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Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:19 PM

Who Would Paul Wellstone Vote For?

Who represents the heart and soul of the Democratic Party? Hillary or Bernie?

Are Rahm Emmanuel and DWS the future of the Democratic Party? Is that that we are fighting for?

Help me understand why you are voting for Hillary. Do you believe endless war in the Middle East will bring world peace? Are corporate contributions the key to progressive change? Will Hillary attract Independent voters who lean Dem? Will Hillary govern as a Third Way Dem or will she side with the Progressive Caucus?


64 replies, 2452 views

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Arrow 64 replies Author Time Post
Reply Who Would Paul Wellstone Vote For? (Original post)
Meteor Man Mar 2016 OP
bravenak Mar 2016 #1
Peace Patriot Mar 2016 #3
msanthrope Mar 2016 #8
LisaM Mar 2016 #26
senz Mar 2016 #50
senz Mar 2016 #41
BainsBane Mar 2016 #2
Jitter65 Mar 2016 #4
Peace Patriot Mar 2016 #5
senz Mar 2016 #42
Armstead Mar 2016 #9
BillZBubb Mar 2016 #27
senz Mar 2016 #43
senz Mar 2016 #40
dubyadiprecession Mar 2016 #6
Armstead Mar 2016 #10
BillZBubb Mar 2016 #28
msanthrope Mar 2016 #7
Mnpaul Mar 2016 #12
DrDan Mar 2016 #21
Mnpaul Mar 2016 #25
DrDan Mar 2016 #34
dflprincess Mar 2016 #59
senz Mar 2016 #45
auntpurl Mar 2016 #11
Meteor Man Mar 2016 #13
auntpurl Mar 2016 #16
Meteor Man Mar 2016 #17
auntpurl Mar 2016 #18
Meteor Man Mar 2016 #63
Mnpaul Mar 2016 #33
senz Mar 2016 #47
revbones Mar 2016 #32
senz Mar 2016 #48
dflprincess Mar 2016 #57
MineralMan Mar 2016 #14
senz Mar 2016 #49
Peace Patriot Mar 2016 #15
SheenaR Mar 2016 #22
Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #29
BillZBubb Mar 2016 #30
SamKnause Mar 2016 #35
AtomicKitten Mar 2016 #36
senz Mar 2016 #53
Meteor Man Mar 2016 #19
Meteor Man Mar 2016 #23
WhaTHellsgoingonhere Mar 2016 #20
Paulie Mar 2016 #24
dlwickham Mar 2016 #31
senz Mar 2016 #56
Peacetrain Mar 2016 #37
lunamagica Mar 2016 #38
calguy Mar 2016 #39
HereSince1628 Mar 2016 #44
DanTex Mar 2016 #46
Desert805 Mar 2016 #51
DanTex Mar 2016 #52
Desert805 Mar 2016 #54
senz Mar 2016 #55
Agschmid Mar 2016 #60
senz Mar 2016 #58
senz Mar 2016 #61
bigwillq Mar 2016 #62
DemocraticWing Mar 2016 #64

Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:28 PM

1. More seances

 

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Response to bravenak (Reply #1)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:30 PM

3. Thanks for the kick for these important questions!

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Response to Peace Patriot (Reply #3)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:46 PM

8. It makes a nice change from the ransom notes OPs. nt

 

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #8)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:46 PM

26. Ha ha ha

I just burst out laughing.

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #8)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:23 PM

50. “I don’t represent the big oil companies, the big pharmaceuticals, or the big insurance industry."

 

Paul Wellstone shortly before his plane mysteriously crashed.

http://inthesetimes.com/article/14009/paul_wellstones_legacy

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Response to Peace Patriot (Reply #3)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:08 PM

41. Wellstone was pro-union, pro-campaign finance reform.

 

And it wasn't just empty campaign rhetoric. He meant it.

He was the opposite of Hillary Clinton.

