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Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:20 PM

About the Clintons parking income in Delaware to avoid paying taxes....

New York Times, 2012

How Delaware Thrives as a Corporate Tax Haven

By LESLIE WAYNEJUNE 30, 2012

NOTHING about 1209 North Orange Street hints at the secrets inside. It’s a humdrum office building, a low-slung affair with a faded awning and a view of a parking garage. Hardly worth a second glance. If a first one.

But behind its doors is one of the most remarkable corporate collections in the world: 1209 North Orange, you see, is the legal address of no fewer than 285,000 separate businesses.

Its occupants, on paper, include giants like American Airlines, Apple, Bank of America, Berkshire Hathaway, Cargill, Coca-Cola, Ford, General Electric, Google, JPMorgan Chase, and Wal-Mart. These companies do business across the nation and around the world. Here at 1209 North Orange, they simply have a dropbox.


What attracts these marquee names to 1209 North Orange and to other Delaware addresses also attracts less-upstanding corporate citizens. For instance, 1209 North Orange was, until recently, a business address of Timothy S. Durham, known as “the Midwest Madoff.” On June 20, Mr. Durham was found guilty of bilking 5,000 mostly middle-class and elderly investors out of $207 million. It was also an address of Stanko Subotic, a Serbian businessman and convicted smuggler — just one of many Eastern Europeans drawn to the state.

Big corporations, small-time businesses, rogues, scoundrels and worse — all have turned up at Delaware addresses in hopes of minimizing taxes, skirting regulations, plying friendly courts or, when needed, covering their tracks....

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/01/business/how-delaware-thrives-as-a-corporate-tax-haven.html?_r=0



So how do the Clintons take advantage of this?

‘The Delaware Loophole’

The article has some surprising revelations. Delaware has more corporate entities, public and private, than people. It’s a clear indication that these are almost all just shell companies – with no employees, assets or any real business dealings in the state.


A major reason for the state’s popularity is the fact that Delaware does not tax Limited Liability Companies (LLC) which do not have business operations in the state. So any company which operates in another state can simply register an LLC subsidiary in Delaware and transfer its revenue to the tax haven, thus avoiding taxation on their profits.


http://www.mintpressnews.com/delaware-the-us-tax-haven-of-choice/32218/



How do we know they do? The only ones reporting on it this week are RW sources and surely they can't be trusted.

One, here's their 2014 tax return & you can see for yourself:
https://www.hillaryclinton.com/p/files/returns/WJC_HRC_2014_Form_1040.pdf

And two, here's an article from Bloomberg last year:

Bill Clinton's Shell (Company) Game
The candidate made more in a year than most Americans earn in a lifetime and used a shell company to manage money and cut down on risk. It wasn't disclosed until investigative reporters dug up the paper trail.

In 2012, the candidate was Mitt Romney and the company was Bermuda-based Sankaty High Yield Asset Investors Ltd.

This time around, it's Hillary Clinton and Delaware-based WJC, LLC.

Since late 2008, Clinton's spouse, former President Bill Clinton, has used the limited liability company as a pass-through for his speech and consulting income, an increasingly commonplace practice since LLCs can shield business owners' personal assets from some lawsuits and potentially offer some tax benefits.

........"Here's the question," the Obama video asked. "Is not technically breaking the law a high enough standard for someone who wants to be president of the United States?"

Though not exactly a parallel case, the Clinton LLC and the questions that have surfaced because of it recall some of the challenges that Romney faced during the last cycle and that Clinton is already running up against: immense wealth, and a reliance on legal and tax protections that are outside the experience of most voters.

http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2015-05-27/bill-clinton-s-shell-company-game


....Elsewhere around the web....

Hillary and Bill Clinton quietly create two shell companies listed at “1209 North Orange Street” in 2008 and 2013. The real names of the firms, however, not their location, year were first made public in tax filings released by Hillary Clinton last.

According to records, among the Clintons’ “1209 North Orange Street” companies is WJC, LLC, which was set up by Bill Clinton in 2008 as a pass-through for his consulting fees.

