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shira

(30,109 posts)
Wed Dec 14, 2011, 06:48 PM Dec 2011

Wiesenthal Center names top 10 anti-Semitic slurs

NEW YORK (JTA) – A comment by Mahmoud Abbas referring to Palestine as the “holy land” placed first in the Simon Wiesenthal Center’s Top 10 Anti-Israel/Anti-Semitic Slurs of 2011.

The Palestinian Authority president made the remark at the U.N. General Assembly on Sept. 23.

“I come before you today from the Holy Land, the land of Palestine, the land of divine messages, ascension of the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him and the birthplace of Jesus Christ peace be upon him, to speak on behalf of the Palestinian people,” he said.

The Wiesenthal Center said it did not consider statements by terrorist organizations, the Iranian government or “the lunatic fringe."

http://www.jta.org/news/article/2011/12/13/3090716/list-of-top-anti-israel-anti-semetic-slurs-of-11-relesed


“I come before you today from the Holy Land, the land of Palestine, the land of divine messages, ascension of the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him and the birthplace of Jesus Christ peace be upon him, to speak on behalf of the Palestinian people…”

-Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas at his UN General Assembly address, September 23, 2011. Speaking to the world, Abbas omitted any reference to the Jewish people’s connection to the Holy Land. No reference to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, nor King David, King Solomon, or Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel. READ SOURCE...

http://www.wiesenthal.com/atf/cf/%7B54d385e6-f1b9-4e9f-8e94-890c3e6dd277%7D/TOP-TEN-SLURS_2011-FINAL.PDF
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Wiesenthal Center names top 10 anti-Semitic slurs (Original Post) shira Dec 2011 OP
Rich considering the group's "activities" : Jefferson23 Dec 2011 #1
Utter rubbish. Here's Israel's Supreme Court ruling on the site... shira Dec 2011 #2
The ruling did not change the irony. It is called the Museum of Tolerance..you missed that point. Jefferson23 Dec 2011 #4
I don't normally respond to your posts, because I normally have you on ignore Crunchy Frog Dec 2011 #3
Not a bad objection, but consider that in the speech... shira Dec 2011 #6
I think there's quite a bit of that going on on both sides. Crunchy Frog Dec 2011 #7
Denying Jewish history in Israel is an attempt to deny Israel's very legitimacy... shira Dec 2011 #11
But Abbas wasn't *denying* Jewish history in Israel LeftishBrit Dec 2011 #19
I think you're right.... shira Dec 2011 #22
In his speech Abbas said 63 years of Nakba (Palestinian Diaspora) not 63 years of occupation azurnoir Dec 2011 #10
Before the UN speech Abbas talked about bringing up the 63 year occupation... shira Dec 2011 #14
why did you pare Abbas statement in NYT down to one sentence? azurnoir Dec 2011 #16
What he was quoted as saying in according to the NYT is contradictory.... shira Dec 2011 #20
well that would be your opinion n/t azurnoir Dec 2011 #21
Presumably the fact that the Christians also had a connection to that land justified the Crusades?nt shaayecanaan Dec 2011 #13
I don't understand the connection you're making. Clarify please? n/t shira Dec 2011 #15
Abbas statement was more antisemitic than Holocaust support and denial, adoration of Hitler azurnoir Dec 2011 #5
Hillarious that their first example isn't antisemitism. Donald Ian Rankin Dec 2011 #8
It was the Simon Wiesenthal Centre, not the ADL... shaayecanaan Dec 2011 #12
I don't consider the first two listings anti-semitic. Little Tich Dec 2011 #9
The first one wasn't IMO LeftishBrit Dec 2011 #18
'CNN mistranslated Erdogan's Palestinian casualty remark' - Jerusalem Post Little Tich Dec 2011 #23
Shouildn't it be the "bottom" ten? bemildred Dec 2011 #17

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
1. Rich considering the group's "activities" :
Wed Dec 14, 2011, 07:20 PM
Dec 2011

Museum of Tolerance Special Report / Part I: Holes, Holiness and Hollywood

On the connection between the California-based Simon Wiesenthal Center, run by one of America’s most famous rabbis, the Israel Antiquities Authority, and a feverish excavation at what is probably Israel’s most secret civilian building site.

