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Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:20 PM

My son committed suicide 1/27--he was 25 years old

Last edited Sat Feb 5, 2022, 04:09 PM - Edit history (1)

I am in so much pain I can't breathe. My son was my firstborn and he was my rock. Perhaps I relied on him too much?

I can't get over the fact that my last conversation with him I relayed a bad argument his father and I had about money. It was a dumb argument and I should NEVER have burdened my son with the details. I of all people KNEW how he would internalize other people's feelings, emotions, and somehow blame himself. Worse, in my conversation with my son I told him that if his dad and I didn't get this resolved the only solution may be for us to get divorced. Not true--I was just mad--but this would have been something that would have weighed heavily on my already fragile son. Yes, I realized I didn't know how fragile he was but that doesn't matter---I was perhaps the proverbial straw.

Looking at receipts, etc. he had started planning his death over a month prior. He was just waiting for a reason, and I gave it to him. I will never forgive myself. I will never be the same. I don't know how to live with this pain.

I get people telling me "you need to be strong for your other two kids". Yes, I KNOW THAT. "It wasn't your fault". Really? How do YOU know? Then I get mad at my son as well, why didn't he come to me first? Then I get mad at myself again. I knew he was depressed and feeling a bit at loose ends due to COVID sort of short-circuiting his career plans (he graduated 4-year college during lockdown).


I was trying to gently guide him towards getting back on track, then he took his life using a toxic chemical combination (which he found all the instructions for on the internet, isn't that great?) his note was simply a warning to HAZMAT and also the words "I don't deserve to live".

EDIT/UPDATE: I don't know how to do a "reply all" but I'm reading through all the comments and they are so helpful. Particularly those who have suffered from depression themselves and are explaining to me that nothing I or anyone would have tried to do at the time would have helped because they hid their despair. Also those who have experienced a similar loss and felt similar feelings of guilt. I just stumbled across a video my husband made in 2005 when all 3 of our kids were little. Justin was smiling, happy, and it kills me in some ways to remember happier times. I want to go back there and never leave.

I'm also trying to find someone to facilitate his celebration of life and struggling to find the right person. Justin was not religious but was very accepting of EVERYONE. I hope I can find just the right person. I'm lost.

Anyway, THANK YOU everyone for your kind words, advice, understanding. My heart has been ripped out and I honestly don't know how people can survive this much pain.

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Reply My son committed suicide 1/27--he was 25 years old (Original post)
crimycarny Feb 2022 OP
JohnSJ Feb 2022 #1
MLAA Feb 2022 #2
XanaDUer2 Feb 2022 #3
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shrike3 Feb 2022 #5
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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:23 PM

1. So sorry for your loss crony. Please take care

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:23 PM

2. OMG, dear, dear crimycarny

I am sending you love.
💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💖💕❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️.

Feel welcome to share your grief and thoughts anytime.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:26 PM

3. I'm so sorry

Nt

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:27 PM

4. There is nothing I can say, but my deepest, deepest condolences

Rest in peace.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:28 PM

5. No words. I am so, so sorry.

Since he was planning his death a month prior, you are not to blame. He probably already had his reason before you even talked. The reason may have been that he wanted to end the pain. There is considerable pain in feeling you are worthless. And no, you are not to blame for that.

I've never experienced this personally, so perhaps someone else can chime in. There are also groups you can join. There are people with whom you won't have to be strong. You might want to contact NAMI. National Alliance for the Mentally Ill.

On edit, I have dealt with depression, and the pain came from within me. That's what makes it so intolerable. The pain came from within him. It didn't come from you.

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Response to shrike3 (Reply #5)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 08:08 PM

80. Very well stated.

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Response to BigmanPigman (Reply #80)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 11:27 PM

96. Thank you. Unfortunately, that is hard-won knowledge.

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Response to shrike3 (Reply #96)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 11:50 PM

97. I know and I understand.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:29 PM

6. I am very sorry to hear that.

Post-mortem guilt--no matter how unwarranted-- is human and pretty normal. We've all experienced it--no matter the reasons behind a loved one's death. Me? That I never got to hear my Mom's last recorded answering machine message before it was inadvertently deleted (among many other things). I remember my Mom's best friend was forever tortured by her failure to cook her husband his favorite meal that he'd off-handedly requested three days before he had a fatal MI. It is things like this that get anchored in memory and unfortunately cause pain and guilt.

I've been reading excerpts from Jamie Raskin's book (Maryland Dem Congressman, Constitutional expert, and father to a rising legal scholar son and civil rights advocate who committed suicide just before the last Trump impeachment trial). His book "Unthinkable" is both cathartic and inspired. You might find it so as well.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:29 PM

7. This is a terrible tragedy. He was on a secret track which

you could not have caused or changed unless he had come out and told you. Even then, itís unknown. You will have your desperate thoughts. Just remember how many of them are things you simply canít know. You can wish it had been different. You didnít make it happen. I am so very sorry. (((Hug)))

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:29 PM

8. ...

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:35 PM

9. I am so very sorry! Suicide is intensely painful and destructive to families. I still don't know

how my Nana coped when her youngest son killed himself. We all went round in circles with guilt, anger, sadness. Nana was of the generation where we just don't talk about things, so I don't know how she coped in the short term. She did survive though, and eventually even laughed again, but maybe beneath it all she hurt always and forever? I can't imagine, as a mom of 2 boys, that I would break apart and then be put back together the same after that.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:36 PM

10. Oh my god, crimycarny

words can't express the grief I feel for you.

