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Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:26 PM

Provisional Ballot Numbers Released in Maricopa County, Arizona

per this video:



and I will spare you the agony of listening to it.....

Total Provisional Ballots Cast: 24,639

Total deemed non-eligible 20,008

Total deemed eligible 4,631

So brothers and sisters of Maricopa County, if you cast a provisional ballot your chances that it was actually counted are roughly 1 in 5.



The only person of integrity involved in this Board of Supervisor's hearing was Steve Gallardo. Toward the end of the hearing he said that in good conscience he will not vote to certify the Maricopa County election results to which some Republican replied it was 'too soon' to draw that conclusion. All that moran could repeat was the usual, 'Nothing to see here, move along, we have to make sure this doesn't happen again, move along.....



47 replies, 4039 views

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Reply Provisional Ballot Numbers Released in Maricopa County, Arizona (Original post)
Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 OP
Wilms Mar 2016 #1
NWCorona Mar 2016 #10
Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #14
NWCorona Mar 2016 #16
CorporatistNation Mar 2016 #38
geek tragedy Mar 2016 #2
NWCorona Mar 2016 #11
Wilms Mar 2016 #13
NWCorona Mar 2016 #15
hellofromreddit Mar 2016 #17
geek tragedy Mar 2016 #18
hellofromreddit Mar 2016 #26
geek tragedy Mar 2016 #27
hellofromreddit Mar 2016 #28
geek tragedy Mar 2016 #29
hellofromreddit Mar 2016 #30
geek tragedy Mar 2016 #31
hellofromreddit Mar 2016 #32
geek tragedy Mar 2016 #33
hellofromreddit Mar 2016 #34
geek tragedy Mar 2016 #35
hellofromreddit Mar 2016 #36
geek tragedy Mar 2016 #37
mhatrw Mar 2016 #42
geek tragedy Mar 2016 #43
kristopher Mar 2016 #47
Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #3
lostnfound Mar 2016 #5
Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #8
jillan Mar 2016 #4
Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #6
Pisces Mar 2016 #7
Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #12
snowy owl Mar 2016 #9
Uncle Joe Mar 2016 #19
Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #21
blueintelligentsia Mar 2016 #20
riderinthestorm Mar 2016 #22
kgnu_fan Mar 2016 #23
blueintelligentsia Mar 2016 #24
Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #25
So Far From Heaven Mar 2016 #39
Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #40
Time for change Mar 2016 #41
Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #44
Time for change Mar 2016 #45
Vinca Mar 2016 #46

Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:31 PM

1. I wonder how many of the non-eligble provisional were a party affiliation issue.

 

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Response to Wilms (Reply #1)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:56 PM

10. That's the million dollar question!

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Response to NWCorona (Reply #10)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 08:04 PM

14. Steve Gallardo supports a revote on June 7.

It'll cost 'em though and would probably have to go through the courts.

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Response to Land of Enchantment (Reply #14)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 08:10 PM

16. I'm not a resident but I'd welcome that.

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Response to Wilms (Reply #1)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 11:31 PM

38. No Doubt 19-20K!

YES Election Fraud is the Way Forward in 21st century Amerika!

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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:33 PM

2. not everyone was eligible to vote in the primary.

 

registered independents, if they showed up and filled out a provisional ballot, would have had their provisional ballots ruled non-eligible

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #2)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:58 PM

11. This is true

Only time will tell what the actual percentage break down will be.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #2)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 08:00 PM

13. There are reports that party affiliations changed in the system.

 

The AZ SoS acknowledged that reporting it happened to one of her staff.

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Response to Wilms (Reply #13)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 08:06 PM

15. I posted a video of a lady who voted early and found out she'd been switched

She went down to the county office to see what was up.

It seems super easy to change things in the system.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #2)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 08:33 PM

17. The concern is that some eligible voters were marked as ineligible due to errors by the state

 

Arizona's closed primary system combined with obvious incompetence on the part of the state has disenfranchised thousands of voters. But even when things go smoothly closed primaries present new voters with an additional hurdle of dubious value.

Is the candidate to represent the electorate at large or just the party?

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Response to hellofromreddit (Reply #17)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 08:37 PM

18. sure, and that's why there were around 4-5,000 provisional ballots that were accepted

 

but voter error is a very real thing.

And--independents who tried to vote in the primary contributed to the vote suppression by clogging up the lines when they had no right to vote in the primary in the first place.

that doesn't let the state off the hook for their misfeasance and malfeasance, obviously, but it looks quite plausible that a lot of people tried to vote who simply weren't eligible to participate in a closed primary.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #18)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 09:37 PM

26. The same people who screwed up the vote now claim to have fixed it

 

It is no surprise that people are skeptical about the extremely high (~80%) number of rejected ballots.