Sometimes a lack of sensitivity or even an innocent mistake exposes a major truth. On the Web site of Moriah, a public company for infrastructure work that belongs to the Jerusalem municipality, one can find descriptions of various projects in which the company is involved. Among them is the Museum of Tolerance: “The Simon Wiesenthal Center, the entrepreneur for the construction of the Museum of Tolerance in central Jerusalem, asked Moriah to carry out preparatory and infrastructure work for the project,” says the site. Immediately afterward, under the heading “Objective,” it says: “Carrying out infrastructure work, removal of nuisances in the area of the project ...” What the site calls “nuisances” are in fact skeletons, bones and skulls. Hundreds of skeletons that were buried in Jerusalem’s central Muslim cemetery over a period of some 1,000 years.

A Haaretz investigation indicates that the “nuisances” were cleared away from the site swiftly and clandestinely during five grueling months of nonstop work. Testimonies of participants who worked at the site, which were obtained by Haaretz, indicate that the skeletons were removed as quickly as possible to enable the start of construction on the museum. “That wasn’t archaeology, it was contract work,” claimed one of the workers.

The story of the Museum of Tolerance is one of a clash between worlds, between the concealed subterranean world of dead bodies − members of the Muslim community who were buried in the soil of Jerusalem − and an American Jewish institution in Los Angeles with Hollywood-style panache, the Simon Wiesenthal Center. The institution is headed by Marvin Hier, an American Jew who has an open door to U.S. presidents, and the man who brought California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger to Israel for the museum’s groundbreaking ceremony in 2004. Opposing him is the leader of the northern branch of the Islamic Movement in Israel, who has tried to block the project, it has been claimed, out of cynical and political motives.

The High Court of Justice was also involved in the story, with several petitions placed on its desk in an effort to prevent the realization of the ambitious and controversial project. The permission finally granted by the High Court to go forward was based on a controversial opinion submitted to it by the Antiquities Authority, and on the fact that the project was supposed to be designed by preeminent architect Frank Gehry, who has since withdrawn from the assignment. Also involved in the affair are two prominent former members of the Jerusalem municipality, who are currently suspected of criminal offenses in other real estate projects: former prime minister Ehud Olmert, who was mayor of Jerusalem, and former municipal engineer Uri Sheetrit.

Also involved in the story are Tel Aviv University and an archaeologist who works for the university, Alon Shavit. Shavit is a key figure in this story, who has held many jobs related to moving the graves located beneath the land on which the museum is slated to be built. Among other things, he was the expert responsible for the removal work and the contractor in charge of carrying it out, and the company he established paid the excavators’ salaries.

There are also arguments among archaeologists. Now all that is left in the long and complex unfolding of events is a large lot with a huge open pit, in the heart of the city of Jerusalem.

To this day, for most Jerusalemites, the Museum of Tolerance is the six-meter-high metal fence that surrounds a construction site that has been off-limits for the past six years. Unlike most other building sites − here it is difficult, if not impossible, to find a slit through which to peek inside. Along the top of the fence are security cameras and spotlights; parts of it are edged with barbed wire. During the months of excavation the site was probably the most secret civilian construction site in Israel. Today it is quite deserted. But if we could go back to the period from about November 2008 to April 2009, we would see a place bustling with hundreds of workers employed in the excavations in three shifts around the clock.

in full:http://www.haaretz.com/weekend/2.278/museum-of-tolerance-special-report-part-i-holes-holiness-and-hollywood-1.290924

 

shira

(30,109 posts)
2. Utter rubbish. Here's Israel's Supreme Court ruling on the site...
Wed Dec 14, 2011, 08:00 PM
Dec 2011
Quote from the Unanimous Israeli Supreme Court Ruling in Favor of the Project Moving Forward

"For almost 50 years the compound has not been apart of the cemetery, both in the normative sense and in the practical sense, and it was used for various public purposes." It also noted: "During all those years no one raised any claim, on even one occasion, that the planning procedures violated the sanctity of the site, or that they were contrary to the law as a result of the historical and religious uniqueness of the site ... . For decades this area was not regarded as a cemetery by the general public or by the Muslim community ... . No one denied this position."
http://www.wiesenthal.com/site/pp.asp?c=lsKWLbPJLnF&b=5505225


==========================

A unanimous ruling from a very liberal/progressive Supreme Court.

WRT the antisemitic slurs, Abbas' UN speech is strong evidence that antisemitism is mainstream. It wasn't just that Abbas made that speech at the UN, but that there has been zero criticism from any "anti-racist" leftwing NGO's, the Mainstream Press, academics, etc..

