Kentucky was a closed primary and Hillary won by a handful of votes?

[NightWatcher]

What would the outcome be if Independents, who do get to vote in November, were allowed to vote?

This HUUUGE victory for Hillary should be raising red flags and it would if the Party didn't have their Hillary blinders on.

November is going to suck for Hillary and it will be hers and the Party's fault and no one else.

[YouDig]

1. And here come the alternate reality scenarios.

[Barack_America]

17. Independents voting in the general election is "alternate reality"?

Do explain.

Or don't. You'll realize soon enough.

[MrMickeysMom]

18. Only if you stopped paying attention...

... Are you of the mind that Trump wouldn't destroy her? That makes you a member of that club.

The close primary states were explained to another DUer who probably is a member of that club, but worth repeating here -

Given that the primary states of today have "always been closed" (actually, that's not quite true, but for the sake of the argument, I'll agree that they've been pretty static as many of us slept), how do you suppose this phenomena of who is and isn't a Democrat has changed over time?

What is the logic behind the change in party for MANY Democrats residing in the "closed primary states" over the last 15 to 20 years? I can tell you that these voters (CLOSE TO HALF OF THE ELECTORATE) have moved away from the Democratic party. And, it doesn't just happen by accident. Unless you are one of those true believers who think that the Democrats previously elected kept on giving their electorate love, you will see that their movement OUT of our party happened with reason. Coupled with gerrymandering to help the Republicans, they left because they saw (and still see) that the party left us. They now have lessened the chance of inclusion unless the state allows them to. They STILL hold the long-forgotten Democratic party's values. THEY HAVE NO PLACE, unless they change parties just to have a primary vote. Depending on where they are, they can. And, when they do, they do it because they see a candidate WHO NEVER FORGOT THOSE VALUES.

Your problem is one of over-simplicity when no longer looking at people who are fed up with corporately owned members of our party. You pretend they don't exist. They do.

[cali]

99. What alternate.History? The race is still undecided

[jwirr]

24. I wonder about that also. But I do not think O'Malley would

have wanted this.

[Skwmom]

88. I don't know about that. Aren't they floating around O'Malley for DNC?

[jwirr]

96. I meant voting for candidates that are not running anymore.

[Arugula Latte]

3. She's a very, very weak presumed nominee.

Her negatives are through the roof.

[RBInMaine]

20. Oh Bullshit. And Bernie is an avowed socialist who would be CRUSHED with negative ads. Get real.

Bernie hasn't been fully vetted, and if was the nominee the hammer and sickle communism ads would CRUSH him to pieces. He is to the left of the majority of the country, and he isn't even a real Democrat. While I agree with him in principle on many issues, he would be a VERY weak nominee because of his avowed socialism. Get real.

[Arugula Latte]

27. There's never been a Democratic nominee who has been so well known and also so thoroughly hated

as Hillary Clinton. A percentage of that is due to rightwing lies and sexism, yes, but a majority has been brought on by Clintonian sleaze and corruption and lies and her own statements and long record of siding with the wrong thing because it's politically expedient at the time.

[KittyWampus]

43. It's good to see so many Sanders supporters on DU helping spread the hate….

Newsflash- there is so much negative crap on Sanders that never gets flung by the media.

The only sleaze in this primary is Sanders and his campaign. Stealing data, misappropriating logos, impersonating union members, false claims of cheating, failure to strongly condemn mob behavior and threats to Democrats and THEIR CHILDREN/GRANDCHILDREN.

[Arugula Latte]

50. A lot of us feel like this is the last chance for the Democratic Party.

The DWS/Clinton stranglehold on the party means it has basically become the Republican Party from 20 years ago. Reasonable and very popular positions are now labeled "extreme" and "far left" by so-called Democrats. Corporate interests and wars for profit are for "grown ups" and things like affordable healthcare and college are selfish and pie-in-the-sky requests by brats. Sleaziness and blatant cheating are just par for the course with this new Democratic Party.

I'm pretty much done with enabling this shit.

[timmymoff]

85. there is so much negative crap on Hillary that does

get shown in the media, with more to come. Should be interesting.

[NWCorona]

113. Lol do you even listen to yourself?

"It's good to see so many Sanders supporters on DU helping spread the hate…"

And a few sentences later.

"The only sleaze in this primary is Sanders and his campaign."

You are everything I expect in a Clinton supporter.