This period (TFG, COVID) has been devastatingly hard on young people. The more sensitive and aware the harder, I think.

I just had to ask my 29 year daughter whether she felt she was at risk of self-harm, the other night in a call. Was terrified to say "suicide" out loud.

I hope you can find some healing therapies. I imagine this will be a lifelong journey for you and your family.

I wonder if Jamie Raskin's new book could provide some healing.

https://www.npr.org/2022/01/04/1069793647/rep-jamie-raskin-searches-for-answers-in-unthinkable-journey-of-trauma-and-grief

MSNBC will also have a special on his story on Sunday, 2/6.

https://variety.com/2022/tv/news/love-the-constitution-jamie-raskin-msnbc-1235154204/

We are all with you, crimey.

Holding you in my heart.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:38 PM

11. Deepest Condolences

My heart aches for you.

Please consider contacting a hospice bereavement department to pursue help in resolving your grief, when you are ready.

They will provide free therapy for 13 months to support you through "the year of firsts," birthdays, holidays, etc.

Hospice might well also have a group you can join.

Sending you hugs. Please be gentle with yourself. There is no timeline for grieving, and the stages of grief are not linear.

Be good to yourself. Grieving is hard work, physically, as well as psychologically, and emotionally.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:39 PM

12. As someone who has suffered from serious depression

I can assure you that your argument with your husband did not trigger him. Suicide is the result of incredible internal pain, so much so that the person would rather die than bear it.

My condolences for your loss, but please don't blame yourself.

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Response to iemanja (Reply #12)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 01:58 AM

102. Exactly.

With each of my attempts (there have been several), I was trying to end the psychic pain.

To the original poster: My deepest sympathies to you and your family. As others have said, please don't blame yourself.

The are multiple groups around that may help you besides NAMI. Also, there is grief counseling, if that is possible.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:42 PM

13. My condolences.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:44 PM

14. I am so sorry.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:51 PM

15. I am so sorry, crimycarny.

I cannot imagine the pain you are feeling. Please try to be good to yourself.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 02:52 PM

16. I'm going to take a chance and say something

from a Buddhist perspective. You did not maintain self discipline over your speech. Your mind was afflicted with anger. Words can cause suffering or happiness. You realize this now. The question is: can you learn from this mistake and be more mindful of your speech going forward?

We cannot know the karma and mental formations that people bring from previous lives, or even previous times in the current life. You are not responsible for your son's depression in the first place. You are not responsible for his confusion. Were I in your place I would wish him the most auspicious rebirth possible and to be reborn into a loving family.

We Buddhists are taught to consider all sentient beings as having been our parent in a previous life. I don't know if reincarnation is true, but I am open to the possibility. I believe that we keep doing the same mistakes over and over until we gain enough wisdom and compassion to do otherwise. You might gain some peace of mind if you engaged in some altruistic activity for the benefit of others and dedicate the merit to your son. There are a plethora of good causes and activities to choose from. Maybe choose one that was near and dear to your son's heart.

Finally I'll leave you with a famous Buddhist scripture from the Damnmapada

All experience is preceded by mind
Led by mind
Created by mind
Speak or act with contaminated mind,
and suffering follows.
As the wheel of the wagon follows the hoof of the ox.

Speak or act with a peaceful mind,
and happiness follows.
Like a never departing shadow.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:03 PM

17. I am so sorry!!!! (((hugs)))

..we are here if you need to talk.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:04 PM

18. Can't imagine your pain. A parent's worst nightmare. nt

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:08 PM

19. How heartbreaking

The loss of one's child is the worst pain. I am so sorry.
You make it clear your son already decided he wanted to end his life (third paragraph). He wasn't looking for an excuse as you seem to be taking on in self-blame. He was preparing himself.
Depression is a quagmire. For those suffering it often seems there can be no relief.
Please hold your remaining two kids close. They must be suffering too.
This is such an awful loss.
I hope you have help. We are here if you feel like reaching out.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:14 PM

20. I am so very sorry

There are no words ... I just hope you can find your way through the grief :hugs:

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:19 PM

21. I'm so very sorry. We have a worry with my son in this way and my wife constantly worries that she's

done something to upset him and frets about all the mistakes she thinks made raising him. It's so hard to get out of that mind set but really, it's not your fault. I'm sure you tried your best.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:20 PM

22. I'm so terribly sorry for your loss. I hope that you, your two kids and husband

can comfort one another through this very difficult time.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:22 PM

23. So very very sorry

Iím literally sitting here crying for you and your son. There is nothing I can do or sayÖjust know people here at DU care so very much.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:23 PM

24. I am so, so sorry

I lost my son to suicide 6 years ago. Here is what I know. IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT. That'a the big thing. He had more internal pain than he could reasonably deal with. You couldn't help him, no matter what you did. I know that sounds stark and terrible, but he had far more pain than you could see. I know that now about my own child's pain. We all tried, but it wasn't enough. Sometimes they get in a dark place and we can't love them out of it. Sadly, love isn't always enough. Professional help is often what's needed, and they can't see it, or sometimes can't get to it soon enough, which is what happened to my son. Your son is free of his pain now, but what he can't see is the pain he left you with. That's the hard part. Forgive yourself. You tried.

