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Thu Jun 16, 2016, 04:39 PM

Sanders' demands & the path forward - What if it were two men?

Last edited Fri Jun 17, 2016, 01:03 AM - Edit history (3)

This is kind of an expanded x-post from a reply I formed in GD-P, but honestly it's a point I've not seen brought up yet.

Pardon my girl-dar, but I'm catching a little whiff of less-than-equal treatment and paternalism in the media's treatment of Mr. Sanders and his behavior since the end of the Democratic primaries. It saddens me to my core to say this, but I have come to believe that Mr. Sanders would not be making demands of his victor if he had lost the same contest to a man, and more importantly; I do not believe the media or so many others would be entertaining it with any seriousness were the contest between two men.

The content of the demands Mr. Sanders is making of the party he so recently joined has been noted and addressed by the media as transparently self-oriented. That's fine, but what about the very fact that this man who lost, is now not only failing to concede graciously in accordance with all traditions of politics and basic sportsmanship to the female who bettered him, but also making demands targeted most pointedly at powerful women (and fewer men I notice) in the party?

When Mr. Trump mused that he may remove the chairman of the RNC if he won his party's nomination, the statement was treated rightly as vindictive and childish; a threat to act as a spiteful and belligerent winner. Mr. Sanders is the loser, not the winner, and yet he has not merely mused upon, but demanded the right to oust the powerful female chair of our party and install his own choice.

Unless and until Mr. Sanders makes a gracious concession and changes his tone towards the nominee and the party he so recently hooked his wagon to, the Clinton campaign and the Democratic Party should quietly dismiss him. This is not an appeal merely out of reaction to discerned paternalism, but also a matter of respect for the voters, and the future of the party.

We should not set a precedent in this party whereby the runner-up gets to pick the platform, blame and subsequently oust the chair because they are mad about losing, and in short, demand that the party bend to the will of the losing campaign. This would make a mockery of voting. The voters choose a winner because they trust that winner and her/his vision to carry the party forward. The voters speak to endorse a leader who will shape the platform, the party organization, the process, and the Presidency. To cede leadership to the losing campaign is to disrespect the entire process and point of asking voters to make that choice.

That the winner of the process becomes the leader, that the victor chooses the path forward has never been a subject of question before, so why would it be now? On what basis might this man who lost feel entitled to dictate to women of power in this party what course they should take? I am a big believer in Occam's razor. Most often the obvious answer is in fact the correct one.

If someone can demonstrate an example of a time when Mr. Sanders lost to a man and behaved in a similar fashion I'm willing to look at it objectively and reconsider. We do have another example, curiously enough, of Mr. Sanders losing an election to a woman, and how he behaved then.
That Time Bernie Sanders Said He Was a Bigger Feminist Than His Female Opponent
Some of the parallels are rather stark and a bit disquieting.

The two-term governor who defeated Sanders endorses Hillary.
When Bernie Sanders ran against me in Vermont
Again, if someone can demonstrate Mr. Sanders showing this kind of pettish fractiousness following contests with men, I will happily give it fair reading.

Any parts or points of Mr. Sanders agenda should be brought forth as a request, not a demand, in the spirit of cooperation. The Democratic Party, with Hillary as the leader elected by the Democratic voters, should then decide what points to consider or adopt as she sees beneficial to the party and her campaign moving forward. It's obvious to many that the changes Mr. Sanders is demanding for the party he just recently and only "kind of" joined, are not-too-coincidentally exactly the ones he thinks would have allowed him to win. It seems rather self-serving because it is; but nonetheless it seems likely the campaigns will search for common ground.

There is room on the path forward for Mr. Sanders, but there must be no doubt that it is Secretary Clinton, at the behest of the voters of our party who has been chosen to make those decisions great and small that will guide our journey.

