Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,705 posts)
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 04:50 PM Mar 2016

Just when you thought it couldn't get worse. Horrific and telling. -H

Hillary Clinton ?@HillaryClinton 2h2 hours ago
Hillary Clinton Retweeted Ali Vitali
Just when you thought it couldn't get worse. Horrific and telling. -H




Ali VitaliVerified account
?@alivitali
NEW Trump to @msnbc: "there has to be some form of punishment" for women who have abortions but he has yet to determine what that should be.
40 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Just when you thought it couldn't get worse. Horrific and telling. -H (Original Post) DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2016 OP
It is almost as if Trump doesn't want to win, realizes he might, and knows a surefire way to lose. Jackie Wilson Said Mar 2016 #1
either that is is just so reckless and erratic that he's per se geek tragedy Mar 2016 #2
Something seems reeeeally weird about this whole Trump phenomena. Arugula Latte Mar 2016 #5
Now THAT is the BEST analogy I have EVER heard! Jackie Wilson Said Mar 2016 #8
Why thank you! Arugula Latte Mar 2016 #9
Very funny, passing it along, thanks! Jackie Wilson Said Mar 2016 #15
This needs to be it's own post felix_numinous Mar 2016 #37
I think he thinks he can say anything and his supporters won't care. redstatebluegirl Mar 2016 #27
Well, if Hillary hadn't said she would be willing to compromise on abortion TheDormouse Mar 2016 #3
She was talking about third trimester abortion which is already subject to restrictions, per SCOTUS DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2016 #4
She was saying she's open to more new restrictions, though. Arugula Latte Mar 2016 #7
It was based on the premise that no nation allows unrestricted third trimester abortions. DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2016 #13
It's sad a post which should be about Trump morphs to this. joshcryer Mar 2016 #21
the OP was about HILLARY's response to Trump TheDormouse Mar 2016 #23
There is a ginormous (sic) difference DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2016 #25
DSB quickesst Mar 2016 #28
Amazing how in every issue mcar Mar 2016 #33
"health of woman" is typical language. joshcryer Mar 2016 #20
That's actually supporting existing law KingFlorez Mar 2016 #11
How did we go from Trump criminalizing all abortions to a discussion of third trimester abortions? DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2016 #16
Because it seems people want to attack Clinton instead of Trump KingFlorez Mar 2016 #17
Sadly... DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2016 #18
I don't believe there are... tonedevil Mar 2016 #26
You can't honestly think she believes people should be punished for having abortions. N/t gollygee Mar 2016 #14
It would be odd for somebody endorsed by NARAL and has a 100% NARAL rating DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2016 #19
This is one of the MANY reasons I may not be able to hold my nose. IdaBriggs Mar 2016 #24
I don't believe there is language in the Democratic platform DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2016 #31
"Strongly and unequivocally support Roe v. Wade" IdaBriggs Mar 2016 #34
Did or did not the Supreme Court place restrictions on third term abortions? DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2016 #35
Are we discussing Trump or Hillary? Trump sucks. IdaBriggs Mar 2016 #38
We are moving the goal posts. DemocratSinceBirth Mar 2016 #39
"We oppose any and all efforts to weaken or undermine that right." - Dem Platform IdaBriggs Mar 2016 #40
Trump is going to lose by double digits. joshcryer Mar 2016 #6
Proof he's determined to win the Primary, he's speaking to his base, his party, his suporters AuntPatsy Mar 2016 #10
The man is insane...especially about women workinclasszero Mar 2016 #12
Thank you! Hadn't seen it before! Lucinda Mar 2016 #30
Show it to everybody you know workinclasszero Mar 2016 #36
I have thought for a long time that sadoldgirl Mar 2016 #22
Trump enablers of the unicorn left are ignoring the danger. n/t cosmicone Mar 2016 #29
... mcar Mar 2016 #32
 

Arugula Latte

(50,566 posts)
5. Something seems reeeeally weird about this whole Trump phenomena.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:05 PM
Mar 2016

I can't help but think there's something major we don't know, because it really does seem like a political version of "The Producers."

