This Saints scandal is a pretty big deal....

[trumad]

A far bigger scandal than anything I've seen in the NFL.

A bounty to hurt someone--- a fellow NFL player-- that's fucked up.

Plus--- Money on the side for interceptions, sacks, etc--- that's a violation of the league's salary cap.

The whole football team and coaching staff were certainly in on it---Bree's, Payton, etc....

I will be very surprised if Payton and GM Mickey Loomis survive this.... and multiple suspensions of players.

[seabeyond]

1. nevermind. sn just came to me and

Last edited Sat Mar 3, 2012, 12:26 PM - Edit history (1)

explained, gave me the points. seems he is on the right track

[madinmaryland]

2. It is a big fucking deal. That is right up there with the gambling rules.

Payton, Loomis, and Williams at a minimum should be facing suspensions measured in years not in games.

Fuck them.

[dixiegrrrrl]

3. Been in a cave, I guess. Had not heard about it.

In a nutshell, what is the problem?

[madinmaryland]

4. Here is a link. It just came out yesterday...

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/peter_king/03/02/saints.bounties/index.html?eref=sihp&sct=hp_t11_a2

[dixiegrrrrl]

7. Thank you..that was VERY helpful.

[n2doc]

5. Seems to me far worse that the videogate scandal from the Pats

Especially since they were warned not to do it and they did it anyway, and everyone has acknowledged knowing about it for years. IMO, huge fines, loss of future 1st round draft picks, and a ban of Gregg Williams for at least a year from the NFL would be in order. Will be interesting to see what the Commish does.

[madinmaryland]

9. As I have said elsewhere in this thread, the suspensions for these guys need to be measured in years

and not games. All of them. Suspended without pay.

This to me is far worse than Pete Rose's gambling. The only person that Rose hurt was Ray Fosse and that had nothing to do with gambling. Rose never hurt anyone other than himself with his gambling.

[El Supremo]

13. Rose hurt Bart Giamatti.

And don't tell me cigarettes killed him. I'll never forgive Rose for all the stress he caused Bart.

[madinmaryland]

32. Dammit, El. Bart tombstoned Rose from baseball with a flick of a cigarette.

[ScreamingMeemie]

20. Both are bullshit, f-ed up ideas, outside of the rules of sportsmanship.

The Pats don't get a pass over some imagined "scale of what's worse". They're both cheating scumbag teams.

Sorry, I just chose your post to vomit out my ire over this situation.

[Auggie]

6. The Oakland Raiders, of course, are linked to it as well

The Raiders' new head coach, Dennis Allen, was the Saints' secondary coach in 2009. The Raiders had no comment.

Link @ The San Francisco Chronicle, 3-2-12: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2012/03/03/SPKE1NFG1Q.DTL

[charlie and algernon]

8. Hell they should follow the NCAA's lead and forbid them from the playoffs next year.

If the Saints win the division, the second place team goes instead.

[KamaAina]

10. Brees plays offense

what would he have had to do with it?

[trumad]

11. Seriously?

You don't think the entire team new about this?

[KamaAina]

16. It must be "old" news

You don't think the entire team new about this?

[trumad]

34. Typing on my smart phone...

Short cuts in writing--- LOL

[bluedigger]

12. It's pretty bad alright.

“Instead of getting caught up in it, I should have stopped it. I take full responsibility for my role,’’ Williams said yesterday. “I am truly sorry. I have learned a hard lesson and I guarantee that I will never participate in or allow this kind of activity to happen again.’’

The NFL found no evidence of other bounty programs, but several Redskins told the Washington Post that Williams had a similar system as defensive coordinator for the team.

Former defensive end Philip Daniels, now Washington’s director of player development, said he believed Williams paid off big hits with fines collected from players for being late to meetings or practices.

“Rather than pocket that money or whatever, he would redistribute it to players who had good games or good practices,’’ said Daniels, who added the most he received was $1,500 for a four-sack game in 2005.
http://www.boston.com/sports/football/articles/2012/03/03/nfl_saints_violated_bounty_rule/

I think Williams is banned, Payton and Loomis fined, and the Saints lose a #1 pick. At a minimum.

[ScreamingMeemie]

21. Payton should be kicked out of the NFL. nt

[MrSlayer]

14. Bounties have been around forever in football.

What's shocking to me is that people are shocked. It's an open secret. I don't see what the big deal is.

Hockey does bounties too.

[madinmaryland]

15. This coming from an Eagles fan who cheered on and paid for the hits on Michael Irvin.

nuff said.