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:30 PM

2. Clinton, Wellstone was a Democrat, true blue

He'd support Clinton, just like the rest of the party has done. Wellstone got things done. He didn't believe speeches were more important than improving people's lives.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:32 PM

4. And he had one really telling encounter with Sanders. nt

 

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:33 PM

5. Speeches to Goldman Sachs for $225,000 are absolutely more important than...

...peoples' lives--to those raking in the filthy lucre.

Paul Wellstone would be appalled.

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Response to Peace Patriot (Reply #5)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:09 PM

42. Paul Wellstone WOULD be appalled.

 

She is the opposite of him in every way.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:46 PM

9. Oh Puleeeeze...I Wellstone were alive today and were running against Clinton...

 

He'd be demonized in exactly the same Sanders is

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Response to Armstead (Reply #9)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:47 PM

27. Exactly.

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Response to Armstead (Reply #9)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:10 PM

43. Of course he would be demonized. Of course!

 

He'd be called naive, socialist, unicorn-promising, the whole bit.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:02 PM

40. Wellstone was not a 3rd Way sellout. He didn't run with Goldman Sachs.

 

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:42 PM

6. Wellstone would probably vote for Hillary, just like Al Franken is planning to do.

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Response to dubyadiprecession (Reply #6)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:47 PM

10. Not so sure...Wellstone was many times more of a Sanders progressive than Franken

 

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Response to dubyadiprecession (Reply #6)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:48 PM

28. Nope. Wellstone was a progressive. Franken has always been a moderate Democrat.

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:44 PM

7. Hillary. Wellstone was a Democrat. nt

 

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #7)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:51 PM

12. No, Wellstone was not a Democrat

He was a member of the Democratic Farmer Labor Party or DFL for short.

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Response to Mnpaul (Reply #12)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:22 PM

21. which is affiliated with the Democratic Party

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Response to DrDan (Reply #21)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:45 PM

25. But we do it better

Voter ID went down in flames and constitution amendment against gay marriage blew up in the Republican's faces. Voters came out, voted against it and the Republicans who proposed it and the DFL took control and legalized gay marriage.

We are always near or at the top in voter turnout.

We made every effort to count every legal vote in Franken vs Coleman.

Now today the House Republicans caved and allowed for two separate bills to pass and extend unemployment benefits to laid off iron workers(with backpay) and cut unemployment taxes for business. The federal government has decided that our unemployment fund is adequately funded for the first time ever. Previously, the Repubs had tied the two together. Now both can go forward separately and should pass as we have a good size surplus in the budget.

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Response to Mnpaul (Reply #25)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:55 PM

34. not surprised - you are able to focus on more "local" issues and actually make significant progress

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Response to DrDan (Reply #21)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:38 PM

59. And there was a time when the Democratic Farmer Labor party

enjoyed being a thorn in the side of the DNC. I miss those days.

One of the things the DNC has always hated is the name - every so often there is noise made about how we should change it. Sometimes I worry that the Third Way types currently running the state party will try to push that but I keep hoping it won't fly with the rank and file.

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #7)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:11 PM

45. Wellstone stood for something. And it wasn't Goldman Sachs.

 

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:47 PM

11. I believe Paul Wellstone was a Democratic loyalist

and as the vast majority of the Democratic congressmen and women have endorse Hillary, I think it's likely Wellstone would have endorsed and voted for Hillary.

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Response to auntpurl (Reply #11)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:51 PM

13. Democratic Loyalist?

I belive you are channeling Paul Wellstone's evil twin Skippy Wellstone.

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Response to Meteor Man (Reply #13)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:58 PM

16. He was always a Democrat.

I don't understand your post.

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Response to auntpurl (Reply #16)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:14 PM

17. Advance to Wiki

Do not pass GO. Do not collect $200.

[link:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Wellstone|

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Response to Meteor Man (Reply #17)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:16 PM

18. Lemme shoot another link right back atcha

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_Democratic%E2%80%93Farmer%E2%80%93Labor_Party

Relevant info: "National affiliation: Democratic Party"

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Response to auntpurl (Reply #18)

Fri Mar 25, 2016, 01:28 AM

63. DFL-Democrartic Farmer Labor Party

Ideology: Social Liberalism.