 

Arugula Latte

(50,566 posts)
9. Why thank you!
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:08 PM
Mar 2016


I wish I could take sole credit for the thought. If you get a chance to watch the video, it's really spot on and entertaining.

redstatebluegirl

(12,264 posts)
27. I think he thinks he can say anything and his supporters won't care.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:37 PM
Mar 2016

It will buy him another day of free publicity on the networks including MSNBC and CNN.

TheDormouse

(1,168 posts)
3. Well, if Hillary hadn't said she would be willing to compromise on abortion
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:01 PM
Mar 2016

to get things done, I'd be more inclined to take her tweet at face value.

Instead, quite frankly, I can't tell when it is that she is pandering vs when she is being honest.



CHUCK TODD: Are there reasonable restrictions that you would ever support on abortion?

HILLARY CLINTON: I've said that there were.

CHUCK TODD: What are they?

HILLARY CLINTON: And that's under Roe v. Wade, that there can be restrictions in the very end of, you know, the third trimester. But they have to take into account the life and health of the mother.

I remember in '96, Chuck, my husband vetoed a very restrictive legislation on late-term abortions. And he vetoed it at an event in the White House where we invited a lot of women who had faced this very difficult decision that ought to be made based on their own conscience, their family, their faith, in consultation with doctors. Those stories left a searing impression on me. You know, women who think their pregnancy is going well and then wake up and find some really terrible problem, women whose life is threatened themselves if they carry their child to term, and women who are told by doctors that the child they're carrying will not survive.

And so, you know, again, I am where I have been, which is that, you know, if there is a way to structure some kind of constitutional restrictions that take into account the life of the mother and her health, then I'm open to that. But I have yet to see the Republicans willing to actually do that. And that would be an area, where if they included health, you could see constitutional actions.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511552065

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,705 posts)
4. She was talking about third trimester abortion which is already subject to restrictions, per SCOTUS
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:05 PM
Mar 2016

There isn't one nation in the world that allows unrestricted third trimester abortions.

 

Arugula Latte

(50,566 posts)
7. She was saying she's open to more new restrictions, though.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:06 PM
Mar 2016

Why even go there? Sadly, this kind of thing is SOP for her.

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,705 posts)
13. It was based on the premise that no nation allows unrestricted third trimester abortions.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:11 PM
Mar 2016

It was based on the premise that SCOTUS provided a framework for when abortion is allowed in Roe V Wade and the Supreme Court has ruled there is no unrestricted right to third trimester abortions.

It is telling we are parsing Hillary Clinton's words when this thread is about Trump punishing women who have an abortion at any time during the gestation period.

TheDormouse

(1,168 posts)
23. the OP was about HILLARY's response to Trump
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:28 PM
Mar 2016

So commenting on Hillary's positions is totally germane.

This discussion isn't just about Trump. If it is supposed to be, then it's in the wrong forum.

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,705 posts)
25. There is a ginormous (sic) difference
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:34 PM
Mar 2016

There is a ginormous (sic) difference between criminalizing all abortions and discussing the conditions where third trimester abortions should be legal.

Third trimester abortions are so rare and tricky I don't even know how one decides when they should and should not be allowed. Roe V Wade was set up so that as the woman went further in her pregnancy the greater the state's interest was. That is basically how every liberal democracy deals with the issue.


I doubt Trump ever thought this through.

quickesst

(6,280 posts)
28. DSB
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:48 PM
Mar 2016

They just can't keep themselves from widening the divide even further. I don't know how that's possible, but some will find a way.

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
20. "health of woman" is typical language.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:25 PM
Mar 2016

Since pregnancy is literally a parasitic relationship between the zygote and host. You actually want laws that say that.

But viability has always been a core concept of Roe v Wade.

KingFlorez

(12,689 posts)
11. That's actually supporting existing law
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:10 PM
Mar 2016

I don't know anyone who supports third trimester abortions outside of the health of the mother.

 

tonedevil

(3,022 posts)
26. I don't believe there are...
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:34 PM
Mar 2016

seekers of third trimester abortions outside of the health of the mother. Are we truly to believe that a person, woman for this example as men don't get pregnant, who will go through 6 months or more of pregnancy and then decide that maybe this isn't the right choice for my lifestyle? That would be a person who really needs emotional/mental help not a law.

