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Can you imagine believing this?
And that's gun control in a nutshell.
65 replies
= new reply since forum marked as read
= new reply since forum marked as read
Last edited Sun May 29, 2016, 11:40 AM - Edit history (2)
no country in the world has gun crime like America.
Thats not a standard to judge whether or not Americans en masse are capable of safely owning guns. Statistics of misuse versus non- misuse are, which is why you want to use the rest of the world as a standard and ignore the statistics unchallenged.
Sorry. Not happening here.
It's obviously the exception.
America is the exception in many ways.
It doesn't matter if a lot of non-violent Americans have to suffer because of a few (relatively speaking) violent people.
Oh, it matters.
As a society America suffers greatly because of guns.
Such nonsense. Any suffering is because of individuals making bad choices, not because of the majority - roughly 100 million people - that don't make bad choices. Shared responsibility for the heinous criminal acts of individuals is and always has been a bullshit argument made nearly exclusively by people that hate guns.
And the only reasonable solution is a complete ban.
There is NOTHING reasonable about a complete ban. NOTHING.
Self-defence is not a legitimate use.
That's nice, but I was talking self-defense, and in America self defense is legitimate and moral, whether one uses a gun or a sword or a club or ones fists.
Ask Europeans who suffer from almost no gun crime if they'd trade thousands of people dead at the end of a gun per year for access to guns for self-defence.
Guess how much I give a fuck what Europeans think*.
The fact that Americans feel that it's a good trade off, thousands of kids shot dead a year, 300,000 dead at the end of a gun per decade in exchange for access to a weapon of death for self-defence, is a symptom of American's inability to properly control themselves with guns.
"Thousands" of kids shot dead every year? Puhleeze. The 99.9+percent of gun owners that do not misuse their firearms resulting in death, is elegant proof that the only people that can not control themselves with guns, is a tiny percent of a percent. You have no argument against that.
Ask Europeans who suffer from almost no gun crime if they'd trade thousands of people dead at the end of a gun per year for access to guns for self-defence.
See my comment above with the * near the end.
You can believe what you want, but I live in Europe now and my kids have LITERALLY never heard of a school shooting.
Bully for you. I prefer living here, thanks. My kids will never be subject to living under stupidity that leads to signs like these:
If you think I'd trade all of that so that I could have a gun to defend myself you'd be wildly wrong.
I don't really care what you would or wouldn't trade. Live your life over there as you see fit, and extend us here in America the same courtesy.
Your whole post reeks of anti-gun dogma and canned anti-gun talking points.
It doesn't matter what percent misuse guns.
It most certainly does. The people who aren't committing gun violence, the 99.9+ percent of gun owners, have a voice in this too, and we aren't going away because you feel that we statistically don't matter.
The outcome is thousands of dead kids per year and tens of thousands of dead Americans.
Thousands of dead kids? You claim that repeatedly, but you never substantiate it. Why is that?
I don't care one iota if you're a safe gun user because your safe gun use - in fact 99% of gun owners safe gun usage - does exactly nothing to save the lives of all of those people.
I don't care that you don't care. You aren't the arbiter of anything here. Maybe I'll start donating to what ever irish pro-gun group I can find, and start posting screenshots of the receipts, and see if you appreciate me sticking my nose into your countries affairs as much as you seem to enjoy sticking your nose into the affairs of mine.
And self-defense... I now live in Ireland which is endlessly safer.
Bully for you.
My kids and kids all over the country have never even heard of a school shooting. They've never had to be taught how to shelter in place.
That's nice. My kids will never need ID to buy plastic utensils:
Taking away all guns removes the need for guns to protect against guns.
Taking away all the guns, leaves the old the infirm and the physically weak at a major disadvantage to those who aren't.
That's a fact.
Because until the gun violence epidemic in America is solved America as a country can not be trusted with guns.
There is no 'epidemic' of gun violence. There are people, a tiny percentage of a percentage, making bad choices.
Nothing more, nothing less. Calling it an 'epidemic' is just canned anti-gun hyperbole intended to scaremonger.
and was not addressed in federal gun laws until the National Firearms Act was amended in 1968. There simply wasn't a market for them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destructive_device
When this amendment passed, the IRS sent out press releases to pick up the forms at the local post office. There also an amnesty to register your war trophy MP-40 or whatever. The quality of journalism being what it is, some local papers reported that you need to register your guns at the post office. My local paper did that, and my mom and I went to register her .25-06 rifle. So did half the town. The clerk measured the barrel and and pointed to the poster that showed what needed to be registered.
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30k people a year die from plastic knives get back to me with your silliness.
Because it was 30k people dying from plastic utensils that prompted those regs, right?
And no saying that some people can be trusted with a grenade doesn't mean grenades should be readily available to the public.
Anti-gunners can't help but conflate, like you're doing here. Because a discriminate weapon like a firearm that actually has to be aimed, is exactly like an indiscriminate weapon that kills anyone in its proximity.
Oh wait. They are illegal. Because there's no safe way for 350m Americans to have access to hand grenades without lots of death. Kinda like guns.
Oh, wait. You don't know fuckall about this subject, and are spewing falsehoods again. Grenades ARE legal to own under the national firearms act of 1934.
Oops. They're legally referred to as 'destructive devices' under the NFA. Look it up.
You can pretend 30k people dying a year from one cause, for decades, includes thousands and thousands of children isn't an epidemic, then you don't know what an epidemic is.
You can pretend that suicide and homicide have the same causes and therefore require the same solutions, to your hearts content, although it makes you look like you care nothing for the lives your using in a failed attempt to prop up your argument, since not correctly identifying the root cause does them all a major disservice. We on the other hand, can point out that factually, that suicides and homicides aren't the same, and they therefore don't have the same solutions.
I note that you still have yet to substantiate the "thousands of children" talking point. I thusly dismiss it, until such time as you substantiate it.
As to what an 'epidemic' is, meet mister dictionary:
ep·i·dem·ic: a widespread occurrence of an infectious disease in a community at a particular time.
"a flu epidemic"
Gun violence isn't an infectious disease, nor are individually made bad choices.
As far as the elderly... Now that IS scaremongering. Elderly people are much less likely to suffer from violent crime in Europe and guess what - they don't have guns to protect themselves. Huh.
None of which refutes the fact that such people are at a disadvantage.
All American pro-gun arguments boil down to the same thing: justifications for the senseless deaths of 10s of thousands of Americans.
All anti-gun arguments boil down to the same thing: Blaming deaths on the instrument rather than the people that choose to misuse that instrument, and short of that, blaming the people that aren't committing gun violence because they don't agree with you about the instrument.
Nothing new there.
Look...you aren't very good at this. You haven't any depth of understanding of the subject matter (tell me more about the legality of grenades, wont you?), and your anti-gun retread arguments keep coming off the wheels, as all anti-gun retread arguments inevitably do. At least consider boning up on the facts before you come in here wasting everyones time with falsehoods and hyperbole.
"...Constitution that gives us our right..." The right is innate; not created by the Constitution or any other law.
"...Federal, State and Local governments..." Federal and state yes, local less so.
"...the right to control and curb the right..." Governments don't have rights they have power/authority. Their laws neither control nor curb any rights. Laws delimit criminal activity such that a reasonable person can deter ahead what is and isn't a crime.
A sincere thanks for joining the discussion and welcome to the group. 