Your point being?

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Response to Meteor Man (Reply #17)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:53 PM

33. I like this part

Wellstone gained national attention after his upset victory over Republican incumbent Rudy Boschwitz in the 1990 US Senate election. Widely considered an underdog and outspent by a 7-to-1 margin, he was the only Democratic candidate to defeat a Republican senator in the 1990 election cycle. In his 1996 reelection campaign he defeated Boschwitz in a rematch. He won both senate elections with a majority of the popular vote.


and this:

As Senator, Wellstone authored the Wellstone Amendment for the Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act of 2002. His efforts toward campaign finance reform were posthumously overturned in 2010 by the U.S. Supreme Court in Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission. In 2002, he was the only Senator facing reelection to vote against the congressional authorization for the Iraq War.

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Response to auntpurl (Reply #16)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:15 PM

47. He was an FDR Democrat, not a Third Way/DLC Democrat.

 

Yuuge difference.

And you know it.

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Response to auntpurl (Reply #11)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:53 PM

32. OMG! You really said that????

 

Paul Wellstone was not one for team or identity politics. He saw past the D at the end of people's names and called them out on their crap.

I find it disgusting that people would malign him with such.

Here are some telling Wellstone quotes:

"The Democratic Party has lost much of it credibility with working class and low-income people. It retards progress toward presenting a genuine alternative."

"The American polity is infected with a serious imbalance of power between elites and masses, a power which is the principal threat to our democracy."

And the one Howard Dean stole from him: "I represent the Democratic wing of the Democratic party."


The whole loyalist thing disgusts me. It supposes that everything is ok if they just have a 'D' after their name and I find this appalling. I see a lot of this from Hillary followers and that is what causes a lot of the 'cult of personality' insults from others. The D should stand for something besides just your team.

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Response to revbones (Reply #32)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:17 PM

48. Exactly! He knew what Al From and Bill Clinton did to the Democratic Party

 

and he didn't like it one bit.

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Response to auntpurl (Reply #11)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:35 PM

57. Wellstone was more Farmer-Laborite than Democratic.

The state party does its best to deny it, but there are a lot people in the party that prefer to identify with the FL and not the D.

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:52 PM

14. The Democratic nominee, that's who.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #14)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:17 PM

49. The true progesssive nominee, that's who. He was no 3rd Way Dem.

 

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 06:52 PM

15. Paul Wellstone would have been doing what Bernie Sanders is doing now...

...had Wellstone's health permitted it and had he not been killed. When his small plane fell out of the sky on a clear day with no wind, he was running for Senate re-election and his goal was to return to the Senate and lead the battle against the Bush junta's goddamn bloodbath in Iraq.

He was an ALLY of Bernie Sanders in their difficult campaign to stop this horrible war. And he was a true-blue New Deal leftist like Sanders.

If he was here now and could do it, Wellstone would be running against Clinton, as Sanders is doing, because of her vote FOR the Iraq War and her enthusiastic support of it, and because she ISN'T a true-blue leftist--she is exactly the opposite. OR Wellstone would be supporting Sanders in his effort.

He OPPOSED all the cowardly Democrats who voted for that war! He would oppose Clinton now, and would probably be sickened by her filthy fundraising (and delighted with Sanders' success at CLEAN, people-oriented, small donor fundraising).

And, let me tell you, Wellstone would also be sickened by Henry Kissinger and Robert Kagan (PNAC chief) being her foreign policy advisers (gawd!), and would be appalled at her use of the Sec of State's office to lure big bucks to the Clinton Foundation from tyrants like the Saudis in exchange for arms deals!

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Response to Peace Patriot (Reply #15)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:26 PM

22. Amen

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Response to Peace Patriot (Reply #15)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:49 PM

29. Amen II. nt, you said it all.


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Response to Peace Patriot (Reply #15)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:51 PM

30. Yes, Wellstone probably would be running for President AGAINST Hillary.

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Response to Peace Patriot (Reply #15)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 08:04 PM

35. ...