Another company at the same location, ZFS Holdings, LLC, in February 2013 was setup, week after Hillary Clinton left hawaii Department one. Hillary Clinton received $5.5 million from her book publisher, Simon & Schuster, through the ongoing company.

The “1209 North Orange Street” building is the headquarters for the Corporation Trust Company. The firm acts as a registered agent for a large number of corporations that aren’t actually located in Delaware, like the Clintons’ companies.

Anti-secrecy advocates say the building is prime evidence that Delaware has turned into a corporate haven that’s much like more well-known, offshore locales.

“In case a building was imagined by you with 1,000 corporations inside it, you’d imagine a building just like the Empire State building,” said Richard Phillips, a senior policy analyst with Citizens for Tax Justice. “But apparently 285,000 companies claim [1209 North Orange Street] is their address.”

“What this shows is this isn’t actually the address of companies that are doing real business. This is the address of a complete lot of companies which are just shell companies,” he added. “In cases like this, it doesn’t even appear to be they will have mailboxes. They declare that address because the places they’re conducting business just, though they’re not conducting business there even.”

http://trueviralnews.com/this-delaware-address-is-home-to-200000-shell-companies-including-hillary-clintons/





So robbing the US & its states (like New York) of much needed tax revenue is bad when others do it, but not when the Clintons do it?

Or unless its Marc Rich or friends wanting to hide money in Panama...




The NYT called these tax dodgers scoundrels & rogues back in 2012, before they knew Bill & Hill were amongst them, but now tax dodging is going to be ok?

Talk about lowering the bar.

I guess Obama only meant this when talking about Romney?

63 replies, 2880 views

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Reply About the Clintons parking income in Delaware to avoid paying taxes.... (Original post)
RiverLover Apr 2016 OP
Else You Are Mad Apr 2016 #1
RiverLover Apr 2016 #2
TheBlackAdder Apr 2016 #31
Cheese Sandwich Apr 2016 #32
Stallion Apr 2016 #3
RiverLover Apr 2016 #4
Stallion Apr 2016 #5
RiverLover Apr 2016 #6
Stallion Apr 2016 #9
RiverLover Apr 2016 #11
Stallion Apr 2016 #12
RiverLover Apr 2016 #14
Stallion Apr 2016 #16
karynnj Apr 2016 #46
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #28
Stallion Apr 2016 #34
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #41
kristopher Apr 2016 #44
questionseverything Apr 2016 #55
Stallion Apr 2016 #56
questionseverything Apr 2016 #57
Stallion Apr 2016 #58
questionseverything Apr 2016 #59
Stallion Apr 2016 #60
questionseverything Apr 2016 #61
Stallion Apr 2016 #62
CorporatistNation Apr 2016 #24
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #25
Hiraeth Apr 2016 #48
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #49
Hiraeth Apr 2016 #50
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #54
Hiraeth Apr 2016 #63
JDPriestly Apr 2016 #52
CentralCoaster Apr 2016 #7
RiverLover Apr 2016 #8
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #29
RiverLover Apr 2016 #36
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #38
RiverLover Apr 2016 #40
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #42
brewens Apr 2016 #10
RiverLover Apr 2016 #13
Stallion Apr 2016 #15
Viva_La_Revolution Apr 2016 #17
Stallion Apr 2016 #18
Viva_La_Revolution Apr 2016 #19
Stallion Apr 2016 #22
Viva_La_Revolution Apr 2016 #23
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #27
Viva_La_Revolution Apr 2016 #30
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #33
Viva_La_Revolution Apr 2016 #35
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #39
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #26
Left Brain Apr 2016 #20
hollysmom Apr 2016 #21
RiverLover Apr 2016 #37
COLGATE4 Apr 2016 #43
DebDoo Apr 2016 #45
Octafish Apr 2016 #47
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #51
TheDormouse Apr 2016 #53

Response to RiverLover (Original post)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:22 PM

1. Funny how none of this is being brought up... nt

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Response to Else You Are Mad (Reply #1)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:24 PM

2. Right?

It makes you wonder how many media owners are dodging taxes like this.