[ChiciB1]

87. Well We SHALL See If It's Her... But THIS DEMOCRATIC PARTY

has done far too much damage to "we the people" and many of us have NOW clearly seen just how much they've worked to MAKE SURE they have "their queen" a person we have NO FAITH IN!

To Hillary supporters go ahead and jump for joy... but I CAN NOT see how she can beat TRUMP! Even IF she does get some Bernie supporters falling on their sword and doing what they clearly find distasteful.

Those who DIDN'T GET TO VOTE in Primaries WILL NOT be on her side and her head to head with Trump is eroding!

Our Democratic Party has shown us an UGLY face and there will be many. many defections!

GET READY... the millennials simple DO NOT support OR like Hillary and they DO NOT TRUST HER! I'm not saying this because Bernie may not have enough to win because of SUPER DELEGATES, but many new voters think SUPER DELEGATES have given her an UNFAIR ADVANTAGE! Simple facts, don't have to agree but I predict THE DEMOCRATS have now have shot themselves in the foot!

[Waiting For Everyman]

91. "Those who DIDN'T GET TO VOTE in Primaries WILL NOT be on her side..."

Your whole post summed up the situation very well, and that one statement especially jumped out at me.

Those who DIDN'T GET TO VOTE in Primaries WILL NOT be on her side and her head to head with Trump is eroding!

We're constantly aware of the difference in results when Independents are shut out of primaries, but I don't think we look at it from their point of view as far as motivation for a particular candidate in the General Election.

They don't feel included or invested in the process. An analogy might be a conversation among several people in which they are talked over and have no input, and no one is interested in what they have to say. It's boring and insulting when it goes on repeatedly.

Those of us who have been in a party for a long time do not really appreciate how important this is. And now, Independents are 45% of the entire electorate -- the biggest group! Granted, they are not all Dem-leaning, but that isn't the point.

A party that leaves them on the sidelines and doesn't care about their views is not going to have any depth of strength to win.

This is the big thing Bernie has done, which is under-appreciated. For once, they have been brought in and included in the conversation and we see the response. The only problem is, they do not usually take part in primaries and so they are not familiar enough with the process to know the fine points of registering.

Bernie's campaign has been so short on time, that there has not been enough of a chance to inform them properly, as I'm sure he would've liked to do. Of course, the media has been little help as they have become mostly useless.

And now having brought them into the conversation, the Dem party is slapping those people in the face by blatantly railroading their candidate with obvious election rigging and voter fraud, in order to hand the election to the candidate they emphatically don't want. In my opinion, they will turn on this party in droves. Independents do not like dishonesty or unfairness, especially millennials.

I really fail to see how party designation, which is essentially signing up for a meaningless card saying "D" on it, is a reason to disenfranchise a huge swath of people. If someone is going to vote Dem in the General, why is having that "D" card a few months ahead of time a reason to exclude them from choosing which candidate will run via the Primary? It's nonsense!

All of this party allegiance stuff is nonsense at a grass roots voter level, and nobody knows it more clearly than Independents. BUT THEY ARE RIGHT ABOUT THAT.

NOBODY SHOULD BE EXCLUDED FROM THE VOTING PROCESS. PERIOD.

Anyway, I realize I'm preaching to the choir because it was your point after all, you just started me thinking. Great post, ChiciB1!

[ChiciB1]

134. Hi There My "Jackson" Friend! Been Meaning To Get Back To You

ALL day if not since quite some time ago. I don't post as much as before and when I do I get so FRUSTRATED by so much crazy crap that I have to log off!

So since this A.M. even KY tightened and razor thin isn't even that! Think what it would have looked like right now if elections AND voting even came close to looking like "we the people!"

I will have to say that I've NEVER seen the Democratic Party more clearly than I am now. I figured that Hillary was going to get a lot of support, but NEVER did I think they would stoop so low and show how very biased they are. They aren't even trying to hide their animus for a person who has always caucused with them and a candidate who has brought MORE excitement to an election than anyone I can remember!

One thing for sure it's exposed so many Democrats that I once thought were willing to fight for us but have shown me a completely other side. Add that to a MEDIA that they can manipulate and one that they've been in bed with like never before.

Anyway, I could go on and on about how betrayed I feel by more people than I can name, and I KNOW my eyes have been opened like never before. I will forever be on the outside looking in, but things will NEVER be the same so these so called leaders ARE going to feel the brunt of the ire of more people than they expect. I firmly believe that Bernie has made millions of people finally WAKE UP and the movement will continue no matter WHO wins!

