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Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:19 PM

Bernie Sanders’ Campaign Manager Just Blamed Hillary For ISIS

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/bernie-sanders-campaign-manager-just-blamed-hillary-for-isis/


Well, this might be a tough one to walk back. In the aftermath of a feud that started when Bernie Sanders thought he heard Hillary Clinton say he was “quote-unquote not qualified to be president,” Sanders campaign manager Jeff Weaver isn’t just doubling down on the attack, he’s flipping over the table and slapping the pit boss. In an interview with CNN’s Carol Costello Thursday morning, Weaver stood by the Senator’s “not qualified” attacks on Hillary Clinton, and added a new item to the list that Sanders ticked off last night: the rise and expansion of ISIS. Yes, that happened:


I think if you look at her record and campaign, her campaign is funded by millions and millions of dollars from Wall Street and other special interests. She’s made a deal with the devil, and we all know the devil wants his money in the end. So that’s the kind of campaign she’s running. She supported the terrible trade deals which have devastated American manufacturing in the country. She supported the war in Iraq. She continues to have a very, very hawkish foreign policy that has led to the rise and expansion of ISIS throughout the Middle East.



The comment is a stark departure from the left’s common understanding of the rise of ISIS, which even Donald Trump places at the feet of George W. Bush. If Sanders’ rant Wednesday night wasn’t a threat to eventual party unity, this might just be, and Jeff Weaver will probably find himself starring in a Republican campaign ad very soon.


The comment is a stark departure from the left’s common understanding of the rise of ISIS, which even Donald Trump places at the feet of George W. Bush. If Sanders’ rant Wednesday night wasn’t a threat to eventual party unity, this might just be, and Jeff Weaver will probably find himself starring in a Republican campaign ad very soon.


What an IDIOT Weaver is--he'll never have lunch in This Town again...unless he's dining with Karl Rove.

Watching the Sanders campaign fall apart at the seams is a painful exercise.


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Reply Bernie Sanders’ Campaign Manager Just Blamed Hillary For ISIS (Original post)
MADem Apr 2016 OP
morningfog Apr 2016 #1
Jitter65 Apr 2016 #38
kristopher Apr 2016 #60
timmymoff Apr 2016 #72
morningfog Apr 2016 #92
Live and Learn Apr 2016 #96
revbones Apr 2016 #2
NWCorona Apr 2016 #3
SHRED Apr 2016 #4
Else You Are Mad Apr 2016 #5
CorkySt.Clair Apr 2016 #11
Else You Are Mad Apr 2016 #12
timmymoff Apr 2016 #26
MADem Apr 2016 #87
pangaia Apr 2016 #130
Warren DeMontague Apr 2016 #138
beedle Apr 2016 #71
onehandle Apr 2016 #6
MADem Apr 2016 #20
4139 Apr 2016 #7
MADem Apr 2016 #45
leftynyc Apr 2016 #142
ibegurpard Apr 2016 #8
MADem Apr 2016 #17
Armstead Apr 2016 #9
MADem Apr 2016 #16
Armstead Apr 2016 #27
MADem Apr 2016 #48
Armstead Apr 2016 #58
MADem Apr 2016 #68
Armstead Apr 2016 #121
MADem Apr 2016 #123
Gregorian Apr 2016 #10
MADem Apr 2016 #13
Gregorian Apr 2016 #47
MADem Apr 2016 #51
Gregorian Apr 2016 #59
MADem Apr 2016 #63
Gregorian Apr 2016 #91
MADem Apr 2016 #97
Gregorian Apr 2016 #103
MADem Apr 2016 #125
Gregorian Apr 2016 #145
amborin Apr 2016 #14
Broward Apr 2016 #15
MADem Apr 2016 #32
Broward Apr 2016 #53
MADem Apr 2016 #57
Broward Apr 2016 #65
MADem Apr 2016 #66
Broward Apr 2016 #67
MADem Apr 2016 #79
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MADem Apr 2016 #84
Motown_Johnny Apr 2016 #18
MADem Apr 2016 #23
Beacool Apr 2016 #77
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MADem Apr 2016 #100
Vinca Apr 2016 #19
MADem Apr 2016 #22
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MADem Apr 2016 #25
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MADem Apr 2016 #41
bigtree Apr 2016 #21
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bigtree Apr 2016 #35
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Marr Apr 2016 #50
bigtree Apr 2016 #61
timmymoff Apr 2016 #64
bigtree Apr 2016 #69
timmymoff Apr 2016 #70
bigtree Apr 2016 #73
timmymoff Apr 2016 #76
Sheepshank Apr 2016 #28
PatrickforO Apr 2016 #30
MADem Apr 2016 #34
Blue Meany Apr 2016 #33
MADem Apr 2016 #39
betsuni Apr 2016 #37
Bohemianwriter Apr 2016 #40
MADem Apr 2016 #44
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Enrique Apr 2016 #42
Kalidurga Apr 2016 #43
MADem Apr 2016 #54
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RedCappedBandit Apr 2016 #49
MADem Apr 2016 #52
RedCappedBandit Apr 2016 #80
MADem Apr 2016 #81
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MADem Apr 2016 #86
RedCappedBandit Apr 2016 #89
MADem Apr 2016 #90
jfern Apr 2016 #55
dr60omg Apr 2016 #62
bigwillq Apr 2016 #74
Luminous Animal Apr 2016 #75
MADem Apr 2016 #78
AgingAmerican Apr 2016 #94
MADem Apr 2016 #95
Fuddnik Apr 2016 #129
Live and Learn Apr 2016 #98
MADem Apr 2016 #99
Live and Learn Apr 2016 #114
MADem Apr 2016 #115
Live and Learn Apr 2016 #118
MADem Apr 2016 #120
snowy owl Apr 2016 #101
MADem Apr 2016 #122
snowy owl Apr 2016 #136
MADem Apr 2016 #139
snowy owl Apr 2016 #140
MADem Apr 2016 #143
BillZBubb Apr 2016 #102
MADem Apr 2016 #105
beam me up scottie Apr 2016 #106
BillZBubb Apr 2016 #107
beam me up scottie Apr 2016 #110
TheFarS1de Apr 2016 #113
beam me up scottie Apr 2016 #117
MADem Apr 2016 #112
wendylaroux Apr 2016 #104
MADem Apr 2016 #111
wendylaroux Apr 2016 #116
beam me up scottie Apr 2016 #108
redstateblues Apr 2016 #109
MADem Apr 2016 #119
delrem Apr 2016 #124
MADem Apr 2016 #126
delrem Apr 2016 #135
whirlygigspin Apr 2016 #127
pangaia Apr 2016 #128
MADem Apr 2016 #134
Fuddnik Apr 2016 #131
MADem Apr 2016 #132
dchill Apr 2016 #133
Warren DeMontague Apr 2016 #137
tirebiter Apr 2016 #141
silvershadow Apr 2016 #144
polly7 Apr 2016 #146

Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:21 PM

1. The Iraq war invasion gave rise to ISIS, she voted for and supported the war.

 

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Response to morningfog (Reply #1)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:22 PM

38. Yeah, she did that all by herself and took great delight in doing so....more lies

 

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/war_stories/2016/02/hillary_clinton_told_the_truth_about_her_iraq_war_vote.html

For once just get a little more context. And stop besmirching the decent people who voted for the Iraq war making a difficult and complex decision.