Shameful.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
4. The ruling did not change the irony. It is called the Museum of Tolerance..you missed that point.
Wed Dec 14, 2011, 08:22 PM
Dec 2011

snip* Ran Boytner, an Israeli-born archeologist who is director of international research at UCLA's Cotsen Institute for Archaeology and heads a cooperative Arab and Israeli effort to protect ancient sites, said last month that he was concerned approval of the Jerusalem museum could turn into "a galvanizing event ... because of the symbolic importance of who is building the building. This is the Museum of Tolerance."

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/culturemonster/2008/10/a-frank-gehry-d.html

Wiesenthal Center opposes NYC mosque, supports museum on Palestinian graveyard
Zakaria: ‘Does Foxman think bigotry is OK if people think they’re victims?’

The Simon Wiesenthal Center, a human rights organization devoted to fighting anti-Semitism, has been accused of hypocrisy for joining the ADL in opposing the Ground Zero mosque, while funding the construction of a “Museum of Tolerance” on top of Palestinian grave sites.

Rabbi Meyer May, the center’s executive director, told Crain’s New York that building a mosque near the site of the 9/11 attacks was “insensitive” to the people still dealing with the wounds of that tragedy.


http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/08/07/wiesenthal-mosque-museum-grave-sites/

Crunchy Frog

(26,548 posts)
3. I don't normally respond to your posts, because I normally have you on ignore
Wed Dec 14, 2011, 08:13 PM
Dec 2011

but calling the Holy Land the "Holy Land" is an anti-semitic slur?

I mean, a bunch of those are unquestionably anti-semitic, but why cheapen the meaning of the term by throwing in something frivolous like that?

I won't be holding my breath for a reasonable discussion on this. Just going to post and run on this one.

 

shira

(30,109 posts)
6. Not a bad objection, but consider that in the speech...
Wed Dec 14, 2011, 09:35 PM
Dec 2011

...Abbas also referred to Israelis as colonists. IOW, people who don't belong in the area at all. As if Jews have zero connection to the land. In addition, he said Palestinians have been occupied 63 years (not just since 1967).

The real proof is within PA controlled media (which Abbas controls).

Rewriting history

Rewriting the history of the Land of Israel in order to deny Israel's right to exist is central to Palestinian Authority (PA) policy. Long before it started the PA Terror Campaign (the "Intifada," 2000-2005), the PA was fighting a history war – erasing Jewish history and replacing it with a fabricated Palestinian history. This rewriting has two central goals:

1- Erase the Jewish nation's 3,000 year history in the Land of Israel;
2- Invent ancient Palestinian, Muslim and Arab histories in the land.

The goal of this historical revision as a political strategy was first expressed publicly at a conference of Palestinian historians in 1998, when rewriting history was linked to the political goal of denying Israel's right to exist:

Dr. Yussuf Alzamili Chairman History Department, Khan Yunis Educational College called on all universities and colleges to write the history of Palestine and to guard it, and not to enable the foreign implants and enemies to distort it or to legitimize the existence of Jews on this land... History lecturer Abu Amar clarified that there is no connection between the ancient generation of Jews and the new generation." Al-Ayyam, Dec. 4, 1998.

Erasing Jewish history in the land of Israel is followed by the PA’s invention of ancient and modern histories that support its political ideology and claim to the land of Israel. The Holocaust and other aspects of Jewish history are alternately denied, downplayed or distorted. Another distortion is to hide from Palestinians that Jesus was a Jew who lived in the Land of Judea/Israel. PA leaders repeatedly define Jesus as a Palestinian who preached Islam, thus denying not only Jewish history, but also the history and legitimacy of Christianity.

Citing numerous examples, this section will document that these and other historical revisions are an integral part of Palestinian policy and are used to create political ideology.

more...
http://palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=487


There's a LOT of damning evidence in that article.

Abbas' PA is clear that Jews have no connection to the land. If the Jews have no connection to the land, they don't merit national self-determination. IOW, Israel has no right to exist at all. Same old song and dance for over 60 years. Denying only the Jewish people (and no one else) of national self-determination is antisemitic. It's as bigoted as denying Palestinian national aspirations using similar arguments.

Crunchy Frog

(26,548 posts)
7. I think there's quite a bit of that going on on both sides.
Wed Dec 14, 2011, 10:19 PM
Dec 2011

I see many, MANY people, many of whom are big shots in Israel, suggesting or outright stating that Palestinians have no historical connection to the land that they're living in, refer to the OT as "Judea and Samaria", suggest that "Jordan is the Palestinian state", etc. As abhorrent as I find that kind of thing, I would never with Holocaust denial or expressions of sympathy for Hitler.