Holding you close.

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Response to Jilly_in_VA (Reply #24)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:54 PM

34. These are my thoughts too. This had been in the making. When the Rep. Raskin story airs, make

sure the whole family watches it. Love and the Constitution is the name I think. Think it's MSNBC, but maybe CNN. Looked it up. MSNBC, Sunday Feb. 6, 10 pm ET. Raskins son committed suicide right before Raskin had to lead the House impeachment proceedings. You can't change the past; only deal with the present. My heart goes out to you. Someone here said your son is free of his pain. Not true. Many investigations show that Mind continues to exist after physical death. Your son greatly regrets the pain he can witness his family going through because of his action. He knows it was his decision, not anyone else's. Forgive him. Don't blame yourself.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:25 PM

25. I too had this happen and know how you feel at this moment.

The worse thing on earth is to outlive you children. My heart breaks for you as mine was broken. Not gonna write a book on here but PM me if I can give any solice.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:29 PM

26. I am so very sorry. Losing a child must be one of life's most difficult challenges.

I hope you can forgive yourself for your last conversation, especially since your son had already planned his actions. He sounds like a truly empathetic young man who most likely would not want you to suffer.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:39 PM

27. I'm so very sorry.

Depression doesnít allow a person the opportunity to think logically. Itís a disease. It can be fatal.
You didnít give him the reason, depression did. For now, your grief is very strong, give yourself time. Self recriminations wonít bring him back and wonít give you the opportunity to heal.

Please be kind to yourself. Sending you love and hugs.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:40 PM

28. Oh, my heart hurts for you.

Unfathomable what you must be going through.

We arenít perfect and you canít beat yourself up so much about what you said or didnít say, sweetheart. You didnít KNOW what was going on behind the scenes, and if you did, you wouldíve acted accordingly, right? You. Didnít. Know. and you are human and were in pain, yourself. Give yourself that break, that condolence.

When most people are depressed they donít reach out, and donít necessarily share even when asked. So loved ones donít know the extent of the thinking distortions/self-blame that are bothering them. Your sonís note doesnít say anything about your family making him feel unworthy. Iím not a shrink but it seems like he was focusing on what was happening inside himself. And how unusually considerate to include a HAZMAT warning, that seems like a generous, loving act.

I hope you and your husband can find a way to deeply support each other through this shared grief. Wishing you comfort as you work your way through all this.

Good to reach out here on DU. People care.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:41 PM

29. Being a mother, my heart so hurts for you.

I don't presume to know you, but I feel from what you've said, that you loved him with all your heart.
He knew you loved him.

Our adult children's lives are not within our control. Taking oneís life is not a rational decision; but it was his life, his death. In that moment he just wanted to end his pain. Nothing you said or did would have changed his mind. Forgive yourself.

As you live one hour and day at a time, depending on where you live you'll likely find a support group in your area. Even online (the internet's good side) there are many for those who've lost children to suicide. Online support is more widely accessible and available any time of the day; often the nights are the worst, but help and solace are there. May you find your way through your grief and suffering, though it now seems impossible.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:48 PM

30. please be gentle w/yourself


my husband and I lost his son in 2019 to suicide and my husband just passed away 2 months ago... guilt is unfortunately normal although not productive... do what you must to take care of yourself (no you don't have to be 'strong' for the other kids- they will understand)
talk about your son, your feelings, your concerns to everyone who will listen and let people help

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:50 PM

31. I'm so so sorry...




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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:52 PM

32. Condolences, crimycarny



Be kind to yourself

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:52 PM

33. My deepest condolences. My sister committed suicide in 2017.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:56 PM

35. You did not give him a reason.

He had his reasons already established. His suicide is not your fault nor was it within your control to stop. No one but your son understood what his mental state was or what his triggers were. His death is heartbreaking, but it is not your fault. Brain chemistry is a bitch, and sometimes it can overwhelm, but it was not your fault. Love his memory, love yourself, it was not your fault. I am truly sorry for your loss, and it was not your fault.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:56 PM

36. I am so sorry.

I hold you in love.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 03:58 PM

37. Read Jaime Raskin's book.

"......But what makes this book memorable is the way he weaves memories of his son Tommy into his account of the insurrection and impeachment. On New Year's Eve, this brilliant, creative young activist succumbed to the depression he had suffered from for several years, taking his own life in the basement apartment of the Raskin family home. Tommy was laid to rest just a few days before Congress was to meet to certify the presidential election results. The Raskins are a large, closely knit extended family, and they came together from all parts of the country to mourn. When Raskin decided that he was obligated to attend and cast his vote in person, his daughter Tabitha and his son-in-law (married not to Tabitha but to her sister Hannah) came with him to lend support. Little did they know that they would end the afternoon hiding under a desk in Steny Hoyer's office as a crowd of angry insurrectionists stormed the U.S. Capital. I won't belabor the events of that day; suffice it to say that Raskin's firsthand account is chilling.