 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
24. This is one of the MANY reasons I may not be able to hold my nose.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:28 PM
Mar 2016

She gave an ADMINISTRATIVE answer. She is currently a CANDIDATE.

The Democratic Platform is pretty damn clear: NO.

I don't want what looks like weasel pandering and equivocation to appeal to REPUBLICAN voters because that means she is misleading one set of supporters.

The answer is NO. No ifs, ands or buts. NO.

Here is an example of how easy it is to use the word NO --

Question: "Do you support a return of property illegally taken from southern slave owners during the Civil War?" (clear reference to slavery)

Correct Answer: NO, and that is a DUMBASS QUESTION to be asking in this day and age!

Hillary Answer: "If there is a way to structure some kind of constitutional..."


Of course, when asked if she thought New York should recognize gay marriage, she sure popped out a pretty fast "NO!" then, didn't she?

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,705 posts)
31. I don't believe there is language in the Democratic platform
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:56 PM
Mar 2016

I don't believe there is language in the Democratic platform that allows an unrestricted right to third trimester abortions.

 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
34. "Strongly and unequivocally support Roe v. Wade"
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 06:04 PM
Mar 2016
http://ontheissues.org/Celeb/Democratic_Party_Abortion.htm

The Democratic Party strongly and unequivocally supports Roe v. Wade and a woman's right to make decisions regarding her pregnancy, including a safe and legal abortion, regardless of ability to pay. We oppose any and all efforts to weaken or undermine that right. Abortion is an intensely personal decision between a woman, her family, her doctor, and her clergy; there is no place for politicians or government to get in the way. We also recognize that health care and education help reduce the number of unintended pregnancies and thereby also reduce the need for abortions. We strongly and unequivocally support a woman's decision to have a child by providing affordable health care and ensuring the availability of and access to programs that help women during pregnancy and after the birth of a child, including caring adoption programs.

Source: 2012 Democratic Party Platform , Sep 4, 2012


That seems like a pretty damn clear platform to me - no weaseling about first, second or third trimester, no attempts to tell doctors how to do their jobs of protecting their patients health, and not one mention of "constitutional amendments" to change established law about women's reproductive health issues. It hasn't changed in years.

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,705 posts)
35. Did or did not the Supreme Court place restrictions on third term abortions?
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 06:16 PM
Mar 2016

Did or did not the Supreme Court in Roe V Wade place restrictions on third term abortions, and leave those restrictions up to the individual states?

If you believe there is no difference between Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton there is nothing a random internet poster can do to disabuse you of that notion.

 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
38. Are we discussing Trump or Hillary? Trump sucks.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:07 PM
Mar 2016

Hillary is NOT abiding by the Very Clear Language of the Democratic Platform, and thus this *DEMOCRAT* has concerns about her commitment to the principals of that platform.

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,705 posts)
39. We are moving the goal posts.
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:14 PM
Mar 2016

The Democratic party and I stand by the holding of Roe V Wade but Roe left it to the states to place restrictions on third trimester abortions.

The whole decision is based on the notion that the further along in the pregnancy the greater the interest of the state. It is a careful weighing of the rights of the woman versus the viability of the fetus. There is nothing in Hillary Clinton's comments that put are at odds with the decision.

 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
40. "We oppose any and all efforts to weaken or undermine that right." - Dem Platform
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 07:19 PM
Mar 2016

HILLARY: "if there is a way to structure some kind of constitutional restrictions that take into account the life of the mother and her health, then I'm open to that."

That isn't a goal post - that is an entirely new ball game. And for me, it is a non-negotiable deal breaker.

AuntPatsy

(9,904 posts)
10. Proof he's determined to win the Primary, he's speaking to his base, his party, his suporters
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:10 PM
Mar 2016

It's what most love to hear,

sadoldgirl

(3,431 posts)
22. I have thought for a long time that
Wed Mar 30, 2016, 05:26 PM
Mar 2016

the Dumpster really does not want the job.

He would be laughing loud though, if he
could accomplish killing the repug's party.

That kind of thing is much more in his
line of "You are fired". What he did not
count on is the idiocy of that party's voters.

Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»Just when you thought it ...