Oh, and lots and lots of people are denied self determination. The Palestinians for one, but many, many others as well. The Jews, on the other hand, have their own state, so are evidently not being denied self determination (at least if that's how you define "self determination" ). Palestinians or anyone else simply saying something doesn't deny anything to anybody. And though I may disagree with these sentiments expressed by Palestinian leaders (or inferred from their statements), given their own historical and current experiences, I can see why they might view things the way they do.

 

shira

(30,109 posts)
11. Denying Jewish history in Israel is an attempt to deny Israel's very legitimacy...
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 06:04 AM
Dec 2011

...or Israel's right to exist, and that is pure antisemitism. What other nations in the world have to actually defend their legitimacy or very right to exist in peace?





LeftishBrit

(41,190 posts)
19. But Abbas wasn't *denying* Jewish history in Israel
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 12:34 PM
Dec 2011

He was emphasizing his own nation's religious connections to the Holy Land; not saying that Israel didn't have one.

 

shira

(30,109 posts)
22. I think you're right....
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 03:24 PM
Dec 2011

I'm looking at Abbas' statement in addition to his comments about a 63 year occupation and Israeli colonialism. Not just the Wiesenthal quote alone. So I think you're right.

I suspect the Wiesenthal Center is well aware of his record in Arabic as head of the PA where it's far more obvious Abbas is against Israel's right to exist.

http://palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=433

Based on that, the Wiesenthal Center probably understood his UN speech was just more of the same.

azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
10. In his speech Abbas said 63 years of Nakba (Palestinian Diaspora) not 63 years of occupation
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 02:13 AM
Dec 2011

also his references to colonization were about West Bank settlement

here are the quotes from his speech

I come before you today from the Holy Land, the land of Palestine, the land of divine
messages, ascension of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) and the birthplace of Jesus Christ (peace be upon him), to speak on behalf of the Palestinian people in the homeland and in the Diaspora, to say, after 63 years of suffering of an ongoing Nakba: Enough. It is time for the Palestinian people to gain their freedom and independence.
The time has come to end the suffering and the plight of millions of Palestine refugees in
the homeland and the Diaspora, to end their displacement and to realize their rights, some of them forced to take refuge more than once in different places of the world.


and

The core issue here is that the Israeli government refuses to commit to terms of reference for the negotiations that are based on international law and United Nations resolutions, and that it frantically continues to intensify building of settlements on the territory of the State of Palestine.
Settlement activities embody the core of the policy of colonial military occupation of the land of the Palestinian people and all of the brutality of aggression and racial discrimination against our people that this policy entails. This policy, which constitutes a breach of international humanitarian law and United Nations resolutions, is the primary cause for the failure of the peace process, the collapse of dozens of opportunities, and the burial of the great hopes that arose from the signing of the Declaration of Principles in 1993 between the Palestine Liberation Organization and Israel to achieve a just peace that would begin a new era for our region.


http://gadebate.un.org/sites/default/files/gastatements/66/PS_en.pdf

 

shira

(30,109 posts)
14. Before the UN speech Abbas talked about bringing up the 63 year occupation...
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 06:35 AM
Dec 2011

“We are going to complain that as Palestinians we have been under occupation for 63 years.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/06/world/middleeast/06palestinians.html?_r=1

This is the same Abbas who glorifies suicide bombers as holy martyrs and parades around with maps of Palestine replacing all Israel. It all makes sense when context is considered.

Pure antisemitism.



azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
16. why did you pare Abbas statement in NYT down to one sentence?
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 12:17 PM
Dec 2011

here is the full statement from Abbas

“Some Israelis complain that this is a unilateral move, but when you address 193 countries, that is not unilateral,” he said. “We are going to complain that as Palestinians we have been under occupation for 63 years.”

“We don’t want to isolate Israel but to live with it in peace and security,” he also said. “We don’t want to delegitimize Israel. We want to legitimize ourselves.”

Mr. Abbas, 76, said that as long as he remains president, Palestinian security in the West Bank would continue to be coordinated with the Israeli military.

“We have good coordination to prevent terror and keep the situation calm and quiet,” he said. “We will continue to do our job. Security will prevail as long as I am in office.”


seems some of that doesn't really fit your scenario

and we were discussing his statement to the UN weren't we?

 

shira

(30,109 posts)
20. What he was quoted as saying in according to the NYT is contradictory....
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 01:10 PM
Dec 2011

He says he doesn't want to delegitimize Israel, but then he talks about the 63 year occupation.

