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mzteris

(16,232 posts)
Sat Apr 12, 2014, 12:56 PM Apr 2014

When is it time

to intervene?

You try not to interfere. You try to get them to help themselves. And they have taken the "first steps" - sort of. But they are falling apart. Minute by minute. It sounds like. You only have phone contact. One call they're all I don't know what to do I'm falling apart. The next it's stop trying to run my life. The next it's screaming and anger. The next it's tears and confusion.

You think if you can get them to hang on until the meds kick in (probably at least another week or two - more likely two or three but hey I'm trying to get him to hang the fuck on!)

He's trying to make life changing decisions in the the throws of a deep clinical depression (he went off his meds). His gd stupid mf'ing new doctors think his request for "anxiety" medication is some sort of gd ruse to get drugs. Hell, he's had full fledged panic attacks since at least five years old. He exhibited OCD when he was less than a year old.

And then they give the former gd cutter a f'ing rubber band to snap when he "feels anxious" - does that sound like sound therapy to you? He kinda likes that pain . . . ijuts.

So he wants to give up everything. His life's dream. To do what? He doesn't know. He can barely decide to get out of bed. From what I can gather he's eating pretzels and hasn't bathed, washed dishes, or anything fing thing but the bare minimum - and a paid gig - hey he can get to THAT because it's part of something "larger", but he can't go to CLASS? I know the career path is fraught with angst and perfection - that's why he freaking chose it in the first place (of course he was 13 at the time) but it's seven years later and he has poured his heart and soul into it. He thinks he's a failure because he's not gd PERFECT. what artist is? If you were, why would you be an artist? He says he can't do it anymore, but he doesn't want to do anything else.

I don't know what to do. Do I go and get him? Do I let him make his own choices? WHAT? Am I being an over-bearing controlling mom, or am I saving his life if I just say fuck it and go and get him. I firmly believe if he can just hang the f on until his anti depressants kick in in a week or so, he can make "better" decisions about his life. If he could get the gd doc to prescibe real anti-anxiety meds, then he could probably function. But to give up NOW. To give up everything. To blow up every bridge and connection and possibility because you're too damn depressed/unstable to make a good decision - an informed decision - is unconscionable to me. When he gets back to being mentally stable, is he going to be totally pissed off that he ended his love/career choice under the auspices of being unstable? (And blame me of course.)

I accept the fact that no matter what the fuck, it's my fault. I blame myself, he will blame me, everyone will blame me - and I don't give a fing rats ass. I just want my son alive and kicking.

We can figure out what to do - I think. He just has to be stable enough to do it. I'm worried that he's on the edge. He feels like a failure and he will never ever ever be any good so why even try and everyone who says he has talent is LYING!

I'm half a damn country away. I cajole and encourage, I rant and threaten and bribe and try logic and emotion and blackmail and everything I can think of to just get him to HANG ON - for just a couple of more weeks. Just. Hang. On.

But I'm not sure he can last that long. So do I just go and get him. Have him committed there or here. What? he's so confused and lost and doesn't know what to do. I don't know what to do. He's scared and confused and I'm scared for him.

Do I get on a plane? Do I make him get on one? Do I try to MAKE him marginally function there until the meds kick in?

I don't know what to do. I'm so afraid. I feel so guilty about every damn thing, but it's not about me and I don't give a f about me - I just
1. want my kid ALIVE,
2. want him reasonable sane,
3. want him to live the life he wants,
4. don't want him making life changing decisions while clinically depressed and suffering from major anxiety and untreated OCD. (and oh yeah, did I mention he's probably at least somewhere - even on the top end - of the aspie spectrum, and we're pretty sure mild tourettes?)

What what what? I'm not all that gd stable myself at this point. I'm on my meds, but the stress is putting me over the edge which isn't fair to my other son (still at home) or anyone else.

