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Mon Apr 3, 2017, 11:38 AM

So, why the continual denial that race was a big factor in the election? by certain liberals even?

The claim that it is "wrong" to call a chunk of Trump supporters racist and misogynistic is back again.

I'm too young to already be tired of these attempts to deny the obvious.

To figure it out, I have Very Smart Brothas to thank.

"Interesting. So why do you think this is? Why are they having so much trouble admitting to what’s right in front of them?

One of the more positive byproducts of existing while Black in America is that it forces you to be multilingual. Ebonics, the King’s English, code-switching, Cardi B — we’re well-versed in several different dialects and means of communication. We’re also more in tune to the language of race and racism. We know what’s really being said when Chicago is seemingly randomly name-dropped by a conservative; we immediately knew what “Make America Great Again” meant to convey. It’s a linguistic sensitivity taught to and learned by us; perfected and fine-tuned to the point of virtuosity.

Anyway, maybe this isn’t actually right in front of them. They’ve never had to be as aware of it as we’ve had to be. And maybe they just don’t see or get it because they’ve never had to. White men — by virtue of being White and male — just don’t need to develop the same defense mechanisms everyone else has to.

Also, maybe they do see it, but they just don’t want to admit that the country is as flawed as we’ve been saying it is. Perhaps they’re Neo immediately after he’s taken the red pill; the shock of the real world too much for them to comprehend. And there’s no Trinity available to myrrh for their hot foreheads; just selfies with Ann Coulter.

Those, of course, are optimistic answers to that question. A less optimistic answer would be that they too have a critical stake in the preservation of White supremacy, and their obliviousness is an intentional ploy to retain that status. How do you feel about that?


http://verysmartbrothas.com/why-so-many-liberal-white-guys-just-cant-admit-the-election-was-about-race-explained/

43 replies, 14733 views

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Reply So, why the continual denial that race was a big factor in the election? by certain liberals even? (Original post)
JHan Apr 2017 OP
lunasun Apr 2017 #1
JHan Apr 2017 #2
lunasun Apr 2017 #3
bigbrother05 Apr 2017 #4
JHan Apr 2017 #6
wcast Apr 2017 #5
JHan Apr 2017 #7
wcast Apr 2017 #8
forjusticethunders Apr 2017 #9
JHan Apr 2017 #10
irisblue Apr 2017 #11
JHan Apr 2017 #12
JustAnotherGen Apr 2017 #13
JHan Apr 2017 #14
Eliot Rosewater Apr 2017 #15
JustAnotherGen Apr 2017 #16
Number23 Apr 2017 #18
Number23 Apr 2017 #17
JHan Apr 2017 #19
Number23 Apr 2017 #38
betsuni Apr 2017 #21
Number23 Apr 2017 #39
betsuni Apr 2017 #40
JustAnotherGen Apr 2017 #22
YoungDemCA Apr 2017 #23
kwassa Apr 2017 #36
La Lioness Priyanka Jun 2017 #43
betsuni Apr 2017 #20
wildeyed Apr 2017 #24
JHan Apr 2017 #25
58Sunliner Apr 2017 #28
wildeyed Apr 2017 #31
58Sunliner Apr 2017 #34
saidsimplesimon Apr 2017 #26
DonCoquixote Apr 2017 #32
58Sunliner Apr 2017 #27
JHan Apr 2017 #30
58Sunliner Apr 2017 #33
JI7 Apr 2017 #35
sheshe2 Apr 2017 #29
heaven05 Apr 2017 #37
YoungDemCA Jun 2017 #41
JHan Jun 2017 #42

Response to JHan (Original post)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 11:42 AM

1. Good read. Great site

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Response to lunasun (Reply #1)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 11:43 AM

2. it's cathartic for sure :)

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Response to JHan (Reply #2)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 11:57 AM

3. It's helpful especially when tired

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 12:31 PM

4. They hide behind it being HRC on the losing end

They cherry pick all the different ways that she didn't measure up instead of the many ways tRump called out to our checkered history. He didn't care if the voter heard racism, misogyny, or classism as long as they felt at home on the right. It was a return to the Donna Reed era where the menfolk handled things and the ladies went to bridge club while "the help" took care of the house and kids.

