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MineralMan

(146,284 posts)
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 01:55 PM Apr 2016

Sanders Tones Down Rhetoric - Scranton, PA Rally



See the video above, if you have an hour or so to spare. I watched and listened to it live. Here's what the takeaway is, from my point of view:

Bernie Sanders hit all of his normal position points in this speech, but with far less shouting than he has in the past. He also compared himself with Hillary Clinton, but with the same low-key approach, and refrained from attacking her positions. It was almost as if he mentioned her in passing only. The speech was done in a lower key than his normal rally remarks. His focus was more on change that is needed than on his run for the Democratic nomination.

He wrapped the speech up with a call for people to turn out in PA in larger than normal numbers. He said, as usual, that if the turnout was very large, he would win, but he said that only once, and in a normal speaking voice, rather than in the usual exhortation style he typically uses.

Overall, it was a very good speech and called for the changes he always calls for, but it seemed much less of a campaign speech and more of a general speech to stir up enthusiasm, not so much for him as the candidate but for voter action in general.

Here's what I took from this: He's still running, but is not expecting to be the nominee any longer. He is pushing his message, but not himself at this point. This seems to reinforce my opinion that he understands that he no longer has a reasonable path to the nomination, but is carrying on the campaign in a different way. It is a distinctly toned-down rhetoric he presented in Scranton today. Watch the video yourself. Compare it to some of his other rally speeches.

I'm sure he'll continue his campaign through Tuesday, at least, but it's clear that he's not going to attack the Clinton campaign in the same way as he has previously. He seems to have heard the message from New York, and is transitioning to a message-based presentation rather than an election campaign strategy.