And exactly how much money the US is losing through these types of set ups.

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Response to Else You Are Mad (Reply #1)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 12:45 AM

31. Could it be a 5 Node Hop? Delaware > Canada > Ireland > England > Luxembourg

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Response to Else You Are Mad (Reply #1)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 12:47 AM

32. Imagine if Bernie had 5 shell corporations in Delaware to avoid taxes

 

We'd never hear the end of it.

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Response to RiverLover (Original post)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:25 PM

3. Article Is From 2012 and Doesn't Involve the Clintons

The Clinton's paid Income Tax on both LLCs since the revenue from both LLCs "flowed through" to them individually as clearly reflected in Schedules C attached to her Income Tax Returns. The Clintons have produced all Income Tax Returns since 1992 and they are the only remaining candidates for President who have produced all Tax Returns including schedules. I'm sorry so many Sanders supporters are uninformed about taxation of "pass through" corps but you are embarrassing yourself

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Response to Stallion (Reply #3)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:28 PM

4. Why didn't they set up their LLCs where they live?

Because in Delaware, LLCs don't have to pay taxes.(on income not earned in the state)

Nice try though. You sound very connected.

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #4)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:31 PM

5. The Residence of Individual Shareholders Has No Bearing on Where a Corporation is Incorporated

a "flow through" LLC is still obligated to pay income taxes only it is reported directly on Schedule C to their Individual Income Tax Return rather than on a separate corporate filing. Sorry you are uninformed. I have 30 years of experience as a Business lawyer/litigator

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Response to Stallion (Reply #5)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:33 PM

6. I realize that. And the answer is they did that to AVOID PAYING THEIR TAXES. /nt

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #6)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:37 PM

9. You Want to Learn Something or Just Spout Nonsense

WJC,LLC Is Listed on Page 11 of Clinton's 2014 Consolidated Income Tax Return


and shows revenue of over $6,000,000.00 that was "passed through" to the Clinton's Individual Return-See Schedule c plus also the Statement at the end. There are 5 separate Schedule Cs for all 5 of the businesses they operated in 2014 including Hillary's LLC and separate speaking, consulting and authorship-each reports revenue and income tax was assessed for each of the 5 businesses. I estimate they paid taxes on over $40,000,000.00 of revenue from these 5 separate business in 2014 alone

https://www.hillaryclinton.com/p/files/returns/WJC_HRC_2014_Form_1040.pdf

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Response to Stallion (Reply #9)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:50 PM

11. Your source is hillaryclinton.com. LOL

Go try to school someone else.

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #11)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:53 PM

12. Geez-I Linked to the Clinton's Actual Income Tax Return Reporting to the Internal Revenue Service

nm

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Response to Stallion (Reply #12)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:59 PM

14. I'm sorry, but the only reason to set up corporations(2 for Bill & Hill & 3 for their foundation)

in Delaware with all of their buddies is to cheat on taxews.

Otherwise, why not set up the LLCs in NY?

What you posted didn't list the tax savings by not paying income generated by their LLCs in a state which doesn't tax LLCs.

Does it now?

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #14)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 11:18 PM

16. Deleware Does Have an Corporate Income Tax But I'll Let a Deleware Attorney Handle The Details

but generally all corporations are subject to the income tax laws in every state in which they are incorporated AND in which they transact business. All states I know of and have dealt with have ample exceptions for exempt corporations. 50 different states so I don't plan to describe all the possible permutations. Bottom Line is only 7 states have no corporate income tax including Texas for example. Foundations are entirely different matter-the Clintons don't "own" that foundations, they aren't shareholders and can't make gifts of inheritance of their assets. Those funds are owned by the public and shouldn't be considered as assets owned by the Clintons

See Link for Delaware Corporate Income Tax

http://revenue.delaware.gov/services/Business_Tax/FilingCIT.shtml

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Response to Stallion (Reply #16)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 10:08 AM

46. Stallion, thanks for your knowledgeable response

One lingering question I have from your responses is whether the income also hits the NY state taxes. Given that it came into their federal forms via schedule Cs, I would assume that not only is that income reported and taxed on the federal level, but on the state level.