That version of reality was only valid for a very few, but we all saw it on the TV and that's when America was Great! The thing many forget is that era was also the high point for Unions and it only took a downturn when minorities and women asked for an equal shot in the workplace.

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Response to bigbrother05 (Reply #4)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 12:47 PM

6. well said... and "The Gaslight Hour" should be the official description of the 2016 election.

( thanks DU for that phrase - whoever made it up)

As soon as I heard "Make America Great Again" i knew what Trump was up to, but then there was his machismo talk which would appeal to sexist males ( Yet the claim continues to be made that sexism had nothing to do with anything)

This isn't to say politicians are perfect, or course not. They're all flawed in some way or the other (just to state the obvious here), but when an entire platform drives policy that fucks over the less fortunate, but folks co-sign it anyway because other folks will get fucked over more than them, we have a problem. Dare I say a deplorable problem.

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 12:32 PM

5. Who we are as a nation has been grounded in Racism and White exceptionalism since day one.

from 1620 until today, every facet of our national identity has embraced this. Most people, especially repubs, don't realize how this has affected them. Our history is taught championing white heros with a nod towards"others". It excuses our atrocities with pat phrases such as manifest destiny.

Our culture, from books to movies, reinforces this. Whites don't like to watch shows that show nonwhites as hero's, except as individuals, when it's about overcoming the odds.

The justice system has been rigged to over incarcerate nonwhites, so much that many white people view nonwhites as criminals. Our news programs and papers reinforce this view.

When you hear repubs rail against political correctness, what they are saying is they "know" this set of facts outlined above, and are being prevented from saying it. And many are now scared as the demographics switch from being a white majority nation

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Response to wcast (Reply #5)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 12:50 PM

7. Yes, and what you accurately describe, I think people know....but..

often they use the qualifier -"Oh that's how things were THEN" not now, even though just LAST YEAR folks elected a demagogue to be President - yet we can't point this out because that would be divisive. Who does this willful ignorance serve?

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Response to JHan (Reply #7)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 01:07 PM

8. It serves the majority.

they have a vested interest in keeping things the way it is, or was. That's the definition of a conservative today. They want to stay in power, they don't want tolerance. And few people, unlike many here on DU, engage in any critical thinking.

It's easy for them to point backwards and say things were wrong when they don't have to accept responsibility. But most don't acknowledge there is still, and will continue to be, a problem unless it is addressed outright.

This is why our textbook companies sugar coat history so it is palatable to the south. It explains white America's fascination with OJ and supposed black on black crime. Why playing the race card and affirmative action a4 still issues.

Unfortunately, I think this will continue to be an issue for a long time because America has never dealt with its abusive past. Just like in Civil War times, poor whites are doing the rich man's bidding, as these people, Trump supporters, think they are fighting for their way of life. They couch it in different terms, but the fight is still the same.

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Response to JHan (Reply #7)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 01:25 PM

9. I've heard Trumpers say "we want the old days back, just without the racism"

 

Maybe they mean well but they simply don't understand how much "the racism" made the old days that they remember.

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Response to forjusticethunders (Reply #9)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 01:27 PM

10. yeah, delusional nonsense.

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 04:31 PM

11. Kicking for truth & realism

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Response to irisblue (Reply #11)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 04:50 PM

12. it's truth as unsubtle as salt.

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 05:06 PM

13. I love the VSB!

They nail this shit for what it is - and do so without remorse!

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Response to JustAnotherGen (Reply #13)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 05:11 PM

14. and this shit will get called divisive...

point out divisiveness , point out rhetoric that is divisive, point out that millions found that divisive rhetoric appealing for varying reasons.. get called divisive because you point out it's divisive.

We wouldn't even be talking about it if some folks fessed up about their cognitive dissonance and refusal to understand how toxic America continues to be.

#TheGaslightHour

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Response to JHan (Reply #14)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 05:15 PM

15. White supremacy explains Putin, Trump, their rise to power.

White supremacy and racism was what the election was about, almost entirely about that and nothing else.

