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Thu May 19, 2016, 09:05 AM

From Robert Reich's Facebook Page


Many of you who support Bernie ask me what you should do at this point. My suggestion:

1. Continue to work like hell for Bernie, especially given upcoming primaries in California and New Jersey on June 7. Putting aside superdelegates, the difference between him and Hillary Clinton isn’t huge. So far, Bernie has won nearly 10 million votes and has 1,499 pledged delegates. Hillary Clinton has won 13 million votes and has 1,771 pledged delegates. California could make a huge difference.

2. Don’t demonize or denigrate Hillary Clinton. If she wins the Democratic nomination, I urge you to work like hell for her. She’ll be the only person standing between Donald Trump and the presidency of the United States. Besides, as I’ve said before, she’ll be an excellent president for the system we now have, even though Bernie would be the best president for the system we need.

3. Never, ever give up fighting against the increasing concentration of wealth and power at the top, which is undermining our democracy and distorting our economy. That means, if Hillary Clinton is elected, I urge you to turn Bernie’s campaign into a movement – even a third party – to influence elections at the state level in 2018 and the presidency in 2020. No movement to change the allocation of power succeeds easily or quickly. We are in this for the long haul.

What do you think?

59 replies, 2532 views

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Arrow 59 replies Author Time Post
Reply From Robert Reich's Facebook Page (Original post)
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 OP
onecaliberal May 2016 #1
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #3
onecaliberal May 2016 #5
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #8
onecaliberal May 2016 #9
lagomorph777 May 2016 #11
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #12
Hiraeth May 2016 #19
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #23
Hiraeth May 2016 #24
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #25
Hiraeth May 2016 #27
onecaliberal May 2016 #33
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #34
Hekate May 2016 #39
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #41
onecaliberal May 2016 #45
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #48
onecaliberal May 2016 #53
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #56
themaguffin May 2016 #42
onecaliberal May 2016 #46
themaguffin May 2016 #59
merrily May 2016 #26
Post removed May 2016 #52
Jitter65 May 2016 #15
merrily May 2016 #30
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #35
merrily May 2016 #37
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #43
merrily May 2016 #44
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #47
baldguy May 2016 #4
Hiraeth May 2016 #17
baldguy May 2016 #18
Hiraeth May 2016 #20
baldguy May 2016 #21
Hiraeth May 2016 #22
baldguy May 2016 #55
Hiraeth May 2016 #58
Hoyt May 2016 #2
ThePhilosopher04 May 2016 #6
DookDook May 2016 #7
onecaliberal May 2016 #10
DookDook May 2016 #16
CorkySt.Clair May 2016 #36
Todays_Illusion May 2016 #13
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #14
Dem2 May 2016 #28
pengu May 2016 #29
seekthetruth May 2016 #31
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #32
seekthetruth May 2016 #49
seekthetruth May 2016 #54
Algernon Moncrieff May 2016 #57
seekthetruth May 2016 #50
eastwestdem May 2016 #38
Katashi_itto May 2016 #51
Fast Walker 52 May 2016 #40

Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Original post)

Thu May 19, 2016, 09:41 AM

1. #2 is just not going to happen. Too many things. I can't bring myself to go there

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #1)

Thu May 19, 2016, 09:54 AM

3. Let me say, as a Clinton supporter, that if Bernie is nominated I'll vote for him

I won't be thrilled about it, but I'd do it because: I don't see either Hilary or Bernie moving to illegalize abortion or stem cell research; neither will move toward selecting justices that want to turn back the clock on same sex marriage; neither wants to build a wall along the Rio Grande; neither wants to renegotiate the Paris climate agreement; neither will appoint Sarah Palin to any position of importance within the government. I could go on.

Our respective factions have differing visions of what it means to be a Democrat, and neither faction likes the other too much right now. Reich's point is well taken, though; the Sanders revolution can survive the election as a faction within the Democratic party, or the nucleus of a new progressive party (or a revamped Green party).