If this is true, I want to be able to say that in the fall when she most likely will be our nominee. (Side question could this have been done for accounting purposes to keep track of the money?)

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #14)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 12:17 AM

28. Educate yourself a little before spouting off.

An LLC is NOT - repeat NOT- a corporation. It is a company, and a company whose income flows directly through it to its owners who must report that income as ordinary income. An LLC does not file taxes, does not pay any kind of corporate tax (since it's not a corporation) or have any direct tax liability. There's no way to cheat on taxes with an LLC.

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Response to COLGATE4 (Reply #28)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 01:28 AM

34. It Can Be Set Up in Two Different Ways I Believe

but a "flow through" is the preferred electiion of most smaller business

IRS Publication 3402

What is a Limited Liability Company?

For purposes of this publication, a limited liability company (LLC) is a business entity organized in the United States under state law. An LLC may be classified for federal income tax purposes as a partnership, corporation, or an entity disregarded as separate from its owner by applying the rules in Regulations section 301.7701-3.
-------------------------
Classification of an LLC

Default classification. An LLC with at least two members is classified as a partnership for federal income tax purposes. An LLC with only one member is treated as an entity disregarded as separate from its owner for income tax purposes (but as a separate entity for purposes of employment tax and certain excise taxes). Also, an LLC's federal tax classification can subsequently change under certain default rules discussed later.

Elected classification. An LLC can elect to be classified as an association taxable as a corporation or as an S corporation. After an LLC has determined its federal tax classification, it can later elect to change that classification. For details, see Subsequent Elections, later.

https://www.irs.gov/publications/p3402/ar02.html

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Response to Stallion (Reply #34)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 09:23 AM

41. That is correct. But the whole point of creating the

business organization known as an LLC was to lessen the burden on small businesses (very often one-man shows or general partnerships) by 1) providing them with tort liability protection for their personal assets and 2) have a much less complicated tax situation than that of an 'S' corporation (the only other vehicle availale before the creation of the LLC). I suspect this choice was put in the law to help tax filers who were already set up as an S corporation. I would hazard to guess that about 99% of businesses today go LLC opt for the immediate pass-through option rather than incorporating as an 'S'corp.

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Response to Stallion (Reply #34)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 09:51 AM

44. I think you've done a good job of making your point

What is the affirmative case for why the LLC system exists? Use of these entities obviously benefits those who establish them, so it would be helpful to your effort if you'd fill in the missing piece.

Also, if you don't mind, would you then venture an opinion about the value of this system to society writ large?

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Response to Stallion (Reply #9)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 02:53 PM

55. were do you get 40 mil?

on the 1040 it says

agi $27,946,350

taxes due $9,981,350

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Response to questionseverything (Reply #55)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 03:13 PM

56. It Was just a Quick Estimate of the Revenue Based on Flipping Through the 5 Separate Schedule Cs

Looks like I did overestimate-may have carried a thousand to a Million.of course, there were deductions for running each of those those businesses. Each Schedule C (Profit or Loss from Business) represents a separate business:

2 LLCs:
WJC,LLC-p.11 ($6,417,475)
Hillary's LLC- ZFS Holdings,LLC (?) or something-p. 13 and 15 ($10,492,000 + $5,563,867)

Businesses apparently run as sole proprietorships for:
Authorship-HRC-p. 5 ($18,421.00)
Speeches-WJC-p.7 ($9,730.00)
Authorship-WJC-p.9 ($36,442)

The business deductions flow through to the Individual Tax return as well


https://www.hillaryclinton.com/p/files/returns/WJC_HRC_2014_Form_1040.pdf

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Response to Stallion (Reply #56)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 03:29 PM

57. just seems odd after you representing yourself as an expert that you didn't look at page 2

were all the income is shown ac-cumulatively...unless i am missing something(not an expert here)

interesting the clintons are claiming $5,159,242. in itemized deductions while bernie is getting blasted for 100 times less in his return

i did also notice reading the expenses misc over 34 grand for one of the llc ...most tax payers would get audited over that alone

all and all 9.9 mill on nearly 28 mill is about 34% so much better than the romneys 13%

so do they pay state taxes on that in ny or no with the llc set up in delaware?