If it's Trump or Hillary... they may think they won, but I wonder if they really know how much THEY DIDN'T!

Anyway, just wanted to give you a shout, gonna log off for tonight... just had ENOUGH of this for today. I'm sure I'll log on again soon but just have to break away or I'll go NUTS!

[GulfCoast66]

53. Looks like we agree

Hell, I like Bernie but have never been fanatical about any candidate. I just have realized from the get-go that once the mainstream media and the Republican machine started in on him we would have a McGovern level loss. Even most Democrats do not identify as socialist. And while I, and apparently you, realize the difference between democratic socialism and Socialism, that difference would be lost on most Americans. I am now convinced that the most radical and vocal Bernie supporters are 'True Socialist' who are looking to burn the system down.

I take from your name that you are from Maine. I honeymooned there 25 years ago. As normal for me went to the unpopulated parts of the state. Was shocked that you guys have some rednecks up there too😄

[Luminous Animal]

59. You keep banging that Trump drum re "avowed socialist."

[pengu]

80. They reveal themselves

[Nitram]

118. Better get used to it if Bernie wins the nomination.

You ain't seen nothing yet. You'd be hearing hyperbole about socialism 24/7 from the right if he won the nomination. Ya'll has a false sense of security because the right wing has totally ignored Bernie and aimed all their fire at Clinton. Just like the Bernie fans.

[phleshdef]

81. I love the smell of so called Democrats red baiting in the morning.

Wake the fuck up. The Democratic party is the only major party in this nation that embraces a good deal of socialism. If you are going to keep that shit up, then go join the Paul Ryan party. Its where you belong.

[Uponthegears]

129. Allow me to introduce you

to two words:

"reality" = Hillary's over-the-top negatives

"speculation" = what you CLAIM . . . MIGHT . . . be Bernie's negatives (You remember him, right? He's the person seeking the DEMOCRATIC nomination who has been FALSELY accused - by the most privileged woman in the world - in the Brockosphere - for the past at least nine months - as being everything from a flaming racist, to a misogynist, to a communist, to an inciter of riots, to an egomaniac . . . ) IF tRump can come up with something Hillary hasn't tried yet.

[dchill]

4. Why do you think they only want closed primaries?

[annavictorious]

37. The State Boards of Election decide what type of contest is held,

and in California where state law gives the political parties the right to allow independents to vote, the Democratic party opted to open its primary to independents while the Republicans did not

There goes that conspiracy theory.

[dchill]

42. By "they" I mean Clinton's people.

[msongs]

5. in November independents DO get to vote and they can vote for hillary. kills your argument eh? nt

[k8conant]

7. They can, but will they?

[NightWatcher]

10. How does Hill do with Independents?

[timmymoff]

86. Not so much by the negatives she has among independents.

Good luck.

[JimDandy]

6. She is way weaker than any candidate should be at this point.

But with all the media and the establishment behind her and even with her name and the fact her opponent is an upstart, she still can't close the deal, even. in. a fucking. closed. primary!

[LuvLoogie]

40. Bernie needed a thirty point win. From here on out, he needs

66% to 34% in each contest. Every single contest. I am only counting pledged delegates.

[WhiteTara]

8. As a Bernie supporter just told me

a win is a win.

[LuvLoogie]

9. Anyone is free to register as a Democrat according to his state's

Board of Elections rules. There are no Political Thought Police.

[Cali_Democrat]

11. Bernie actually won Kentucky

#BernieMath

[RBInMaine]

12. Um, this is the DEMOCRATIC Party, not the "Independent" Party. Enough of the nonsense.

It is up to DEMOCRATS to nominate THEIR candidate, not independents. Get real.

[snowy owl]

21. And you don't want our votes in the GE? Okay.

[LuvLoogie]

45. Bernie is running as a Democrat. He could have remained unaffiliated.

Why didn't he?

[QC]

23. How's LePage working out for you? n/t

[Newkularblue]

64. Snort

[Skink]

117. More like the DNC put up a for sale sign on the nomination

[pmorlan1]

13. I'm amazed

That Sanders got this close in Kentucky. This should have been a walk in the park for Hillary. It was a closed primary, Hill and Bill made numerous appearances here, they spent a bundle on TV ads and this is the result? WOW. Bernie had never campaigned in KY before. Bill won KY in the GE in '92 & '96. Hillary won here in 2008 with 65% of the vote. Fast forward to 2016 - Hillary wins in a squeaker. Not good for Hillary.