And remember that Bernie has voted for every military increase since then.

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Response to Jitter65 (Reply #38)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:04 PM

60. How did it go? "We came, we saw, he died! Hahahahahaha!"

Isn't that what Hillary said?

How one major failure allowed ISIS to exploit the chaos in its newest hotspot

Pamela Engel
Jan. 27, 2016, 12:01 PM 2,406 3
ISIS LibyaReuters
An Islamic State militant holds a gun while standing behind what are said to be Ethiopian Christians in Wilayat Fazzan, in this still image from an undated video made available on a social media website on April 19, 2015.
Five years after the fall of Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi, the country has plunged into chaos, allowing extremist groups to rise up in place of the dictator's brutal regime.

The failure to establish a unity government that includes both rival governments fighting for power in Libya has led the terrorist group ISIS (also known as the Islamic State, ISIL, or Daesh) to exploit the power vacuum and take control of territory in the country, a new report from strategic security firm The Soufan Group notes. And Al Qaeda has also used the situation in Libya to its advantage...
http://www.businessinsider.com/isis-libya-rise-2016-1

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Response to Jitter65 (Reply #38)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:49 PM

72. Nope

 

But one candidate warned of the Iraq war consequences, another voted for it. One was fooled by George W Bush, another wasn't . I'd say that speaks volumes about her judgment.

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Response to Jitter65 (Reply #38)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 08:17 PM

92. No one said she did it by herself.

 

Any no one gets credit for supporting bush's lies. Fuck that.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #1)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:29 PM

96. +10,000 nt

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:22 PM

2. Yeah! Calling out corrupt politicians like Hillary must mean he's an idiot! nt

 

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:22 PM

3. And?

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:22 PM

4. So she didn't push for Libya's overthrow?

 

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:24 PM

5. You realize...

Hillary says she was lied to by Bush, but her husband, the president just months before, was privy to intelligence information that would have shown that Bush was lying about Iraq. Either she was negligent and didn't ask Bill Clinton to confirm or deny the lies before she signed off on innocent Americans dying for an illegal war, or she asked him and just did not care.

Don't pretend that she wasn't aware of what was really going on in Iraq.

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Response to Else You Are Mad (Reply #5)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:28 PM

11. So in Bernieworld Bush is free of any blame

 

That seems pretty clear since he is rarely or ever criticized by Berners.

Also, how did we get there in the first place? Oh that's right, a lot of far left cranks who thought Bush and Gore were the same. We all saw how that one turned out. Hearing some echoes of that in this campaign. Some never learn.

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Response to CorkySt.Clair (Reply #11)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:32 PM

12. I never said that.

Bush is utterly to blame. I was just saying it is naive to think Hillary didn't know that Bush was lying to Congress and the American people.

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Response to CorkySt.Clair (Reply #11)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:04 PM

26. Bush forced Hillary

 

to vote for Iraq? do you guys ever take any responsibility. A right wing conspiracy was always Bill's problem. She helped Wall St because of 9/11. Are any of her bad decisions her fault, or do we just ignore the long list of terrible decisions? By terrible, I mean terrible. Neocons love her, they know the MIC will be well greased and used under Hillary's not so watchful eye.

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Response to CorkySt.Clair (Reply #11)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 07:28 PM

87. And Bernie's vote that set Porgie up to ask for the moon doesn't count, either.

Because Saintly Bernie gets a pass on everything!

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Response to CorkySt.Clair (Reply #11)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:35 PM

130. Who the fuck said Bush is free of blame.?? WHO !!

HUH? name one person.

Stop making up shit.

Go vote for Hillary...

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Response to CorkySt.Clair (Reply #11)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 03:37 AM

138. SHE HAD NO CHOICE BUT TO VOTE FOR IT!

NO CHOICE WHATSOEVER!

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Response to Else You Are Mad (Reply #5)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:49 PM

71. They lied to Bernie too

 

But Bernie didn't have the opportunity to sacrifice hundreds of thousands of Iraqi lives in a war based on OBVIOUS lies, in exchange for a couple billion dollars from Bush to help out Wall St. So Gawd knows what he would have done in the same situation ('cause after 50+ years of consistency, who the fuck knows what Bernie might do )

(Hillary fans take it at face value when Hillary wants them to believe bullshit like:
Wall St., after 9/11, wouldn't have received government funds to rebuild, if Hillary had not intervened???
Really???? No, Really????)

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:24 PM

6. What's his Free Republic username? nt

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Response to onehandle (Reply #6)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:53 PM

20. Something to do with comic books, no doubt!

He owns a comic book store--which kind of explains a lot of his marketing strategy.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:25 PM

7. Hillary's war on Libya brought ISIS to North Africa. Here war also...

...sent Libyan arm to Boko Harum. Hillary was an awful SoS.

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Response to MADem (Reply #45)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 04:21 AM

142. Interesting article

 

Allow me to post part of it:

More problematic for the Senator in Birkenstocks is the little-known fact that Bernie Sanders himself voted twice in support of regime change in Iraq. In 1998 Sanders voted in favor of the Iraq Liberation Act of 1998, which said: “It should be the policy of the United States to support efforts to remove the regime headed by Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq and to promote the emergence of a democratic government to replace that regime.”

Later that same year, Sanders also backed a resolution that stated: “Congress reaffirms that it should be the policy of the United States to support efforts to remove the regime headed by Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq and to promote the emergence of a democratic government to replace that regime.” These measures gave congressional backing for the CIA’s covert plan to overthrow the Hussein regime in Baghdad, as well as the tightening of an economic sanctions regime that may have killed as many as 500,000 Iraqi children. The resolution also gave the green light to Operation Desert Fox, a four-day long bombing campaign striking 100 targets throughout Iraq. The operation featured more than 300 bombing sorties and 350 ground-launched Tomahawk cruise missiles, several targeting Saddam Hussein himself.



Certainly does put a different light on things.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:26 PM

8. She voted for the IWR

She and everyone else who did can share the blame.

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Response to ibegurpard (Reply #8)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:49 PM

17. And what did Bernie vote for?

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/02/16/blood-traces-bernies-iraq-war-hypocrisy/

Read the whole thing--the truth does sting, doesn't it?

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:26 PM

9. The truth hurts

 

She supported a war that created the conditions that led to ISIS.

She was secretary of state during the time that the tensions within Iraq fueled the growth of Isis

She pushed for the destabilization of Libya, which has created conditions favorable to ISIS and Islamic extremism in that country

These are not just arguments Jeff Weaver plucked out of thin air today



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Response to Armstead (Reply #9)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:49 PM

16. Cough.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/02/16/blood-traces-bernies-iraq-war-hypocrisy/

You need to learn your candidate's horrible history, and stop waving that tired flag.