17 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
When is it time (Original Post) mzteris Apr 2014 OP
. libodem Apr 2014 #1
That's a tough choices in a nightmare situation. I know a little bit of what you're going through... marble falls Apr 2014 #2
he drove to the studio. mzteris Apr 2014 #5
We all have an aspect that others cannot understand. marble falls Apr 2014 #12
VERY rough. elleng Apr 2014 #3
That would be good. mzteris Apr 2014 #6
Good to hear you actually SPOKE with his therapist, elleng Apr 2014 #7
Thank God you could talk to her get the red out Apr 2014 #14
oh, mzteris fizzgig Apr 2014 #4
If it weren't for my younger son mzteris Apr 2014 #8
Sounds like a little progress has already been made libodem Apr 2014 #9
thank you. mzteris Apr 2014 #10
That is a good sign that he is reaching out libodem Apr 2014 #11
Then why mzteris Apr 2014 #13
Honey, no, it's not like that get the red out Apr 2014 #15
Thanks. mzteris Apr 2014 #16
The really scary part is if you get law enforcement involved angstlessk Jun 2014 #17

marble falls

(56,029 posts)
2. That's a tough choices in a nightmare situation. I know a little bit of what you're going through...
Sat Apr 12, 2014, 01:43 PM
Apr 2014

and I have no insight that makes this any easier. The most important person to worry about is you. If you can't be strong there's no one to advocate for your son. You've done the first and most important thing for him right now. He's alive and will be reasonably safe. You've made a decision for his safety and treatment and it is important to stick with it so long as he's not deteriorating or in direct danger. Keep paying attention and let everybody know it, question doctor and treatment but without something you personally know keep your son in treatment.

My prayers are with you and your son.

mzteris

(16,232 posts)
5. he drove to the studio.
Sat Apr 12, 2014, 02:08 PM
Apr 2014

He called me and I talked him through getting out of the car. even through the panic attack. Breathe, son. Breathe.

He actually walked in to the building. hurrah. Whether he says or not? Well, I consider it a win anyway.

I told him he didn't have to talk to any one. He doesn't owe anyone an explanation. That if they ask where's he been, it's because they care, not because they're nosy (well most of them ) but he didn't have to answer. He could say, I've not been feeling well. Say, hey, sorry - got to go change. That observing the social niceties/amenities would be a nice thing, but not required if he's not feeling up to it. He can leave if he's overwhelmed.

But that I was proud of him for showering. For getting in the car and driving there. For getting OUT of the car. For walking in the building. If he has to leave, I'm still glad he made it this far. That's a whole damn lot.

He did say he broke down in front of his neighbors as he was leaving, but I told him, so what? They're either his friends and understand or accept him - and worry about him - or they don't so who gives a fk.

He doesn't have to explain his absence or his illness or his mental state. he doesn't have to say anything. if he feels compelled, a simple I didn't feel well should suffice. Persistent questions can be met with silence or I have to go or I dont' want to talk it about it.

But also that there is absolutely NO SHAME to having a mental issue so being open about depression and anxiety is okay, too. but I don't think he's there yet. And so what if he's not. One foot in front of the other. Just keep walking.

I am very very open about my depression and anxiety and meds. I quit hiding it. I talk about it it freely. I'm not a failure beause of it. I'm a "failure' if i know it and don't at least try and fix it. (Though I honestly don't assign that word 'failure' to anyone either. Except myself, of course. ha. And here's the best part, at least two people - that I know of- at work has sought professional help and are functioning so so so much better.

It's time to stop hiding. It's NOT OUR FAULT. We have to stop acting like it's some sort of personal failure. Of course I've had a lifetime to learn to live with this. He's just getting started with a judgmental group of young people who haven't a gd clue yet.

elleng

(129,772 posts)
3. VERY rough.
Sat Apr 12, 2014, 01:55 PM
Apr 2014

I might go out to hold his hand for the duration. Would of course be good if you could discuss this with the gd docs.

mzteris

(16,232 posts)
6. That would be good.
Sat Apr 12, 2014, 02:10 PM
Apr 2014

I told him I'd be on the next plane if that's what it takes. But I also dn't want to crowd him. BUT, if I think he's too close to the edge, the gdmit, I'm coming.

I do have another son at home to consider and make arrangements for - which ain't easy by a long shot. But I do what I have to do.