[NightWatcher]

16. Yep

[Arugula Latte]

31. And big surprise -- The Secretary of State of KY is a longtime friend/ally of the Clintons.

But, hey, I'm sure it's all on the up and up, right?

[annavictorious]

41. Sanders was expected to win.

The surprise is that he lost and that Clinton won the county with the University of Kentucky.

[pmorlan1]

48. That was before

she and Bill came back to the state to campaign and run ads. If they hadn't he would have won. You can spin all you like but it won't change the fact that this is not good news for Hill. Yes she will win and a win is a win but her backers can not be very happy about the sorry showing in Kentucky especially with their history of winning my state.

[peace13]

109. Let the votes be counted!

The SOS had more than a few problems last night!

[LuvLoogie]

47. Bernie needed a 30 point win. Now he needs 31 point wins.

[pmorlan1]

57. I'm still a happy supporter tonight

If we couldn't win my state this was the next best thing. This contest really exposed how weak she is as a candidate. She won here in 2008 with 65% of the vote and if this hadn't been a closed primary she would have lost big time. I know her supporters on DU will not admit this was not a real good win for her but the professionals backing her know it and I know it. So I'm good with this contest.

[LuvLoogie]

61. So tell me. What is Bernie going to win by in Oregon?...

In Puerto Rico? In California? New Jersey? against this weak candidate you speak of?

[pmorlan1]

62. Sorry

you'll have to find someone else to play games with tonight. It's not my thing.

[Waiting For Everyman]

92. I was very happy too, to see how well Kentucky did for Sanders!

It was very uphill, and to come within a fraction of a percent was outstanding! The truth is, it was a virtual tie, and if Bernie asked for a recount anywhere there's an even chance it would reverse. A technical "win" label isn't a big deal.

They sent a message, alright.

I wish my state had done half as well.

[pmorlan1]

93. What was your state?

[Waiting For Everyman]

95. Maryland, sad to say.

People here don't yet know the real Hillary, they just vote Blue (with occasional exceptions).

Although, against all odds one of our counties DID go for Sanders. (It wasn't reported anywhere of course, except on the state elections results site.) If there was more time, more of them might've done so too. Mine was very close, as were the other western counties.

Ah, well. I'm vicariously enjoying the showing in other states, like yours and West Virginia, and the rest, both the squeakers and the landslides.

[pmorlan1]

98. That one county

was sending a signal of what was to come. It's tough to have your primary in the beginning of the process before people are really paying attention. Good to know at least one county was doing so. I bet if they voted there again there would be a lot more than just one county going to Bernie. Like you I too enjoy watching the voting in each state. By the way, nice to meet you.

[peace13]

112. Ohio had the same problem!

The people who didn't pay attention didn't realize how viable Bernie was. They chose to snooze.

[Waiting For Everyman]

128. Yes, if he were the nominee I think he'd do much better

the second time around. Maybe we'll get to find out, who knows.

Same here, nice to meet you too.

[appalachiablue]

54. Did you see where Pike Co. votes, 3,000 and heavy Bernie were held back, then

reappeared just a while ago. They were handled by the SOS office, based on it being 'one of the places to watch' or smthg. if I read the info. on another thread correctly. #6, http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511986566

[pmorlan1]

55. I sure did

I was watching HuffPo results and saw reporting change from 99% to 98% and then saw Pike Co in white. They should be watching Jeff Co. They are always the last to report. They're probably trying to figure out how to get her an extra delegate.

[appalachiablue]

58. Negotiations for at least one more delegate, over some really good Bourbon!

Yum

[pmorlan1]

94. Um Hmm

I saw a tweet last night from Chris Hayes where he said it was Bourbon O'Clock. I tweeted back to him that I hoped it was Kentucky bourbon in honor of Bernie's showing.

[appalachiablue]

97. Good for you & Chris. Midnight Kentucky Bourbon always goes down smooth.

[pmorlan1]

101. Aaaaahhhhh

[ChiciB1]

127. I Think What Too Many People Here Are MISSING I A Much Bigger

PICTURE. These situations that have popped up over and over again in so many Primaries is something that has made far too many suspicious. I'm sure by now that there are MILLIONS of people who were previously UNAWARE of what a "closed Primary" means and there are people who believe it's their fault for not being better informed, but it's NOT THAT SIMPLE!