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Response to MADem (Reply #16)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:05 PM

27. Cough you're using Counterpunch as a source? And by a Whitewater exposer?

 

Have you become an ultra leftist? Or libertarian? Or whatever otehr labels are put on it when articles critical of Clinton are published from there?

That's the same reporter, by the way, who recently wrote an article about, ahem, Whitewater.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/12/11/paper-trails-big-timber-the-clintons-and-the-origins-of-the-whitewater-scandal/

Of the thousands of stories written about the Whitewater scandal, some 90 percent have concerned themselves with the cover-up question: if or how the Clinton White House suppressed evidence in the wake of Vince Foster’s suicide. Almost all the remaining stories deal with the efforts of Governor Bill and the First Lady of Arkansas to keep their friend James McDougal’s Madison Guaranty Savings & Loan afloat. Meanwhile, one of the great untold stories of Whitewater is the chummy nexus of the Clintons and big timber, which may have played a role in the original Whitewater Estates deal and certainly was evidenced in a subsequent transaction that amounted to a last-ditch effort to save the Whitewater Development Corporation from bankruptcy.



But that aside....He's not saying anything new. And it's an article from the ultra-leftist anti war purist faction that Clintonistas are always complaining about. You mean Bernie did something moderate? Horrors.

Sure, Bernie voted to support Bull Clinton in the 90's with a resolution that supported sanctions and support for internal Iraqi movements but was not NOT to authorize military invasion of Iraq. Clinton did misuse it to launch airstrikes...coincidentally just at the time of his impeachment. But it was nothing like Bush's War Permission Act that Hillary voted for.

And gosh, I though Bernie is bad because he hates Democrats and never supports them.

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Response to Armstead (Reply #27)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:41 PM

48. Oh, let's whine about the SOURCE and ignore the FACTS presented--by someone to Berrrnie's left.

You think "lefty sources" get to create Congressional votes? Manufacture facts?




Sorry, it doesn't work that way.

Oh, and the desperate, clomping, obvious, and at the end of the day, pointless Whitewater pivot? That was pretty obvious and sad. Go ahead and start another thread on that, if you'd like--this thread is about what a BSer BS is.

Struggle on, though!



The point is that his "lefty" bona fides are being called out by people who his unthinking acolytes would believe are on his team.

There's something wrong with that "Bern." And when the people to the LEFT and RIGHT of him have a problem with the guy, well, maybe he just... has a problem.

He's a hypocrite--and his votes prove it.

The Bernie Brigade has no standing to make "purity" whines, either. As you sow, so shall you reap.

Enjoy.

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Response to MADem (Reply #48)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:01 PM

58. You are trying yourself up in pretzels.

 

I have no problem with the source, except it strikes me as really weird that you use something that even I say is very far left to complain about how Sanders is awful for supporting Bill Clinton's policies -- when you also spend so much time griping that Bernie's a malcontent who never supports Democrats. Using this against him just seems odd -- like you have no core of beliefs of your own..

....And compared to what Hillary did, that's total Bush league.

And Whitewater was just to point out the source you are using...If someone else had posted an OP with that article, you'd be shrieking what a Glenn Greenwald Libertaian or something the author is.

I just find your lack of consistency....funny.



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Response to Armstead (Reply #58)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:43 PM

68. LOL -- and you are "trying yourself up" way too hard!!!

Bernie Sanders' blowhard campaign manager just pulled a Brutus on his own personal Julius Caesar.

Instead of calling him out for being an idiot and an asshole, who just stuck a knife in his campaign and made him toxic to those super delegates he wants to woo, you defend him.

There's a point--and you are past it--where YOU can't walk that back, either.


I'm entirely consistent--I've always thought Weaver was a petulant, nasty lying, cheating blowhard who was in over his head--and his conduct in this exchange bears that out!

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Response to MADem (Reply #68)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:07 PM

121. I'm not real fond of Jeff Weaver

 

I think Sanders could pick a surrogate with a better personality.

But he didn't say anything new or outrageous in that. Facts is facts.

Now when you drag out a column by ultra lefty writer saying that Sanders is a warmonger because he supported Bill Clinton's policies towards Iraq in the 90's (which was a far cry from Bush's outright pushing of an invasion) -- when you usually spend so much time bashing Sanders as "not supportive of Democrats" and too far left of the mainstream....I just have to laugh...or scratch my head in confusion.



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Response to Armstead (Reply #121)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:17 PM

123. They're joined at the hip. Jeffy has RUINED Bernie. And I think he's pushed him over a cliff with

this latest fit of pique.

He got three pinocchios from the WAPO. His research was a fricken LIE, and he fed it to his principal, and his principal, trusting his sorry, skeevy ass, repeated it --QUOTE/UNQUOTE--and made an ass of himself. Then he tosses out this ISIS shit, right after he flings some eighties-era sexist trash at HRC for being "too ambitious."

He's a MORON.

And I'm sure he's collected plenty of that "little people money" for himself, Jeffy has. When his candidate crashes and burns, I think the "Brigade" ought to do a little vigorous vetting of the Worst Campaign Manager Ever. Maybe sue to get their donations and their "I Believe" back.

Who else could take an insurgent campaign on an up-trend, and crush it so decisively with sexism, snark, crudeness and outright lies?

Like I said, Karl Rove....without the brain. He's got the mendacity and tenacity, but he doesn't have the smarts.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:27 PM

10. It's an accurate statement of the truth about her.

He made no direct relation, but rather an indirect one, which is true. Bernie has none because he was smart enough, or moral enough, to see clearly to make the decision which had others made might have saved this country, and Iraqis, massive suffering, cost, death, and now ISIS.

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Response to Gregorian (Reply #10)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:47 PM

13. Oh please--your hatred blinds you. Not even The Donald buys off on that Big Honking Lie.

But if you want to die on that hill, you be my guest.

Just don't be surprised if the remains are left to be picked over by a little birdie ... or dozens.

If you're going to play the "origins" game, jump to the far left and see what they say:

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/02/16/blood-traces-bernies-iraq-war-hypocrisy/

Hillary wasn't even in the Senate when Bernie was making those bad decisions!

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Response to MADem (Reply #13)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:38 PM

47. What's going on with that article? He didn't vote for the aumf.

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Response to Gregorian (Reply #47)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:49 PM

51. Yes, he did. If Osama had been in Lebanon, his vote would have allowed Bush to invade there.

If Osama had decided to hang with Saddam, well, that vote would have been an up-check to go after him in Iraq.


Well I don’t usually do this, but I feel compelled to respond to this post in particular. Bernie Sanders voted to go to war with Afghanistan in 2001. To be more specific it was an Authorization for Use of Military Force Against “terrorists responsible for 9/11.” Which at the time was Osama Bin Laden who was being harbored by the Taliban in Afghanistan. The first AUMF to go to Afghanistan was voted for on September 18th 2001. Literally a week after 9/11. Not only had our nation just suffered from a devastating terrorist attack, the most devastating attack from a foreign threat in the history of the nation. On top of that the nation was in a state of patriotic fervor and public opinion was basically unanimously in support of military action against Afghanistan. Granted time and time again no power has been able to effectively subjugate Afghanistan, but a week after 9/11 a vote to go to war with Afghanistan was completely justified. Definitely a short sighted decision, but one that anyone operating as a politician at the time would have been hard pressed to turn against. Which is why it should come as no surprise that only one congressperson voted no. Ten representatives and two senators abstained from voting, mostly because there was an attack and a military response seemed necessary at the time.