His therapist - surprisingly - called me back the other day. She couldn't say much, but I did give her a brief synopsis, earful about his life, him, and his physiological heritage. Hope that helps.

elleng

(129,772 posts)
7. Good to hear you actually SPOKE with his therapist,
Sat Apr 12, 2014, 02:15 PM
Apr 2014

and would be excellent if he could help, close-up and personal.

get the red out

(13,456 posts)
14. Thank God you could talk to her
Mon Apr 14, 2014, 01:08 PM
Apr 2014

What you described as "therapy" is like a band-aid over a gaping wound. I have major depression, OCD, and General Anxiety disorder. I've been on a bad down-swing of late but I keep talking to my doctors/therapists and describing my symptoms. They need to know what his deal is, little band aids won't work, I tried that route and ended up obsessing on death non-stop. Of all people who should know that this is a brain disease it is the professionals who have gone to school to treat it.

Thoughts for you. I do know one thing, since I have an elderly mother that I inherited this shit from, when she went into free-fall after the death of my Dad I had to bug the living hell out of the people who were supposed to be treating her, I had to become the thorn in their ass that got infected and spewed puss, they had to get sick of hearing me on the phone. Different professionals over and over, until finally someone listened before it was too late and she has been stable for almost 2 years now, the most stable she has ever been in her life.

Sometimes we have to be the itch the professionals cannot scratch. My Sister and I were at the point of going to court to get my Mom declared incompetent if nothing had been able to be done. It didn't have to go that far but we were the itch they couldn't get rid of.

fizzgig

(24,146 posts)
4. oh, mzteris
Sat Apr 12, 2014, 02:01 PM
Apr 2014

i cannot imagine how awful this is for the both of you.

how do you think he'd react if you got on that plane? it sounds as though it would be good for him to have someone around, but you can't make him do anything, all you can do is be there for him. is there any way he would sign a consent form for you to talk to his docs and put some pressure on that end?

i don't have kids, so i can't fully relate to how you're feeling and it's been awhile since i was that age, so i really can't say how i would have reacted to my mom intervening. but it does sound like he needs more help than what he's getting.

my love to you both

mzteris

(16,232 posts)
8. If it weren't for my younger son
Sat Apr 12, 2014, 02:37 PM
Apr 2014

at home, I'd've been there by now. But I have a responsibility to him, too. And I have no one here, really, that I can count on to help me out so I feel really really stuck and torn between responsibilities.

It's like you have one life preserver and both kids are drowning, which one do you save? Though the latter isn't in danger of drowning, but leaving him alone isn't a really a very good option except in an extreme emergency. And even then - well, it would be - complicated, not easy, fraught with complications for everyone - so many many issues to leaving him home.

I love my children. I'd do anything for them. But they all deserve everything I can do.

I find it ironic - okay this is a weird aside but it came up in conversation with the older - that the most stable one in the family is adopted and his birth family has some very very significant mental health, behavioural, and lifestyle issues. I just find that an interesting and slightly odd fact worth exploration. (Though I tend to seek surcease from sorrow and confusion in logic and puzzles on an esoteric level. You know, something to occupy my mind to keep from running screaming naked through streets brandishing scissors. . . )

Thank you, though. I feel so very alone. I don't feel I can talk to ANYone. Co-workers? Well some know something is going on because I've had to put them on notice I may just up and leave. My younger son - no . Not only doesn't he want to talk/hear about it, he probably shouldn't. the exhusband/dad? ROFLMAO. he's useless as far as I'm concerned. but the son - who blames the dad (and the f'er is to blame = though *I* should have stepped up sooner) for that vast majority of the incidents that exacerbated the issues - seems to listen to the (non-practicing alcoholic dad on occasion) though IMO the advice pretty much royally sucks - but at least he's TALKING. But *I* can't talk to him (the dad). I "stress him out". He doesn't want to 'hear it" - how bad it is. His big plan is we shoudl pull the plug and stop paying for everything (like he's paying for a damn thing.) I don't want to keep enabling, either, but my son has to get stable first, right?

libodem

(19,288 posts)
9. Sounds like a little progress has already been made
Sat Apr 12, 2014, 02:39 PM
Apr 2014

I feel for you in the position you are in. I don't have any answers but your love and support over the phone seem to help sustain his confidence. What a good caring mom you are being. You are not rushing to judgement or rushing in to take over and do it for him. His knowing that you believe he can cope and find a way may be his greatest gift. Yet, he knows you would fly in for a rescue, allows him to know if he absolutely can't do it, he has back up.

mzteris

(16,232 posts)
10. thank you.
Sat Apr 12, 2014, 02:44 PM
Apr 2014

It's so hard to know if I'm doing the right thing or the wrong thing or the best thing.