I'm very much aware of what the rules are in my state of Florida because it IS a Closed Primary state, but I'm willing to bet that many here don't even know how we vote. Even here I answered a question from a member who thought our Primary was over. We here are activists who follow politics and yet I had to tell this person that yes, our "Presidential Preference Primary" is over but we still have ANOTHER Primary coming up that will take place for the REST of the candidates. The candidates for Senators and Representatives etc., which is also a CLOSED PRIMARY before the GE in November.

Florida is a tourist state and millions of people move here all the time but that does NOT mean that how we vote is one of their first priorities and many ONLY FIND OUT when they register to vote. As time has passed many people just want to be Independents and don't find out that MAYBE they missed the deadline to change their affiliation to vote in a CLOSED PRIMARY! Far too many Supervisors of Elections simple register people and don't actually say much more. Too many people simply think they're registered and like so many have a busy life and don't read fine print. I hope you see where I'm going with this... I could go on and on and explain more and get deep into the weeds!

This is ONE state so take this example and apply it to ALL our states! We tried to inform and register people before the Primary but we could only do so much and it DOES irritate me when I see people post here saying "well it's their fault" that they didn't register. It's COMPLICATED and as I said "some people" miss the deadline because they didn't even live here long enough to vote in any election! And then there's so many people who thought they were registered ONE way but somehow when the went to vote something happened and they couldn't vote!!

What I'm getting to is this... I feel if you're the head of THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY some effort should be made to inform Senators and Representatives that it is essential that they inform their constituents and on down the line.

Bottom line we have a SUPER, SUPER SCREWED UP SYSTEM! It's confusing and differs from state to state. AND THEN THERE'S a feeling that perhaps THE HEAD OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY may NOT want this information to get much attention.

So I predict that we now have a very, very ANGRY ELECTORATE and this election has been an eye opener for millions and millions of people who feel they've been left out!

THIS DEMOCRATIC PARTY is going to have to understand THIS ANGER and REALIZE how dangerous this is going to be in the upcoming GE!

Much more needs to be added, but this is where I feel we're at and I know from personal experience that my THREE grand kids are really, really pissed! And I did get them to register in time, but they KNOW many, many angry friends.

So GOOD LUCK, the fat lady hasn't sung! I don't think this is going to be pretty!

[appalachiablue]

131. Choir here and didn't mean to suggest the KY vote counting issue was humorous.

Yes the US election system is very complex, the FEC has been made toothless, and there needs to be consistency and more outreach and education particularly for voters who are new to the political process or have recently changed their residency or voter registration status.

Our national and state level Dems. and election boards are not doing a good job of informing people about the intricacies of the system, possibly by design which is tragic for democracy. Five years of new voting restrictions implemented especially in red governed states like WI, NC, the south and other places impacting college students, elders, busy working people- ie Democratic constituents, creates even more confusion and obstruction of the voting process.

An example of state differences like Tim Canova challenging DWS's So. FL congressional seat, an area I know fairly well, in the election to be held in August even gave me pause since I knew the FL presidential Primary had already taken place. Until recently I also didn't fully know the large number of American voters who identify as Independent in the last 10-15 years, or the peculiar variances of closed, open and mixed!? state primary election systems.

As far as those here who blame and disparage voters as being dumbasses, young and too lazy to know the rules, that attitude exemplifies some of the very problems with the direction the party has taken in the last 10- 25 years, obviously.
National Dems. better recognize and stop antagonizing the large, growing mass of informed and frustrated Americans in the electorate I agree, especially IF they intend to remain a viable political party, a concern I share with many others.

[appalachiablue]

100. +5

[1StrongBlackMan]

119. Doesn't that mean, like in West Virginia, ...

the same (white, male) voters that preferred the white woman over the Black guy (in 2008); prefer the white guy over the white woman (in 2016)?

Fast forward to 2016 - Hillary wins in a squeaker. Not good for Hillary.

And, that same demographic will likely go for the "uber-AMERICAN", white guy over, either Democratic candidate.

However, the (President) Obama coalition is holding strong and there should be enough independent support (minus the BoBers) to keep things close in Ky.