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #3)

Thu May 19, 2016, 10:08 AM

5. He's an honorable person. What's not to support. Same can't be said for her.

Sorry but I'm not okay with record poverty and 40 million uninsured, I'm not okay that no bankers went to prison and I'm not okay with my granchilds family possibly being wiped from this planet so evil greedy people who already have WAY to much, can get even more. We should all be ashamed, history will NOT be kind.

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #5)

Thu May 19, 2016, 10:53 AM

8. The alternative is Donald Trump

Donald Trump will address none of the issues you claim to value. Hillary Clinton will likely address at least some of them, and won't create new issues.

As for "What's not to support"? From my perspective, there is a lot not to support about Bernie Sanders, and I'd be holding my nose if I had to vote for him, but I'd readily concede he's a better alternative than Trump.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #8)

Thu May 19, 2016, 10:58 AM

9. She can't beat trump. I don't understand how folks like you can see the polls, for months

her numbers are NEVER increasing. Bernie has consistently performed better against trump, handily defeating him. So you go ahead and buy that corporate media propaganda, it is you folks who are going to elect trump by supporting the weakest candidate in modern history. She can't even get half the dems, let alone any of the indies. There are more Indies, than dems, or cons, and they DO vote in the general, couple that with 67% of dems describing her as a liar. If you're being honest with yourself, you know she can't win.

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #9)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:13 AM

12. Nevertheless, Hillary Clinton has more votes and pledged delegates

1768 Pledged delegates to 1494
525 SDs to 39
12,989,134 to 9,957,889 votes

Not corporate media propaganda. Simple math.

Why is it that anyone who disagrees with Sanders supporters is automatically supposed to be falling for corporate propaganda. Has it ever occurred to you that we value different things in a candidate? Ever occurred to you that some of us just don't see Sanders as an effective leader? Ever occurred to any of you that some of us just don't think America is not best served by having another old white male in the White House?

Speaking of corporate media propaganda: that poll showing Trump up 3 that everyone is crowing about comes courtesy of FOX News. It doesn't get much more corporate than that.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #12)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:55 AM

19. it might be math but, it dang sure ain't simple. Those numbers represent people and people

are complicated.

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Response to Hiraeth (Reply #19)

Thu May 19, 2016, 12:23 PM

23. No - people are generally pretty simple

They vote out of fear of loss or hope for gain, and they select issues or candidates relating to those feelings. In terms of the Democratic primaries, more people have voted for Clinton than Sanders. You may not like it; it may leave you scratching your head; but it is the simple truth.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #23)

Thu May 19, 2016, 12:30 PM

24. one person might be simple but, people together create a myriad complicated juxtaposition.

You might not like it but, that is a simple truth.

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Response to Hiraeth (Reply #24)

Thu May 19, 2016, 12:34 PM

25. The person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals, and you know it!

(It's from "Men In Black"

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #25)

Thu May 19, 2016, 12:37 PM

27. see. the word dangerous is complicated and you know it. If not then governing would be simple.

as you can witness right here on DU it is NOT so simple.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #12)

Thu May 19, 2016, 02:04 PM

33. ONLY because millions of independents were locked out of the process, please stop acting like

everyone voted. When you have to lock people out of voting to win what does that say for your candidate. The only propaganda going on here is Hillary and her supporters lying and lying about vote suppression and outright cheating. Skin color and gender have no bearing on my decision who to support, my support is based only on policy. It's about who is owned and supported by corporate America. You can pretend it's propaganda if you want, the facts prove you wrong over and over. You are entitled to your opinion, but NOT to facts. As far as the corporate media and the candidates they back, that is also very EASILY proven to be Hillary and Trump in the free airtime they've both been given for months, while Bernie has virtually been locked out. Also look at their donors lists, and I'm so sure they're giving millions out of the goodness of their hearts, I have a bridge for sale too.....