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Response to questionseverything (Reply #57)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 03:32 PM

58. Yea I Amended My Answer-I was Trying to Get Everybody to Realize that there Were 6 Schedule Cs

which all recognized income under the Individual Income Tax Return-the way to show that is to point to the 6 separate Schedule Cs

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Response to Stallion (Reply #58)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 03:37 PM

59. ok np but pls answer about state taxes

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Response to questionseverything (Reply #59)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 03:44 PM

60. Why Don't You Do That?

I've already said I'm not a Delaware attorney or accountant but that it appears based on a link I posted that Delaware has a corporate income tax. My experience with other states though is that often entities are exempt under many state's income tax laws for various reasons just like there exemptions from filing or deductions for individual filers There is usually about 25 exemptions.

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Response to Stallion (Reply #60)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 03:54 PM

61. i asked because you represented yourself as an expert,ss

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Response to questionseverything (Reply #61)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 04:10 PM

62. See Post 16-I Never Represented Myself as an Expert on Deleware State Income Tax Law

I was stating that the Clinton weren't hiding Federal Income Tax by creating the LLCs because the income from those LLCs "flowed through" to their Individual Income Tax returns. Anybody can create an LLC in any state they damn well want to but you can't hide LLC income that way from the Internal Revenue Service. The residence alone of shareholders doesn't matter whatsoever with regard to the state the LLCs are created in. HOWEVER, most states (like New York) can constitutionally reach income earned by out-of-state corporations (even if created in Delaware) if the LLC conducts substantial business say in New York (not exempted by one of the many state exemptions). I know of no media report establishing that the Clinton have evaded the state income taxes of any state PERIOD

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #4)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 11:51 PM

24. Clintons Demonstrating Their Patriotism?

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #4)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 12:08 AM

25. They could have set up in Florida or any

other number of states. Nothing illegal or even immoral about doing that. Why the complaint?

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Response to COLGATE4 (Reply #25)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 10:50 AM

48. lol

nothing immoral.

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Response to Hiraeth (Reply #48)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 02:21 PM

49. Did you take your standard deduction on your taxes this year?

Perhaps a deduction for children? childrens' education? medical expenses? gifts to your church or charity? Were you able to write off the interest you paid on your mortgage? I wouldn't say you were immoral by following the law and avoiding paying more tax to the government than you were required to do. The only difference here is the amount, not the moraity.

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Response to COLGATE4 (Reply #49)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 02:28 PM

50. omg. you have got it backwards. the only difference is the morality NOT the amount. The

SYSTEM is MORALLY bankrupt and HIDING money is HIDING money.

I am fucking POOR and I still owe Federal ~$400.oo and State ~$400.oo

I have NOTHING to hide and my taxes as a private citizen are none of your fucking business.

The subject of this thread is CLINTON who seeks PUBLIC office.

You have overstepped your bounds, sir/ma'am.

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Response to Hiraeth (Reply #50)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 02:39 PM

54. I did not ask you for your private data, merely asking

if you avoided taxes as everyone does to demonstrate a point . But you seem determined to believe that people makin more money =immorality so I think we've concluded this discussion. Bye.

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Response to COLGATE4 (Reply #54)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 05:41 PM

63. Bullshit. Never said that. You asked questions. I answered.We are done here.

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Response to Stallion (Reply #3)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 02:37 PM

52. Did they pay their state taxes?

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Response to RiverLover (Original post)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:33 PM

7. I was scolded and told that it's legal so I should shut up and die.

 

Others say that if I take a single exemption on taxes that it's exactly the same, and that I should shut up and die.

People are so cute that way.

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Response to CentralCoaster (Reply #7)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:34 PM

8. ROFL!

Very cute. Indeed.