That paragraph is from YOUR link.....you should read stuff before you post it.

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Response to MADem (Reply #51)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:01 PM

59. I'm sorry, I was thinking of the Iraq War Resolution, which is actually worse.

I did read that article, and misconstrued it. Brain malfunction.

I can explain why he voted for the AUMF. He mentioned it. Once the IWR was passed, he felt the best route was to support the troops with whatever it took to get them back home safely.

It's not like he voted for the war, and that's what I felt these posts imply. Not at all.

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Response to Gregorian (Reply #59)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:15 PM

63. One paved the way for the other--no one has clean hands here.

It's like pregnancy--all or nothing.

He voted to allow Bush to go after Osama. If Osama had been in Iraq, that's where Bush would have gone to get him.

You can't sugar coat this turd. He's as complicit as any of his peers.

AND he voted to fund that which he claimed to hate, even though the continuing resolution authority would have preserved the ability of the nation to fund the military at existing levels.

So....what can I tell you? He's a bullshitter. He's playing a holier-than-thou game, when he's down in the mud with the rest of 'em.

And when you look at his curious accommodations with Lockheed Martin, you can see why he plays both ends against the middle. They aren't snuggling up next to him because he's a Big Peacenik--even if he wants you to believe that. They're snuggling up with him because he is FRIENDLY to their goals. Everything from F-35s to drones to Sandia Labs (those charmers who make atomic weapons).

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Response to MADem (Reply #63)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 08:08 PM

91. The IWR is all that matters.

Without the IRW there is no AUMF. Period. End of discussion. So let's get that fact straight.

Then we can move on to the AUMF, which had he not voted for would have seemed ridiculous.

I stand by my original statement.

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Response to Gregorian (Reply #91)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:30 PM

97. Excuse me? I think you've got that ENTIRELY backwards. """End of discussion."""

In the world I live in, 2001 comes BEFORE 2002~!!!



And, to quote YOU "So let's get THAT fact straight!"



How special that you've managed to twist the space-time continuum to suit your desires!

Here are some links for your much-needed edification:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorization_for_Use_of_Military_Force_Against_Terrorists

The Authorization for Use of Military Force (AUMF), Pub. L. 107-40, codified at 115 Stat. 224 and passed as S.J.Res. 23 by the United States Congress on September 14, 2001, authorizes the use of United States Armed Forces against those responsible for the attacks on September 11, 2001. The authorization granted the President the authority to use all "necessary and appropriate force" against those whom he determined "planned, authorized, committed or aided" the September 11th attacks, or who harbored said persons or groups. The AUMF was signed by President George W. Bush on September 18, 2001. As of December 2015, the AUMF remains in effect and provides Congressional authorization for the use of force against ISIS and other Islamic militant groups.[1]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_Resolution

The Iraq Resolution or the Iraq War Resolution (formally the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 2002,[1] Pub.L. 107–243, 116 Stat. 1498, enacted October 16, 2002, H.J.Res. 114) is a joint resolution passed by the United States Congress in October 2002 as Public Law No: 107-243, authorizing military action against Iraq.[2]



Gregorian
91. The IWR is all that matters.
View profile
Without the IRW there is no AUMF. Period. End of discussion. So let's get that fact straight.

Then we can move on to the AUMF, which had he not voted for would have seemed ridiculous.

I stand by my original statement.


Still standing by that original statement, are you?

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Response to MADem (Reply #97)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:43 PM

103. One of them voted for a war based on lies. That's all I'm trying to say.

I don't care about the details, which I obviously have always had mixed up.

It's the part about buying the lies that goes right back to my original post. Her judgment.

Save the details and look at the bigger picture, which is dead people, deplete uranium, and all the rest, including trillions in debt.

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Response to Gregorian (Reply #103)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:27 PM

125. LOL--you do realize the AUMF continues to be used to this day to justify war?

And you "don't care about the details?"

Really?

The details are the nub of the matter. Bush NEVER would have tried for the IWR had he not had the AUMF under his belt--in fact, if you recall, he pretty much said "I've got this AUMF, I don't need your IWR, this is more about 'solidarity' than anything else." And his surrogates also insisted that it was more of a "bargaining chip" than anything else, to show that mean old Saddam that We Mean Business!

The framing IS important.

But the first "war" vote? Bernie beat Clinton on that by a mile. He not only voted for the AUMF, he also voted--not once, but TWICE--for regime change in Iraq.

Now, by "regime change" we're not talking about having free and open elections where some schmuck would run against Saddam. We're talking "regime change" at the end of a rope, like we saw in all its ugly horror.

And BS voted FOR that. TWICE.

So let's not perpetuate this fiction that the Senator from Lockheed Martin is some kind of peacenik, because he's not. He likes drones, he likes fighter aircraft, he likes military authorizations. He likes them best when the pork of these things accrues to his state and covers him in glory.

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Response to MADem (Reply #125)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 09:20 AM

145. You're typing a storm without saying anything. What are you talking about?

Do you even realize Bernie Sanders lead the opposition to the war in Iraq, while your candidate paved the way.

You cannot spin that no matter how many words you type.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:48 PM

14. so does the NY Times

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:49 PM

15. He's spot on and should repeat it over and over.

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Response to Broward (Reply #15)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:10 PM

32. I hope he does. RELENTLESSLY!!!

I love a full-blown crazy-ass implosion every now and again!

If he wants to see Superdelegates treat his candidate like they're Superman and he's Krytonite (see? That was a "comic book" reference because this idiot runs a comic book store) he should PLEASE, continue on!!!



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Response to MADem (Reply #32)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:51 PM

53. He should keep telling the truth.

Btw, if Hillary's the nominee, she'll be hearing this from the Repubs too. This connection was made a while ago. Perhaps, Bernie and his team will help her in the long run because she'll need to come up with a line of defense on this sooner or later.

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Response to Broward (Reply #53)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:00 PM

57. Yeah, go TEAM!!! Slash and Bern! Tear down the Democratic Party!!!

Heckuva strategy....






This petulant rant by Weaver was a strategic error of significant proportions. It shows him to be vicious, and amateurish--a dangerous combination. He has "bernt" bridges and will never be trusted by anyone who matters, ever again. He'd better hope he still has a job with Bernie, because he screwed the guy with these remarks.

He also made damn sure that no Super Delegate would contemplate touching Sanders with a ten foot pole.

Stupid, stupid man.

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Response to MADem (Reply #57)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:20 PM

65. He's just pointing out the consequences of the disastrous war that Hillary voted for.

There's nothing petulant, vicious or amateurish about it. You also say Weaver can't be trusted ever again for stating the truth about the Iraq War. However, correct me if I'm wrong, but I presume you trust someone in Hillary that voted for that very same war for political reasons.