That's my opinion. Watch the video. Your opinion might differ.
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Sanders Tones Down Rhetoric - Scranton, PA Rally (Original Post) MineralMan Apr 2016 OP
All his ideas and he can still win are all still there! Will Hillary tone it down and stop lying? ViseGrip Apr 2016 #1
I didn't say otherwise. It was how he said it all MineralMan Apr 2016 #2
I think he knows getting into her negative trap is not the place to be. peace13 Apr 2016 #4
Well, that's another possible interpretation. MineralMan Apr 2016 #8
She trapped him into being negative? Good one! bettyellen Apr 2016 #24
I am sure that we can disagree without being rude to one another. peace13 Apr 2016 #35
It blows my mind how Bernie escapes responsibility for everything. Not just the results of his bettyellen Apr 2016 #47
Hey, I'm not Bernie! Don't take my word for a thing. peace13 Apr 2016 #48
LOL! nolawarlock Apr 2016 #16
NEVER! CorporatistNation Apr 2016 #63
Message from New York? northernsouthern Apr 2016 #3
Doing better is not winning. I'm sorry, but MineralMan Apr 2016 #5
No, but doing worse is a sign of weakness northernsouthern Apr 2016 #10
I was responding to your post. northernsouthern Apr 2016 #31
Agreed... This POST Is JUST The WRITERS' "opinion! CorporatistNation Apr 2016 #64
party primary = closed system? only closed to people not smart enuff to read the voter regs lol nt msongs Apr 2016 #20
Oh god that is so funny! northernsouthern Apr 2016 #32
a lot of us want to go back to liking Bernie Sanders. geek tragedy Apr 2016 #6
I never stopped liking him. MineralMan Apr 2016 #12
Sadly I stopped liking Hillary much after that Reagan was an AIDS activist bullshit. Bluenorthwest Apr 2016 #17
I was already on the fence... northernsouthern Apr 2016 #34
Yet you ignore Mayor Sanders voting for a homophobic marriage resolution. KittyWampus Apr 2016 #36
To be honest, I stopped liking him some time ago and... CajunBlazer Apr 2016 #22
If you didn't like Bernie in this campaign, you never liked Bernie. aikoaiko Apr 2016 #37
thanks for splaining my own thoughts to me nt geek tragedy Apr 2016 #38
I liked Hillary but only when she wasn't campaigning to be President. aikoaiko Apr 2016 #42
yes, feelings do get hardened during a conflict nt geek tragedy Apr 2016 #44
Same thing would happen with Warren. Ambition is not something we enjoy seeing in women, culturally bettyellen Apr 2016 #45
My point is some People only like Bernie when he's not campaigning. aikoaiko Apr 2016 #49
No, I don't think anyone suggested anything remotely like that. Playing games? No thanks. bettyellen Apr 2016 #50
That's crap. PyaarRevolution Apr 2016 #52
Well it's been studied and is true, despite your personal feelings. bettyellen Apr 2016 #55
Hillary has always been ambitious. There was talk about 8 years for her immediately after Bill's Warren DeMontague Apr 2016 #62
Ambition is fime. Cheerleading for endless imperial war is not n/t eridani Apr 2016 #66
Apparently it is impossible to not like anything hillary clinton has EVER done, on its own merits Warren DeMontague Apr 2016 #61
you totally miss how bias actually works. bettyellen Apr 2016 #68
"same thing would happen to Warren if she ran" Warren DeMontague Apr 2016 #69
LOL savalez Apr 2016 #53
That really is not true. blue neen Apr 2016 #51
"I'm glad he left my state and I hope he never comes back." frylock Apr 2016 #54
Maybe you should talk to the people on yr side still flogging the "rape fantasy essay" shit, then. Warren DeMontague Apr 2016 #60
This is the Bernie I remember Haveadream Apr 2016 #7
He's going past Tueday. pat_k Apr 2016 #9
I hope you are right about this. At some time or another, regardless who the candidate is, we are Arkansas Granny Apr 2016 #11
When you are outside speaking to 28000 good idea to speak loudly Skink Apr 2016 #13
Especiall when there were only 11,000 or so actually there Tarc Apr 2016 #19
How many HRC events would that be? Skink Apr 2016 #27
Apples and oranges Tarc Apr 2016 #40
Interesting. I wonder ... NurseJackie Apr 2016 #14
I don't know. It does appear that there was some regrouping and MineralMan Apr 2016 #15
MMan, thanks very much for posting. kstewart33 Apr 2016 #18
Good Stuckinthebush Apr 2016 #21
It was a Townhall meeting. Skwmom Apr 2016 #23
For starters I have very little respect for people who voted for Clinton. Bread and Circus Apr 2016 #25
He will fall in line..no doubt. Some of his followers, however....nt LexVegas Apr 2016 #26
There's no "rhetoric" to tone down. It's a dirty Brock-style smear and you know it. senz Apr 2016 #28
Did you watch the video? Compare it to earlier ones in MineralMan Apr 2016 #29
+1. nc4bo Apr 2016 #30
Sounds exactly like he always does. bobbobbins01 Apr 2016 #33
It will be interesting to see if this trend you notice continues. apnu Apr 2016 #39
I hope it means he will quit after PA or Maryland Demsrule86 Apr 2016 #58
I hope so for the sake of the country. DCBob Apr 2016 #41
He's doing two things lumberjack_jeff Apr 2016 #43
Indeed! KoKo Apr 2016 #56
My one problem with Bernie is that he doesn't hit Hillary hard enough with her own lies, record and AzDar Apr 2016 #46
I noticed in Bernie's email this morn that he referred to "our opponent", never said HRC's name jg10003 Apr 2016 #57
You just love to project nonsense onto everything whatchamacallit Apr 2016 #59
Uh, think AGAIN... "Bernie Sanders Eases Off, Then Tees Off On Clinton" BigBearJohn Apr 2016 #65
He has to continue through at least Tuesday to collect more money. He has huge bill to pay AND Jitter65 Apr 2016 #67
He's a man of his word. In it until every state has voted! (nt) pat_k Apr 2016 #70
Well that didnt last long. He was evidently back to his old ways last night. n/t Lucinda Apr 2016 #71

MineralMan

(146,284 posts)
2. I didn't say otherwise. It was how he said it all
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 01:58 PM
Apr 2016

that was different. I've watched a number of his rally speeches. This one was much different, overall. What Hillary Clinton will do remains to be seen. This is not about Hillary Clinton. It is about Bernie Sanders.

 

peace13

(11,076 posts)
4. I think he knows getting into her negative trap is not the place to be.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:01 PM
Apr 2016

He makes the turn back to the place he started and she can decide for herself which path is better. Should be interesting.

MineralMan

(146,284 posts)
8. Well, that's another possible interpretation.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:05 PM
Apr 2016

He'll be making other campaign speeches before Tuesday. We'll see how it goes. I'm not seeing as much fire in this one as in his previous speeches. That's an indication of something, I'm sure. It's obvious that he's made some sort of decision here.