[pmorlan1]

120. I disagree

In my opinion if Hillary is the nominee it will not be close in Kentucky. The Obama coalition is not strong for her in Kentucky which is why she had such a narrow win. I know you hate to hear it but a lot of the Obama coalition in Kentucky are Bernie or bust voters. It's not just Independents who feel this way it's also a big chunk of Democrats. Voter turnout in my state yesterday was very low and if she is the nominee in November the Obama coalition turnout will be low again. A lot of Dems who voted for Obama just don't like her.

Those racist Democrats who you mentioned mostly stayed home yesterday because they didn't want either candidate but they will vote in November and they will vote for Trump. If Hillary is the nominee she will have to appeal to establishment Republicans (mostly women) and the Bernie voters to beat Trump. Considering those are two diametrically opposed groups it will be a neat trick if she can do it.

I don't know how Bernie would fare. I know he appeals to a lot of the Trump voters who are anti-establishment but aren't comfortable with the racist aspects of Trump's campaign. There is not a visceral hatred of Bernie here with some on the Democratic side like there is with Hillary so it's possible he could make it close but I just don't know enough at this point to make that claim.

[1StrongBlackMan]

121. I disagree, particularly, with this part ...

I know you hate to hear it but a lot of the Obama coalition in Kentucky are Bernie or bust voters.

That, simply, is not true. The (President) Obama Coalition are solidly behind HRC largely BECAUSE they see her continuing President Obama's agenda ... that cannot be said about the BoB crowd.

[pmorlan1]

122. We will agree to disagree

A lot of people in my state who voted for Obama do not want to continue with the status quo.

[1StrongBlackMan]

123. And those people are not a part of the coalition that elected President Obama ... twice.

[pmorlan1]

125. What?

So if they voted for Obama they are not part of the coalition? I voted for Obama and I'm not content with continuing the status quo. I want to go forward not stay stagnant. I want to build upon his successes.

[Tarc]

14. "Kentucky was a 90% white state and Bernie lost by a handful of votes?"

[oldandhappy]

39. yep

[Nanjeanne]

49. Clinton won by more than 35% in 2008 and in 2016 barely wins against a Socialist?

[Tarc]

68. Yep. Goes to show that white rural men dislike African-Americans more than they dislike women

[Nanjeanne]

70. Good thing white men don't vote in the GE then.

[Tarc]

89. Good thing that they're slipping into minority status :)

[COLGATE4]

104. Well, since Kentucky always goes Republican

doesn't make a whole lot of difference, does it?

[Nanjeanne]

132. Guess not. Same as all those Southern states.

[auntpurl]

72. Yes. She's winning Obama's areas.

Have you not seen the electoral maps? She won KY in 08, therefore BERNIE should have won this year.

Hillary is winning the Obama coalition. Her areas are almost identical to his in 08. Bernie, therefore, is taking the Hillary areas. This is not complicated. It has nothing to do with closed or open primaries (both have won both). It is a simple variance of diverse urban areas versus white rural areas. it has played out over and over and over again this primary season. It was obvious after the South. I don't understand why people don't get this?

This is playing out very similar to 08, except I think Hillary will win California, which will be a difference.

[Number23]

65. THANK YOU. That state was tailor made for a big Sanders victory. All these people pretending that

his loss is anything but a huge blow to Sanders are full of it.

He's had a bad week. The loss in Kentucky and he's getting pounded in the press over Nevada. The primaries have been over for weeks and at this rate, I think even Sanders might come to realize that soon.

[ViseGrip]

15. Exactly, and with Bernie KY could go blue first time because of Trump.

[Peregrine Took]

19. The grande dame won a squeaker and we are supposed to keel over?

[RBInMaine]

28. She is WAY more qualified for that office than Bernie who is the the king of VAGUE talking points.

He has big VAGUE talking points and big shiny promises he can't begin to pay for or keep. Hillary will crush the orange man. If Bernie was the nominee, I would support him, but the R's would demolish him with anti-socialism/communism ads. He would be smashed to bits.

[LuvLoogie]

29. Bernie needed a 30 point win.

[COLGATE4]

105. The operative part of your post being

"The grande dame won..."

[annavictorious]

22. Clinton was expected to lose

She didn't.

Guess the newly minted Democrats and the university students in Fayette county didn't come through.
http://voteforbernie.org/state/kentucky/

[nc4bo]

60. And you bought that bullshit line?! Wow. I sure as hell didn't.

Even responded to a post saying M$M felt Sanders would win.

She blew it out against Obama in '08.