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Response to Broward (Reply #65)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:31 PM

66. LOL....you see what you want to see! He's not "just" doing that.

He's taking a stance that is so far out on a limb, even Donald TRUMP won't go there.


By any measure, this appearance was a FAIL. A huge one, too.

And it is already resonating (hint: not in a good way, either).

This guy won't be able to get a reservation inside the beltway unless he makes it under an assumed name.

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Response to MADem (Reply #66)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:36 PM

67. I see that you trust someone who voted for the Iraq War, but not someone that's pointing

out the consequences of it.

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Response to Broward (Reply #67)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 07:09 PM

79. And you trust someone who gave Bush the authority to chase Osama anywhere.

Hell, if he'd been in Canada, we wouldn't be so snuggly with Trudeau these days....

LOL!

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/02/16/blood-traces-bernies-iraq-war-hypocrisy/

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Response to MADem (Reply #79)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 07:21 PM

82. LOL is right. You've laughably exposed yourself.

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Response to Broward (Reply #82)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 07:24 PM

84. No--just saying silly things doesn't make them so.

Your candidate is in hot water. And he's drowning.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:50 PM

18. Hillary's attack has backfired. Now she is running scared and they are pressing the attack.

 


She screwed up, again.

Don't blame Weaver. Blame Hillary.



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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #18)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:56 PM

23. LOL! That sound you hear is the death rattle of the Sanders campaign.

These crazy comments, and the bizarre lashing out, are death paroxysms.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #18)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:58 PM

77. Delusional much????

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Response to Beacool (Reply #77)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 07:22 PM

83. Then explain why she is walking it back

 

and the Sanders campaign isn't.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #83)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 07:38 PM

88. Take what back????

Sanders doubled down on the lie that she called him unqualified, which she didn't. That's nothing to be proud about.

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Response to Beacool (Reply #88)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 08:21 PM

93. This.

 

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/apr/07/bernie-s/bernie-sanders-not-qualified-be-president-hillary-/

^snip^


Instead, the Sanders people sent us video of a Sanders news conference in which he cites a CNN report saying that the Clinton campaign's strategy would be to "Disqualify (Sanders), defeat him and unify the party later."

But that's not a quote from Clinton. It's a summation by CNN's senior Washington correspondent Jeff Zeleny, who begins his article this way: "Hillary Clinton's campaign is taking new steps to try and disqualify Bernie Sanders in the eyes of Democratic voters."

The article says Clinton spokeswoman Christina Reynolds argued that Sanders is unqualified, but Reynolds is not directly quoted as saying that.




Yes, Bernie should have said that he was paraphasing and should not have said "quote, unquote". That was wrong.


Of course Hillary spent about a month claiming that she had run from sniper fire in Bosnia and then called the whole thing "misspeaking". You do know why people use double standards, right? Because they need to.


Hillary is walking back her campaign's attacks on Bernie's qualifications. Why? Because it has backfired.


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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #93)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:36 PM

100. LOL!!

Yes, Bernie should have said that he was paraphasing and should not have said "quote, unquote". That was wrong.


Yep--so wrong it earned him not one, not two but THREE WAPO pinocchios!
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2016/04/07/sanderss-incorrect-claim-that-clinton-called-him-not-qualified-for-the-presidency/


This ain't going away--and folks like you are helping keep it alive, so thanks for that! Your inadvertent help to the Clinton campaign is appreciated!

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:52 PM

19. That's inadvertently true.

By voting for the Iraq war she was an enabler for ISIS. So were a whole lot of other people, so it's not like she's alone.

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Response to Vinca (Reply #19)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:55 PM

22. Oh, but who predated her with a carte blanche vote?

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Response to MADem (Reply #22)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:00 PM

24. Bernie said no to the vote that counted and the bombs dropped soon after.

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Response to Vinca (Reply #24)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:04 PM

25. He said YES to the vote that made it easy for Bush to wage war.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/02/16/blood-traces-bernies-iraq-war-hypocrisy/


And then he voted over and over and over to FUND the war he pretended to eschew.

And the answer to the Big Stinking and Stupid Lie that the "trooooooops" wouldn't "get fed" is two words:

Continuing Resolution.

Anyone who has served in the military knows all about these--we operate under them most years, because of the divided Congress we've "enjoyed" since the Days of Newt.

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Response to MADem (Reply #25)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:09 PM

31. So after a war begins he should vote to not supply the troops?

Wow . . . damned if you do, damned if you don't.

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Response to Vinca (Reply #31)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:27 PM

41. Thanks so much for making it clear to everyone that you don't understand what a

CONTINUING RESOLUTION is.

The troops are supplied--a NO vote wouldn't stop that.

Anyone who knows how Congress works, and how military appropriations works, knows this, too.

Heck, I even gave you a HINT to "Not Go There" in my post above--but you ignored it.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 04:54 PM

21. fire him, Bernie!

Tommy Christopher ‏@tommyxtopher 4h4 hours ago

Watch Bernie Sanders' Campaign Manager Blame Hillary Clinton For ISIS. Fire Him, Bernie! http://thedailybanter.com//2016/04/watch-bernie-sanders-campaign-manager-blame-hillary-clinton-for-isis/

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Response to bigtree (Reply #21)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:07 PM

29. Fire him, he is correct.

 

Her disastrous vote did lead to their creation, way to go regime changers!

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Response to timmymoff (Reply #29)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:14 PM

35. I like this fellow's term for you folks cheering this kind of tripe

...he calls you folks, #SandersLittleHelpers.

Please proceed!

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Response to bigtree (Reply #35)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:16 PM

36. We will

 

we are enjoying watching the hillarians meltdown from yet another terrible campaign move. I thought Gore sucked as a candidate but it's obvious why she lost in 2008 .. she is a terrible candidate.

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Response to timmymoff (Reply #36)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:49 PM

50. The fun part is how excited they got when they thought they finally had a good smear.

 

The hilarious part is the increasingly frantic assertions that everyone go with it.

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Response to timmymoff (Reply #36)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:10 PM

61. 2.4 million-plus more votes for Hillary

...sucks to be the one trailing her.

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Response to bigtree (Reply #61)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:16 PM

64. he will only win his home state

 

, he will be gone after iowa, he will be gone by super Tuesday, march, 15, NY. Not as bad as it's going to suck watching her get beat by the gop. Enjoy.

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Response to timmymoff (Reply #64)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:45 PM

69. 2.4 million-plus more votes for Hillary

...now that's a meltdown I can live with.

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Response to bigtree (Reply #69)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:48 PM

70. Yes, because you can't see a huge momentum shift

 

Maybe those aren't televised in " the bubble"

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Response to timmymoff (Reply #70)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:52 PM

73. Hillary will likely net more votes from Puerto Rico

...than Sanders did in this 'surge' in these delegate-poor states.

