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Mon May 23, 2016, 04:59 PM

On Democratic Party Unity

Rather than threaten Sanders with ostracism, Democrats could embrace his message, and thereby his supporters. The message going out presently is “he better bend to the establishment's will,” or else. The establishment risks disenchanting huge numbers of voters by denying Bernie's accomplishment of bringing them all together. Right now the Democratic apparatus declares itself closed to change at the very moment it could best capitalize on demand for change. Unless the Democratic party can open it's arms and embrace a substantial part of Bernie's platform, one cannot dismiss fears that Trump wins in November.

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Response to ArcticFox (Original post)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:01 PM

1. Uh, Bernie is the one that is attacking the very people he wants support from

 

And yes, not voting in November, or writing in Bernie is the same as voting for Trump. Bernie can't bring anybody together except white males aged 18-25 for the most part.

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Response to tonyt53 (Reply #1)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:10 PM

3. That's your opinion. Mine is that Hillary is center-right to right at heart but faking her

 

left lean to get elected. She'll become her old hawkish self as soon as she can.

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Response to floriduck (Reply #3)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:13 PM

6. Hillary will retire

 

Bernie will be running the show, and the party will finally grow up and out and become what we all need.

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Response to tonyt53 (Reply #1)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:14 PM

7. LOL..Bernie is the one attacking....then OP goes on attack..LOL

 

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Response to ArcticFox (Original post)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:07 PM

2. So, let me get this straight.

The strong majority of Democratic voters chose to vote for Hillary, and presumably her policies and platform. But somehow, even though Bernie has lost the primary, we should abandon the policies and platform that the majority of Dem voters chose and adopt Bernie's instead?

I am a Hillary supporter, but not one who says their platforms are basically identical. There IS daylight between the two of them, and Democratic voters across the country have chosen the one they prefer - Hillary's. Personally, I do not believe in Bernie's platform because I think 80% of it will never pass Congress and some of it makes him basically unelectable. I don't believe in a $15 minimum wage, I don't believe in free college by raising taxes, and I don't believe in demolishing the ACA to make room for a single-payer system that will never pass Congress. That's my personal opinions, and I voted for Hillary because I agree with more of her policies than Bernie's. The majority of Democratic voters have made the same choice.

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Response to auntpurl (Reply #2)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:11 PM

4. Actually with her multiple adoptions

 

and recent evolutions, by voting Hillary you actually voted for Bernie's platform. Kind of ironic how her weathervane approach put you in that position, isn't it?

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Response to auntpurl (Reply #2)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:19 PM

8. And let's be honest.....

 

By supporting Hillary, you're also supporting an "America -first" foreign policy which does believe that it's appropriate for the U.S. to preemptively invade other countries if we don't approve of their leaders, you're supporting more climate -warming energy practices (fracking), and you're supporting neoliberalist views on the economy.

Not faulting you for your beliefs, but if you hold them then you're not a liberal, rather you're a centrist.

As a result, we have the deep divisions that we currently have, and most Sanders supporters will not buy into Hillary's platform.

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Response to seekthetruth (Reply #8)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:26 PM

9. Some of that is true.

I am in favour of a strong foreign policy that will engage in military intervention when necessary to prevent the unchecked growth of terrorism or genocide. I am strongly in favour of engaging in intervention only in concert with our allies. Reducing it to "we don't approve of their leaders" does not reflect my beliefs.

I favour fracking over coal, and I think Hillary's energy policy is well-reasoned: we move toward clean energy, creating jobs in that sector that can make up for the shortfall of jobs in coal. In the meantime, we need short-term energy solutions, and fracking while not ideal is cleaner than coal and reduces our dependence on foreign oil, which props up terrorism.

I have never made any secret that I am slightly fiscally conservative and consider myself a moderate in general. I won't apologise for that. I've voted Dem in every race (national and local) since I was 18. I am every bit as much of a member of the Democratic party as anyone else, and there are apparently more of me (I'm over-generalising in the sense that everyone's beliefs are somewhat different, but you know what I mean) than there are far-left members, or at least ones who vote.

My opinion re: Bernie supporters is that most will vote for Hillary and the rest will be as insignificant as the PUMAs were in 2008. But I guess we'll see.

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Response to ArcticFox (Original post)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:12 PM

5. I think you might be confusing the rantings of people here on DU, not actual office holding

 

Democrats. The official party line continues to be that he can run as long as he wants, and that they think he has brought 'healthy competition' to the race.

BTW, the problem with embracing his message is that the tax increases it would require would never sell to this particular electorate. Maybe with a better overall economy, but as things stand, huge financial hits won't be supported in a general election.