I really just want to go and get him and love and squeeze him and take him home and call him george (ok I seek refuge in dumb jokes).

I really do just want to go get him, but I think - right now - it's the wrong thing. That may change with the next phone call. Fortunately, I am in a position financially to that. I'd have to sell a kidney to retire, but dammit I can get there.

I consider it a HUGE WIN hat he keeps calling. He's maintaining contact. He's talking - even when he's screaming.

libodem

(19,288 posts)
11. That is a good sign that he is reaching out
Sat Apr 12, 2014, 03:11 PM
Apr 2014

I've been on both sides with mental health issues as one who has depression and as a care provider. The prevailing wisdom asks if they are a danger to themselves or another. If it is clearly a possibility of suicide or hurting another person a judge can order a 72.hour hold for an evaluation. But that is horribly drastic and dissolves all the trust. Nobody likes to be locked up and institutions are no rest and relaxation palaces. They suck. And it costs a fortune.

You are his beacon. Stay as tuned in, centered and loving as you have been, and reinforce his ability to cope. You are a beautiful, mom.

mzteris

(16,232 posts)
13. Then why
Sun Apr 13, 2014, 12:20 AM
Apr 2014

Do I feel like such a horrible mom? It's my fault that he got my genes . And his dads too, I suppose. Neither of us are what you'd call paragons of stability. Our lives have not contributed to our sons well being, though I thought I was doing a good job for a long long time. Not sure where it ran so totally off the rails. Or how I missed how bad it was.

I'm supposed to protect him and take care of him and fix everything. And yeah, I know at some point he has to grow up and be a man on his own terms, no matter what those terms are. I know I can't control him or make him or anything, and part of me doesn't want to. But gd I'm so afraid for him. Let's face it, I'm afraid for me. I can't bear the thought of him harming himself. I also can't bear the thought of having him ...put under observation ... Though if he gets even a whiff of that, I don't know what he'd do to avoid it.

Thank you, though. It helps oh so much to be able to talk about it. I have no one in my life in whom to confide. (Except my psych and my appt isn't for months since *i* was doing so well. Which also makes me feel guilty. I'd gladly sacrifice my sanity for his. I've lived with this my whole life, I can deal a little bit longer. Just please dear universe, make my son okay.

get the red out

(13,456 posts)
15. Honey, no, it's not like that
Mon Apr 14, 2014, 01:13 PM
Apr 2014

We all have our path. My Mom was crazy as hell and refused treatment until we made her as a last resort a few years ago. My sister and I have inherited her genes, and bad mental health genes from our Dad's side too. What you are is what my Mom was never capable of when my illness appeared, LOVING. You still love your child. My Mom could not do that. When I asked for help for my severe OCD and depression at 17 I became my illness in her eyes, I was no longer her honor student, I was sickness walking. You love your son, you are a good Mom. My Mom wasn't capable of that because she was so caught up in her own fear of someone figuring out that the apple didn't fall too far from the tree. And as sick as she was, that was probably all she could do.

You have love, you are a good Mom!!!!!

mzteris

(16,232 posts)
16. Thanks.
Mon Apr 14, 2014, 09:27 PM
Apr 2014

It as good to hear. I do beat myself up. Daily. Over everything. And hey, I'm doing better... But this has really put me in a tailspin.

It's hard enough being a parent, period. You Thorpe in this alphabet soup of mental health issues on either side and it gets really really hard. You put on both sides, and it's damn near insurmountable.

I guess the only good thing about my mental health history is, shen I tell him I know what he's going through, he actually believes me. And sometimes, he listens.

Today was a pretty good day. That's all I can ask for right now.

angstlessk

(11,862 posts)
17. The really scary part is if you get law enforcement involved
Tue Jun 17, 2014, 05:54 AM
Jun 2014

They No Longer Serve And Protect...They Seem More Interested In Killing The Enemy, Which It Turns Out Are Regular Citizens

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