 

peace13

(11,076 posts)
35. I am sure that we can disagree without being rude to one another.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 04:56 PM
Apr 2016

There are points that you would not believe so I will spare you. But when he began answering her and standing up for himself it translated into being 'mean to the lady'. He should remain calm and carry on. That is his way and it suits him well. It's all good now. He had an evening in his home as Hill and Bill did on Election Day. This should recharge them all.

 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
47. It blows my mind how Bernie escapes responsibility for everything. Not just the results of his
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 05:42 PM
Apr 2016

policy proposals (because he never achieves them, can escape the blame). But his taxes, and now, even what he says. Hillary's fault. How impotent of him.

 

peace13

(11,076 posts)
48. Hey, I'm not Bernie! Don't take my word for a thing.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 06:22 PM
Apr 2016

And secondly, stepping back, taking a breathe and measuring steps carefully is not escaping responsibility! It is being an adult. You know Hillary has her own set of issues and your concern might help her along. I wouldn't worry about Bernie. He seems to tick right along!

nolawarlock

(1,729 posts)
16. LOL!
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:42 PM
Apr 2016

Hillary ignored him for most of the campaign. She never saw him as a credible threat until recently and frankly I don't think she ever should have seen him as such. I'm sure she'd be more than happy to go back to firing her attacks at Trump.

CorporatistNation

(2,546 posts)
63. NEVER!
Fri Apr 22, 2016, 12:02 AM
Apr 2016

Bernie Needs to Take Her to The Cleaners On All Of Her Blumenthal Shit And On And On! Call her on it NOW!

 

northernsouthern

(1,511 posts)
3. Message from New York?
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:00 PM
Apr 2016

He did better than Obama in a state with the most closed voting system in the country? The people voted on the false narrative of who had a better chance of defeating Trump, and most made their minds up to vote for Hillary months ago.

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/04/19/us/elections/new-york-primary-democratic-exit-polls.html


Also as it stands Hillary can no longer win either by delegates.

MineralMan

(146,284 posts)
5. Doing better is not winning. I'm sorry, but
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:03 PM
Apr 2016

Bernie cannot make progress toward the nomination by losing major states like NY. Too many delegates are at stake. On Tuesday, another big block of delegates are up for grabs. It looks like he'll lose those primaries as well, since they're also closed primaries in Northeastern states.

What I'm saying is that he has dialed his rhetoric down. What that means is open to interpretation. I've said how I interpret it. You might interpret it differently. Go watch the video and let me know what you think after doing that.

 

northernsouthern

(1,511 posts)
10. No, but doing worse is a sign of weakness
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:07 PM
Apr 2016

Hillary is losing her core voters in a race that was only among the core. Not a good sign, this was her race to lose in NY, and if the ballots get added she will only do worse.

 

northernsouthern

(1,511 posts)
31. I was responding to your post.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 04:34 PM
Apr 2016
He's still running, but is not expecting to be the nominee any longer. He is pushing his message, but not himself at this point. This seems to reinforce my opinion that he understands that he no longer has a reasonable path to the nomination, but is carrying on the campaign in a different way. It is a distinctly toned-down rhetoric he presented in Scranton today. Watch the video yourself. Compare it to some of his other rally speeches.

I'm sure he'll continue his campaign through Tuesday, at least, but it's clear that he's not going to attack the Clinton campaign in the same way as he has previously. He seems to have heard the message from New York, and is transitioning to a message-based presentation rather than an election campaign strategy.

That's my opinion. Watch the video. Your opinion might differ.


Did you ask him? Did he tell you any of these? You got quite a lot from the speech including dates. Your post would make Sherlock jealous. :p

CorporatistNation

(2,546 posts)
64. Agreed... This POST Is JUST The WRITERS' "opinion!
Fri Apr 22, 2016, 12:07 AM
Apr 2016

Let's wait and see... Keep contributing. THIS IS NOT The time to fold up under criminal assault from your opponent. Take it to the convention and let the delegates such as they are... stand up and vote... Declare yourselves so that you can be held accountable. For Bernie to capitulate, he will go down as a YHUGE HYPOCRITE! He should be prepared for "other" alternatives leading up to November... He could still be President...