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Response to anotherproletariat (Reply #5)

Tue May 24, 2016, 02:15 AM

13. This article seems to be about actual office-holding democrats

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/05/23/bernie-sanders-risks-berning-bridges-in-senate.html

And - what? What electorate are you talking about that wouldn't support taxing the rich again to give the rest of us a chance?

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Response to ArcticFox (Original post)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:45 PM

10. Here is the thing.

 

I only see this ending one way for Sanders considering what he is saying in public and what he is saying behind the scene.

Call me an optimist but I believe his endorsement is going to be epic. I see him going to the convention with as much clout as possible. He will get multiple sentences added or changed in the party platform. Possibly even a section added from his own team on economics. They will not be minor and it will be in the guiding list of principals expected of Democrats. Kind of. Lol. It really is a big tent.

He will take to the podium and talk about how successful the revolution has been in such short time. Talk about how hard it was to work for the change that has occurred during the campaign, with real results, yet the hardest has yet to come. He will hammer home the point that he worked from the inside to achieve these changes. That he will continue to work as a Democrat and that is where the revolution should reside. Here it is. Hold on. He will then passionately tell us why the next most important step in the revolution is to elect Clinton. He will destroy Trump and praise Clintons positions, many of which he likes.

The fight for power is real and everyone has their role. This is a two party system with 300 million plus people. I don't think the yelling right now is as significant as some think. Sanders has told some highly respected Democrats recently some things I find to be very positive. I think too often we become hypersensitive to the negative. It seems there are no words left to promote our candidates, we've made all those arguments. Negative seems to come in anever ending supply.

Sure. Optimist. Im not kidding when I say I'm looking forward to the convention. I'm a bit pissed at Sanders right now. That's a part of being a Democrat and the party is big enough for Sanders, the Democrats supporting him, and a number of Independents. I can't think of a Democrat that hasn't pissed me off at one point or another.

It's going to be one heck of a fight in the GE. I believe we will be in a good position to win.

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Response to ArcticFox (Original post)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:51 PM

11. One small problem with your conditions; Sanders lost.

He's the second place candidate, and his supporters bet on the runner up. So Hillary's policies get kicked to the curb and Sanders gets top billing? That's not how it works.

No matter what she might do to appease them, short of personally handing the victory to Sanders, there's no guarantee that his followers will ever back Hillary. You have only to read the endless Hillary hate on this forum to see it's impossible to placate them.

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Response to procon (Reply #11)

Tue May 24, 2016, 02:20 AM

14. who said anything about kicking to the curb?

If Clinton is as good a politician as I keep hearing, she'll find a way to include Sanders's message.

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Response to ArcticFox (Reply #14)

Tue May 24, 2016, 09:43 AM

16. How much influence should Sanders have over the Democratic platform?

Hillary has already agree to see that Sanders is well represented in the drafting of the party's platform, and Sanders has said he is satisfied with the way the committee seats were distributed. Hillary has also promised that her platform will be very progressive, but will it be enough to appease Sanders?

With so many of his followers -- at least here -- saying they aren't Democrats, and swearing a blood oath that they will never vote for Hillary, and some have made disturbing declarations that they will vote for Trump to hurt Hillary's election. What clout does does Sanders really bring to the table if he can't bring his followers onboard? ? He's still likely going to want a major role in picking Hillary's VP, and he's definitely going to demand a primetime slot on the convention stage to promote himself. What else?

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Response to procon (Reply #16)

Sat Jun 11, 2016, 02:53 AM

18. it's not a question of whether Sanders has influence

(He does, btw)
It's a question of whether the democrats will have the sense to recognize the good to come from adopting Bernie's platform. Both politically and for the future of mankind. In the end, this isn't about Bernie or Hillary. It's about us. Do we want to sink deeper and deeper into serfdom, or do we rise up to take control of our destiny?

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Response to ArcticFox (Original post)

Mon May 23, 2016, 05:59 PM

12. Giving 40% of party platform shows the effect of Berners

and their leader. Hard fought recognition should be celebrated as coalition building, even if trust is lacking right now. This a good start toward unity that respects differences.

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Response to ArcticFox (Original post)

Tue May 24, 2016, 02:21 AM

15. The Bernie revolution is the future. The sad saps at the DNC are having trouble coming to grips ...

 

but the writing is on the wall. Bernie has too many decks stacked against him to overcome a rigged system for this election cycle but the young people of this country will keep the torch lit moving forward. Goodness will eventually prevail.

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Response to ThePhilosopher04 (Reply #15)

Tue May 24, 2016, 04:34 PM

17. thanks for your optimism

I hope it's borne out

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