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #33)

Thu May 19, 2016, 03:20 PM

34. Please stop acting like its hard to become a Democrat

You check a box on your voter registration. It's not hard. There's no blood oath, no goat sacrifice, no initiation ritual, no quiz -- none of the things I'd favor for party membership. It.could.not.be.easier.to.join.the.Democratic.Party.Please stop spreading this lie that people were locked out.

Primaries are the mechanisms by which parties choose candidates. Independents, by definition, have chosen not to join a party. It's like insisting you should have a say in who the Exalted Ruler of the local Elks lodge should be when you are not a member of the Elks.

Other than that, your post is the same-old-same-old -- it's all lies and the corporate media and a giant conspiracy and propaganda and what's really in the hangar at Area 51 (OK - you didn't say that last part). Why is it so difficult to accept that Bernie Sanders is, in fact, being outvoted?

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #34)

Thu May 19, 2016, 03:31 PM

39. Thank you for that, Algernon. My gods, Reality. What a difficult concept.

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Response to Hekate (Reply #39)

Thu May 19, 2016, 03:40 PM

41. You are more than welcome

I love and admire the enthusiasm over in Bernieland (I say that without snark or rancor). But I'm really, really tired being treated as it we're no better than Joe Ricketts and Sheldon Adelson.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #34)

Thu May 19, 2016, 04:19 PM

45. My post is the same old, that's rich.... Stop acting like the majority of Americans

Trust democrats. They don't. #Blocked

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #45)

Thu May 19, 2016, 04:47 PM

48. If you don't trust Democrats, why be on Democratic Underground?

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #48)

Thu May 19, 2016, 05:21 PM

53. You don't know me, you have no idea how old I am or how many years I have voted straight ticket dem,

They have been taken over by corporations, maybe you're okay with fucking over 40 million people but I'm not. And don't bother responding to me, you just earned yourself a stop on my ignore list.

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #53)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:37 PM

56. I'll respond anyway

You won't respond, but you'll see this. You'll log out and see if that SOB responded. It's what most of DU does with their ignore list.

Of course I don't know you. You don't know me either.

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #9)

Thu May 19, 2016, 03:43 PM

42. Polls mean nothing now. "She can't beat Trump" has no substance. It's BS. Also...

One can say that Bernie can't even get half the Dems. Most Republicans voted for someone NOT named Trump.

Let's drop the bullshit especially the "if you're being honest with yourself" bullshit. Grow up.

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Response to themaguffin (Reply #42)

Thu May 19, 2016, 04:20 PM

46. I got some cheese to go with your whine.

Don't say we didn't tell you.

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #46)

Mon May 23, 2016, 12:47 PM

59. Oh bless your heart, you wanted to use that line so bad, relevance be damned.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #8)

Thu May 19, 2016, 12:35 PM

26. Maybe.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #8)


Response to onecaliberal (Reply #5)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:37 AM

15. Maybe you can't say the same for her but I can. She is an honorable person as much as Bernie is.

 

You need to check out his past a little more closely. He is a s much a political animal as Hillary. She is no more dishonorable than Bernie. The most "honorable" person in politics today is the President and he has taken much the same flack from purist Dems as Hillary. Bernie and Mrs. Bernie are not as "clean" as you might want to believe.

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Response to Jitter65 (Reply #15)

Thu May 19, 2016, 12:41 PM

30. He is political. DUH. He is a politician. Hell no, Hillary is not in the same class with Bernie.

I don't know where Hillary supporters got the meme that Bernie supporters don't realize that Bernie is a politician, but it couldn't be dumber or wronger. We know he is a politician. Does his being a politician mean he is the same as Hillary? Hell, no.

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Response to merrily (Reply #30)

Thu May 19, 2016, 03:20 PM

35. It doesn't mean he's all that different either.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #35)

Thu May 19, 2016, 03:24 PM

37. He is, unless you fall for the Rovian crap, but thanks for your opinion.

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Response to merrily (Reply #37)

Thu May 19, 2016, 03:56 PM

43. Why is it always that Hillary supporters are suckers? Some of us just like Hillary better.

3,031,245 more voters liked Hillary better than Bernie Sanders -- so far.

