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cbayer

(146,218 posts)
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 07:44 AM Aug 2014

What Happens When Evangelical Virgin Men Get Married? This Secular Female Sociologist Found Out.

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/119119/secular-sociologist-studies-evangelical-virgin-men-who-got-married

August 17 2914
By Alice Robb

In 2008, sociologist Sarah Diefendorf spent a year attending a support group for young Christian men who’d pledged to remain abstinent until marriage, getting to know the 20-something bachelors whose lives revolved around an evangelical mega-church in the southwestern United States. Studies have found that teens pledging abstinence through large-scale national programs like True Love Waits and Silver Ring Thing are no more likely than their peers to remain virgins until marriage, but small peer groups may be more successful. “In these small groups, the men would really talk and grapple with issues of sex and sexuality,” Diefendorf, a PhD candidate at the University of Washington, told me. All fifteen men in the group kept their pledges (as far as she could tell). But their struggles with sexuality didn’t end on their wedding nights. Diefendorf followed up with the men five years later, after they were married, to see what kind of issues they were still facing.

Diefendorf will present her research to the annual convention of the American Sociological Association in San Francisco on Sunday. I talked to her about what she found out—and what it’s like to be a secular woman at a virginity support group for religous men.

Alice Robb: Was it awkward for you to be there?


Sarah Diefendorf: I initially was worried about being a woman entering this space. They had a Facebook page at the time that said, “Men only”; I didn’t even think they would let me in. But I found that my secular identity trumped my gender identity. It didn’t matter as much that I was a woman as it mattered that I was someone from outside the church. They see a very clear divide between the evangelical community and the secular world. They wanted to tell their story to someone from the outside.

AR: What does the church teach them about sex?


SD: The church teaches that that sexual activity is a gift from God, and in order to enjoy that gift, it needs to occur only within marriage. Men talked about sexuality as a dichotomy: They believed that sex was sacred, but they also talked about sex as beastly, as something that needed to be controlled. The “beastly” elements of sex, for them, are things like masturbation, pornography, lust and same-sex desire.

more at link

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What Happens When Evangelical Virgin Men Get Married? This Secular Female Sociologist Found Out. (Original Post) cbayer Aug 2014 OP
Wow thats just yuiyoshida Aug 2014 #1
I'm out of the loop most of the time, but what does SMH mean? cbayer Aug 2014 #7
SMH yuiyoshida Aug 2014 #9
Thanks! New one for me. cbayer Aug 2014 #10
Marking for later read underpants Aug 2014 #2
There's not much more to read. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2014 #3
I think it's worth reading, but your synopsis is pretty right on. cbayer Aug 2014 #5
I think religions could actually do some good in re sexuality, if they realigned Erich Bloodaxe BSN Aug 2014 #11
I think some religious groups try to do the right thing, but they cbayer Aug 2014 #12
Most of the churches/religious pretend that sex does not happen before or after marriage LiberalArkie Aug 2014 #13
Most of the churches/religious? Hardly. cbayer Aug 2014 #14
I've not heard of this - what churches are like this? goldent Aug 2014 #18
Very good libodem Aug 2014 #8
I just read it underpants Aug 2014 #20
Fascinating read AndreaCG Aug 2014 #4
Agree, they seem to have a very conflicted view cbayer Aug 2014 #6
"... someone in the group said he'd cheer if his pastor decided to talk more about sex." Jim__ Aug 2014 #15
Same author. cbayer Aug 2014 #16
This is one woman's story. rug Aug 2014 #17
Wow! Excellent link.nt Starboard Tack Aug 2014 #19

cbayer

(146,218 posts)
7. I'm out of the loop most of the time, but what does SMH mean?
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 08:35 AM
Aug 2014

I found a couple of different definitions.

Erich Bloodaxe BSN

(14,733 posts)
3. There's not much more to read.
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 08:20 AM
Aug 2014

The linked article chops off pretty quickly, and has a line at the end that says it was 'edited and condensed' or somesuch. Basically it just says they still had the same struggles after marriage as before, but without the support group any more.

cbayer

(146,218 posts)
5. I think it's worth reading, but your synopsis is pretty right on.
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 08:32 AM
Aug 2014

The two things I found surprising was that there are no equivalent groups for girls/young women and that there was not additional support after marriage.

This whole dirty/sacred dichotomy looks like it could be very confusing.

Erich Bloodaxe BSN

(14,733 posts)
11. I think religions could actually do some good in re sexuality, if they realigned
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 08:48 AM
Aug 2014

a bit, and focused on consent, rather than marriage. Spend far more time discussing the 'sin' of coercing or forcing others into sexual contact, rather than condemning the contact itself. And introduce information about the links between pornography and prostitution and human trafficking to show that lots of porn is also coerced. Not only might that actually help reduce unwanted sex, but it would remove the 'sex is sinful' mentality these guys are still struggling with afterwards.

(Caveat - I say 'lots of porn', not all porn, there's plenty of amateur stuff out there, made by couples who seem to be enjoying themselves just fine. Remove the profit motive, and a lot of the coercion disappears. Although, even to caveat that, I'm sure there's still plenty of guys coercing girlfriends and wives into movies while saying 'this will never go past our bedroom'.)

Given that abstinence programs fail about as often as any other group, at least if you focused on consent, you might actually reduce some of the real harm done by those teens.

cbayer

(146,218 posts)
12. I think some religious groups try to do the right thing, but they
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 08:54 AM
Aug 2014

often miss the mark.

This program actually sounds like it could be very positive for those that wish to participate, but it's missing so many other aspects, like girls/young women and post-marital support.

It's certainly a tough subject and it's difficult to do it right, but you make some excellent points about the other topics that could be included in a more comprehensive program, particularly the consent versus coercion aspect.

LiberalArkie

(15,686 posts)
13. Most of the churches/religious pretend that sex does not happen before or after marriage
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 09:21 AM
Aug 2014

They believe it is like "I Love Lucy". Sleep in deferent beds and the baby just appears, like a stork delivered it. That is why they have a problem with abortion. It means that the woman had sex.

cbayer

(146,218 posts)
14. Most of the churches/religious? Hardly.
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 09:27 AM
Aug 2014

While it may be the case for some denominations, it is certainly not the case for many others.

Their problem with abortion really isn't about the woman having sex and most religious people do not sleep in separate beds.

This is an old stereotype.

AndreaCG

(2,331 posts)
4. Fascinating read
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 08:31 AM
Aug 2014

I appreciate when religious people stick to their principles. I'm just sorry their church has such a constrained view of sex that they had no solutions to the problems that came up after marriage, because they felt to talk about sex would be to betray their wives and the sacred nature of the act.

cbayer

(146,218 posts)
6. Agree, they seem to have a very conflicted view
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 08:33 AM
Aug 2014

and the inability to keep talking about something that you have shared so intimately with a small of group people seems wrong.

Jim__

(14,045 posts)
15. "... someone in the group said he'd cheer if his pastor decided to talk more about sex."
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 10:14 AM
Aug 2014

This article on the same issue is similar, but it brought up a slightly different aspect that I thought was interesting. From phys.org:

They wished for more guidance from the church, and someone in the group said he'd cheer if his pastor decided to talk more about sex.

"While the whole point of these support groups is to honor sex in marriage, these men have gotten so used to thinking about sex as something negative that they bring those concerns with them to the marriage bed," Deifendorf said. "Once they're married, these men struggle to manage those concerns in the absence of the supportive community they once benefited from."



cbayer

(146,218 posts)
16. Same author.
Sun Aug 17, 2014, 10:20 AM
Aug 2014

She hasn't published her results but seems to be getting a lot of calls for interviews.

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