I've never seen so much shrugging off of things as has happened with this entire election cycle.

====================

[ucrdem]

5. They can't shrug off a 5-3 Supreme Court decision.

Because that's probably where we're headed.

[Tiggeroshii]

15. Whos the five and whos the three

?

[ucrdem]

18. 5: Ginsburg, Breyer, Sotomayor, Kennedy, Kagan

3: Thomas, Alioto, Roberts. But it could be 7-1 if the recounts go well. Who in their right mind wants to go down in history as one of the justices that put Trump in office?

[Tiggeroshii]

22. Two of them still have to carry the guilt of putting Bush in...

Maybe they can make up for it...

[ucrdem]

23. Exactly.

The horror of Trump-in-office real time seems to bring out our better angels. Let's hope he decides to chew out the SC on Twitter. They might decide unanimously for once!

[rgbecker]

7. Oh, the GOP presidential nominee grabs pussy without provocation....I guess that's what people do.

Yawn.

[Beartracks]

10. Just locker-room talk!

Yeah, that sounds legit!

Next story...



===========================

[0rganism]

6. I would be but would the rest of the country?

after 3+ weeks of manufactured consent, I imagine there would be some upheaval along the way

[ucrdem]

9. 3 weeks of clown prince are plenty.

This guy wouldn't last a month before they turned him out and gave the job to Pence.

[alfredo]

30. It's called removal in place. That is probably what happened with Reagan.

Poor sap's mind just walked away. It was probably Nancy and advisors running the show.

[Richard D]

11. Worth it.

[0rganism]

12. agreed

10/10 would risk rw freak out again

[msongs]

13. Hillary says the country is worth fighting for, right? nt

[ucrdem]

14. Yes she did.

I'm thinking there might be some buyer's remorse after witnessing Club Trump in action ... he really has no idea of what he's doing and thinks he's still running his hotel

[alfredo]

32. Businessmen make bad presidents. As a businessman, he enjoyed absolute power.

His party will turn on him if keeps breaking promises.

[sheshe2]

58. Running his hotel/ hotels into the ground.

[MFM008]

16. I will lay on the ground

So she can walk on me to get into the white house.
How's that?

[triron]

17. I understand there are no paper ballot trails i n Penn?

[flamingdem]

20. I was wondering about this.. don't want to get too carried away

but she's disgustingly close and far ahead in the popular.. can we do it?

[ucrdem]

21. Halderman says the machines can be subjected to "forensic analysis"

meaning searched for malware used to flip votes.

[Cosmocat]

24. Depends on the county

Nm

[Amishman]

70. PA heavily uses ELECTronic machines from the 80s

Other than their lack of a paper printout and age related breakdowns, they are pretty secure.

No external (internet) connections, no software updates to trojan in malware, no touch screens to configure. Someone would have had to break into storage in numerous counties, open the self contained machines, and seamlessly alter 30 year old software that was not designed to be updated... All for hundreds or thousands of machines.

I'm not commenting on other states because I don't know their systems, but hacking PA would have taken an army of criminal masterminds on the ground in the state months ahead of the election.

[LostOne4Ever]

19. Yes!!! Anything so long as the Republicans don't get the Supreme Court!!! nt

[shenmue]

63. Same here

[Hoyt]

27. I would love for Clinton to take it, but I wonder if most folks here will accept

it if the vote is validated if there is a recount.

[EL34x4]

68. Recounts may net Clinton (or Trump) a few hundred additional votes.

Probably only a few dozen. And you can guarantee Trump will have his observers present fighting over every additional Clinton vote.

There's no way she's going to get the tens of thousands needed to change the election. It's simply not going to happen.

This is a cash grab by Jill Stein for her Green Party, nothing more, and desperate people are falling for it.

[jimlup]

28. Let's not get ahead of ourselves

Even if erroneous data is discovered the Trump people will take this to the 4 to 4 split Supreme Court. If the recount shows errors and hacking then it is going to be a weird couple of months.

[ucrdem]

31. You know what? I knew she wouldn't take it without a battle royale.

No way in hell they were going to let her have that triumph. Whether they can keep up the charade indefinitely is another question. The ol' vast right wing conspiracy might have to settle for the satisfaction of having humiliated her on election night and then turn their attention to impeaching her because it's looking more and more like she won this thing every which way.

[jimlup]

42. I will be watching the data from the recounts of

MI, WI and PA closely!

They are not going to take it from her if I can help it!

[Hekate]

33. Can it be done before the EC meets? Will Hillary be willing to step into the woodchipper again?

Will she have time or be willing to file at the SCOTUS?

[ucrdem]

34. So much for that restful retirement eh?

Hillary has some serious multitasking ahead of her but if it's doable she'll do it.

Happy TG Hekate!!

[Hekate]

35. Happy TG back atcha

[lonestarnot]

53. She has no fucking choice! She has to do it for America. It's what she ran to do. Be President of

the United States, not let a fucking orange woodchip steal it from her.

[RKP5637]

59. It's her duty, and I think she would do it, to save the US from a horrific death! n/t

[longship]

36. MI votes with paper ballots.

It's not looking good for my state.

And the margin in PA is too big.