 

northernsouthern

(1,511 posts)
32. Oh god that is so funny!
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 04:36 PM
Apr 2016

It is funny because you are laughing at the disenfranchised in a party that claims to care about it. You are right, f@ck the rest of them, they are such losers.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
17. Sadly I stopped liking Hillary much after that Reagan was an AIDS activist bullshit.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:56 PM
Apr 2016

Those comments scare me because she knows better or knew better. If she's forgotten, that's really scary stuff. If she's just pandering to the right wing it's also scary but not the same scary. Pandering would be better than the other.
But I do not understand how a sound mind could say that. The fact that her supporters were perfectly happy with those comments is very disturbing. It's like she can say anything and they cheer for it. What's next? GW Bush the hero of Katrina?

 

northernsouthern

(1,511 posts)
34. I was already on the fence...
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 04:38 PM
Apr 2016

That just reminded me of the reason I did not vote for her before, but it seems most of hte HRC crew are alright with her past...

 

KittyWampus

(55,894 posts)
36. Yet you ignore Mayor Sanders voting for a homophobic marriage resolution.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 04:57 PM
Apr 2016

And Sanders also lied about the Pope inviting him to the vatican on tv. I posted the clip numerous times.

Either he was lying or (using your words) "I do not understand how a sound mind could say that".

CajunBlazer

(5,648 posts)
22. To be honest, I stopped liking him some time ago and...
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:18 PM
Apr 2016

... I don't expect I will change my mind any time soon.

If follows up and sincerely endorses Hillary and works hard to get all of his supporters to follow his example, he'll return to my good graces. But if he doesn't go all out to get her elected, then screw him. I will do my best (which I admit isn't much) to get his status in the Senate by having him removed from committees, etc.

aikoaiko

(34,165 posts)
37. If you didn't like Bernie in this campaign, you never liked Bernie.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 05:00 PM
Apr 2016

You simply like the idea of progressive ideas on the margin.
 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
45. Same thing would happen with Warren. Ambition is not something we enjoy seeing in women, culturally
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 05:36 PM
Apr 2016

speaking.

aikoaiko

(34,165 posts)
49. My point is some People only like Bernie when he's not campaigning.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 06:55 PM
Apr 2016

As evidenced on DU.

Do you think thats Because he's Jewish?

PyaarRevolution

(814 posts)
52. That's crap.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 07:23 PM
Apr 2016

I like Warren and if Bernie went up against Warren I would honestly be conflicted who I would've voted for in the primary. When it was Bernie v. Hillary it was a no-brainer I would support Bernie.
I mean I've heard Bernie enough on Thom and have seen enough of Hillary's background, to me she wasn't even worthy of heavy consideration.

 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
55. Well it's been studied and is true, despite your personal feelings.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 09:16 PM
Apr 2016

Feelings toward a person can change greatly when they become ambitious- and women suffer the most for it. Lots of studies have been done.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
62. Hillary has always been ambitious. There was talk about 8 years for her immediately after Bill's
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 11:35 PM
Apr 2016

First two terms.. As far back as the Clintons have been on the national stage.

I thought it was great when she tried to get traction on health care in the early 90s, even if it didnt work out.

I never had any problem with her or her ambition until it led her to do things like vote for the IWR, sponsor pandering flag burning legislation, etc.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
61. Apparently it is impossible to not like anything hillary clinton has EVER done, on its own merits
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 11:34 PM
Apr 2016

its gotta be people out to get her cuz she's a woman. Always.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
69. "same thing would happen to Warren if she ran"
Fri Apr 22, 2016, 04:29 PM
Apr 2016

conjecture. Without Warren actually running, it's a meaningless assertion.

Just because "she's too ambitious" is a trope sometimes thrown at women, doesn't mean that there aren't situations where a woman's ambition might actually cause politically self-destructive behavior.

Ambition in politicians taken to the point of clouding their own better judgment exists, and it has nothing to do with Gender. See Nixon, Richard Milhous.

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
60. Maybe you should talk to the people on yr side still flogging the "rape fantasy essay" shit, then.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 11:31 PM
Apr 2016

Because that's a shit-scented smear job if there ever was one.

Haveadream

(1,630 posts)
7. This is the Bernie I remember
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:05 PM
Apr 2016

I'm so glad he took time off to get away from his advisors and has returned to his original message.

Thank you for sharing this, MM!

