Are Straight People Born That Way?

[xchrom]

http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2012/03/are-straight-people-born-that-way/254592/

Time for a thought experiment: Are straight people born that way? When I put the question to a number of sexology colleagues, they thought it a good question -- indeed, a hard question.

To answer it, we have to start with a more fundamental question: What do we mean when we say someone is "straight"? At the most basic level, we seem to be imagining female bodies that are specifically sexually aroused by male bodies, and vice versa.

Laboratory studies such as those conducted by Michael Bailey of Northwestern University and Meredith Chivers of Queens University suggest that, while such people probably do exist -- at least in North America, where many sexologists have focused their attentions -- it's not uncommon for straight-identified people to be at least a little aroused by the idea of same-sex relations.

The media has tended to broadcast the news that gay-identified men and straight-identified men have quite discernible arousal patterns when they are shown various kinds of sexual stimuli. And that's true. But if you look closely at the data, you'll see that most straight-identified men do tend to show a little bit of arousal across sex categories (as do gay-identified men).

[ejpoeta]

1. i often want to ask people who say being gay is a choice if they chose to be straight.

they tend to not understand the question. of course they just ARE straight. I don't see how gay people choose to be gay any more than straight people choose to be straight. you just are. It's accepting it and being accepted by others that is at issue.

[wandy]

2. Well you asked....

I think it's just how you're born. I guess I'm stright not that it makes a diffrence. Let me try to explain. It's spring. Time to wake up the dragon. 35 years ago I fell in love with a big yellow hunking Mopar. For what the dam thing cost I could have had a Corvett. But no! had to be a flipping Chrysler. You are what you are.
So. I'm about to be covered with used oil and grease but it could be a shiney new Totota.
But that's what I yam.
You are what you am.
Be what you are.
Like I said.
You asked.
Wandy

[closeupready]

3. Personally, I think most "straight" people are lying,

particularly those who make a point to say that they are straight. Likely, they are bisexual.

[Kali]

5. well I will jump in since this was brought to my attention in meta

are you being sarcastic or do you really think self-identified straights are liars?

and as pointed out in the alert to this post: what happens if you change the word "straight" to gay?

[closeupready]

6. Read what I wrote, not what you want to read.

Most means "most"; "most" does not mean "all".

[Kali]

8. that is a potentially large group of people

that you are calling liars. I repeat - what if you change the word "straight" to "gay"? same opinion?

[William769]

10. The Jury has spoken, so thats the end of it.

There is a reason someone is blocked from this Group.

Please don't drag Meta bullshit into our Group, We will not tolerate it.

Thanks for your understanding.

William769

[Kali]

11. excuse me

I wasn't bringing meta in here, that is just how I came to be here. I was discussing the post by closeupready, not "meta bullshit."

is that really not allowed? I haven't been rude or disrespectful have I? Someone posted an opinion about something and I wanted to discuss that. Do you have an opinion on the statement re: most straights who call themselves straight being bi?

[William769]

12. I will not ask a second time.

[closeupready]

17. No, because there is no social currency in claiming to be 'gay'.

To the contrary, to openly state that you are gay is to diminish your own standing within a homophobic society, such as ours. People are mostly unwilling to do that, even gay people. Those who do are doing so for compelling reasons, IME and IMO.

And to openly state that you are 'straight' is to reinforce your mainstream credentials. Look at Ricky Martin. I don't think he ever claimed to be straight, but of course, his recordings and videos were all about getting the girl, the sexy straight sex, etc. He later came out, but the compelling reason, he stated, were his children - he wanted them to know that, like Daddy, you don't have to lie about yourself, you can be honest.

[closeupready]

7. One more thing: this is OUR forum.

I can speak freely here, even if I can't in GD or LBN.

[Kali]

9. I don't question your right to do anything

I just question your opinion. Am I not allowed to do that? I don't think I have been rude or disrespectful in any way, have I?

Your assertion doesn't jibe with anything I have ever read or experienced (from either end of the spectrum) so I came to discuss it with you.

[closeupready]

15. Okay, let's agree we'll be respectful of differing opinions.

yes, I personally think most people who overtly identify as "straight" are lying - not in any clearly sinister way, or exploitive way (though that also exists - see, for example, Roy Cohn). Most are simply aware of 1) heterosexual feelings/desires; and 2) the negative social baggage that comes with being gay; and so 3) decide to err on the side that benefits them most, "since I have heterosexual desires, I'm straight."

I think the percentage is greater than 50% and less than 100% of those who identify as "straight" that they are truly bisexual, aware of their homosexual desires, fantasies and dreams, but denying the significance/importance of these manifestations both to themselves and to society.

I would also point out that there are a number of cultures where homosexual activities are socially permissible under certain circumstances. Western culture is generally not one of them, and adults must 'choose' to be either straight or gay. So the fact that so many lie about their sexuality is, to a very big extent, an artifact of cultural conditioning.

[Marrah_G]

16. I think you are right in that many people have bisexual thoughts and feelings

But if they never act on those, never really intend to act on those, I'm not sure I would consider them bisexual. I am Bi and to me that means that I would date a woman or a man, not just that I find women attractive or sometimes fantasize about them.

Human sexuality is a complicated things with many many shades of gray I think.