Hillary is not going to be able to turn this around.

[Exilednight]

37. She can't reverse them. Maybe one, but even that is a very long shot.

[ucrdem]

38. She can reverse MI and WI by recounting the votes.

MI has paper ballots and WI has ballots and voter-verified paper trail audit printers. Will they have been tampered with? Probably, but that should be revealed in the audit. PA might be more of a challenge but if malware can be found, or some clear evidence of tampering, and it's claimed that the Russians done it, I'd think the citizens of PA might agree to a fresh election. Yes it's unprecedented, but so is "Russian" vote-reporting fraud.

https://www.verifiedvoting.org/verifier/

[Exilednight]

39. Yes, and then we will find martians on Mars. Conspiracy theories need to be tossed out the window.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

40. A recount is a recount

Not a forensic examination of voting machines.

That's assuming the court in PA allows a recount.

And there is no Constitutional allowance for a re-vote, so that can't even happen.

[quantumjunkie]

46. Trump would declare War (literally) on the USA

[liberalla]

47. he'll ask putin for some polonium...

for a target-specific weapon.

[RonniePudding]

48. Good grief

The recount fantasy is so pitiful. Thread after thread of nonsense. I was eager for DU to return because I thought people would be talking about how to advance progressive issues over the next 2-4 years. Instead it's the land of tin foil. Hopefully this will abate soon and we can get back to confronting the spectre of a Trump presidency. Reality awaits.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

56. Yep

It's easier to claim that the election was stolen than to admit that we as a party made mistakes that cost us in a close campaign in the swing states, most especially in the Rust Belt.

And once the recounts are conducted (if they are in all three states) and the results don't change, then the cry will be that the canvassers were bought off, the state election boards were bought off or threatened, that there's no way Hillary lost, the election was hacked, the election was stolen, etc. Everyone will ignore the fact that the UM computer science professor whose analysis started this whole thing has said that he doesn't believe the election was hacked, and keep screaming that the election was stolen.

And then the next two years can be spent complaining about how we were robbed instead of doing a deep dive into why we lost and what we have to do in order to fix it for the 2018 elections. And when we lose 4 or 5 more Senate seats in 2018, we can wash, rinse, repeat with the stolen election theme again.

And while this is going on, anyone who says that this is a waste of time and money that would be better spent on gearing up for 2018 will be told to be quiet because it's very discouraging to others to hear that recounts are as waste of time and money.

[Charlotte Little]

49. Not going to happen

I'm so bitter, I can't even deal with family members. I really wanted Hillary to win. I believe she would have been an amazing president for all Americans, even the ****wits who voted for the Orange Shit Stain.

But the reality is, she's not. She did not win.

Even if, with a recount, it could somehow be proven there was vote tampering, I don't see a reversal. I just don't. It's so far-fetched. And really, we all need to pull together and become the resistance to Trump. That should be our focus - aim for 2018; then 2020.

But sadly, 2016 is going to be that nightmare year we will never forget.

[gollygee]

50. Absolutely but I think this is really unlikely

Despite all of the Trumpsters' bellyaching before the election, I don't think rigging elections is something people can really do.

[lonestarnot]

51. Whoa... mertie.

[Renew Deal]

52. I don't expect it to happen

PA looks too tough

[lonestarnot]

55. This is not based on looking tough. Its based on what bullshit happened. If enough votes were

calculated for the yammering yam that didn't belong to yammering yam, or for that matter didn't even exist, then all bets are fucking off.

[andym]

54. The only way vote reversals happen is if there was cheating

If there was cheating, then there is going to be a tremendous upheaval in the country. Hillary would be considered the victim of cheating and would receive quite a lot of support. However, this is all contingent on actually finding cheating.

[no_hypocrisy]

61. I believe Trump would secretly be relieved.

[musicblind]

65. Oh most definitely!

Since winning, Trump has only taken two presidential briefs, compared to a daily brief for Pence.

Trump very clearly does not want to be president. He never meant for it to get this far.

[Blanks]

62. The best we can hope for...

Is that in the months (or years) to come, if there was some kind of cheating, there will be some moron bragging about it. That will bring the Trump administration crashing down.

Everyone was all happy and doing hand springs when Nixon won in 1972, and the scandal dripped, and dripped until all of the celebration stopped and we (as a nation) felt into a deep funk.

Reagan won in 1984, and then we had all of the Iran/Contra hearings and the mood was not real positive, but they got a few convictions out of it.

If there's something to the 'stealing the election' conspiracy (and I expect that there is) it won't likely be discovered by looking at these 3 states.

I could be wrong, I occasionally am, but I think it's a bad idea to get our hopes up. Having said that, Pennsylvania seemed pretty suspicious on election night, Florida too (I know it's too late for that), I think it's good that they're going through the motions, but I'm not holding out much hope for success.

[musicblind]

64. There is almost no chance the results will be overturned.

But I still donated, because I think the recount is a good idea for democracy in general. It's not about overturning the states, since that is likely not possible, it is the principal of the thing.

[budkin]

66. There will be civil war

I'm not kidding. Trump voters are not just going to give it back.

[ucrdem]

67. We've got it covered.

Cue the black helicopters!