Arkansas Granny

(31,513 posts)
11. I hope you are right about this. At some time or another, regardless who the candidate is, we are
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:08 PM
Apr 2016

all going to have to pull to defeat the Republicans. We've got too much at stake to divide the party.

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
14. Interesting. I wonder ...
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:11 PM
Apr 2016

... did his campaign advisors rethink and change their advice; or did the candidate rethink his advisors and start taking better advice from someone else? (Or maybe he's just relying on his own intelligence instead of listening to others who may have had other more personal motivations for the advice they were feeding him.)

I guess we'll know more when the book comes out.

MineralMan

(146,284 posts)
15. I don't know. It does appear that there was some regrouping and
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:15 PM
Apr 2016

redesigning how to deliver the message, though. A day off produced some marked changes in his public approach. At least it seems so to me based on this speech.

I have no idea what went on yesterday. Maybe we'll find out. I was just looking to see if there was a change in presentation, and it sure seems like there was.

What I wonder is what Bernie's superfans are going to think of it? Maybe we'll hear about that too.

kstewart33

(6,551 posts)
18. MMan, thanks very much for posting.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:03 PM
Apr 2016

This is great news. I'm a Hillary supporter. I believe that Bernie has every right to stay in the race and push his positions. But attacking Hillary as hard as he did in NY does no good. Not for Bernie who would eventually be portrayed as a flailing old grouch, and not for Hillary and the Democratic chances to win the general election.

Bernie can come away from his campaign as a much more powerful advocate than he's been in the Senate. But he has to play his cards right for that to happen.

Bread and Circus

(9,454 posts)
25. For starters I have very little respect for people who voted for Clinton.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:23 PM
Apr 2016

I think they are either ill informed, cynical, or near sighted.

However as I have long said the chances of Bernie winning the nomination has always been very low and now they are almost zero. The only thing that might save him would be legal trouble for Hillary Clinton.

That said I agree that Bernie needs to continue his message and carry it to the convention. He has been a good moral compass for the Democratic Party which has lost its way.

MineralMan

(146,284 posts)
29. Did you watch the video? Compare it to earlier ones in
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:36 PM
Apr 2016

similar venues. Thanks for your reply. I don't "smear" anyone and I have no association with any campaign. Please don't imply that I do. Thanks.

nc4bo

(17,651 posts)
30. +1.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:43 PM
Apr 2016

I wonder when HRC will quit pretending she's as populist as Sanders and start following the direction of the red arrow in her campaign logo.

Tick tock...



apnu

(8,751 posts)
39. It will be interesting to see if this trend you notice continues.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 05:04 PM
Apr 2016

I've often thought that Bernie knew his chances were slim but that he wanted his message out there and he wanted to make sure Democrats were talking about those things too. And in that way he's accomplished his goal.

Demsrule86

(68,539 posts)
58. I hope it means he will quit after PA or Maryland
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 11:23 PM
Apr 2016

And not do the nasty things Tad said he was going to...I have very little liking or respect left for Sander whom I believe has harmed our chances in the fall, but I would feel very sad if he destroyed himself with such unethical behavior.

 

lumberjack_jeff

(33,224 posts)
43. He's doing two things
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 05:10 PM
Apr 2016

1) being the completely credible alternative in event of the Clinton campaign implosion
2) Making sure that the agenda is given full consideration if the DNC expects any sort of post convention unity.

As posters upthread have noted, this is typical rhetoric, not to be confused with the caricature promulgated by media and the Clinton campaign.

KoKo

(84,711 posts)
56. Indeed!
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 09:20 PM
Apr 2016
As posters upthread have noted, this is typical rhetoric, not to be confused with the caricature promulgated by media and the Clinton campaign.
 

AzDar

(14,023 posts)
46. My one problem with Bernie is that he doesn't hit Hillary hard enough with her own lies, record and
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 05:37 PM
Apr 2016

dirty, dirty dealings... If she sleazes her way to the Nomination, I'm sure the GOP will pound her with them though. And we will subsequently lose the WH.

 

Jitter65

(3,089 posts)
67. He has to continue through at least Tuesday to collect more money. He has huge bill to pay AND
Fri Apr 22, 2016, 05:25 AM
Apr 2016

HUGE...salaries for his top two advisors. Just think how much they will be able to invest in Wall Street when the primary is over.

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