[MrSlayer]

27. You say that like it's a bad thing.

I assure you it is not.

[JonLP24]

17. They don't count against the salary cap

I know they've been around before they receive the rules so when they don't follow, they have no excuse. I see two problems, it doesn't count against the salary cap and encourages players to go for injuries. Not surprised but that is my deal.

[MrSlayer]

29. Who cares if it goes against the salary cap?

They're personal incentives. An extra G whiz here and there is of no concern. Everyone is acting like this is tiddlywinks. Football is a brutal and barbaric game. Do you think Ray Lewis goes out there to tackle guys? He goes out there to kill people. The bigger the hit the better. What difference does it make if he gets an extra 500 bucks for it or not?

This shock and outrage is ludicrous.

[JonLP24]

31. I care

Salary caps are huge sticking points in contract negotiations, lockouts happen when either side doesn't agree with the limit. If some team is paying players under the table that isn't reported, other teams have a right to be upset about that. I think these kind of payments changes the way players take someone out, Ray Lewis in those cases, is probably trying to force a fumble or a drop, if given an extra incentive to injure someone, probably going to hit an areas likely to cause injury.

[ScreamingMeemie]

22. There is a difference between challenging a guy to get an interception or a sack...

and challenging a guy to cause willful and meaningful damage to another player. No...I will not buy that this has been "going on forever" at this level in football.

What's shocking to me is, that if everyone knew about the willful paying for maiming, someone didn't blow a whistle a long time ago. Oh wait, they did. During the cheating, uninspiring Saints' 2009 season.

[MrSlayer]

28. This is a sport played with bad intentions.

Every time a player goes over the middle the defense is trying to kill him. Not to wrap him up but to light him up. It's always been this way whether you like it or not. And bounties have always been a part of it. This revelation will change nothing.

[ScreamingMeemie]

30. Changes everything. Sorry. But I don't buy it.

And it is not a sport played with bad intentions...or else Suh's gonna have a helluva fit. And rightfully so then.

[Kingofalldems]

18. The question I would have is--where did the money come from?

[El Supremo]

19. It came from the players and coaches.

Lucky they have so much money to waste.

[Auggie]

23. Fines that the players paid for being late for practice ...

and other infractions.

[JonLP24]

25. Was that the case for the Saints?

I'm aware of that for when Williams was with the Redskins but haven't seen that was the case for the Saints, where players themselves offered to pay for them, like Vilma offering $10,000 in one case.

[bluedigger]

24. Bill Plaschke: Now it's Saints who should absorb a knockout blow

Already, folks are connecting the dots, beginning with the resurrection of an old Washington Post interview with former Indianapolis Colts coach Tony Dungy in which he claimed Peyton Manning's neck problems began with a brutal head hit from two Washington Redskins in 2006.

The Redskins defensive coordinator at the time? Who else? Gregg Williams. This means we now know that three of the NFL's greatest quarterbacks may have had their lives changed by the Bounty Baron, and surely we'll soon learn about more.

You will hear huge sighs this week from former players who claim this sort of thing happens all the time. Listen only a little bit. Certainly, dating back far beyond even the infamous Bounty Bowl in 1989 between the Dallas Cowboys and Philadelphia Eagles, players long have been quietly paid for big thumps. Various forms of bounties, particularly for lower-paid special-teams players, have existed forever.

But this is the first time this compensated, potentially criminal behavior has been traced to the offices of a team's coach and general manager, operating in a system that even a warning from ownership couldn't shut down, mayhem so organized that money was even distributed on the basis of what sort of vehicle was used to transport the fallen player from the field.
http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-0304-plaschke-20120304,0,5070173.column

[Renew Deal]

26. I agree that it's a big deal

I'm not sure that Peyton is at risk, but who knows?

[madinmaryland]

33. What's really fucking amusing is that an Eagles "fan" is supporting this shit. Of course we

should all expect that from the team that actually cheers at opponents getting injured. Hell they would have cheered when Joe Theismann got his leg snapped by LT.

Don't see anyone else supporting headhunting, like the douchebags in the NHL.

[trumad]

35. The Eagles fan is simply full of shit...

and is acting all expert and everything--- oh---football is brutal---oh--there's always been bounties...

I've been a football fan for 40 years and I've never seen shit like this on a scale like this.

[ProfessorGAC]

36. A Bears D Coordintator Took Big Heat. . .

. . .for putting bullets on the locker shelf of guys who did something particularly good.

That may have been foolish, but it was NOTHING compared to this.
GAC