Just a few days later, Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi called Raskin to repeat her condolences--and to ask Raskin if he would chair the second impeachment committee. Despite the personal tragedy that had just occurred, as one of the few Constitutional lawyers in the House, his inclination was to agree, but he asked for a little time to consult with his wife and daughters. They were vehemently opposed, fearing that the position would put his life in danger and that they could not withstand another loss. But Raskin believed that his son's spirit was with him, encouraging him to take on the task for the sake of American democracy, which had been threatened on January 6. After assuring them that his security team would be even stronger than that provided for Adam Schiff, chair of the first impeachment committee, because of the Capital breaching, he accepted the position...."


I think there is so much more than Covid hurting people. Take the maniac who was POTUS and his preposterous sycophants that are trying to destroy what is good about this country. And there is much more on the internet to drive us all to the brink. I imagine there are many other matters weighing heavily on a sensitive soul.

I am so sorry for your grievous loss. Such a tragedy. Take care of yourself. Maybe follow Raskin's lead.

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Response to SleeplessinSoCal (Reply #37)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:13 PM

40. +1

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Response to SleeplessinSoCal (Reply #37)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:22 PM

45. I was suicidal in my teens, again in my late 20's/early 30's and again during the lock down

When I think about what our grown children are facing with climate change/pollution, the threat to our democracy, student debt, and a fractured society, my heart breaks anew each and every time. I know with the utmost certainty that had I lived in this time, I would have been successful in my plans to end my pain.

Sensitive souls don't really stand a chance these days.

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Response to Native (Reply #45)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 07:08 PM

69. So pleased you see this as the daunting challenge it is for us all.

Any life kessons are much appreciated in these horrific times. And truly made horrific by the team of T&P.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:09 PM

38. So very, very sorry.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:11 PM

39. So, So Very Sorry for your pain and loss.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:13 PM

41. this is so sad. my heart aches for both you and him and the rest of your family

i know two moms who have gone through what you are going through.
you are not alone in this experience. a support group may provide some guidance

i'm so sorry.
i can't imagine your heartache.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:16 PM

42. I am so very sorry.

I have a friend whose 20 something son took his own life about three years ago. His birthday is in January, and I have just been through communicating with her about the memory of him on the anniversary of his birth. She also lost her other son, many, many years ago, about a month after he was born. She still remembers him and feels the pain of losing him, too.

I've just finished reading Jamie Raskin's book and told her about it. Her words? She thinks it's too soon, that she won't be able to handle reading it. There is no timetable for handling grief. I can tell you, though, that Jamie Raskin mentions in his book that he started zooming with a grief therapist, weekly, not long after his son's death and that it has helped him a lot.

He also says that with the benefit of hindsight, he believes that his son had been planning his suicide for some time. You are not responsible for his decision. It is not your fault. You didn't do the research, buy the chemicals, or consume them. It was his decision.
Yes, I agree with you that you will never be the same. But you will learn how to live with it. And part of how you will do that is to talk about your son. Remember him. Cherish the memories and never let go of having loved him.

You know that all of us here are surrounding you with love and hugs? And as Skittles says, there is always somebody here at DU when you want to talk.



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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:18 PM

43. My deepest sympathies to you & your family.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:21 PM

44. I am so very sorry, crimycarny.

Deepest condolences to you and the family.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:22 PM

46. So, so sorry, crimycarny.

Please be kind to yourself.



For your boy...



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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:34 PM

47. I am so sorry to hear that

I don't know what to say other than my thoughts are with you and your family.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:35 PM

48. Please believe this: Nothing you did/did not do contributed to this.

Your son's brain was broken. You didn't break it. Probably he didn't, either. Brains break, we don't always know why or how.

He was in dreadful, unrelenting pain from that broken brain, telling him awful things about himself and who he was.

He honestly believed that taking himself away would first, end his own pain, and second, take the burden of his presence (his broken brain told him over and over that his presence was a burden to everyone he loved) from those he loved.

You could not have unbroken his brain or even fixed it.

It's possible he could have been prevented from acting as he did - there is always hope, up to the final act. But no guarantee.

And when the broken brain has gotten what it wants - the end in sight - it can be horribly, horribly efficient at concealing that purpose.

Release "guilt" from the mix of pain that holds you, if you can. You have enough to struggle with, without that.

Stay strong one minute, one hour, one day at a time.

Ask for help.

There are other families who have suffered, other families who know. Try Alliance of Hope or any of the major national suicide prevention organizations in your area - most of them also help with information and connections to support for survivor families.

Your son WOULD want you to, it would lessen the terrible guilt that was part of the broken brain driving him.

One minute.
One hour.
One day at a time - keep going.

lovingly,
Bright

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Response to TygrBright (Reply #48)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:52 PM

52. An excellent and very wise post

Thank you.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:43 PM

49. I am terribly sorry for your loss

I have no words or wisdom to ease your pain, though I wish I did. I can't imagine such a loss and wish you only support from your family and friends to carry you now when you need it most.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:45 PM

50. I'm just one more person

hearing you, not knowing you or your son, but somehow taking on, I hope, some of your pain. Please keep sharing here and other places. I believe it will help you and for sure it will help others in many ways. Positive waves of energy from me to your son and your family.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:48 PM

51. My dearest crimycarny, I ask that you do something for yourself and your son

...when you are able to see through your tears, please take the time to research depression. You will find that a depressed brain is physically very different. All the love and care and right words won't/can't make a difference. There is a terrific program out of Stanford that is worth noting. It's called SAINT. People who have been depressed their entire lifetimes are cured after magnetic stimulation treatments. Please know that you did not cause your son's pain. If he were with you right now, I am convinced he would tell you that the one thing he was/is sure of is your love for him. Unfortunately, love does not conquer all, as much as we like to think it can.