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #8)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 12:18 AM

29. No, it's actually sad to see people making

foolish arguments about subjects they know nothing about.

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Response to COLGATE4 (Reply #29)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 05:42 AM

36. It is sad that a tax cheat under FBI investigation for federal crimes ag the US is our

"frontrunner".



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Response to RiverLover (Reply #36)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 08:55 AM

38. You keep saying 'Tax Cheat' and yet you can't

provide anything to back it up. That's actually slander.

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Response to COLGATE4 (Reply #38)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 09:00 AM

40. The OP provides the back up. hello? Spin, spin, spin.

You do your Clintonism very well. Maybe you'll get a raise.

I bought into their crap in the 90s. No more. I see through all Clinton spin now.

They ripped off New York state by creating corporations for their personal income in a state that doesn't doesn't tax corporations who don't sell products in that state.

You can use all the legalese in the world, doesn't change that fact.

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #40)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 09:43 AM

42. None so deaf as those will not listen.

They didn't create any 'corporations'. They set up LLC's, which are totally different entities. With an LLC BY LAW all the income from the LLC is treated as DIRECT INCOME to the Clintons, just as if they had personally earned it directly. The Tax law governing corporations has nothing to do with it whatsoever.

Not legalese. The law.

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Response to RiverLover (Original post)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:48 PM

10. A corporate HQ that's nothing but a PO Box is fraud all by itself. I know what the office at

a small business does. I mean a beer distributor with like 13 employees. Ordering, scheduling, shipping and receiving, payroll and on and on.

JAYUSUS! You might as well have a giant meth lab under a KFC and just look the other way! That crap has to stop. My blood center gets inspected by the FDA almost every year. If we weren't really running a blood center, I'm pretty sure they would catch on!

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Response to brewens (Reply #10)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 10:56 PM

13. It IS fraud, made legal by our congress. And it costs US big.

Found this while researching~

The Internal Revenue Service estimated a total tax gap of about $450 billion, with $376 billion of it due to filers underreporting income, in 2006.

In fact, in 2009, the Tax Justice Network named the United States as No. 1 on its Financial Secrecy Index, ahead of Luxembourg and Switzerland. It cited Delaware as one of the reasons.

"Our analysis reveals that the United States is the jurisdiction of greatest concern, having made few concessions and posing serious threats to emerging transparency initiatives,” the report says. “Rising from sixth to third place in our index, the U.S. is one of the few whose secrecy score worsened after 2013."

Another part of the appeal is the ease and rapidity with which a business entity can be formed there. Business entities can be set up in a number of hours and, once they are, Delaware law is committed to protect the rights of boards of directors and shareholders.

Last year, 133,297 businesses were set up in the state, making nearly half of all public corporations in the United States incorporated in Delaware.


http://www.newsweek.com/panama-papers-secret-state-delaware-445436

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Response to brewens (Reply #10)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 11:02 PM

15. How Many Times Do We Have to Go Over these Ridiculous Arguments

the address listed is simply the registered address of the largest commercial registered agent and registered office in the Country CT Corp which simply served as a mailbox within the jurisdiction so that legal notices, papers and citations maybe served upon the corporation within the boundary of the state. Attorneys use that address so they have a definite address to serve a citation upon the corporation to obtain jurisdiction over the corporation within the state. It has no significance other than as a mailbox. There is absolutely nothing nefarious about using the CT Corp registered address and in fact they have been the registered agent for about 40% of all the corporate defendants I have sued in my 30 year legal career. CT Corp operates in every jurisdiction in the Country and is America's largest commercial registered agent

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Response to Stallion (Reply #15)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 11:19 PM

17. to avoid paying higher taxes in new york. no other reason. just cause it's legal

Doesn't make it right. We understand who wrote these laws, who voted for them, and who uses them to avoid paying higher taxes in their home states. We understand that NY got ripped off, legally.