If a very large number of people "who simply weren't eligible to participate in a closed primary" chose to participate, isn't that indicative of a problem with keeping the primary closed in the first place? After all, votes are to garner the opinion of a large number of people, and those people seem to want to vote.

There is no upside to having closed primaries, and they seem to substantially drive up voter error while also driving down participation.

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Response to hellofromreddit (Reply #26)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 09:40 PM

27. No, closed primaries are a good thing.

 

If you want to choose the leadership of the Democratic Party, join the Democratic Party.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #27)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 09:54 PM

28. OK, explain please

 

Why is if helpful to keep the primary closed?

The actual election will not be closed, so it would seem to me that closed primaries and general elections would tend to select different candidates. What's the use in that?

The open primaries seem to do no harm in the states that have them. Do we not wish to grow the party by letting more voters become invested in our candidates?

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Response to hellofromreddit (Reply #28)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 09:58 PM

29. do you want Republicans helping choose who our nominee is?

 

Open primaries are why the Republicans are stuck with Donald Trump.

it's pretty simple--Democrats should choose their own nominee. If someone turns their nose up at being a Democrat, then why should they help choose our leaders?

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #29)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 10:05 PM

30. Aren't they democrats by definition if they for for a democrat?

 

What is required to become a real democrat? Does filling out a form some arbitrary period in advance accurately reflect who is real and who is not?

People who vote in one party's primary don't get to also vote in the other one, so those who vote for a democrat don't get to vote for a republican. Unless the number of people strategically voting in the opposing primary gets ludicrously high I don't see a problem there.

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Response to hellofromreddit (Reply #30)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 10:11 PM

31. because Independents don't care about the health and success of the party.

 

they're not invested.

primaries choose all kinds of officials, and they choose delegates for state conventions who then set state party rules.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #31)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 10:23 PM

32. How can you determine that much based on party registration?

 

Because the difference on election day boils down to a mark on a form--no matter what the voter has or hasn't done up to that day. There is no evidence of correlation between forms and intent, but there is quite a lot of evidence of the opposite (eg. the AZ primary).

Your argument seems fear-driven. You are afraid that people you don't like might get a voice. That's not democracy--it's exclusion.

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Response to hellofromreddit (Reply #32)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 10:28 PM

33. There is a reason people decide to register as Independent. nt

 

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #33)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 10:33 PM

34. How does that justify shutting them out?

 

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Response to hellofromreddit (Reply #34)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 11:15 PM

35. They shut themselves out. Why not register as Democrats? nt

 

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #35)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 11:23 PM

36. That's not an honest argument. Why register as democrats?

 

What is required to become a real democrat? Does filling out a form some arbitrary period in advance accurately reflect who is real and who is not?

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Response to hellofromreddit (Reply #36)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 11:28 PM

37. All a person needs to do is call themselves a Democrat.

 

If someone refuses to call themselves a Democrat, then they are not a Democrat.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #37)

Thu Mar 31, 2016, 02:03 PM

42. Yeah, I have an idea. Let's alienate everyone who won't wear our party label!

That's a winning strategy for sure!

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Response to mhatrw (Reply #42)

Thu Mar 31, 2016, 02:07 PM

43. no need to alienate. we welcome them to join with open arms.

 

But, political parties are private organizations. They should be able to govern themselves.

they choose to exclude themselves, well if they exclude themselves then they don't get to govern us.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #27)

Thu Mar 31, 2016, 04:16 PM

47. AZ's primary is OPEN

And if you look for that information on the Arizona SecState's website that is exactly what it tells you - Arizona's primary is open and you can just show up and vote how you wish.

What they don't tell voters without doing a considerable amount of digging based on pre-existing knowledge, is that the presidential choice within the party's isn't a primary.

It's a form of deliberate voter suppression built into the voter information system.

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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:39 PM

3. 18,322.

they were listed as Independent, Libertarian or 'none.


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Response to Land of Enchantment (Reply #3)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:45 PM

5. Don't ignore reports of mishandled registrations or unexplained flipping

That's what worries me. Because taking away someone's right to vote is disgusting, unforgivable and un-American. When there are reports of unjustified denial of the right to vote -- and there have been MANY -- all people of goodwill need to take it seriously.

No matter who those voters support, if they followed the rules about being registered in the Democratic Party, and their registrations mysteriously flipped to independent through no fault of their own -- of which there have been numerous reports -- we as Americans ought to stand up for them and get to the bottom of it.

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Response to lostnfound (Reply #5)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:52 PM

8. They never directly addressed that--it was a short comment period for audience members, then a brief

presentation from an unidentified man from the Recorder's Office (Helen Purcell is the Recorder) and he presented all the numbers. He did mention there were 46 clerical errors and I think they resolved 26 of those. No mention of how the 'eligible' provisionals were attributed.