It's never simply that we have different views; different priorities; different things that we want in a candidate. No -- it's always that we've fallen for "Rovian crap" (despite Bernie's acceptance of an invitation to debate on FOX), or that we've fallen for corporate media lies (interestingly, the Poll showing Trump +3 over HRC comes from FOX, but believe what you want).

But thanks for your post!

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #43)

Thu May 19, 2016, 04:15 PM

44. Um, my post was about whether Sanders was different from Hillary.

Not who you liked better. Not whether you are allowed to have different views--as if I could stop you from having whatever view you want, etc.

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Response to merrily (Reply #44)

Thu May 19, 2016, 04:42 PM

47. Um they are both career politicians

Both hold similar views on 80+% of issues.

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #1)

Thu May 19, 2016, 09:56 AM

4. Trump supporter then.

 

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Response to baldguy (Reply #4)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:50 AM

17. look in the mirror.

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Response to Hiraeth (Reply #17)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:53 AM

18. I'm supporting the Democratic Party nominee against Trump. Can you say the same?

 

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Response to baldguy (Reply #18)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:56 AM

20. we don't yet have a nominee. and if you are supporting the nominee then stands to reason

that you can NOT call a Bernie supporter a Trump supporter. You understand how this works, yes?

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Response to Hiraeth (Reply #20)

Thu May 19, 2016, 12:02 PM

21. I don't care who the nominee is, I'm voting for 'em. Can you say the same?

 

No qualifying clauses, no hedging, if's, and's or but's. Just say it: "I will support the Democratic nominee for President, no matter who it is".

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Response to baldguy (Reply #21)

Thu May 19, 2016, 12:05 PM

22. then retract your previous comment to a fellow DUer. NOT playing your ugly game.

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Response to Hiraeth (Reply #22)

Thu May 19, 2016, 10:36 PM

55. So, I'm guessing you're a Trump supporter too, huh?

 

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Response to baldguy (Reply #55)

Fri May 20, 2016, 09:31 AM

58. That does not stand to reason and you know it.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Original post)

Thu May 19, 2016, 09:44 AM

2. Reich has been wrong about a lot of things recently, but this deserves applause!!!!

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Original post)

Thu May 19, 2016, 10:08 AM

6. Deep down, he knows No. 2 ain't happenin' but I'm sure he's saying it to make nice

 

As for the comment, "she'll be an excellent president for the system we now have," that's exactly what I'm afraid of. The last thing we need is someone who's excellent at running a shitty system. Don't settle. Change the system.

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Response to ThePhilosopher04 (Reply #6)

Thu May 19, 2016, 10:29 AM

7. If he admitted that he knew that No. 2 is impossible,

it would shift the entire conversation to "How can Secretary Clinton win over those people who like Bernie?" or "See, he's really a Bernie or bust person." So by putting in the line about how Yup, if she gets the nod we'll all pull behind her because what else are we going to do? Well, I know that I've got a plan B if Sanders doesn't get the nomination that involves supporting the most progressive candidate that's running.

I also think that this line from No. 2 is also telling that he claims that, "she’ll be an excellent president for the system we now have." I don't think that that is such a good thing for us. Look at the direction that the country is going, we're concentrating the wealth into fewer and fewer hands and squeezing the middle class out of existence, so if she knows how to pull all the levers of power and 'get things done' what is the country going to look like after she's had her run with it? What is the next economic crash going to look like? And who are they going to go to to get to bail out the bankers? What will we do when we find that we've poisoned all the ground water and the oceans are dead?

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Response to DookDook (Reply #7)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:00 AM

10. She can't win us over.

They ARE going to kill the fucking planet for my grandkids, and their family. I will NEVER support that. Ever!

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #10)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:48 AM

16. I agree.

It was one of the reasons that my wife and I made the choice to not have any children. We've made plenty of other lifestyle choices to try and help the planet and we realized that our small effort wasn't going to do too much to stem the tide so we came to the conclusion that it wasn't fair to the planet and it wasn't fair to whatever new person that we would potentially create.