That is so obvious. When someone starts their campaign by questioning the first black president's legitimacy because of his color, when someone starts their campaign with "they're rapists" talking about Latino's.

Give me a break.

It is now clear Trump team colluded with another world champion racist, Putin. Republicans dont belong anywhere near the WH.

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Response to JHan (Reply #14)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 06:58 PM

16. Not on my watch

Posted in a protected group. I will increase the blocked from posting in this Group if this thread gets invaded.

If it makes you feel better - I guess I got alerted on for calling Trump POSUCS!

Damn it feels good to be a gangster!

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Response to JustAnotherGen (Reply #13)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 07:19 PM

18. They called Sanders "Crunchy Jesus"

I'm and at the same time!!

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 07:16 PM

17. John Stewart, Bernie Sanders and a whole bunch of white people are just busted up that so many

are calling out the racism for exactly what it is.

We're supposed to believe that it was economic "concern" or whatever that was a huge factor in the election. That people were being "left behind" and not being given what they were "promised."

There is NO GROUP in this country more working class and concerned about economics more than black folks and we rejected Trump by more than 90% to 10. Hispanics are another huge working class group and they also rejected Trump. But I guess none of us are supposed to notice that.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #17)

Mon Apr 3, 2017, 07:47 PM

19. what's tragic is how tiresome it is having to fight on multiple fronts, here's the thing..

Sanders has been put in a leadership position of the Dem party so with every bomb he throws into the party when the feeling hits him, the more ground we have to cover and pieces we have to pick up and defending we have to do - perpetual re-litigation of the primaries. Even after Perez was demonized and elected to be DNC chair and invited Ellison to lead along with him.

All over Social Media , in my feed, I'm seeing people resharing his criticisms as further evidence to abandon the democratic party completely but some black millennials my age ( and by no means is this statistically significant I admit) are watching it all alarmed: which causes further fractures.

Today, Charles Pierce wrote this off as a "wankfest" , and described the reaction to Sanders latest diatribe against the Democratic party, while acknowledging he didn't agree with Sanders...

"This [Sanders' comments] touched off a wild ovation in the hall, although several of the minority guests behind Sanders on stage looked at him very much as though he'd grown a second head. It also touched off the 34,998th relitigation of the 2016 Democratic primaries and, frankly, I am sick of all these people. I am sick of the useless posturing, the vain heckling, the shined-up counter-narratives that have nothing to do with the damage that is being done now, at this moment, all over the government, to every progressive accomplishment back to the turn of the last century." - http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a54271/trump-self-destruct/

Where he's wrong is that this is not a "wankfest", it's just the latest manifestation of myopia about the dynamics at play last year, from liberals of all people.

So here we are in a situation that black people ( and PoC) are all too familiar with- holding our noses, joining the cause, and mentally editing out the bullshit to work on a larger goal while so called progressive heroes cynically pander to roughly 25% (thereabouts) of the electorate who enthusiastically threw their support behind Trump's divisiveness. Ain't life grand.

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Response to JHan (Reply #19)

Tue Apr 18, 2017, 10:12 PM

38. What an amazing post! Love every word and I'm glad to see that minorities are still giving Sanders

the side eye. I really love so much of what he does but that man's blind spot is fourteen miles wide.

Thanks for that Esquire link too.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #17)

Tue Apr 4, 2017, 02:29 AM

21. Number23, I'm so happy to see you again!

I missed you.

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Response to betsuni (Reply #21)

Tue Apr 18, 2017, 10:14 PM

39. Hey darling! I'm only here for a minute. This place lost its allure for me years ago

I used to spend half my damn day on DU, EVERY day. Now, I can hardly stand to do about 20 minutes a month.

It's lovely to see you again.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #39)

Tue Apr 18, 2017, 10:21 PM

40. Oh, hey!

Yeah, I thought that was probably the case. Once a month is enough, an online menstruation. The AA Group used to be such fun... Oh well! See you around.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #17)

Tue Apr 4, 2017, 03:50 AM

22. They know

That we see things as they are. We can't be manipulated.

