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Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:10 PM

If you could REMAKE the election system FROM SCRATCH what would you create?

So that THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES COULD BE EFFECTUATED IN THE MOST FAITHFUL MANNER.

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Reply If you could REMAKE the election system FROM SCRATCH what would you create? (Original post)
Baobab Apr 2016 OP
CentralCoaster Apr 2016 #1
MineralMan Apr 2016 #2
bettyellen Apr 2016 #11
JimDandy Apr 2016 #37
bettyellen Apr 2016 #39
JimDandy Apr 2016 #43
bettyellen Apr 2016 #44
MineralMan Apr 2016 #54
Chasstev365 Apr 2016 #3
Travis_0004 Apr 2016 #45
Chasstev365 Apr 2016 #52
Jitter65 Apr 2016 #4
Frustratedlady Apr 2016 #5
JSup Apr 2016 #6
pat_k Apr 2016 #8
Baobab Apr 2016 #18
msongs Apr 2016 #7
Baobab Apr 2016 #23
MrsKirkley Apr 2016 #9
Baobab Apr 2016 #25
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #10
Baobab Apr 2016 #22
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #31
Baobab Apr 2016 #40
Blanks Apr 2016 #32
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #12
Baobab Apr 2016 #19
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #20
italiangirl Apr 2016 #13
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #14
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #15
Baobab Apr 2016 #16
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #24
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #17
Baobab Apr 2016 #21
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #27
LadyHawkAZ Apr 2016 #26
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #33
LadyHawkAZ Apr 2016 #48
muriel_volestrangler Apr 2016 #28
DamnYankeeInHouston Apr 2016 #29
hobbit709 Apr 2016 #30
leveymg Apr 2016 #34
leveymg Apr 2016 #35
leveymg Apr 2016 #36
JimDandy Apr 2016 #38
Violet_Crumble Apr 2016 #41
Kip Humphrey Apr 2016 #42
pansypoo53219 Apr 2016 #46
cherokeeprogressive Apr 2016 #47
Tarc Apr 2016 #49
cui bono Apr 2016 #51
Tarc Apr 2016 #55
The Second Stone Apr 2016 #50
napi21 Apr 2016 #53
LWolf Apr 2016 #56

Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:13 PM

1. Bust up the 2 party system. Grow ballot access/public financing/voting holiday/effective oversight.

 

extensive debates, aired publicly by broadcast and free internet.

These are starters.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:16 PM

2. I can't do that, so I won't speculate about it.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #2)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:36 PM

11. Blows my mind people want to focus on fantasizing and forget the supreme court.....

 

and they call southerners low info voters but are uninterested in how shit actually works. Oy vey.

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Response to bettyellen (Reply #11)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:39 PM

37. Skinner, comments like this one is why Progressives need their own

website separate from DU, just like you did with Discussionist for the Republicans.

We need to work and focus on issues and solutions to fix this country. Election reform is one of the big ones. You Hillary supporters have been all over this board telling us progressives that we should be focusing on issues at this point, instead of campaigning for Bernie or criticizing Hillary.

Look what happens when we do...



PS: Shame on you bettyellen.

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Response to JimDandy (Reply #37)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:53 PM

39. you only need your own site because you prefer to demonize 95% of Dems, and that is not going

 

to fly here. You ain't going to be able to get people to help you implement jack shit unless you replace all of congress- not just three people.

No shame in saying the Supreme court matters. It sure as fuck does to us women.

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Response to bettyellen (Reply #39)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 05:50 PM

43. Flat WRONG and again, shame on you!

You said:

you only need your own site because you prefer to demonize 95% of Dems, and that is not going to fly here.

You made that up. I have been a Dem all of my life: a PCO, a delegate many times for Dem candidates, canvassed, phone banked and registered thousands of people to vote always only for Dems, and worked on I don't even remember how many liberal initiatives/referendums. Stop making up shit to demonize Progressives who actually want to get things done. We want Skinner to design our own site so we don't have to stumble over posts like yours.

You ain't going to be able to get people to help you implement jack shit unless you replace all of congress- not just three people.


Progressives are working on that:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511865833
https://brandnewcongress.org/

No shame in saying the Supreme court matters. It sure as fuck does to us women.


Quit being disingenuous. The shame you deserve was 1.) for castigating a poster who is trying to come up with solutions to long time election protection issues that are still unsolved and are part of the DEMOCRATIC PLATFORM and 2.) implying the poster was a low-information voter. I didn't alert on you for that and you should have been, but you just go on with your big bad self... I remember now the reason I had you on ignore.