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Response to onecaliberal (Reply #10)

Thu May 19, 2016, 03:23 PM

36. You'll be supporting it if you don't vote for the Dem nominee

 

Whether that's Bernie or Clinton. That is a FACT.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Original post)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:29 AM

13. This feels less and less like an election as we go along. Are we all feeling properly manipulated?

Let's all join the herd and run of the cliff smiling.

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Response to Todays_Illusion (Reply #13)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:36 AM

14. All elections are like that to lesser or greater extents

...especially to those who are voting for their 2nd or 3rd choice candidates.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Original post)

Thu May 19, 2016, 12:37 PM

28. Reich makes good points

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Original post)

Thu May 19, 2016, 12:39 PM

29. 2 out of 3 ain't bad

I agree with #1 and #3.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Original post)

Thu May 19, 2016, 12:42 PM

31. Numbers 2 and 3 don't fly.

 

Can't support Clinton at all until she adopts a progressive platform. Especially for the earth's sake.

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Response to seekthetruth (Reply #31)

Thu May 19, 2016, 01:59 PM

32. American politics is about compromise

I think we all agree that we don't want President Trump. You indicate that you could possibly support Clinton if she made some platform changes. What specifically would you want to see?

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #32)

Thu May 19, 2016, 04:51 PM

49. A few things.

 

I am opened minded, and I do agree that there are certain things that can be compromised over, but given the historical trends and current state of our economy, our healthcare system, infrastructure, and energy consumption rates along with how we obtain energy, I feel there is little to compromise over if I stand for a progressive platform. I do agree that the various purity tests that many Sanders supporters always fall back on can seem to be tiresome, but they are based on certain "absolutes" with respect to the environment, war, and many other matters.

So, in essence, this is what Mrs. Clinton would absolutely have to do to earn my vote both in private (i.e. behind closed doors with other politicians, lobbyists, etc.) and to the public:

- immediately give back any campaign contributions that she has received from various corporations that exist in the oil, pharmaceutical, and banking industries
- support a complete and total ban on fracking
- support a framework of moving to a single-payer healthcare infrastructure. Of course, keep the ACA....but move towards single-payer
- support revised Glass-Steagall act which prohibits the intermingling of commercial and investment banking
- support for cap and trade on CO2 emitters
- a pledge to overturn Citizens United, and support the complete end to SuperPACS, thus relying only on individual contributions for campaign funding. And to nominate SCOTUS Justices who support such policies
- gun reform (a given....I do agree with her positions on this)
- a pledge not to engage in further military action in any Mideast conflicts (unless we're directly attacked), and to support a policy of supporting other Mideast countries taking the lead to combat terrorism

Those are the main things she'd need to support to get my vote. However, given her past performance, I highly doubt I could trust her. I distinctly remember her frantically shouting that universal healthcare would never happen only to hear about her support for such legislation a few weeks later......just one example of her flip-flopping.

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Response to seekthetruth (Reply #49)

Thu May 19, 2016, 05:35 PM

54. In addition.....a $15 federal minimum wage....

 

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Response to seekthetruth (Reply #49)

Thu May 19, 2016, 11:39 PM

57. Your response is interesting.

Thanks.

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Reply #32)

Thu May 19, 2016, 05:06 PM

50. And yes.....the speeches.

 

Since no other candidates have made any paid speeches at the present.....I think she needs to keep her word. She should release all of them.

Doubt that she will......

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Original post)

Thu May 19, 2016, 03:29 PM

38. I agree that #2 won't happen. The Sanders supporter are not big enough people

 

to see beyond their own selfish wants.

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Response to eastwestdem (Reply #38)

Thu May 19, 2016, 05:12 PM

51. Hillbot.

 

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Response to Algernon Moncrieff (Original post)

Thu May 19, 2016, 03:37 PM

40. this is my attitude, but it's too bad how many people have really completely lost their minds

 

over Hillary, and believing the worst.

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