Glad to see your comments here!

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Response to Number23 (Reply #17)

Tue Apr 4, 2017, 11:54 AM

23. I think it's quite plausible that economic concerns and racism are intertwined for white Americans.

 

As for black and Latino voters, the issue last November seems to have been one of turnout. Of course, a not insignificant part of that was the systematic efforts by Republican state legislators to suppress their votes paying off. Look at Wisconsin and North Carolina for particularly egregious examples.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #17)

Thu Apr 6, 2017, 10:01 AM

36. It is the threat of the loss of white privilege, and that's white economic privilege.

Whites are supposed to get the good jobs first, and this group is not getting them, and Trump said he would get their privilege back to them, basically. So, they voted for that. Their own perceived self-interest. Trump conned them, though.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #17)

Fri Jun 16, 2017, 11:57 AM

43. ...

 

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Tue Apr 4, 2017, 02:24 AM

20. K&R

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Wed Apr 5, 2017, 03:19 PM

24. For the same reason that white drug addicts need understanding and treatment

but when the black community faced a similar health crisis, they got three strike law and longer prison sentences. Race plays into every aspect of life in this country, but if you are the ones getting the understanding and second chances, it is easy and convenient to ignore that fact.

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Response to wildeyed (Reply #24)

Wed Apr 5, 2017, 04:29 PM

25. Yes! This++++++

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Response to wildeyed (Reply #24)

Wed Apr 5, 2017, 05:05 PM

28. It's a false equivalency to say the health crisis was the problem. It was the criminal activity

that could be associated with drug use and no financial means of supporting an addiction that was probably a factor in users being sentenced. The others of course are perception, money, a good lawyer and any priors. I don't support the law, it is punitive and abusive.
"Three Strikes" statute provides for mandatory life imprisonment if a convicted felon: (1) has been convicted in federal court of a "serious violent felony"; and (2) has two or more previous convictions in federal or state courts, at least one of which is a "serious violent felony" (the other offense may be a serious drug offense). The sentencing enhancements in this law can have a significant impact on a criminal defendant.

What Is A Serious Violent Felony?

The statute defines a serious violent felony to include:

Murder;
Manslaughter;
Sex offenses;
Kidnapping;
Robbery; and
Any offense punishable by 10 years or more which includes an element of the use of force or involves a significant risk of force

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Response to 58Sunliner (Reply #28)

Wed Apr 5, 2017, 06:01 PM

31. Treating a disease as a moral failing and criminal problem leads to predictably bad results.

Not sure if I understand your reply. People, mostly black people, are STILL in jail for drug offenses that would net a few years, max, now.

Widespread addiction was/is a symptom of larger dysfunction in society. Urban black community were segregated, redlined and 'renewed' into a state of chronic economic instability. Chronic stress can lead to mental illness, including addiction. White rural communities now find themselves in similar situation and are having many of the same problems. But somehow society see their suffering and is willing to extend a helping hand and a bunch of second chances. Which is GOOD. They are right to see addiction as a disease. It's progress. But it makes me really mad that when the black community has identical problems, we called them immoral and criminal. We didn't see them as humans who were suffering in difficult situations. We see them as people who brought it on themselves.

Criminalizing drug addiction just creates more criminals. That's fairly clear. Yet there is a whole different standard for POC who suffer with the disease.

And that is white privilege in a nutshell for me. White people suffer. Addiction, chronic economic instability, you name it. And they say, "I suffer too! All people suffer! Don't make it all about race! If you fix my suffering, it will get better for ALL people who suffer!" But they don't see the different standards that society applies to POC with identical problems or why that might need a separate remedy. All they can see is their own suffering.

Or at least that is my view as a white person who dealt with addiction problems, got MANY extra chances, eventually got better and is a functional, contributing member of society now. If I was treated as criminal I would have become one permanently. Or maybe just died. Who knows.

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Response to wildeyed (Reply #31)

Wed Apr 5, 2017, 10:28 PM

34. We should legalize drugs and stop the drug war.

Take it out of the equation and stop shaming addicts. What will it take to get there? Then we can have a reset and see where we are.
Where is a candidate that will speak up?