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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:43 PM

4. I wonder how many of those were unknown party which was a computer error!

This ain't over.

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Response to jillan (Reply #4)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:47 PM

6. Unknown Party was not mentioned. They did talk

about Service Arizona, illegible signatures, no signatures, PO boxes instead of addresses. At one point the guy from the Recorder's Office was strongly implying the voters were stoopid. It was truly condescending in 'tone'.


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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:49 PM

7. That's because many of those were Independents who wouldn't listen when they were

Told they were not eligible to vote like the lady standing behind me who thought she was right.

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Response to Pisces (Reply #7)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:59 PM

12. Oy Vey. No doubt, but a big part of that failing was the county blamed an election

held over a week earlier in Tempe. They were supposed to advertise the eligibility requirements much earlier (I think it was a little over a week) but waited because they did not want to 'confuse' the Tempe voters. BS in my opinion and they failed miserably to use the funds allocated to educate the voting public in time for the primary. They got reamed for that in Monday's hearings. To me, it more voter suppression by the Recorder's Office.


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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:55 PM

9. Another Fraudulent election - Disgusting

When will the People rise up and demand The Rule of Law return the this "exceptional" country?

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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 08:42 PM

19. Has anyone seen or heard whether the national corporate media conglomerates have covered

the massive voter suppression that took place in Arizona yet?

Thanks for the thread, Land of Enchantment.

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Response to Uncle Joe (Reply #19)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 09:05 PM

21. My pleasure, Uncle Joe. Nope, nothing on the MSM and I'm not expecting to see anything until

it hits the courts on a 'revote'. It could happen.



`

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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 09:04 PM

20. This confirms they need to do a recount or have an extra day of voting...n/t

 

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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 09:08 PM

22. K and R! Very eye opening. Nobody should be disenfranchised nt

 

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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 09:10 PM

23. kick

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Response to blueintelligentsia (Reply #24)

Wed Mar 30, 2016, 09:25 PM

25. Nice. Thanks for adding the petition

I signed it too!


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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Thu Mar 31, 2016, 02:12 AM

39. Is this from registration flipping, or

some sort of voter registration purge?

It's important which one it is, though the result is the same.

Why? If Bernie is close to defeating Clinton or beating Clinton by a small margin, a loss even this small will throw the result. If this is widespread, there is the thought that this may be a concentrated effort to skew the primaries to a particular candidate.

The question is "Who's behind it?"

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Response to So Far From Heaven (Reply #39)

Thu Mar 31, 2016, 11:46 AM

40. 18,322 of the 20,008 were the result of registration flipping. The Recorder's Office

reported they checked up to three times on each provisional ballot (probably against the same faulty database) even thought people had copies of their 'old' cards. When the county 'updated' their records they said they sent out new cards to everyone. Many members of the audience disagreed saying they never received them.

They gave no breakdown of the 18,322 other than to say they were not registered at all (purged?), or they were registered as Republican, Libertarian or Independent.

Something IS rotten in Denmark.


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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Thu Mar 31, 2016, 12:30 PM

41. They're only counting provisional ballots if they can prove by looking through their own database

that the voter was a longtime Dem.

No matter that these voters presented valid Democratic registration cards at the polls.

The purpose of this whole fiasco is to eliminate Bernie voters. He was targeted in this effort.

Please see investigation that provides good evidence for that statement:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511607229

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Response to Time for change (Reply #41)

Thu Mar 31, 2016, 03:01 PM

44. Thanks for the link. I did read an earlier version

where Anonymous was going to look into it but missed your OP. I've had a bad gut feeling about all the voters' affiliations being flipped and for me it all goes back to last fall. Remember in December when Bernie had to sue the DNC to regain access to his OWN voters' data? At the time Jeff stated they had been breached months ago and had asked for an investigation into that breach. Nothing has come of that (that I can find). My sense is that there are probably several hacks going on by various groups. I can't accuse anyone specifically because there is no proof--only circumstantial evidence that it has disenfranchised only Bernie's voters.


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Response to Land of Enchantment (Reply #44)

Thu Mar 31, 2016, 04:09 PM

45. I think that the fact that they could find 113 disenfranchised Bernie voters and only 2

disenfranchised Hillary voters says it all. There is a systematic effort going on in several states to manipulate the election so that Bernie doesn't get the nomination. This is outrageous. He is struggling against enormous odds, but if this was a fair election he would win the nomination easily. Just my opinion.

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Response to Land of Enchantment (Original post)

Thu Mar 31, 2016, 04:13 PM

46. This is just a warm up for the general election.

Hillary people currently find it amusing. They won't in November.

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