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Response to bigtree (Reply #73)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:56 PM

76. We shall see.

 

I'd be pretty embarrassed if I were running for president since 2006 and couldn't put away a 74 year old socialist from one of the least populated states in the nation, but that's just me. Will you please send Camp Weathervane a memo That Bill Clinton needs to speak more about race issues, he did a bang up job. Kind of like DWS did as head of the DNC.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:06 PM

28. bless his over botoxed little head.

 

I think the poisons are leaching into his brain.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:09 PM

30. No, sorry, but that's true. That is a TRUE statement. Our policies in the mid east

are DIRECTLY responsible for the ultimate rise of ISIS, and Clinton is responsible to the extent she helped to promote and implement those 'hawkish' policies.

Notice too, this isn't some pinocchio thing where, "Oh, Hillary didn't say X and Bernie said she did!"

Nope. This is a hard observation about our foreign policy and how enslaved our government has become by the MIC. Policy, people, policy.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:11 PM

33. The Iraq War did give rise to ISIS but, with all due respect,

 

the Bush Administration lied to and deceived Congress to get that war started. Another kind of President might have used that mandate to have "forced inspections" that I would have supported and which some in the administration were advocating. Although I do think Clinton is way too hawkish, I give her the benefit of the doubt on the Iraq vote. But she deserves a lot of the blame for the rise of ISIS because her militancy in Syrian and Libya and hyprocrital position on Israel and Palestine.

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Response to Blue Meany (Reply #33)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:23 PM

39. The only people who believe this honking load of bullshit are kool-aid drinkers who have

completely lost touch with reality and who are allowing their Hill Hatred to overcome every and any semblance of logical thought they might otherwise possess. You really have to work hard to be more out of touch than Donald Frigging Trump on this issue.


They are angry that their candidate has stumbled, three, four, five times--and that this comment may well be remembered, when they do the post-mortem, as the moment where the patient that is the Sanders campaign went into full cardiac arrest.

It's not an accident that people (not Clinton fans, either) are calling for Weaver's head. This guy is like Karl Rove, but without Karl's "delicate touch." LOL!

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:18 PM

37. K&R

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:27 PM

40. Here's the deal for the people who don't understand...

 

the consequences of neocon geopolitics.

Syria was on a brink of uprising after a drought. Assad sought aid from abroad. USA with Clinton as SoS denied aid to the country. Oh noes. They had other plans. They wanted to oust Assad as all cost and proced to bomb the country and then proceded to arm the "moderate" rebels who proved to be anything but moderate.

ISIS was unknown to everyone until Syria, a country Hillary pushed to put boots on the ground.

The breeding ground for ISIS was created by the people who voted FOR the illegal invasion of Iraq.

Did Hillary vote to invade Iraq?

Was Hillary a peace monger towards the Syrians or was she a war hawk?

The spreading of ISIS could easily have been prevented if USA in general have treated the Syrians as HUMANS and not targets for American made weapons, and Libya not bombed to oblivion with Gadaffi dead as a result.

It's all in the pudding.

The only campaign with moral and ideological connections to Karl Rove is the Hillary campaign, trusting her minions to grasp onto any straw she or her surrogates has picked to spread on the interwebs and the media like an infectious, disgusting disease without actually having a clue about what has been going on in the ME the last 25 years...


Her "experience" in foreign policy would disqualify her just as much as it would disqualify Dick Cheney or anyone from the Bush crime family to open their mouths regarding ISIS.

On the side note, the one candidate of Bernie and Hillary, Dick Cheney has given praise to one of them. Guess who!

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Response to MADem (Reply #44)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:35 PM

46. Nice try but no cigar....

 

I once fought the Serbs!

As I disagree with all wars ever since, this is blood on all our hands, and Bill Clinton belongs in the same dock as Karadcic and Milosevic!

Let's talk about the giant lie called 9-11 and Iraq since those have far reaching consequences than a country you can visit on holiday!

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:28 PM

42. this is so stupid, i'm sorry

The comment is a stark departure from the left’s common understanding of the rise of ISIS, which even Donald Trump places at the feet of George W. Bush. If Sanders’ rant Wednesday night wasn’t a threat to eventual party unity, this might just be, and Jeff Weaver will probably find himself starring in a Republican campaign ad very soon.

For one thing, what is this "even Donald Trump" nosnense? Donald Trump put the blame on George Bush for one reason: because he was running against Jeb Bush. If he is running against Hillary, he will put the blame on her, with 100% certainty.

For another thing, "the Left" has always held accountable Dems who voted for the war, including Hillary. I think Mediaite is thinking about partisan hacks, who put all the blame on Bush and forget about the dems that enabled him. Obviously Bernie is not one of those partisan hacks.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:30 PM

43. Well a lot of people here including me made that connection months ago.

Now when Hillary's involvement with the German banks via the vote for the Panama Trade agreement gets out that is going to hurt her a whole lot. Then when the connection is made between that and the destruction of Greece's economy it's going to get real bad.

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Response to Kalidurga (Reply #43)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:53 PM

54. So you are ADMITTING that you're going beyond even Donald Trump!!



http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/02/16/blood-traces-bernies-iraq-war-hypocrisy/


I do have to laugh at all this deflection--it's indicative, when people try to change the subject (Whitewater!!! GERMAN banks!!!!) that they're uncomfortable with the simple truth.

"A lot of people including (you)" are probably going to be very disappointed within the next eight weeks.

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Response to MADem (Reply #54)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:57 PM

56. I guess you don't really want to talk about Hillary destabilizing the Middle East even further...

Or her link to the Panama Papers and it's there. Or the possibility that this tax shelter scheme allowed the destruction of Greece's economy and resulted in austerity measures and Hillary would push for the same policies here and it would result in emergency austerity for people that could possibly die as a result. I wouldn't want to talk about that either if I was you. I really wouldn't want to talk about Hillary seeing war as a business opportunity either. Yes, Bernie is right. Deal with it.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:43 PM

49. That foreign policy *has* led to the rise and expansion of ISIS. lol. nt

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Response to MADem (Reply #52)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 07:11 PM

80. Was that meant to refute the excerpt in question?

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Response to RedCappedBandit (Reply #80)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 07:15 PM

81. If voting for war is somehow the equivalent of "creating ISIS," it's fair to ask "Who did it first?"

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Response to MADem (Reply #81)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 07:24 PM

85. Not sure who you're quoting, but the truth is clear

Reckless military intervention leads to the rise of fundamentalism - ISIS is no exception.

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Response to MADem (Reply #86)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 07:58 PM

89. Glad we agree.

That Bernie, who is far to the left of Hillary, still is imperfect, says plenty. Those of us who are to the left of either candidate have a pretty clear choice, when it's between the two.


