2016 Postmortem
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NV Whino
(20,886 posts)dixiegrrrrl
(60,013 posts)https://twitter.com/MMFlint
Ferd Berfel
(3,687 posts)elite ruling class of both parties.
And this is why Hillary will loose - unless it's rigged.....again.
dixiegrrrrl
(60,013 posts)Let's hope Trump scares even the oligarchs enough they want a sure fire winner in Bernie.
Ferd Berfel
(3,687 posts)Sanders camp suspicious of Microsofts influence in Iowa Caucus
A little Corporate support from a friend?
dixiegrrrrl
(60,013 posts)Microsoft says Trump, Clinton will win in the early primaries.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027576244
Marty McGraw
(1,024 posts)
bjobotts
(9,141 posts)avaistheone1
(14,626 posts)Are other corporations meddling at this level?
TBF
(35,007 posts)and Hillary will not. There's your answer.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)pretended to be. Now I think they support Trump to the point of the general because they want him to scare people into accepting HRC their real choice. They know that Trump would be a lose cannon.
MadDAsHell
(2,067 posts)When's the last time a President was elected 80/20?
ViseGrip
(3,133 posts)snagglepuss
(12,704 posts)bigwillq
(72,790 posts)Jarqui
(10,564 posts)Adding single payer might have been nice for the Dems but it makes Hillary look like she nearly is: a republican
dixiegrrrrl
(60,013 posts)even the ones I know who do not agree with me....
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)She would win the Republican vote with that resume.
JudyM
(29,537 posts)litlbilly
(2,227 posts)TCJ70
(4,387 posts)...which was still a good choice since that's the only retaliation that made sense.
nolabels
(13,133 posts)This authority was given as far enough need to bring the combatants to justice from the information from what was known at the time.
The real information that seems to known about the time, on the fore-sure, that this is a fact, was that bush* was out of town (playing it safe) at an elementary school reading a book about goats. As to guessing (that's all that can be done with mountain of B.S. that was the 9/11 investigation) to what really went on, a coin toss could be appropriate
monicaangela
(1,508 posts)The attacks on the World Trade Center on September 11, 2001 resulted in a military conflict in Afghanistan that is still being fought to this day. Although Bernie Sanders voted in a symbolic debate to retroactively support the U.S. military engagement there, he has been appalled by the continued presence of the U.S. in Afghanistan, the resulting casualties, and the debt accrued over the long war.
http://feelthebern.org/bernie-sanders-on-afghanistan/
senz
(11,945 posts)Several days after 9/11.
dixiegrrrrl
(60,013 posts)BlueJazz
(25,348 posts)reformist2
(9,841 posts)What more is there to say?
trof
(54,273 posts)I think Hil's toast.
dixiegrrrrl
(60,013 posts)Dont call me Shirley
(10,998 posts)tomm2thumbs
(13,297 posts)thanks
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
bvar22
(39,909 posts)Maybe she should just go back to being one.
SammyWinstonJack
(44,203 posts)
Hiraeth
(4,805 posts)TRUTH
KoKo
(84,711 posts)

SammyWinstonJack
(44,203 posts)
WillyT
(72,631 posts)


CharlotteVale
(2,717 posts)dsc
(52,791 posts)One marriage equality isn't the sum total of gay rights. She did oppose marriage equality, as did he, for longer than I would have liked. He opposed it until 2009, she until 2013. Other than that issue both have been in favor with her actually making it happen at state while he pretty much didn't as mayor. She opposes the TPP and she opposes Keystone.
RufusTFirefly
(8,812 posts)There are parts of the chart that need to be updated perhaps. Regarding her position on the TPP, for example, here's Politifact:
...
Its up to voters to decide how they feel about her changed stance on the Trans-Pacific Partnership, but we rate Clintons reversal as a Full Flop.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2015/oct/08/hillary-clinton/hillary-clinton-now-opposes-trans-pacific-partners/
As for Keystone, most of us will recall that she was rather evasive about stating her position until quite recently.
The chart could be clarified, but I see no "lies." Forecasting weather atop Mt. Washington is hard.
senz
(11,945 posts)I do not believe her on either. She had a hand in the design of the TPP and praised it to the hilt until her campaign saw that it could sink her with primary voters. The way she phrased her "opposition" was open-ended and did not sound final.
I know that Bernie's marriage equality position did not fully gel until 2009 and that although he came out many decades ago for full gay rights, he didn't focus on specific issues while mayor in the 1980s -- but it hadn't risen to public consciousness yet. Issues have to reach that point before elected officials begin to consider them.
A DUer gave me the long, sad history of the LGBT struggle for marriage equality, a struggle I hadn't known before. It is a moving account.
bvar22
(39,909 posts)but she helped write the damned thing, and called it "The Gold Standard" in 2012.
---Hillary Clinton, 2012, Australia
Hillary "opposes" the TPP like Obama was going to immediately re-negotiate NAFTA.
I don't believe her. THis is just another empty campaign promise since she has suddenly turned Populist a couple of months ago when Bernie started catching her in the polls.. I don't trust sudden Jail House conversions.
We ALL know her record on telling the truth.
Depaysement
(1,835 posts)The Senator from Vermont.
TIME TO PANIC
(1,894 posts)PWPippin
(213 posts)This doesn't attack Hillary, merely makes comparisons. What a wonderful handout this would be for undecideds.
PatrynXX
(5,668 posts)I don't. only thing in that list I disagree with Bernie on.
MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)They'd love or hate things in place of understanding the situation OF such things.
Personally, there are things people might disagree on, I'm sure, but they understand a thing or two from Bernie because it isn't flowered up or buried under piles of bullshit.
That I know we agree on.
tom_kelly
(1,051 posts)how the HRC supporters continue to ignore the facts.
sammythecat
(3,579 posts)Is this really what they want!? Why!? I really do think it's all about her gender. A male democratic candidate with her record and her associations would have had to drop out of the race a long time ago.
DrBulldog
(841 posts). . . Hillary's a Republican!
MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)Hark! I sense you are getting down on your bad self.
dixiegrrrrl
(60,013 posts)Real Clear politics, for all to see.
'Course, many votes ago, I could not believe that people could not see Nixon for what he was.....
senz
(11,945 posts)Thanks, dixiegrrrrl.
hopemountain
(3,919 posts)i know bernie supports them. clinton is courting them for votes and support - yet, she supports the very corporations which are anti union and have pretty much succeeded in wiping them out in the workplace. kind of a hypocritical claim to allude one supports union workers when she supports anti union efforts.
billhicks76
(5,082 posts)Wait Hillary says she supports free contraception and better education. Wow. How brave.
TBF
(35,007 posts)Faux pas
(15,522 posts)

BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)Or they have no problem with them. Democrats cross a broad spectrum of views. A sizable percentage of Democrats are very conservative on one issue or another. We haven't been a liberal party for a long time--we've been pulled rightward. Hillary, is a center-right candidate which is where a majority of the party apparently feels comfortable. Bernie is on the left which is a tough place to be these days.
dixiegrrrrl
(60,013 posts)We can't, the planet can't, our grandkids surely can't.
From what I am seeing, Bernie, on the progressive side, is gaining a LOT of company every day.
Blus4u
(608 posts)What you say here, dixiegrrrrl!!!!!
We can't afford to wait. Now is the time, the ground swell has started.
Peace and a big K & R for your great post(s)
stillwaiting
(3,795 posts)Bernie wipes the floor with Republicans in Iowa and New Hampshire. The two states where the majority of voters are most informed about the policies and viewpoints he espouses. Bernie's HUGE success in general election match ups against Republicans in Iowa and New Hampshire exposes the LIE that we have been sold for decades. A majority of Americans support just about every policy that Bernie supports. Progressive policies that most certainly are not center-right.
We need more Democrats like Bernie everywhere. Even in battleground states. They WILL win.
Bernie has to beat Hillary and The Establishment first, and the brainwashing, media apparatus, and political machinery might be too powerful to overcome which would be a tragedy. Bernie could help steer the Democratic Party towards a progressive future that CAN be elected. Hillary would do no such thing.
brooklynite
(96,882 posts)dixiegrrrrl
(60,013 posts)Here are Bernie's comments to the Guardian:
Speaking to the Guardian in an extensive pre-debate interview, the senator from Vermont criticised Clinton for carelessly fomenting regime change in Libya without worrying about the ensuing instability that has helped Islamic State forces take hold in the country.
Regime change without worrying about what happens the day after you get rid of the dictator does not make a lot of sense, Sanders said.
I voted against the war in Iraq ... Secretary Clinton voted for that war. She was proud to have been involved in regime change in Libya, with [Muammar] Gaddafi, without worrying, I think, about what happened the day after and the kind of instability and the rise of Isis that we have seen in Libya.
Clinton has previously defended her role in airstrikes against Gaddafi in 2011, arguing he was a murderous dictator ... who had American blood on his hands and there was pressure for US action from European and Arab allies.
jonestonesusa
(880 posts)What do you think about the rest of Clinton's accurately presented record on these issues - and the similarities with Republican positions?
in_cog_ni_to
(41,600 posts)They don't think. Money rules their world. It's all about them, not US.
PEACE
LOVE
BERNIE
florida08
(4,106 posts)Bernie is what we thought Obama was going to be. There is no vision with Hillary just SOP. All you have to do is ask what has Hillary done compared to what Bernie has done for the PEOPLE. Hillary is all about Hillary.
Oilwellian
(12,647 posts)humbled_opinion
(4,423 posts)the issues and the comparisons between the rightwing and Hillary how closely aligned they are and how refreshingly different Senator Sanders is from those positions....
dixiegrrrrl
(60,013 posts)I have 2 sons.
One of just informed me he is going for Hillary.
Happily, the other one has my sensibilities, and sees more clearly.
Dark n Stormy Knight
(10,160 posts)
Response to dixiegrrrrl (Original post)
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