[link:https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2020/04/stanford-researchers-devise-treatment-that-relieved-depression-i.html|

[link:https://www.cbsnews.com/video/a-promising-new-treatment-for-depression/#x|

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:54 PM

53. Giving you a virtual big time hug. My girl

I also have three babes, she is my second and in her forties.
She has been dealing with depression since her late teens. We have tried to get her help so many times. Help does not seem to be out there.
So sorry and I do wish we could hug and talk. 💕

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:54 PM

54. Dear crimycarny, I'm so sorry for your loss! Please know that suicide prevention

hotlines also serve those left behind -- a conversation with someone at one of these lines helped me understand my cousin's attempted suicide -- may you be in peace.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 04:59 PM

55. I'm so sorry for your loss.

I canít say anything that will ease your pain but know this: Itís not your fault. Your son knew how much you loved him but his brain didnít allow him to see a way out. Be good to yourself and know that thereís always someone hear to talk to.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 05:01 PM

56. So deeply sorry for your loss.

I wish you love and peace.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 05:05 PM

57. May I walk with you in your sorrow.

I have found that it takes time, lots of time to even start to heal.
It will get better over that time, never go away, but get better over time.

DU love to you.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 05:11 PM

58. I hardly know what to say.

My 21-year-old daughter was killed in 2001. I have a glimpse of your pain.
This is very, very new. I hurt for you.

Please be as kind to yourself as you can. If you would like to DM me, call anytime, please do. If I can help you in any small way to get through this, that is what I want to do.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 05:15 PM

59. Thank you for trusting DU to come share your hurt

Iím sending you all the love prayers/vibes I can.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 05:21 PM

60. crimycarny

I am so deeply sorry for you and all his loved ones.

I'm going to tell you first......IT WAS NOT YOUR FAULT. I understand you feel guilt but people don't kill themselves because you did something....he suffered from depression, likely battled with it for some time and it overwhelmed him. No doubt he had long considered suicide as an option to end his pain. It is well-known that the holiday season can be very hard on those who cannot feel true happiness.

I don't have kids and cannot even imagine your pain, but I do know the angst of a loved one's suicide. My dad shot himself in the head and lived for six days - the third day was my birthday. All I can tell you is the old adage "Time heals all wounds" is NOT true.....but certainly, only time can make it easier to bear.

PLEASE try to talk to a grief counselor, for your own sake for for your other kids. All you can do now is carry on. And remember someone is always here on DU, we care.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 05:33 PM

61. No one is ever responsible for another person's actions. I lost my first son to drowning.

You will go through anger to both yourself, your son, God if you are religious, every being under the son. You will also go through the 'if only I's" and blame yourself for something you had not control over. My recommendation to you is to seek a group of people that have been there and faced the death of a child. They can listen and help you in ways someone that has not experienced it cannot. Or go to a professional grief counselor. I wish with all my heart that no parent has to face what you are now facing. Much love.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 05:36 PM

62. I'm so very sorry

I can't imagine your pain.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 05:54 PM

63. I'm so very, very sorry!

I've lost three close family members to suicide: my aunt in 1981, my brother in 1996, and my nephew in 2014. Suicide leaves most people with "survivor's guilt", a feeling that had they known, they could have done something to prevent the suicide. Had the person who died died from lung cancer, you would still be deeply hurt and grieving, but you wouldn't feel guilt because you didn't make the person quit smoking, e.g. .

The only advice I can give you is to tell you that it's OK to feel how you feel, be it sad, be it angry, be it bewildered, etc., but DON'T blame yourself. Surround yourself with people who love and support you and please talk to a professional and get grief counseling-- it works. While you can never "get over it", like some people think, you can get through it. Your grief will always be there, but it won't be crippling and self-destructive.

I wish I could put my arms around you and hold you while you just let go, I can't. What I can do is tell you that your feelings are normal, and millions of us know the pain that goes with suicide. Sending you a virtual hug!

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 05:55 PM

64. I am so sorry for your loss, crimycarney.

Love and Healing to you and yours.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 05:56 PM

65. I lost my younger brother to suicide.

He had one attempt, some in-patient therapy, and then disappeared about a year later. He was missing for 5 months over Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Years. They found his body in the river a few days after his birthday. The disappearance was its own special hell.

Parents have a really tough time with suicide of a child. Give yourself some time to grieve, however long it takes. After that, you might want to try a support group. I went to an in-person one and also subscribed to an online group, there are several if you google it. I was able to talk to people to understood and also to learn. It seems like such a senseless, violent act to survivors. As for not seeing the signs of severe depression, the sufferers are extremely good at covering it up. I read a magazine piece by William Styron who wrote "Sophie's Choice" and "Confessions of Nat Turner" and suffered from depression his whole life. He was at a dinner party with his wife and friends during a stretch of severe depression and was contemplating suicide during the dinner party. When he later told his wife and friends how he felt that evening, they were all shocked because he covered up his depression so well.