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Response to RedCappedBandit (Reply #89)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 08:01 PM

90. If you agree that Sanders voted for war first, and multiple times, too,

and his manager just stuck a knife in him from which he's unlikely to recover, then we agree.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 05:55 PM

55. ISIS exists because of foreign policy like her

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Response to jfern (Reply #55)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:11 PM

62. It does exist because of neocon policies and she is a neocon

She never met a war she didn't like

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:52 PM

74. IWR (nt)

 

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:54 PM

75. From the NY Times on Hillary's war...

The fall of Col. Muammar
el-Qaddafi seemed to vindicate
Hillary Clinton. Then militias
refused to disarm, neighbors
fanned a civil war, and the
Islamic State found refuge.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/28/us/politics/libya-isis-hillary-clinton.html

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Response to Luminous Animal (Reply #75)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 06:58 PM

78. You're not proving your point.

I know you think you are, but you're not.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 08:26 PM

94. She supported/supports the policies

 

That led to the rise of isis. Fact.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #94)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 09:50 PM

95. Even Donald Trump doesn't make that claim~!

The comment is a stark departure from the left’s common understanding of the rise of ISIS, which even Donald Trump places at the feet of George W. Bush. If Sanders’ rant Wednesday night wasn’t a threat to eventual party unity, this might just be, and Jeff Weaver will probably find himself starring in a Republican campaign ad very soon.






LOL~! Way to show his behind to everyone--he's just killed Sanders' chance of "stealing" those super delegates~!

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Response to MADem (Reply #95)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:34 PM

129. Donald can't think that far ahead.

The connections are there. Iraq war vote. Libyan overthrow. Syria. Panama.

She's always been a neocon, and neocon policies gave rise to ISIS.

++1000 to Weaver for speaking a truth, and performing a public service.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:30 PM

98. She is partly responsible for ISIS.

Her foreign policy decisions helped create ISIS. It really can't be denied.

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Response to Live and Learn (Reply #98)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:32 PM

99. ...



To boldly go, where not even The Donald has gone before!

I'm sure Bernie is just thrilled with all this "help" from his acolytes!!!

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Response to MADem (Reply #99)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:00 PM

114. Actually, many of us said it long before Bernie. nt

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Response to Live and Learn (Reply #114)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:02 PM

115. Please KEEP saying it--you have no idea how much you're helping!

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Response to MADem (Reply #115)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:05 PM

118. Nothing wrong with saying it, most people acknowledge it as truth. nt

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Response to Live and Learn (Reply #118)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:06 PM

120. You spread that far and wide now!

You have no idea how much you're helping~!!

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:38 PM

101. That sticks. It's about judgement. She's hawkish. I don't want more wars.

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Response to snowy owl (Reply #101)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:07 PM

122. Well, you do know that BERNIE's AUMF vote is STILL BEING USED to justify war, don't you?

If you don't realize that, you might want to check some of the links in this thread.

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Response to MADem (Reply #122)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 03:32 AM

136. It would be nice if you people could see shades of gray.

The world must be pretty boring in black and white.

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Response to snowy owl (Reply #136)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 03:39 AM

139. Hmmm. That's a charge that could go both ways.

The "you people" is an especially telling touch--and not in a good way, either.

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Response to MADem (Reply #139)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 04:02 AM

140. Really? Would it have been better to say "you?"

Okay, you see things in black and white. Now, which of my posts can you claim shows black and white thinking?

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Response to snowy owl (Reply #140)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 04:28 AM

143. 'YOU PEOPLE' should be able to figure that out.... nt

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:39 PM

102. She deserves a small share of the blame. She VOTED FOR bush's war.

Millions of us progressives were screaming that this is exactly what would happen. She ignored that and went along with the neocon propaganda.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #102)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:47 PM

105. And Bernie voted for an open ended AUMF that is STILL being used TODAY as justification to

wage war.

Wow, you quite obviously don't even know what your guy voted for, do you?

The Authorization for Use of Military Force (AUMF), Pub. L. 107-40, codified at 115 Stat. 224 and passed as S.J.Res. 23 by the United States Congress on September 14, 2001, authorizes the use of United States Armed Forces against those responsible for the attacks on September 11, 2001. The authorization granted the President the authority to use all "necessary and appropriate force" against those whom he determined "planned, authorized, committed or aided" the September 11th attacks, or who harbored said persons or groups. The AUMF was signed by President George W. Bush on September 18, 2001. As of December 2015, the AUMF remains in effect and provides Congressional authorization for the use of force against ISIS and other Islamic militant groups.[1]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorization_for_Use_of_Military_Force_Against_Terrorists

In case you missed it the first time, let me reiterate:

...the AUMF remains in effect and provides Congressional authorization for the use of force against ISIS and other Islamic militant groups

Bernie voted FOR that. He voted for every war, from Sep 2001 forward. Not just one misadventure (for which she apologized) in Iraq.

But hey--you go on with your bad self! Without the AUMF, the IWR would never have been brought forward.

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Response to MADem (Reply #105)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:49 PM

106. "against those responsible for the attacks on September 11, 2001" Iraq didn't attack us, remember?


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Response to MADem (Reply #105)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:50 PM

107. "one misadventure" that's what you Hillary fanatics call Iraq. Pathetic. Off to ignore with you.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #107)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:55 PM

110. Hillary also called what we did in Iraq the "gift of freedom".

Funny what people are willing to defend in support of a candidate.

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Response to beam me up scottie (Reply #110)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:00 PM

113. But she did ....

Freedom from peace
Freedom from having to run their own country
And Freedom from living

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Response to TheFarS1de (Reply #113)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:04 PM

117. Don't you love the industrial strength spin that somehow Bernie is responsible for Iraq?

I don't think this thread went as planned so the op is doing damage control. By the time he's done Bernie will have personally given the orders to start bombing Baghdad.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #107)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:00 PM

112. Translation: Oh DARN--Sanders' vote IS still being used to justify war and I have no response to

that point.



Goodnight, Sweet Prince!



Oh, and one more time:

...the AUMF remains in effect and provides Congressional authorization for the use of force against ISIS and other Islamic militant groups

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:46 PM

104. One of Jeff's best here:

"I think if you look at her record and campaign, her campaign is funded by millions and millions of dollars

from Wall Street and other special interests. She’s made a deal with the devil, and we all know the devil wants his money in the end.

So that’s the kind of campaign she’s running. She supported the terrible trade deals which have devastated American manufacturing in the country.

She supported the war in Iraq. She continues to have a very, very hawkish foreign policy that has led to the rise and expansion of ISIS throughout the Middle East."


Yes,the devil WILL want his money.

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Response to wendylaroux (Reply #104)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:58 PM

111. I hope he keeps running his mouth! It's like he's got a backhoe, and he's digging

Bernie's grave with every idiotic comment he makes!!


Worst. Campaign. Manager. EVER!!


http://nymag.com/thecut/2016/04/bernie-sanders-hillary-clinton-tries-too-hard-ambitious.html

That theme was audible again earlier this week when Sanders campaign spokesperson Michael Briggs said testily of an April 14 debate in Brooklyn, the scheduling of which entailed the shifting of a planned Bernie rally, “We hope the debate will be worth the inconvenience for thousands of New Yorkers who … will have to change their schedules to accommodate Secretary Clinton’s jam-packed, high-dollar, coast-to-coast schedule of fundraisers all over the country.” The emphasis here was supposed to be on the high-priced fund-raising events Clinton is conducting around the country, events at which she’s collecting cash for her own campaign and for the Democratic Party for both big-picture party-building reasons and self-serving party-building reasons. But it was hard not to hear Briggs's sneering at the super-busy, transcontinental nature of her campaign commitments. It was derision that could have been dialog from an '80s backlash movie about a workaholic, shoulder-padded career woman, always on the road but empty inside, rather than about a woman who’s keeping a schedule that is entirely appropriate for a person on the verge of being the Democratic nominee for president.