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Wed Apr 5, 2017, 04:45 PM

26. Thank you JHan

and verysmartbrothas. The reference to the "Matrix" is spot on. Morpheus is the brains and Neo is the white hero, just layers and layers of good script writing in the original. I'll take the blue pill, the red is Alice in horror land without music, art, science or values.

Also, maybe they do see it, but they just don’t want to admit that the country is as flawed as we’ve been saying it is. Perhaps they’re Neo immediately after he’s taken the red pill; the shock of the real world too much for them to comprehend. And there’s no Trinity available to myrrh for their hot foreheads; just selfies with Ann Coulter.

Those, of course, are optimistic answers to that question. A less optimistic answer would be that they too have a critical stake in the preservation of White supremacy, and their obliviousness is an intentional ploy to retain that status. How do you feel about that?

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Response to saidsimplesimon (Reply #26)

Wed Apr 5, 2017, 08:36 PM

32. I never thought it was an accident

that the sexists and the racists started using the analogy of the red pill.

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Wed Apr 5, 2017, 04:49 PM

27. Yes, race was a factor. And let us look at another important factor.

As important, if not more important by race, was the number of male votes for DT. Across the racial spectrum. I find it interesting that there seems to be a willingness to ignore the role sexism played.
I also withhold judgment until we find out definitively whether or not this election was hacked.

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Response to 58Sunliner (Reply #27)

Wed Apr 5, 2017, 05:13 PM

30. Agreed. For some males (regardless of color) Trump's machismo was very appealing..

his "telling it like it is" , his track record with women and disregard for norms.

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Response to JHan (Reply #30)

Wed Apr 5, 2017, 10:24 PM

33. Yes machismo was appealing. I was not surprised given the rape culture.

I guess I might have been more surprised if men, white men given their numbers, had voted en masse for HC. It was a 2fer. And twice as hard to digest.

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Response to 58Sunliner (Reply #27)

Thu Apr 6, 2017, 05:04 AM

35. i think sexism played a part. many union guys who supported Kerry, Obama and other male democrats

did not support Hillary. it was clearly sexism. i think this played a part in the rust belt.

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Wed Apr 5, 2017, 05:13 PM

29. Great article, a good read.

Much needed today.

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Sun Apr 9, 2017, 12:59 PM

37. thank you

 

for a great OP and link, again. Had it in my old computer and lost a lot of good links. True...100%

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Response to JHan (Original post)

Thu Jun 15, 2017, 01:58 PM

41. Insulting millions of people who ALWAYS vote does not win elections.

 

Particularly in swing states, and regardless of whether it's deserved. You just don't do that if you want to actually uh, be elected rather than trying to convince everybody how morally upright and non-deplorable you are in comparison to those poor hicks in Flyover Country.

The Wall Street and other corporate connections don't help, either, in our era of rich people's growth at the expense of everyone else - particularly the working class and the poor - yes, disproportionately but by no means exclusively working class and poor people of color. You can't claim to be the "Party of the People" and be taken seriously when all too many people suspect that you're more interested in diversifying elected offices and corporate boardrooms than you are in helping everyone else - "everyone else" (still) disproportionately including women, people of color, and other marginalized people and communities.

We need to do better.

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Response to YoungDemCA (Reply #41)

Thu Jun 15, 2017, 02:06 PM

42. You don't insult your base by diminishing the perniciousness of racism.

When your base is most affected by it,,,Deplorable is besides the point, it is an observation that is true unless you want to deny it. You persist in being more outraged over this being pointed out than the fuckery itself.

And I am tired of the stupid corporatist meme which has done significant damage to the democratic brand. One party in America is beholden to corporatist interests and it ain't the democrats.

EDIT: if you want to make a salient argument about clever ways to reach out to these people ( admittedly deplorable was politically problematic for Clinton) I'm all for it, but being empathetic does not mean you excuse fuckery, white wash it, pretend it doesn't exist or it wasn't a factor.

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