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Response to Peace Patriot (Reply #15)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 08:05 PM

36. Hear! Hear!

 

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Response to Peace Patriot (Reply #15)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:27 PM

53. Paul Wellstone cast his last vote AGAINST the Iraq War Resolution.

 

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:16 PM

19. Who would Camille Paglia vote for?

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Response to Meteor Man (Reply #19)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:27 PM

23. Sounds Like Wellstone

Camille Paglia, long story short:

A vote for Bernie Sanders is a vote for the future, while a vote for Hillary Clinton is a reward to the Democratic National Committee for its shameless manipulation and racketeering.

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:19 PM

20. That's the question I've been wanting to ask but I know the answers are

 

Fear
Gender
Third Way

But when they say it, it sounds like "experience."

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:28 PM

24. I met Paul Wellstone (along with Jim Hightower and Dr. Quentin Young) in Chicago in 1998

At an event hosted by "In These Times". I was attending as a member of DSA Chicago. I still have my Wellstone for President bumper stickers from when we were trying to draft him.


Back to Basics: A Conference on the Future of the American Left

by Harold Taggart and Gene Birmingham

"To explore how we (the Left) can increase our presence in the mainstream of American political and intellectual life" was the way James Weinstein, editor of In These Times magazine, stated the purpose of the "Back to Basics Conference". The conference was held Oct. 9-11, at Chicago's Congress Hotel. Several hundred people attended the conference, which In These Times magazine sponsored and managed. In practice the conference urged the Left to abandon its dead-end, self-destructive course toward cultural politics and return to class politics.

Guests, speakers and panelists included a wide variety of stellar figures of the Left. Syndicated talk show host, Jim Hightower, was emcee for the Friday evening (Oct. 9) plenary session, and typified the tone of the conference. Sandwiched in among his hilarious down-home Texas jokes were serious calls to fight predatory corporations and embrace Joe six-pack.

Minnesota Senator Paul Wellstone, the Left's primary preference for president in the 2000 election, key-noted the conference with an emphasis on the Left's need to join the middle and lower economic segments of society in a common effort for reform if needed changes are to be made in the electoral process. As opposed to the Republican's equating of morality with sex, he defined morality in terms of a living wage, affordable health care, quality education, adequate nutrition for all children and curbing domestic violence, all of which are true family values. Republicans cloak greed and selfishness behind the mantle of "individual opportunity". Wellstone wants us to campaign for education, health care and jobs, saying, "We all do better when we all do better".

At the Oct. 10 plenary, Dr. Quentin Young described the sick U.S. health care system, which costs $4,000 per person. Canadians pay half as much for universal care, better care, and a life span two years longer than ours. The HMOs, PPOs, etc., represent capitalism in its purest state: profits have priority over patients.

Environmentalist Barbara Dudley emphasized a need repeated by others, that the Left has to reach out to the beer and pretzels working majority in America. Rather than viewing the struggle as Left vs. Right, she called us to see it as top vs. bottom, with the largest group in the middle, where our focus should be. Pointing out that most Leftists are past age 40, the need to enlist youth is obvious. No one expected Marx's prediction of capitalism's collapse to occur. In fact, very few mentioned his name at all.

Joel Rogers, founder of The New Party, listed people's concerns: education, campaign finance reform, environment, raising the minimum wage, and concern about global capitalism. Neither Democrats nor Republicans take this list seriously. Liberalism relied on favorable government regulation and mass politics to deal with problems. A new time calls for new politics, emphasizing economic strategy, citizen participation, and electoral strategy.


http://www.chicagodsa.org/ngarchive/ng61.html

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 07:52 PM

31. if you get a hold of him, can you ask him for Saturday's lotto numbers while you're at it

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Response to dlwickham (Reply #31)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:33 PM

56. You disrespect one of the best progressive Democrats of this century?

 

Very Hillary. Very.

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 08:10 PM

37. I met Wellstone more than once.. was there when he first started out

and he would be doing the same thing E. Warren is doing.. and he was a DFL Democrat..