I think the most important thing I learned about suicide came second-hand from my online group. A young woman lost her brother to suicide. He had a good job and shared a home with his fiancee and their dog. He received a severe head injury in an auto accident caused by a driver who was texting while driving. Because of his brain injury, her brother lost his job, his fiancee, his home, and his dog. Her brother, like my brother, ended his life by jumping off a bridge. Shortly after his death, her family received a letter from a young woman that they didn't know. She wrote that she had heard about the death and felt compelled to write because a few months before, she was on the same bridge attempting to end her own life. At the last second, two men pulled her to safety and stayed with her until the first responders arrived. She said that she never found out who they were, they just disappeared, and for all she knew they could have been angels. She told the family that they probably were having a hard time understanding why a person would consider doing such a thing. She said that she was in such a dark place and in so much pain that ending her life seemed like the best option. She hoped that her letter could bring them some understanding and some peace. Her letter brought me some understanding and peace.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 06:27 PM

66. So sorry for your loss.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 06:29 PM

67. I am so very sorry for your loss, crimycarny.

I can't even begin to imagine the types of emotions this has sent churning through you, can't even begin to say I can understand, because I just can't. I was holding my own breath as I read your post.

However, it really wasn't your fault. I know it will take a long, long time to internalize that, but it's true. I know it's going to be a long road ahead, and I'm sending wishes that you find yourself in that place sooner rather than later, that in the meantime there are people and events in your life that bring you closer to peace of mind, body and soul. Please look for and embrace them.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 06:50 PM

68. You're going to find 1000 reasons you are to blame

I know a woman who's been through this. She blames herself, too.

Depression is a physical disease caused by brain chemicals.

You are going to need help to get through this. IF you can't afford a professional, see if you can find a support group. DU also has a mental health group.

Love to you, and prayers if you're a believer.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 07:08 PM

70. So very very sorry crimycarny

I haven't the words, but my thoughts are with you.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 07:17 PM

71. I'm so sorry.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 07:20 PM

72. I'm very sorry for your loss

Sending thought of peace and comfort during this difficult time.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 07:25 PM

73. Very sad...

... you must not blame yourself. It's normal... you're going through normal emotions. Everyone thinks they are responsible and could have done something different. That may be true, but it was his decision, in the end. You can find a support group for suicide families. You can forgive your son... and all those he left behind.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 07:26 PM

74. I'm so incredibly sorry for your unfathomable loss.

My heart goes out to you and your family.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 07:28 PM

75. Sending you love and peace...

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 07:34 PM

76. I don't think your son died from suicide. I think he died from mental illness

When someone takes their own life they are not thinking rationally. It is almost like my grandmother who was mentally ill and thought the neighbors were tunneling under her house so they could hurt her. It didn't make sense to anyone but her and she was convinced of it.

And I know that when someone takes their own life EVERYONE FEELS GUILTY. Everyone thinks of things that they did that were "the cause" It would be good to talk to your other children to make sure they are not going down that road of crazy thinking also.

An then I would definitely get myself into a group from Hospice or for parents of suicide. Talking with others who have been through the same thing would help a lot.

I know this is a horrible time in your life. Probably the worst it will ever be.

And if you want my spiritual/philosophical thought it is this: Every single person comes to the earth at the exact time they are supposed to and they leave the earth at the exact time they are supposed to. And, I believe the reason for that is too big for me to understand but also that it is Divine and good.

I apologize if I sound like I'm giving you a sermon. Know that just like everyone else here it is because I care and I am terribly sorry for the pain you are going through.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 07:44 PM

77. 🤷‍♂️💕

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 07:45 PM

78. No words are adequate for your terrible loss. But please know that I am

holding you ad you family in light andlove. Your DUfamily is here or you.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 08:00 PM

79. So sincerely sorry for such overwhelming sadness.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 08:28 PM

81. For the memory of your son, may he rest in peace



May you find solace in your memory of him from happier times.
Everyone needs their own time for grieving, don't let anyone tell you otherwise.
You'll always love your son and miss him, but someday - eventually - the pain will become bearable.


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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 08:29 PM

82. Small solace, but you know you have a community here.

We donít have all the answers, but maybe, just maybe, we can ease some of your pain.

Healing.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 08:43 PM

83. Dear heart

We are all sending you love. Please be as kind to yourself as you can. Thank you for reaching out to DU. We love you.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 08:49 PM

84. I had a friend commit suicide

And I got to talk to his father and he had some of the same thoughts. He blamed himself for months

You donít need to forgive yourself because you didnít do anything wrong.

He was already planning it. And it could have anyone or anything to set it off.

Much love to you and your family.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 09:13 PM

85. I am so, so sorry.

I have not gone public with this here on DU before, but I will now.

I lost my younger son to suicide in 2017. He was 30 years old. He'd been struggling with depression for some years, and planned ahead. He actually wrote a suicide note four months before he actually did it.

He took some sort of overdose, which he also obtained via the internet. Fortunately, there was no HAZMAT to worry about.

I'll add this: I am very glad that he didn't do something messy like a gun. Nor did he jump off a bridge (he lived in Portland, OR, lots of possibilities there) so that we'd never really know what happened. He had a normal final night of his life, going to a bar and having a couple of beers with a friend, then came home and took the overdose.

