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geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 11:34 AM Oct 2015

Abbas aide: PA won’t tear up Oslo, but also won’t comply with accord

http://www.timesofisrael.com/abbas-aide-pa-wont-tear-up-oslo-but-also-wont-comply-with-accord/

Ramallah won’t cancel agreements signed with Israel over the last 20 years, but “will not comply” with them, a senior Palestinian official said Thursday, a day after Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas said the Palestinians were no longer bound by the accords.

Mahmoud Habbash, a senior adviser to Abbas, warned that the Palestinians “will not work as employees of Israel” in maintaining the agreements, according to the Bethlehem-based Ma’an news agency.


Self-awareness is the first step to improvement, apparently.

But, check the fine print

The speech was blasted not only by Israeli politicians, including Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, who called it “deceitful,” but was also criticized by Palestinians for failing to clearly lay out steps against Israel.

But Habbash told Ma’an that the address begins “a new stage in the relationship with Israel.” He did not elaborate on what the “new stage” may mean in practice.

Habbash did not say when, and in what form, the PA would step back from past agreements. “Future steps haven’t been made public yet,” he told Ma’an, and “each step will be determined according to the circumstances.”



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JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
2. This sounds dangerously vague to me.
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 03:38 PM
Oct 2015

It could even be interpreted as a declaration of war against Israel. I hope that is not the fact, but it is such a vague pronouncement, and after the building of the tunnels and other events in the Middle East, who knows?

Not a good statement to make. It should have been more precise.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oslo_Accords

Should have been more precise unless there is a superseding agreement or understanding or unless it is a declaration of war (which I doubt, but . . . . who knows?)

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
3. in no way is it a declaration of war, what it says is that the PA will no longer consider
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 03:44 PM
Oct 2015

itself obligated to carry out the functions that Israel is obligated to carry out--provide security and civil administration.

most important would be that the PA would no longer help prevent terrorist attacks on Israelis. That's really not their job.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
5. If Americans did terrorist attacks on Canada and the US
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 03:50 PM
Oct 2015

did nothing to stop those attacks, don't you think that Canada would rightfully consider that a declaration of war?

Every nation has the duty to prevent its citizens from attacking other countries to the extent possible.

If the US sends military forces into another country, that is a sort of declaration of war whether it is official or not. We have to have the agreement of the government of the nation into which we are sending soldiers or get the approval of Congress to invade another country. Another alternative is to invade in self-defense or fight a war in self-defense.

If Palestine allows Palestinians to commit acts of terror or violence on Israel, Palestine will be acquiescent and a party to those acts and will be starting a war.

It is not just true for Palestine. It is true for Russia or other countries too.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
6. Canada and the United States are co-equal sovereign nations with distinct borders.
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 04:03 PM
Oct 2015

Palestine is under permanent military occupation and de facto annexation by Israel. The PA has no authority, it is completely subservient to Israel.

The Israelis are the aggressors, the invaders, the occupiers.


Under your formulation, the act of war began when Israel invaded and conquered land that belonged to someone else.

Until the IDF gets the hell out of the West Bank, forever, there's precious little room to complain about acts of aggression.




JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
7. The question is not what happened in the past but
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 04:08 PM
Oct 2015

rather what the PLO threatens to do in the future?

There is no peace. That is a given.

But will there be an escalation?

Is Abbas threatening to escalate the situation?

The Palestinians tried building tunnels. They have tried terror attacks within Israel. Is Abbas telling his people to "just go to it"? And will Israel attack?

Or will we get some grown-up intervention?

I'm hoping for the latter.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
9. The IDF is still imposing its tyranny on the Palestinian people.
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 04:11 PM
Oct 2015

Israel is still treating every Palestinian man, woman and child as prisoners in their own land.

You apparently think the Palestinians should accept apartheid meekly and subserviently.

Obviously they are not willing to go into the night so quietly.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
11. Remember. This is personal for Netanyahyu and a fair number
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 04:23 PM
Oct 2015

of Israelis. Palestinian terrorists killed Netanyahu's brother at Entebbe.

One act of violence begets another.

We need a serious international peacekeeping effort there and a forced settlement of the differences. After all these years, the two sides have agreed to next to nothing.

Israel has a functioning democracy. They have and possibly still do include Palestinian representatives in the Knesset.

Palestine is still a country without borders or a real government, even in spite of elections.

I think this seemingly endless feud will only be settled by outside peacekeepers who impose peace on both parties.

And I would not be surprised if that happens within the next few years. The parties need a cooling off period, a sort of restraining order on both sides.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
13. Unfortunately, both the US and Israel insist that it's only direct negotiations between the
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 04:28 PM
Oct 2015

Palestinians and Israelis that will settle this.

I agree with you that bilateral negotiations between the two are pointless at this time.

 

R. Daneel Olivaw

(12,606 posts)
10. Do you understand that Israel has been "escalating"
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 04:17 PM
Oct 2015

the situation continually?

Half a million illegal Israeli colonists sit on Palestinian land with the IDF to back them up.

These colonists continue to harass and destroy anything Palestinian.

So, yes there is war already: Israeli style.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
12. And do you think that Palestine would be wise to declare
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 04:25 PM
Oct 2015

war on Israel to redress the injustice?

I'm suggesting a peace imposed by international peacekeepers who are allowed to shoot those who violate the peace.

 

R. Daneel Olivaw

(12,606 posts)
8. Now consider that the USA controlled the Maritimes...
Thu Oct 1, 2015, 04:09 PM
Oct 2015

and were forcibly taking land to develop into parks while removing the locals: destroying their homes in the process.

Then you might have something to compare to.

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