Why in the world would anyone expect a different outcome, heaven knows

[auntpurl]

73. Yes. She's winning Obama's areas.

Have you not seen the electoral maps? She won KY in 08, therefore BERNIE should have won this year.

Hillary is winning the Obama coalition. Her areas are almost identical to his in 08 all over the country. Bernie, therefore, is taking the Hillary areas. This is not complicated. It has nothing to do with closed or open primaries (both have won both). It is a simple variance of diverse urban areas versus white rural areas. it has played out over and over and over again this primary season. It was obvious after the South. I don't understand why people don't get this?

This is playing out very similar to 08, except I think Hillary will win California, which will be a difference.

[COLGATE4]

108. Yes. In case you haven't noticed, in '08 Obama

was an African American.

[reformist2]

25. What do you mean? It was a total win! TOTAL!!! lol

And guess what. I don't even believe the numbers anymore. She didn't win Kentucky at all, imo.

[LuvLoogie]

26. Bernie now needs to win 50 of Oregon's 61 Delegates to stay on pace

For the evening for a majority of 2026 pledged delegates where Bernie's any-day-now momentum will flip the supers.

[Skwmom]

30. The Democratic Party and Clinton own the loss in November. And I think they are going to sweep out

a lot of Democrats in the Tsunami that they refuse to acknowledge.

[dubyadiprecession]

32. Bernie was supposed to win...

He's still behind..as always.

[MrTriumph]

33. DP establishment in LEMMINGS march to the cliff.

The only question is: Are their blinders on or off?

[griffi94]

34. And what if the zombie appcolypse brought back JFK

and he won the most votes.

And what if 6 were 9.
And what if sand were worth the same as gold.

And....well I think I made my point.

[oasis]

35. Bernie should have apologized for his rowdy Nevada supporters when

the press gave him a chance. He blew it, and now he's paying the price.

[Matt_in_STL]

78. Please link to where Hillary apologized for her woman beating supporter

No apology? There goes that leg you were trying to stand on.

[oasis]

79. Hillary supporters did not disrupt the Nevada convention. No need

for her to apologize. Bernie damaged his brand by not apologizing for his supporters despicable behavior. Credit his loss in Kentucky to his inaction.

[Matt_in_STL]

82. Ah, disruption is not okay but beating a woman is.

As always, Hillary supporters care about women as long as they are named Hillary Clinton.

[oasis]

83. Who the hell said it was okay?

[Jester Messiah]

36. Yeah, anyone in H's campaign leadership with their eyes open...

Has got to be feeling pretty grim.

[oldandhappy]

38. 98% in and she is one point ahead

Yea, but hey, ya know, she is winning!!! This is not democracy. Maybe has not been. This is the first time for me to realize how rigged the system is (or has become).

[COLGATE4]

110. Yep. It's all a grand conspiracy. Better call Alex Jones

quick with the news. Maybe he'll put you on air to explain it. BTW, you do sound old but you sure in hell don't sound happy.

[KingFlorez]

44. There are still a whole lot of anti-Obama protest votes out there

Clinton managed to win despite those votes, which is quite good. A lot of the Democrats in Kentucky are very conservative and the map shows that Sanders carried them.

[PADemD]

46. There should be an independent primary in each state.

That primary should include all Democratic and Republican nominees. It would give each party an idea of where they stand with the independent vote.

[COLGATE4]

111. Yep. And then we would have had: (D) Hillary Clinton (I) Bernie Sanders

on the ballot.

[riversedge]

51. a win is a win...

https://s.yimg.com/fz/api/res/1.2/KBhnuLML4Wj3esE2RK5RJw--/YXBwaWQ9c3JjaGRkO2g9NjQwO3E9OTU7dz02NDA-/

[snowy owl]

52. CNN,votes dribbling in from county-Allison Grimes, Secy of St. close friend Clintons since childhood

CNN reported that those last votes for Clinton disappeared and then they reappeared again. Not saying any underhandedness but just sayin'... That last county should demand a recount. When it is this close, they should recount anyway.

Didn't know Grimes was so close to Clintons but explains why Democratic Party preferred Grimes to Judd. Always Clinton influence. Too bad.

[RBInMaine]

75. And the wild-eyed conspiracy theories keep just marching along. Give it up!

[Blaukraut]

56. Those goal posts have finally been moved off the field and into the parking lot

So Hillary's victories are really losses unless they're by double digits, and Bernie's losses are really victories if they're within a few points?