And so, after days of these characterizations, Weaver’s glib association of Clinton’s ambition to win the nomination with a force destructive enough to ruin her party didn’t feel like a flub. It felt like he was the guy who gave away the bigger game.

As voters in big states, including New York, Pennsylvania, and California, get ready to cast their votes, the men managing Sanders’s campaign (though notably, so far, not Sanders himself) are offering up a vision of their formidable opponent — the one who’s so far won more states, more delegates, and 2 million more votes than their boss — that reads, seriously, like an old Onion article. You may remember it. It’s the one that’s headlined “Hillary Clinton Is Too Ambitious to Be the First Female President” and includes critiques like “She spends almost all her time these days going to fundraising events dedicated to raising money for—you guessed it—Hillary Clinton,” and “it just wouldn’t feel right to see someone who is so politically calculating win those precious 270 electoral votes in the next election,” and, of course, “she’s stayed in the race, blatantly ignoring the wishes of some people.”



Heckuvajob, Jeffy!!!!

He's like Karl Rove (Bush's brain) -- only he doesn't have the "brain" part to pull it off, and instead, he's humiliating his boss.

Wonder how big a paycheck he's taking? That's a devil right there--and he's no doubt GETTING his money. We'll find out just how much of those heartfelt twenty seven buck donations he, himself, pocketed, eventually.

He's TEXTBOOK when it comes to how to Crash and Burn in dramatic fashion!

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Response to MADem (Reply #111)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:04 PM

116. I'm glad the gloves are off now.See what these two have!

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:54 PM

108. The only idiots are the people who agreed with her that taking out Saddam was a good idea.



Bernie knew better, most of us liberals knew better, why didn't Hillary?

She sided with bush and helped start the war, the power vacuum led to the creation of ISIS. The 'you break it you own it' rule applies here.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 10:54 PM

109. Bernie's plan to deal with ISIS? Break up the big banks!

One size fits all!!

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Response to redstateblues (Reply #109)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:05 PM

119. Oh my god, I'm laughing myself silly, here!



Fix the infrastructure?

Break up those banks!!

Cure cancer?

Break up those BANKS!!

Improve AMTRAK?

Break up the banks!!!!


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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:24 PM

124. Hillary Clinton is essentially connected to the current state of the ME wars. Period.

Anyone who would deny that is a liar.

Hillary Clinton, already well connected and already considered by pundits to be a future POTUS, made a speech before she authorized George W. Bush's plan. She used George W. Bush's exact same words, exact same arguments, to justify her vote both before and after. She has never shown herself to be morally capable of understanding what she did.

Then she was made SoS and she destroyed Libya. That was her "friends of Libya" moment. She followed that with a "friends of Syria" moment that Obama has had to spend his entire second term desperately trying to dial back. And he succeeded. With Kerry he did succeed on several important fronts - that wouldn't have been possible if HRC had any hand in it at all.

She is far and away a Kaganesque parody of a neocon warmonger, responsible for probably more than a million deaths, many more millions of refugees. She's responsible for the terror of a family left behind who can't feed or nurture their loved ones, who don't have medical facilities because they've all been bombed and the pharmaceuticals put under interdiction, and the entire countries' electrical grid has been bombed into the stone age, and there is no secular social infrastructure left at all. She laughs and back slaps with Madeliene Albright, and I bet all the men women and children in the middle east just love Hillary Rodham Clinton, for liberating them.

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Response to delrem (Reply #124)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:28 PM

126. So's Bernie--his AUMF vote opened that door. nt

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Response to MADem (Reply #126)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 12:51 AM

135. No. That's not true. That's a flat out lie.

The vote to authorize the use of military force in Afghanistan was to take out bin Laden, not to forget about bin Laden and go about setting in motion a succession of "regime change" wars. It wasn't about opening a never ending war against the people of Afghanistan, for unknown objectives. It wasn't about expanding that insane war profiteering militancy against Libya, Syria, and wherever it can be unleashed across the Middle East.

That's on you and those like you who for whatever reasons promote it. It sure the fuck isn't on Bernie Sanders.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:32 PM

128. HA HA HA HA !! What a joke.



Keep on truckin'.

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Response to pangaia (Reply #128)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:54 PM

134. Please...after you! And do keep spreading the word!! nt

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:37 PM

131. I loves me some smell of Clinton supporter desperation in the morning.

Sanders takes New York an PA by double digits.

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Response to Fuddnik (Reply #131)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:45 PM

132. So glad you do--and you keep spreading the "good news" now--it'll help "the Bern" so much!

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Thu Apr 7, 2016, 11:51 PM

133. What an IDIOT Jeff Weaver is...

Talk amongst yourselves...

Seriously, talk amongst yourselves.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 03:35 AM

137. You mean She DIDN'T vote for the Iraq War?


I seem to remember Colin Powell saying some shit about "you break it, you buy it".

Who broke it?

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 04:10 AM

141. Shit Happens

Gene McCarthy, RFK and McGovern all voted for the Gulf of Tonkin Resolution. We didn't hold it against them 3 years later. Ellsberg was in country developing the Phoenix Program with Ed Lansdale. Anybody not gotten around to forgiving him for the Vietnamese he killed on his snatch and snuff missions?

I held Hillary accountable for the IWR in 2008. Taht was then. Do not mistake Libya for anything neocon. Hillary's not neocon, Obama's not neocon, even Bob Gates isn't neocon. He advised against the Libyan operation on purely conservative reasoning. Hillary was affected by Samantha Power. Power of course had condemned the Clintons for inaction in Rwanda. They formed a team to give protection to the rebels in Libya. Khadaffi, not exactly a humanitarian, had declared the rebels cockroaches that he intended to eradicate by any means necessary. Clinton did not want another Rwanda on her list of accomplishments. Clinton and Power sought to stop this massacre and prevailed. For that I applaud them. One of my reasons for being a Democrat is that in the 20th century Democratic presidents do not seek war but are not afraid to wage war when necessary.

Obama has played the long game with ISIS. They are losing ground and in Libya they can be contained and controlled. Were it not for the 22nd amendment Obama could see this campaign through to total victory. My faith is in Hilary to see it through.

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 04:30 AM

144. Well, she did vote for the war that spawned ISIS. nt

 

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Response to MADem (Original post)

Fri Apr 8, 2016, 09:23 AM

146. The destruction of Libya caused the majority of IS recruits to come from that area.

So yeah ................ she DOES deserve much of the blame. In pushing the Iraq invasion, she also helped to allow it to happen, which absolutely helped to spawn IS. War-hawks are super tough, right?? Look at the horrible suffering and even further danger for more they've left behind ... if they're so tough, they should be able to take a little honest criticism.

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