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Response to Viva_La_Revolution (Reply #17)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 11:27 PM

18. And Your Legal or Accounting Expertise for those Conclusions Are What?

a corporation is a separate legal entity-the residence of its shareholders is wholly irrelevant for tax purposes. If it transacts business in the State of New York then it is subject to the tax laws of New York not just the state of incorporation. You do realize don't you that some corporations transact business in all 50 states and are subject to the tax laws of all 50 states. No corporation in any state is subject to the tax laws of a particular state because of the residence of its shareholders.

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Response to Stallion (Reply #18)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 11:35 PM

19. this allows the money to bypass new york.

Book payments and speaking fees go to these shell llcs instead of to the person, who would have to count them as income and thus pay taxes on it. The limited liability also helps if you get sued or go bankrupt, because then they can't touch your personal assets.

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Response to Viva_La_Revolution (Reply #19)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 11:40 PM

22. No the LLC Revenue Flows DIRECTLY to the Clinton's INDIVIDUAL Return

see page 11 of her 2014 Income Tax return which is Schedule C from WJC,LLC that causes those revenues to be taxed on their INDIVIDUAL Tax Return. I think Hillary's LLC is on Page 13 or 14. There are 5 separate Schedule Cs and they recognized income that was taxed from all 5 entities. Go look-I provided the link above

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Response to Stallion (Reply #22)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 11:48 PM

23. Delaware does not tax LLC's. New York does. using loopholes is legal, not right

No matter how much you cut and paste it will not erase the fact that they are avoiding paying taxes to the state they reside in.

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Response to Viva_La_Revolution (Reply #23)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 12:14 AM

27. No, you're wrong. The whole purpose of a LLC is that

income flows DIRECTLY through to the owners. The LLC itself pays no taxes, files no taxes and has no tax liability regardless of the State in which it is created. The individuals who own the LLC pay income tax directly on all income derived through it.

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Response to COLGATE4 (Reply #27)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 12:40 AM

30. then explain why Delaware is different, and Nevada and SD?

If they don't save on taxes, what is the point?

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Response to Viva_La_Revolution (Reply #30)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 12:48 AM

33. For all I know Delaware was easier for them

to form LLC's. After all, Delaware in known in the entire US for having corporate-friendly formation requirements. But whether it's a Delaware LLC or a New York LLC or a Florida LLC the tax situation doesn't vary one iota. As the owner(s) of an LLC all the income that goes to the LLC is treated exactly as if they made the checks out to you, personally. You then have to show it on Federal return as income and on your Stater return (if your state has State income tax) as well. There's no hiding it, no 'now you see it, now you don't). The LLC was created quite recently as a benefit to generally small business that up to then had had to either work as a Limited Partnership, General Partnership or seek some kind of very complicated Corporate formation. Creating the LLC solved those problems. It's not a vehicle for tax evasion.

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Response to COLGATE4 (Reply #33)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 01:46 AM

35. How Delaware Thrives as a Corporate Tax Haven

Big corporations, small-time businesses, rogues, scoundrels and worse — all have turned up at Delaware addresses in hopes of minimizing taxes, skirting regulations, plying friendly courts or, when needed, covering their tracks. Federal authorities worry that, in addition to the legitimate businesses flocking here, drug traffickers, embezzlers and money launderers are increasingly heading to Delaware, too. It’s easy to set up shell companies here, no questions asked.

“Shells are the No. 1 vehicle for laundering illicit money and criminal proceeds,” said Lanny A. Breuer, assistant attorney general for the criminal division of the Justice Department. “It’s an enormous criminal justice problem. It’s ridiculously easy for a criminal to set up a shell corporation and use the banking system, and we have to stop it.”

