2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumANYONE who supports Sanders who would actually vote for Trump over Hillary is NOT progressive.
And that also goes for anyone who would waste their vote on a write in, or not vote at all, or whatever. The stakes are WAY too high. SANITY needs to come into play somewhere. We can not allow a crazed right winger, be it Trump or Cruz, get into that White House.
Hillary Clinton is PROGRESSIVE. Maybe not a purist, but PROGRESSIVE. It is just this simple. She is the likely nominee based on the math, and this is the biggest NO-BRAINER I have ever seen. Period.
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)as to who they vote for. I am tired of the posts who put down others and tell them who they should vote for.
RBInMaine
(13,570 posts)Oh please. A progressive for Bernie who would be so lost in space as to vote for Trump? Are you serious? No progressive could possibly vote for that racist mega unqualified whacko. Give me a break. And yes, I'm damn well saying it. And will say it a thousand more times.
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,110 posts)Fairgo
(1,571 posts)I do not have to listen to you repeat yourself...
onenote
(42,383 posts)aren't progressives.
And I fully agree with the OP: anyone who fails to step up and do what is necessary to block the election of a racist, misogynist, bigots like Trump or Cruz sacrifices the right to be considered progressive by others.
Logical
(22,457 posts)RBInMaine
(13,570 posts)virtualobserver
(8,760 posts)Karma13612
(4,527 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,110 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
virtualobserver
(8,760 posts)we have a battle between center-right and god knows what.
polichick
(37,152 posts)bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)litlbilly
(2,227 posts)HuckleB
(35,773 posts)We have to push for the fastest change possible, but sometimes that still means taking the long view. The damage a GOP president would do in the next for years ought to scare the crap out of us all. Bush was bad enough. We should know better.
Karma13612
(4,527 posts)Bull crap anymore.
At 62, time is running out.
And frankly, the middle class is sinking faster than the long view can handle.
HuckleB
(35,773 posts)I'm sorry, but that's a much worse option.
Karma13612
(4,527 posts)for Hillary while we still have so much fight left, to get Bernie the nomination.
And incremental change is no longer an option.
k8conant
(3,030 posts)I'd have to find someone more progressive than Trump.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)She's a neo-conservative.
Chan790
(20,176 posts)Karma13612
(4,527 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,110 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
insta8er
(960 posts)LonePirate
(13,386 posts)bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)LonePirate
(13,386 posts)By your own words, you disqualified Trump but not Hillary.
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)Dynamite Dave
(26 posts)As in neither Clinton or Trump?
Chan790
(20,176 posts)It's turtles all the way down, RB.
There is one progressive in this race...and that's Sanders. Supporting anybody else is merely to acquiesce to a degree of non-progressiveness. Given, Trump's a lot more anti-progressive than Clinton.
tazkcmo
(7,286 posts)Their in the same club and we're not getting an invitation.
LexVegas
(6,005 posts)But I would likely do it if he was the lesser of two evils.
insta8er
(960 posts)The lesser of 2 evils?
insta8er
(960 posts)LexVegas
(6,005 posts)insta8er
(960 posts)SoLeftIAmRight
(4,883 posts)got extra?
tazkcmo
(7,286 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,705 posts)I don't do begging well...
LexVegas
(6,005 posts)Dont need them.
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,705 posts)LexVegas
(6,005 posts)SMC22307
(8,088 posts)Such a controlling lot... action, speech... anything else?
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,705 posts)I disregard them... I oppose bullies. I don't join em.
Love and Kisses
DemocratSinceBirth
dchill
(38,322 posts)in your opinion about who is and isn't progressive.
Go get things done.
Agnosticsherbet
(11,619 posts)SMC22307
(8,088 posts)Aw, hell, drink again, cuz everyone's a mathematician now!
SoLeftIAmRight
(4,883 posts)and some seem happy
kath
(10,565 posts)Reading up on her history and what she supports might help.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)kath
(10,565 posts)AZ Progressive
(3,411 posts)She is no progressive.
Purveyor
(29,876 posts)politics that they conclude, "what the fuck, let the parties crash and burn. We'll sort it out later".
ibegurpard
(16,685 posts)Yet there are many working class blue collar people who may do so. What do we need to change in the Democratic Party to address this?
hellofromreddit
(1,182 posts)a whole bunch of Sanders' voters aren't progressives. He does very well with independents and disaffected republicans. I know, because when canvasing for him it was relatively easy to get Trump-leaning folks to give some serious thought to Sanders. I even met a couple I had previously converted at the voting booth, so I can actually confirm winning over at least them.
So if you tell those people that they aren't progressive, they'll probably tell you "No shit!"
Trump voters I spoke with were simply disgusted with the "political machine that doesn't give a damn about us," and went for the non-tainted candidate. For some he's kind of a default, but they're open to other options--they're the easiest to win over. I met only a few who were adamantly Trump. And, sure, I met some who would never dream of voting for Sanders because "communism!"
They like a candidate who's not tainted by big donor influence. They like a candidate who will rip someone else to shreds. They like a guy who's not in a political party. Trump is all three. Sanders is all three (Clinton helped him when she tried to say he's not really a democrat). Yeah, Trump's solutions are batshit crazy or just non-existent, but many voters don't go so far as looking that up and the talking heads on TV certainly aren't up to the task of conveying that information. So lots of voters go for Trump, but a fair number of them would potentially vote for Sanders.
Believe it for not, Trump people actually do want things fixed--even the racist assholes. It's Cruz's people who believe in tearing the nation down to prep for the second coming or whatever. So if you want to swing them towards Hillary, you'd better find a way to explain to them how Hillary plans to get their jobs back and let them protect and care for their families in terms they will understand.
w4rma
(31,700 posts)Those conservatives were voting for Democrats on economic issues, but Clinton pulled the rug right out from underneath them. So, then they voted against the Democratic Party, as a proxy, in 1994. Then they kept voting Republican against liberal social issues. And, it's been downhill ever since.
The sooner the Clintons and their "new" Democrats are politically marginalized, the better, imho.
ladjf
(17,320 posts)pinebox
(5,761 posts)slipslidingaway
(21,210 posts)but they are adamant that they will not vote for Clinton, these are registered Republicans and independents, they'll go to Trump or Cruz.
jillan
(39,451 posts)Waiting For Everyman
(9,385 posts)of the "shapeshifting Nixonian neocon 1%er" variety. That's a completely apt description. Just wait a while till she "pivots" (shapeshifts), and then she won't be Progressive Hillary anymore.
And here goes a foul shot from across the room, bang into the Trash Can.