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Response to JimDandy (Reply #43)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 05:58 PM

44. I love the brand new congress idea- but this leaves SBS a lame duck for a minimum of two years....

 

and I know you do not want to hear who difficult it is, statistically to unseat a congress person. So likely it will take 6-10 years. Which is why there should have been "sample ballots" for Sanders voters this year too. I support the effort, and applaud it more than I can SBS's candidacy.

keep kidding yourself about who is progressive here, and keep begging Skinner to make a website just for you. I'm sure that is all going to work out for you.

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Response to JimDandy (Reply #37)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 06:51 PM

54. Then start one, for Pete's sake.

Invest your own money. Skinner' s not interested. He has two already.

Want a new site that suits you? Start one. Good luck.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:18 PM

3. Off the top of my head:

 

1. Elimination of PACs and Super PACs.
2. Universal Voting Rights
3. Gov't gives equal free airtime to all candidates, no lying misleading campaign commercials.
4. Eliminate the Electoral College.
5. No network give projections of ANYTHING until Hawaii and Alaska are done voting.

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Response to Chasstev365 (Reply #3)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 05:59 PM

45. Questions?

 

3? How do you determine who is viable to get free airtime? What If I register in one state to run for president? Who pays for this airtime?

5. Violation of the 1st amendment.

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Response to Travis_0004 (Reply #45)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 06:48 PM

52. That's how it's done in the UK!

 

(You may be right thought about the 1st Amendment)

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:21 PM

4. Primary, closed, and proportional. GE open to all and proportional...no winner take all. nt

 

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:29 PM

5. Find some monster machine to forever destroy voting machines,

go back to paper ballots and get rid of the delegate system.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:31 PM

6. Preferential voting (nt)


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Response to JSup (Reply #6)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:34 PM

8. Yep. IRV/Ranked Choice. Support Fairvote.org

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Response to JSup (Reply #6)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:52 PM

18. Like the Borda Count, IRV, etc? GOOD IDEA!

we need that desperately.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:33 PM

7. by THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE your guy is coming in third. next? nt

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Response to msongs (Reply #7)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:03 PM

23. this thread isnt about that

sorry, maybe you hit the wrong link

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:35 PM

9. No closed primaries.

Independents should have the right to vote in the primaries in all states.

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Response to MrsKirkley (Reply #9)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:06 PM

25. I think that when partes start alienating so many people there really is a need for that.

nt

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:35 PM

10. Cut campaigns down to 3 months

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Response to TheDormouse (Reply #10)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:02 PM

22. why?

>Cut campaigns down to 3 months

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Response to Baobab (Reply #22)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:16 PM

31. A large part of our problem is the $$$$

Longer campaigns means more $$$$ needing to be spent.
(It wouldn't completely eliminate the problem, obviously, but could curtail it somewhat. Look at UK, Australian, and Canadian systems.)

So one way to make a massive dent in the obscene amounts of money being spent is to limit how much time during which there is active campaigning.

It could also help distill campaigns and media coverage of them to their essences. Instead of 24 months of horse-race, like we've seen this past season. More coverage of actual governance and policy and less of the horse-race crap.

Right now, we're basically stuck with 24 months of horse-race in every 8-year-cycle. (Every 4 years if an incumbent is deemed vulnerable.) That's insance.

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Response to TheDormouse (Reply #31)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:54 PM

40. What about having a vote of no confidence for both candidates and their legislation?

Right now the fact that corrupt elected leaders can commit a country to horrible decisions that then become carved in stone until the end of time - a fact that some know and some dont know, is drawing an unhealthy amount of money to this particular campaign.

Perhaps if there was the opportunity to recall a candidate and their decisions abruptly if they did something people did not like, that would eliminate the high stakes, because it could all be reversed. No deal could last forever.

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Response to TheDormouse (Reply #10)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:17 PM

32. Or less. eom

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:38 PM

12. No party primaries; top vote-winners in initial phase go on to final phase

It's a big country--over 300 million people, so it's reasonable to have a two-phase voting process, which would give potential voters a chance to hear the candidates' positions and find out more about them.

But the two-party lock on candidates is too flawed. Let all-comers participate in the initial phase. Whoever the top candidates from that phase are go on to the final phase.

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Response to TheDormouse (Reply #12)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:55 PM

19. I really like that idea. We're being held prisoner by this system that has really been screwing up

in the last few decades, more so now than ever.


>It's a big country--over 300 million people, so it's reasonable to have a two-phase voting process, which would give potential voters a chance to hear the candidates' positions and find out more about them.

>But the two-party lock on candidates is too flawed. Let all-comers participate in the initial phase. Whoever the top candidates from that phase are go on to the final phase.



Weighted choice voting systems are highly desirable. that way people can vote for a first and second and third choice- so they are not wasting their vote to vote for the best candidate if they think that candidate wont win.