[COLGATE4]

114. Yep. You've got it. But no, Hillary's victories are really losses

because the whole thing was rigged! The fix is in!!! It's a vast DNC conspiracy. While Bernie's
'losses' are not really losses - they're a moral victory.

[AzDar]

63. She outspent him 2-1 in KY...

[demwing]

66. She hasn't won yet (.5% difference w/ 99% reporting) /nt

[silvershadow]

67. So few that it could go either way until they are certified! nt

[ThePhilosopher04]

69. Not very impressive. The Democratic Party is in shambles if she's at the top of the ticket.

[silvershadow]

71. Weakest candidate in my lifetime, perhaps. Apparently the PTB have already decided

how this cycle is going to end. That's the only explanation I have. Every single thing they are doing flies in the face of what seems to be the situation on the ground. It's almost as if a stage-managed Great Fraud is being perpetrated. This is the kind of shit that very well might result in An American Spring if they aren't careful.

[auntpurl]

74. She is stronger than Obama EVER was.

She is winning Obama's areas. Have you not seen the electoral maps? She won KY in 08, therefore BERNIE should have won this year.

Hillary is winning the Obama coalition. Her maps are almost identical to his in 08. Bernie, therefore, is taking the Hillary areas. This is not complicated. It has nothing to do with closed or open primaries (both have won both). It is a simple variance of diverse urban areas versus white rural areas. it has played out over and over and over again this primary season. It was obvious after the South. I don't understand why people don't get this?

This is playing out very similar to 08, except I think Hillary will win California, which will be a difference.

[silvershadow]

76. Not a chance. nt

[auntpurl]

77. Guess we'll see.

[COLGATE4]

115. Yep. The revolution is coming. American Spring. Any day now. Just wait... you'll see

just a little longer... it's almost here...

[B Calm]

84. Actually she never won it, it's still undecided and

they are recounting.

[reddread]

103. thank you

real information is bordering extinction in all the spin.

[riversedge]

107. All election results are unoffical until they are certified. This is nothing new.

[tabasco]

90. Independents and liberal Democrats are sick and tired of the same old quisling bullshit

There has been a true split in the Democratic party that only the ignorant and stupid can deny.

I handed out bumper sticker for Hubert Humphrey before I was old enough to vote and have voted Democratic my entire life. Hillary Clinton and her coziness with Wall Street and Kissinger have just about ended my relationship with the Democratic Party.

The corporate mass media annointed Clinton as the Democratic nominee FOUR YEARS AGO, making it nearly impossible for a relatively unknown candidate, like O'Malley or Sanders, to succeed.

[COLGATE4]

116. New excuse de jour. Sanders loses because the MSM annointed Clinton as

nominee 4 years ago.

[tabasco]

135. Deny it all you want. That's how we ended up with a weak, unlikable candidate,

who gained notoriety in the first place because of marriage, not hard work.

The republicans are rallying around Trump and half of all democrats can't stand Clinton.

This is the exact situation the plutocrats and its corporate media wanted.

Slap your head a little bit harder. Maybe it will raise your IQ.

[COLGATE4]

136. Perhaps the next eight years of Hillary's presidency

will do something for yours - athough I'm not optimistic

[tabasco]

137. Alert the media of your startling revelation.

Maybe the election can be cancelled to save money.

[COLGATE4]

138. Works for me.

[whatthehey]

102. Independents are a tiny fraction of KY registered voters

There are <8% who are not registered either D or R and some of them are in minor parties like Green or Libertarian.

[speaktruthtopower]

106. In the South, too

[Blue_Tires]

124. What the fuck is "the party" supposed to do??

Force Hillary to drop out when she's leading??

[floriduck]

126. Precisely. Nuff said.

[onenote]

130. in 2008 the front runner lost the closed KY primary by a huge margin

And it had no impact on his march to the nomination and eventually to victory in the GE.

So why do Sanders' supporters think that the front runner WINNING the closed KY primary somehow portends bad things for her nomination and GE prospects?

[jimlup]

133. I'll just say that I'm concerned

I'm a Bernie supporter but that is really irrelevant. If Hillary can't close the deal with voters is it because of her high negatives?

ABC News just reported Trump leading in a national poll. While May polls are misleading and due to circumstances I'm alarmed. If we end up with Hillary and then she proceeds to drop the easiest win we've had in multiple Presidential cycles we're absolutely fucked and the nation will have to endure 4 years of disaster from bully Trump.