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 08:22 PM

38. Sierra Blanca, Bernie Sanders, Paul Wellstone, a Poor Minority Community and a Nuclear Waste Dump

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 08:59 PM

39. Now the BSers talking to the dead

And of course, in a BSer's dream world of fantasy, all dead Democrats would vote for Bernie. I understand a true BSer has to BS. But let's not speak dead politicians. It just gives such a foul odor to your gibberish.

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:11 PM

44. Wellstone would likely be a strong ally in turning the campaign into the movement.

We need Wellstone buses working all across the nation to cultivate local organizations and new politicians with that sort of workshops

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:12 PM

46. Hillary. nt

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Response to DanTex (Reply #46)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:23 PM

51. Is that comedy intentional

or unintentional?

Because it's certainly a joke, lol.

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Response to Desert805 (Reply #51)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:27 PM

52. 300 delegate lead. No Senate endorsements for B. Enjoy your stay.

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Response to DanTex (Reply #52)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:29 PM

54. Been hanging out here almost since day 1, and I've enjoyed it very much

thanks.


Did you think you were sending me somewhere? Again with the jokes!



***edit to add-- PW voting for Hillary? ROFLCOPTERS TAKE FLIGHT!!1

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Response to DanTex (Reply #52)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:31 PM

55. How empty.

 

We're talking about something of substance here, not your empty little scorecard.

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Response to senz (Reply #55)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:41 PM

60. No you are not talking about something of substance...

You are all making baseless assumptions about how someone who tragically passed away would have voted.

No substance at all, just pure guesswork.

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 09:37 PM

58. On this thread the Hill supporters come in loud and clear.

 

Here you can see them exactly for what they are.

Be advised.

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 10:14 PM

61. Some strong parallels between Paul Wellstone and Bernie Sanders.

 

Paul Wellstone’s Legacy -- In These Times, 10-12-12

Shortly before he died in a plane crash on October 25, 2002, Paul Wellstone explained why he was in the Senate: “I don’t represent the big oil companies, the big pharmaceuticals, or the big insurance industry. They already have great representation in Washington. It’s the rest of the people that need representation.”


He cast his last vote against the Iraq War Resolution.

His parents were Ukrainian Jewish immigrants and he was criticized for not being religious.


He had set the standard for what Jeff Blodgett, Wellstone’s campaign manager in his three Senate races, calls “conviction politics.” “Paul based his political leadership and career on the idea [that] you say that you believe, you believe what you say, you put that out there for voters,” explained Blodgett.


When the Democrats were in the majority in 1993–1994, Wellstone pushed for a Canadian-style single-payer healthcare system, in contrast to President Bill Clinton’s more modest reform proposal.


He opposed NAFTA in 1993.

He fought for campaign finance reform.


He was the only Senate Democrat to oppose his party’s version of lowering the inheritance tax. He virtually single-handedly stalled proposed bankruptcy legislation that would have imposed onerous new burdens on the poor while benefitting banks, credit card and car finance companies, and retailers.


In 1996, Wellstone was the only senator up for re-election to vote against an overhaul of the nation’s welfare system, which Clinton signed that year. In a speech on the Senate floor, Wellstone predicted that the law would hurt low-income children. “They don’t have the lobbyists, they don’t have the PACs,” Wellstone said.


http://inthesetimes.com/article/14009/paul_wellstones_legacy

Wellstone had huge appeal for young people:

Wellstone's upset victory in 1990 and reelection in 1996 were also credited to a grassroots campaign, which inspired college students, poor people, and minorities to get involved in politics, many for the first time. In 1990, the number of young people involved in the campaign was so notable that shortly after the election, Walter Mondale told Wellstone that "the kids won it for you"


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Wellstone

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 10:15 PM

62. None of us really know.

 

But it is fun to guess.

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Response to Meteor Man (Original post)

Fri Mar 25, 2016, 01:54 AM

64. Considering he was planning to run a campaign like Bernie's in 2000, I think I know.

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