[closeupready]

18. Those are valid points.

You are correct, IMO, that human sexuality is very, very complicated. With six billion individuals who share a common drive known as sexuality, that's probably a given.

I think personally, I would indeed refer to such a person as 'bisexual'. I mean, based upon how I was raised and an earlier era that seems like it's fading to dust, each year, funny how that happens, lol.

[Marrah_G]

19. hehe

If it was easy we wouldn't need our own group

[ScreamingMeemie]

13. I don't think so, but then I don't hang out with too many people

who have made it a point to say that they are straight. That seems almost a mythical type of conversation to me.

[closeupready]

14. To be honest, I don't hang with ANY straight people.

I'm trying to remember if I ever did, and I don't think so.

[wandy]

21. Well try this....

This is a personal opinion. That being said. I capitel I think that some people are afraid of what they are.
I don't know how to put this. Or maybe.....
I've been into AMD processors since the 5X86.
Just me, just how I am; and you're not going to change it.
I'm also what you might call 'stright'.
That's not by choice. I just came that way.
We are all what we are.
So you are into Intel........
Big fat harry deal.

[closeupready]

22. If your point is, 'it shouldn't matter', I agree with you.

However, in the real world, Ricky Martin stayed closeted for a very, very good reason (or what he felt was a good reason) - basically, if he'd come out of the closet, he wouldn't have been as successful.

That is, we live in a homophobic society where it DOES matter. Look at Prop 8. Maggie Gallagher's NOM. The Knights of Columbus and the RCC. The military. Sports.

Just as light-skinned black people attempted to 'pass' when racism was rife, some gay people will try to 'pass' as straight since the benefits of doing so are legion, whereas the drawbacks of coming out of the closet are social isolation, poverty, disinheritance, etc.

Likewise, most everyone will either claim to be straight or make an attempt to appear straight, even if they are gay, lesbian or bisexual.

[wandy]

25. My point is; it shouldn't matter. That's all......

Look! It's about as silley as carring on about the color of youre skin.
Dam. When will we ever grow up.

[closeupready]

26. But it DOES matter, unfortunately.

At least we agree that it shouldn't. But sadly, it does very much matter. Still.

[FloridaJudy]

23. Well *I* certainly am!

I really did eat that last piece of chicken.

The cornflake crust was particularly tasty.

[dsc]

27. You could have been more artful in your post

I get your point but this comes close to accusing all straight people of lying. I do think many who make a point of bring up how straight they are, are likely similar to the lady who doth protest too much.

[closeupready]

28. Yes, in hindsight. I didn't realize how much controversy

it was going to stir up here. You have to concede that my original post was not written in such a way as to deliberately stir shit up.

Yes, it may be a minority viewpoint, and a little 'separatist'. But I stated my opinion in a very dry manner.

[Fearless]

29. I would agree with "some" or perhaps "many"

I've been to my share of parties with drunken frat guys (straight guys) who've done some questionably "gay" things. I think in the end we as humans have a majority opinion and a minority opinion in our heads. The majority opinion is the one that's going to win out most of the time, and is what we call ourselves. The minority opinion is one that wins out in special circumstances or with certain people or just at certain times for certain potentially unknown reasons. For instance, I know "straight" people who've had anal sex with guys, yet they still call themselves straight and 99% of the time sleep with women. There are just so many factors at play, I don't know that we can suggest for another person what they are. Maybe they are uncomfortable calling themselves something other than 100% straight. Or maybe it is still a societal expectation that the uber jock has to be straight. Whatever the reason, IMHO we need to take people at their word. Whatever they feel they are, they have a right to feel they are. Maybe there's a minority opinion inside that disagrees or acts in ways that disagree, but I don't think it does us any service call out straight/"straight" people on how they identify themselves any more than it is to call out someone who is LGBTQ.

That said, I tend to agree with you on your point. Many of those who make it a point to call themselves straight, maybe have that minority voice screaming at them a little (or maybe the majority one, who knows!) and they have to compensate to "save face". I'd also say the same about guys who talk about all the sex they have and guys who claim frequently to be well-endowed. I'd say that by and large they're both also compensating for something.

[closeupready]

30. See, I guess with regard to "drunken 'straight' frat guys"

who do 'gay things', that would be my first point of departure from you - if they do gay things, then at a minimum, they are bi. Just that simple.

If they later say they are straight, they are lying.

Same with these guys who claim 'situational homosexuality' - like ex-cons or those honorably discharged from the military. If you got into it, you're bi. Period.

[Fearless]

31. I would agree that their actions are bisexual by definition...

But I wouldn't go up to them and challenge the orientation that they identify with, any more than I would want them to challenge the orientation identity of any of our LGBTQers.

I definitely see where you're coming from though. Sometimes I just want to slap people upside the head and tell them to get over it!

[closeupready]

32. Yeah, it shouldn't matter.

but in our homophobic society, it very much does.

[Fearless]

33. Agreed! n/t

[Fearless]

4. People should just be themselves and leave everyone else well enough alone

Of course like that'll ever happen.

[racaulk]

20. The forum main page says this thread has 19 replies.

But I only see 6 of them upthread.

Confirmation that the people on my ignore list damn well deserve to be there.

[FloridaJudy]

24. You are a very wise man. EOM.