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Response to Baobab (Reply #19)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:57 PM

20. I agree about the weighted choices

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:39 PM

13. start with

Getting rid of Debbie Wasserman Schultz and the Democratic Natlonal Committee. They are the cancer of the democratic establishment. Turn the page and start over so that the will of the people o the United States will be participants in our government and not led around like dogs on a leash.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:40 PM

14. Everybody votes at the same time--no stretched out elections season lasting months

National holidays for initial vote day and final vote day.
Law should allow people who must work on the designated holidays to have time off to vote on an alternate day (eg day before).

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:42 PM

15. Automatically registered to vote for Pres/VP at birth or upon naturalization

Cannot become unregistered unless convicted of a crime.

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Response to TheDormouse (Reply #15)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:50 PM

16. wouldnt that create an incentive to criminalize things that poor people did to make them non-voters?

Also, since homelessness is rising where do homeless people vote?

>Cannot become unregistered unless convicted of a crime.

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Response to Baobab (Reply #16)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:03 PM

24. Homeless voters can vote anywhere--for Pres/VP

Location of voting would only matter for offices responsible for limited districts (ie, basically all offices other than Pres/VP). But for Pres/VP, it shouldn't matter where you live.

Existing laws already provide for stripping voting rights on conviction.
You're right, it does incentivize partisan lawmakers to use the law maliciously. Ideally, there'd need to be a high bar to take away voting rights. High-degree felonies rather than mere misdemeanors, for example. And courts would need to work to try to reduce biases.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 03:51 PM

17. We need a way to limit spending--Thoughts?

You could set a limit on how much a candidate can spend on campaigning. But how could that be enforced? Wouldn't it be a violation of the free political speech principle if a candidates' supporters were barred from (spending money for) speaking out in favor of their candidate or against his/her opponent?

And maybe a candidate with good ideas who is little known needs to be able to spend more money. A candidate who is very well known, who has been in the public eye for decades, has a built-in advantage, even if he or she would make a terrible president.

Hmm

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Response to TheDormouse (Reply #17)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:01 PM

21. In theory, the Internet could solve the problem of candidates needing to spend money.

Imagine a wealth of Free and open source election and organizing platforms !

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_and_open-source_software

that would work better in a world like I would like where people rarely if ever watch commercial TV -

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Response to Baobab (Reply #21)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:08 PM

27. But internet access isn't a right & not everyone has equal access

I did consider what you're saying before.

Look how radio and tv have been (ab)used.
And at least with radio and tv it's somewhat easy to monitor what's being broadcast.
With the internet, all kinds of sneaky things can go on.

http://www.ibtimes.com/donald-trump-wants-bill-gates-turn-internet-stop-isis-2215683
http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/30/tech/web/syria-internet/
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/apr/06/georgian-woman-cuts-web-access
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/egypt-internet-mubarak/

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:06 PM

26. I'd add to what we have: Automatic voter registration

Free voter IDs for states requiring ID
Trackable ballots
Civics classes in school, required
The Fairness Doctrine
Open primaries, by trackable ballot, on the same day in all states, for all party candidates
Mandatory, capped public funding for all federal campaigns

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Response to LadyHawkAZ (Reply #26)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:18 PM

33. Mandatory civics classes--what a novel idea!

They were mandatory when I was a kid, at least in my state.

Why/how could anybody ever dream of cutting mandatory civics classes out of the curriculum?

smh

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Response to TheDormouse (Reply #33)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 06:17 PM

48. An uninformed constituency is much easier to control n/t

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:10 PM

28. Replace the Senate voting system with one based on the Penrose method

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penrose_method

Each state gets 1 senator, and they have voting power proportional to the square root of their state's population. Get rid of filibustering in the Senate. IRV is used to choose each senator.

Make the presidential vote an instant runoff vote, across the entire country.

Use STV for the House, with a maximum size of 5 representatives per voting district (the number of reps per state would still be determined as now).

Put limits on the amount of spending on campaigns, especially on size of donations from each person (no donations from corporations; unions can organise donations, but each member can opt out).

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:11 PM

29. Look at Vermont.

My brother says it works because of its transparency. Every town holds a yearly town meeting on the same day. The representation is direct in small towns and representative in cities.

My main concern is honest elections that are protected and audit able. I want to live in a democracy.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:14 PM

30. Verifiable ballots.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:27 PM

34. Direct voting on most major bills by highly secure, verifiable web balloting.

Give the House a third of a vote and the Senate half on any given measure. Any Presidential veto could be overridden by a two-thirds popular vote. Basically, turn government back to the people

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:27 PM

35. Direct voting on most major bills by highly secure, verifiable web balloting.

Give the House a third of a vote and the Senate half on any given measure. Any Presidential veto could be overridden by a two-thirds popular vote. Basically, turn government back to the people

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Response to leveymg (Reply #35)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:29 PM

36. See, there, I just voted twice. ;-)

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 04:46 PM

38. This is a GD subject matter, not GDP. Good post, though and you're getting some thoughtful answers.

Sorry that some Hillary supporters just want to crap on any post of any Sanders' supporter that they can.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 05:21 PM

41. I'd create a Westminster style system of government...

It's tried and tested....