If he had talked about a 44 year old occupation, no contradiction.

Abbas' mask slipped.

shaayecanaan

(6,068 posts)
13. Presumably the fact that the Christians also had a connection to that land justified the Crusades?nt
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 06:13 AM
Dec 2011

azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
5. Abbas statement was more antisemitic than Holocaust support and denial, adoration of Hitler
Wed Dec 14, 2011, 08:57 PM
Dec 2011

and Albert Speer, statements of Jewish control of finance straight out of what I understand to be the "Protocols" ect? But rather Abbas for not what he said but what he didn't say?

Abbas was speaking as the leader of the Palestinian people almost all of whom are either Muslim or Christian, very, very few of those that identify as Palestinian would call themselves Jews, which would be the basis of Abbas comments

Donald Ian Rankin

(13,598 posts)
8. Hillarious that their first example isn't antisemitism.
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 12:46 AM
Dec 2011

The ADL has poisoned its own well, probably fatally.

By devoting so much effort to using false accusations of antisemitism to try to support Israel against the Palestinians, they've made it impossible to take their efforts to fight genuine antisemitism (such as they are; the seem to devote an awfully high proportion of their resources to promoting zionism rather than to fighting antisemitism, but it may just be that those are the ones I notice) at face value.

They should scrap Foxman, draw a line under their past activities, and make it clear that from now on their remit is fighting antisemitism, not antizionism.

shaayecanaan

(6,068 posts)
12. It was the Simon Wiesenthal Centre, not the ADL...
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 06:11 AM
Dec 2011

either way, to characterise the first statement as the number one antisemitic slur of the year is overegging things outrageously.

Little Tich

(6,171 posts)
9. I don't consider the first two listings anti-semitic.
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 01:13 AM
Dec 2011

Why is the Simon Wiesenthal Center portraying statements that are not antisemitic as antisemitic? Have they lost their minds? Don't they know what antisemitism is? I just read the wikipedia entry on antisemitism (link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism ), and the first two listings are not antisemitic according to it. The other listings are antisemitic, but really, what is this?

LeftishBrit

(41,190 posts)
18. The first one wasn't IMO
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 12:30 PM
Dec 2011

The region is 'the Holy Land' to three religions, and failing to mention the Jewish connection may have been insensitive, and, in the context, jingoistic; but I don't consider it antisemitic.

The second is at least borderline antisemitic. Firstly, it exaggerates the casualty figures. Israelis have in total killed thousands of Palestinians, but hardly 'hundreds of thousands'. Even if you include *all* the casualties on *both* sides in *all* the Jewish/Israeli vs Palestinian conflicts since *before* the 1948 War, I don't think you'd get to 100,000. That could still be political rhetoric, combined with a failure to check facts, rather than antisemitism. But Erdogan went on to accuse Israel of 'hiding behind the Nazi Holocaust and seeking victimhood'. That is something that most Jews would definitely consider as racist - just as it would generally be considered as racist, for example, to accuse African-Americans of 'hiding behind slavery and claiming victimhood'.

Little Tich

(6,171 posts)
23. 'CNN mistranslated Erdogan's Palestinian casualty remark' - Jerusalem Post
Thu Dec 15, 2011, 10:43 PM
Dec 2011

Source: Jerusalem Post

Hurriyet: Erdgoan said hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands of Palestinians were killed by the Israelis, not hundreds of thousands.

Comments made by Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyib Erdogan's to CNN concerning the number of Palestinians Israel has killed in the ongoing conflict was mistranslated by the network, Turkish daily Hurriyet reported on Wednesday.

According to the original translation, Erdogan apparently said that Israel has killed hundreds of thousands of Palestinians.

A Turkish transcript of the interview, provided by Turkish state news agency Anatolia, revealed that "Erdogan said hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands of Palestinians were killed by Israelis," Hurriyet reported.

read more: http://www.jpost.com/MiddleEast/Article.aspx?id=239929&R=R3
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

I Googled Erdogan + palestinians, and this came up as the first hit. It seems as if the Simon Wiesenthal Center never suspected that there could be an error in translation that led to Erdogan inflating the number of deaths. I actually did, but didn't bother checking as I don't know Turkish or have the original interview.

As for the total number of Palestinians killed by Israel and pre-state militia, the number is probably somewhat less than 50 000. Even if the translation would have been correct, it wouldn't have been antisemitic to inflate the number of deaths to a number that is not in magnitude. Inappropriate perhaps, but not antisemitic.

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