I am incredibly fortunate that the night before he took his life he called me and we talked for well over an hour, probably the longest phone conversation we'd ever had. We talked about lots of things. He expressed regret over the failure of a particular relationship in his life. I forget other stuff. I wish I could have said something that would have made him stay, but that wasn't possible. I realized much later he was saying goodbye to me, without overtly saying so. I'm lucky in that last conversation our final words to each other were "I love you."

I know what you are going through. I can tell you that you will never not miss him, will never not feel sad that he's gone, will never stop having outbreaks of grief for him. You will spend the rest of your life wondering where he might be now. That's okay.

I agree with those who say it is not your fault, what you said did not make a difference, not really. He was planning to do this, had thought it out carefully. IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT.

I happen to have strong spiritual beliefs that include my seeing him again eventually. If you have any spiritual/religious beliefs, I hope they bring you some degree of comfort. I mean that.

I will add this. We (meaning my ex and I) learned about his death on Facebook, because one of his cousins had gone to his page and had seen postings from his friends who'd learned about it. That sounds much worse than it really is. His roommate had tried calling me a couple of times that day (roommate had the unfortunate and unpleasant duty of finding him) to let me know, but never left a message. When the cousin called my ex, he looked at FB, then called me. Yes, it was shocking, but it was better than not knowing for several days.

Also, thanks to FB there was a truly joyous celebration of his life in Portland, OR, where he'd lived the last 6 or 7 years of his life. Without FB, it would have been years, literally years before all who knew him could find out. As it is, an exchange student from Ireland whom my son had known when he was a freshman and the other guy a senior in college, only recently looked at my son's FB page and learned the news. He posted something kind, and I was able to respond to him. This is why I push back at those who trash FB. It really does have its place.

I know that right now you are pretty much in the worst place you are going to be. I don't know if I can say it will get better, but I think I can say that it well get easier. The immediacy of this grief will diminish. Your life will go on.

I have one other son, otherwise known as My Son The Astronomer here on DU. As sad as I am to lose the one son, I'm even sadder that the other one lost his only brother.

Hugs and much love to you.

From your DU family.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 09:30 PM

86. So sorry. There's no words I can say.

Good that you're reaching out to share your pain. Please don't stop!

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 09:35 PM

87. I am so very sorry

my heart aches and breaks with and for you Ö

my virtual arms are around you Ö wishing they could actually do so Ö ((((((((hug))))))))

I can only hope your pain becomes bearable

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 09:37 PM

88. So sorry

I lost two friends exactly a year apart. First one was an accident, I spoke to him the night he died, and I had a bad feeling due to who he was going to party with. Exactly a year later my friend's friend blew his brains out on the anniversary, he was full of guilt as he had reintroduced my friend to using. I was the last person to speak to him, I tried to pull him out of his funk, reminding him of his wife and kid and an upcoming concert in a effort to pull him out of it but I found out later it was unsuccessful.

You will go through the what ifs, as they are part of the denial stage. You're going to have to work through those stages and visit anger over it. Please take care, loosing a child is one of the worst things a person can deal with. Take comfort he had the courtesy to warn the first responders. Seek out a support group to help you with this, it is going to be a tough year.

I'm so sorry for your loss.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 09:53 PM

89. So sad and awful. I am reaching out with a big hug.

Hold onto your memories of him. He was in pain and looking for a reason to go.
If it wasnít you it would have been something else.
Try to allow yourself to grieve and cry because of what has happened.
It is a tremendous loss.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 09:55 PM

90. I'm so sorry for your loss

It can feel so meaningless and at the same time it is often the best thing someone can say. My first born son passed away at 20 and almost 10 years later I still have not ďsorted myself outĒ over it. I feel the pain and guilt and so many other emotions still as strongly today as when it happened. It is terrible and difficult but there will be good days ahead. Best to you and your family

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 09:57 PM

91. I am so sorry

Listen to me. What you said to him didn't push him. He was already planning this and he would have done it even if you didn't have an argument with him. This isn't on you. A lot of depression and suicidal feelings go undetected. Mine did because I always put up a facade. You really never know how bad someone is deep down and it does go very underground. This is not your fault. Depression is something neurological and has to be diagnosed and most those who are depressed never show it on the surface. I cannot imagine the pain you're in. I'm just so sorry

I'm a twice suicide survivor. I know how bad someone can hurt and feel like the world is out to get you and crush you.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 10:26 PM

92. This is terrible.

I cannot imagine your pain. You however did not cause this. It seems as though he had already
made his mind up. You join an unfortunate group of people whose lives have been upended by
a loved one taking their own life, me included. May you find some peace and rely on your family for strength.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 10:37 PM

93. I am very sorry. I had a roomate who did it, and to be honest, I came very close...

...myself when I was a young man.

There was nothing that the people I loved could have done to stop me; and I realize now how much I would have hurt them as well as the reasons they may have found to blame themselves.

I came very close; the thought of it frightens me, because life was so rich thereafter, but the issue was not about other people, what they did and didn't do or say or didn't say; it was least of all not about those I loved. It was an argument between me, my pain at the time, and eternity. It was with me, not those I loved.

We all feel failure, that we have let others down, but to live we need to forgive ourselves both from what we perceive and what we know of our own mistakes.