If there were three things I could change, it'd be:

1. Shorten election campaigns from the current endless slog to a short and sharp six week campaign that's publicly funded. Should cut the costs a whole lot and it's more humane for voters. Who wants candidate s getting in their faces for 18 months or more in some three ring cult of personality circus deal where you really have to dig to get to anything that deals with policies? If candidates can't get their act together in six weeks and inform voters of what their stance on issues are, then tough shit to them. As a voter I don't want to have to sit through endless campaign ads for well over a year and listen to a party tell me the same thing on day #458 that they did on day #1.

2. Ditch that whole primaries thing. I mean, WTF? How I see it is that for ages and before an election there's a whole other campaign where the folk who want to lead a party get to have a very lengthy and messy public cat fight and pretend that the opposition isn't on the other side of politics, and where their most ardent supporters are probably the only people that give a shit. How does anyone not collapse of campaign overload with all that shit? A much simpler solution is to vote for a local representative of the party you support. The parties select their leader and whoever the leader is of the party that has the numbers to form government becomes the new president. Easy.

3. Elections to be held on a Saturday with paper ballots and mandatory voting. Absentee voting for those who can't make it to a polling station and there has to be a sausage sizzle and cake stall at every polling station to make it worth people's while to turn up...

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 05:23 PM

42. My DREAM Election System

A. Hand Counted Paper Ballots (HCPBs) supervised by citizen volunteers representing each candidate
B. Open, proportional primaries held on Saturdays and grouped in adjoining 5-state regions to facilitate campaigning
C. Party inclusive primaries whereby everyone in the state gets the same ballot and votes for 1 person per office
D. Regional debates timed to regional primary dates moderated by the League of Women Voters with mandatory debate broadcasts on all over-the-air media within the 5-state region
E. Proportional representation of votes to delegates and votes to electoral college (I prefer to eliminate the electoral college system but that requires a constitutional amendment)
F. Standard, easy ballot access for every candidate (e.g, $500 filing fee + 1,000 qualified voter signatures)
G. Automatic registration on every citizen's 18th birthday
H. A National Election Day employer-paid holiday
I. Mandatory standardized exit polling with automatic recounts when outcomes exceed the MOE for all elections. Exit polls and recounts would be federally funded by way of a federal tax tick box selection similar to the federal election funding tick box currently in use
J. Political contributions are permitted only from human citizens; for each election, every citizen may contribute a maximum of $5,000 to any candidate campaign for which that citizen is entitled to vote (I prefer federally funded elections but find the above a suitable alternative)
K. Political parties shall support their slate of candidates equally and proportionally by office, and may provide training, campaign tools, party voter registries, and party campaign consultants provided those services are offered equally to each party-affiliated candidate. Parties are disallowed from providing candidate funds or candidate-specific advertising.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 06:03 PM

46. election voting open to ALL, candidates get FREE media in EQUAL amounts. no OUTSIDE MONEY.

campaign bribery. no election results til the day AFTER. maybe a weekend to vote. NO MACHINES. pencil on PAPER HAND COUNTED.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 06:06 PM

47. I'd go back 40 years and insert a law into the books requiring a CIVICS course for HS graduation.

 

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 06:18 PM

49. "Must be a member of the Democratic Party for one full year to be eligible to run"

For starters...

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Response to Tarc (Reply #49)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 06:34 PM

51. The topic is about something bigger than Hillary supporters being bitter that someone dared

challenge your chosen one's coronation.



.

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Response to cui bono (Reply #51)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 08:22 PM

55. I will comment on the topic as I see fit, bro


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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 06:27 PM

50. One person, one vote in a representative system

 

each person chooses who represents their vote, and can switch at on 72 hours notice, and that representative collects constituents and is effective in an assembly with a stock system comparing how many constituents they have compared to other representatives.

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 06:49 PM

53. Plain & simple. Everyone is registered to vote when they:

1. Reach the age of 18 (birth records are used)
2. Apply for a drivers license or state ID
3. Gain citizenship
4. Register to vote (covers all who are missed in any of the first three.

All States use primary elections-no more caucuses
All primary elections will be open to all Parties

Winner of any election will be the person who gets the most votes

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Response to Baobab (Original post)

Sat Apr 30, 2016, 08:26 PM

56. This:

100% publicly financed elections, with no outside money allowed
Mandated equal, and equally neutral, media coverage for all candidates
IRV or something similar
Honest debates, in which all candidates were asked the exact same questions and given equal talk time.

Edited to add: This is exactly what I've been calling for...for 2 decades.

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