In these troubled economic times, when many states are desperate for tax dollars, Delaware stands out in sharp relief. The First State, land of DuPont, broiler chickens and, as it happens, Vice President Joseph R. Biden Jr., increasingly resembles a freewheeling offshore haven, right on America’s shores. Officials in other states complain that Delaware’s cozy corporate setup robs their states of billions of tax dollars. Officials in the Cayman Islands, a favorite Caribbean haunt of secretive hedge funds, say Delaware is today playing faster and looser than the offshore jurisdictions that raise hackles in Washington.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/01/business/how-delaware-thrives-as-a-corporate-tax-haven.html?_r=0

I think if i was a lifetime polititian, i would not have 5 llcs registered all at the same address, known to be a hotbed of criminals

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Response to Viva_La_Revolution (Reply #35)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 08:59 AM

39. As I already explained to you in some detail

there is no indication that the Clinton's LLC's in Delaware have any tax implications. The fact that Delaware is the State with more corporate founding documents doesn't have any bearing on the issue we're talking about. Once more -there is no tax avoidance possible with an LLC.

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Response to Stallion (Reply #15)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 12:11 AM

26. None of these folks want to hear the actual facts. They

are too busy beating their breasts with false outrage because of arguments at the level of "by God the IRS didn't let me write off the $50 for new bowling shirts I bought for my team, so it's not fair that corporations can write off their expenses". Sounds much more like what Trump supporters whine about.

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Response to RiverLover (Original post)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 11:35 PM

20. Kickity

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Response to RiverLover (Original post)

Wed Apr 13, 2016, 11:35 PM

21. When I was forming my corporation decades ago

I was advised by my very rich ex-boss to do it in Delaware the "business friendly state". I didn't do it, probably cost me some money, but I had to keep a close eye on my inept relative lawyer, (thanks, Mom <--- she made me hire him).

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Response to RiverLover (Original post)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 05:47 AM

37. *Take Action* against secret companies in Delaware and the US

#PanamaPapers: Take action against secret companies in Delaware and the US

If Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders want to combat the spread of corruption (and they should!) they need to speak about how they will stop the establishment of secret companies in places like Delaware. The upcoming 14 April 2016 Democratic presidential debate is the perfect opportunity to make this happen.

Tweet at the CNN/NY1 debate moderators to make sure they ask Clinton and Sanders about secret companies:

.@wolfblitzer: Ask @hillaryclinton @berniesanders about #PanamaPapers at 4/14 #demdebate. Can they stop secret companies in the US?
.@DanaBashCNN: Ask @hillaryclinton @berniesanders about #PanamaPapers at 4/14 #demdebate. Can they stop secret companies in the US?
.@errollouis: Ask @hillaryclinton @berniesanders about #PanamaPapers at 4/14 #demdebate. Can they stop secret companies in the US?

Last week’s massive Panama Papers leak shone a stark light on secret companies and the many ways the corrupt hide their cash. But this is about so much more than just Panama. The US state of Delaware has long been the poster child of secrecy in the US. While in all 50 US states it’s possible to start a company without giving your name, in places like Delaware, Wyoming, and Nevada it’s quick and easy. And it's a big business. It’s a cinch for a criminal to set up a shell corporation to launder illicit money, and gain access to the global banking system.

More than beautiful beaches and attractive tax-free shopping – Panama and Delaware are both go-to destinations when shopping for secrecy. But Delaware actually dwarfs Panama when it comes to shady business – it’s home to thousands of secret companies and US laws make it so that the public can’t know whose behind them. Drug dealers, terrorists, the corrupt – you name it.

http://www.transparency.org/news/feature/what_do_panama_and_delaware_have_in_common_both_safe_havens_for_corrupt

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Response to RiverLover (Reply #37)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 09:48 AM

43. You do realize that. in order to form an LLC

you have to provide certain information to the State where you do it, including things like who the owners are and in what percentage they own the LLC, where the have their office and naming an agent who can receive lawsuits against the company? All that info is immediately available on any States' website. No secrets there. You're just getting worked up about things that you obviously misunderstand.

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Response to RiverLover (Original post)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 09:54 AM

45. Kick

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Response to RiverLover (Original post)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 10:10 AM

47. Where'd they get the idea that some people are better than others, anyway?

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Response to RiverLover (Original post)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 02:28 PM

51. Why isn't THIS a major topic in the democratic debates?

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Response to RiverLover (Original post)

Thu Apr 14, 2016, 02:37 PM

53. any chance CNN will ask about this in the Brooklyn forum? place your bets

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