I realize it will be hard to come by, but I wish you peace. It can come, if you let it, if you work at it. Guilt, deserved or undeserved, is an opportunity for forgiveness. If you think you need to do so, forgive yourself.

Had I went through with it, I would surely hope that anyone connected to me my act would have done the same.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 10:42 PM

94. Nothing i saw will console you

This is the pain. If possible, get with a grief counselor to help you process and understand what has happened. You must feel the pain without making yourself suffer.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Fri Feb 4, 2022, 11:01 PM

95. I'm unspeakably sorry for your loss. Something that helped me when I lost a love to suicide:

I was thinking of all the things I could have said or done that might have saved him. That night, when he phoned me, he said something strange, and for a moment I thought I should drive out there and sit with him. But then I said to myself, "He's blackout drunk. He won't even remember if I go over there tonight. I'll talk to him after he's sobered up tomorrow." The next phone call I got was from the hospital.

The most helpful thing was when someone said, "You did the best you could with the knowledge you had at the time."
That was more helpful than telling me I did the best anyone could have done, or that nothing I said or did would have changed the outcome.

You did the best you could with the knowledge you had at the time. The grief will still be with you, of course, but it helps take away the guilt. I am sure from this distance that nothing you said or did pushed him over the edge, but even if I am wrong, you love your son and you did the best you could with the knowledge you had at the time.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 12:34 AM

98. I see that multiple people are saying, from various viewpoints,

that you should in no way blame yourself as it was in no way your fault.

I'd like to echo that from the viewpoint of a survivor. Yes, I have been there (and,fortunately, survived) and I can testify that when one is at that point, there is no room in one's head or heart for words, positive or negative, from loved ones, or, really for anything else at all. There is nothing but the pain, and even that is not associated with anything - it's just there.

I understand it is only too easy to think that, because you said something a short time before the event, what you said may have affected/propelled the event. It didn't. I promise you.

And, please, don't just take it from me. Listen to, and take the advice of, everyone who is telling you you are not at fault. Hear, read, and do everything you can, and everything you need, in order to believe it was not. your. fault.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 12:42 AM

99. So much compassion and wisdom here...

Öas DUers seek to comfort and support you. I hope some of it will help.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 01:45 AM

100. I'm SO sorry 😢

Itís natural to want to make sense of a situation that has no answers. Itís very likely that you are not the answer or reason either.

Give yourself a break.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 01:53 AM

101. My heart is lost, The beasts have eaten it. (Baudelaire)

I am so sorry. The book ďItís ok that youíre not okĒ by Megan Devine was a lifeline. A local grief group for parents who lost children was good. Some advice I received which I pass on ďDonít believe people who tell you it will get better.Ē Five years for me.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 04:13 AM

103. Oh Jesus.

I dont know any words to comfort. Iím thinking of you. Keep breathing. Aloha.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 09:43 AM

104. I am so very sorry, as a mom I cannot even imagine..

And yet I want to say ďhug your children tight nowĒ. Be their rock and their comfort, no matter where it comes from. They are hurting, too.

😭

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 10:10 AM

105. Fragility

What you must realize is that your son was mentally ill.

If your son died from brain cancer, would you blame yourself? No. You'd look at the disease.

Some people survive cancer. Some don't. Some people survive mental illness some don't.

Mental illness can be as lethal as cancer.

Once he'd made up his mind the illness had taken over. The illness won that day.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 11:32 AM

106. My heart

aches for you, your son, and your family. ❤️

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 12:34 PM

107. I lost a son as well. What you are going through is normal.

Time is the only thing will will help you. It takes a long time to sort the intense feelings and make peace with what happened. There will come a time when you think of him and it brings a smile instead of tears. There will be set backs along the way but it will happen, I know this to be true.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 12:51 PM

108. This is one kind of pain that truly, never ever goes away. And the questions will always remain,

why?

As so many here have said, don't beat yourself up, don't blame yourself and others, that you and everybody else should have caught clue number 1, clue number 2, etc. You and everyone else could literally go crazy and still be pounding the pavement, seeking the answers to your unanswerable questions.

Instead, enjoy the precious and valuable moments and memories that you and everybody else have had, and perhaps as so many here recommend, get into therapy, get into a self-help group, perhaps help others seeking advice for their own situations (this may be too painful), perhaps have an annual celebration of sorts to honor and remember them.

My best wishes to you.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 12:58 PM

109. My heart aches to read this. Most parents feel an unconditional love for their children.

Last edited Sat Feb 5, 2022, 02:18 PM - Edit history (1)

He was a part of your life and you feel responsible, you should not. Children become adults and have their own reasons for what they do. You must not make yourself the victim. Certainly mental illness has affected your son's perspective. Your son and many other kids of their generation are having a hard time, yet, they and we all need to stay positive that we'll get over this and any other hurdle, to keep hope and appreciate the sunny days. Mental illness confuses people. There will always be hard times. We all have to confront down periods in our lives. Life is not easy, it's just not, even for those who make it seem easy. Please do not be harder on yourself by feeling responsible for another adult's decisions. This very unfortunate event is simply not your fault.









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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 01:18 PM

110. Sorry

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 01:52 PM

111. No words

can make you feel better right now. I'm so sorry.

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Response to crimycarny (Original post)

Sat Feb 5, 2022, 06:44 PM

112. So heartbreaking.

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