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Arrow 29 replies Author Time Post
Reply Sanders' demands & the path forward - What if it were two men? (Original post)
Maru Kitteh Jun 2016 OP
BobbyDrake Jun 2016 #1
spud_demon Jun 2016 #2
Her Sister Jun 2016 #5
sheshe2 Jun 2016 #14
Maru Kitteh Jun 2016 #10
sheshe2 Jun 2016 #13
teamster633 Jun 2016 #17
DemonGoddess Jun 2016 #3
Her Sister Jun 2016 #4
yallerdawg Jun 2016 #6
Maru Kitteh Jun 2016 #11
shadowandblossom Jun 2016 #24
CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #7
BlueMTexpat Jun 2016 #26
sarae Jun 2016 #27
Walk away Jun 2016 #8
Maru Kitteh Jun 2016 #12
BlueMTexpat Jun 2016 #9
sheshe2 Jun 2016 #15
Maru Kitteh Jun 2016 #22
Cha Jun 2016 #16
Maru Kitteh Jun 2016 #20
Cha Jun 2016 #21
NastyRiffraff Jun 2016 #18
Maru Kitteh Jun 2016 #19
Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #23
shadowandblossom Jun 2016 #25
sarae Jun 2016 #28
lunamagica Jun 2016 #29

Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 04:54 PM

1. I think making some of your text into links is cutting them off...

 

The system seems to fade out long link text.

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 04:55 PM

2. DNC failed

 

The Sanders campaign warned them that the data was not secure. They did nothing (except attempt to punish the whistle-blower), and now Russian hackers have it. They even published the key strategy document.

There are other issues too. Rolling back Obama's unilateral campaign finance reforms, for example. Clinton may outspend Trump 5:1 in the coming campaign, but it won't matter, because the media covers Trump for free.

"DWS must go" is not a demand from the runner-up. It's a suggestion to improve the Party. There are other suggestions on the table too. Take them. They don't cost anything, and they can bring independent voters on board.

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Response to spud_demon (Reply #2)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 05:06 PM

5. DWS was Obama's choice!

 

Obama's choice! The sitting President gets to choose the DNC Chair and then voted by DEMOCRATS!!!

So we talking about DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENT + DEMOCRATS!!! OKay!

BTW This is the HRC GROUP!

Discuss the life, career, and accomplishments of Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton. Supporters only.

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Response to Her Sister (Reply #5)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 06:19 PM

14. They are gone.

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Response to spud_demon (Reply #2)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 05:37 PM

10. Clinton has already picked the new DNC leader, it's about his man-splainin' demands

Not the chair. Try to keep up.

Oh and fuck the idea of Independents being allowed to take control of the party. Everyone is invited to join the party. Everyone. But if the kids can't be bothered to RSVP, then they shouldn't act all shocked and amazed when the grownups who have to do the heavy lifting choose their menu items for them. They can join the party if they want a say in it, that simple.



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Response to spud_demon (Reply #2)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 06:17 PM

13. I believe you were looking for the Sanders Group.

They are thatta way. <<<

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Response to spud_demon (Reply #2)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 07:06 PM

17. "Member" since 6/2/16.

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 05:00 PM

3. Thank you

I've been saying this all along. He would not be behaving in the way that he is, if HRC was a man.

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 05:04 PM

4. We are learning a lot about BS!

 

More than some of us, well, talking about myself, never really wanted to know/learn. Cannot wait for the moment where I can forget it all.

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 05:11 PM

6. We seem to have a LOT of cultural gender issues remaining.

IF DU is in any way representative of the Democratic Party, we got LOTS of issues.

And I mean me in that we - I am as screwed up as anyone else!

But I'd like to be better.

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Response to yallerdawg (Reply #6)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 05:40 PM

11. Awww, have a hug yallerdawg

Last edited Thu Jun 16, 2016, 06:30 PM - Edit history (1)



We all have work to do, don't we? I know I do.

Thanks for your nice words.

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Response to yallerdawg (Reply #6)

Fri Jun 17, 2016, 02:41 AM

24. I've got issues related to that too

this election has made some of them more visible to me. Nobody is immune to the culture we grow up in

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 05:13 PM

7. There's plenty of sexism involved.

 

We don't even need to consider a case of two men. We saw nearly the same scenario play out eight years ago, but with the roles reversed. Back then, Hillary was told to stand down, know her place, and get her voters to back the party. She did so.

Now that she's the winner, the loser is making demands, and the narrative has shifted to her needing to persuade Bernie's supporters over to our side. It's a complete flip from the precedent that was set.

What's the difference? Oh yeah, in both cases the woman is expected to make the men feel better.

Bernie can go suck a lemon if he doesn't want to be a responsible Democrat.

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Response to CrowCityDem (Reply #7)

Fri Jun 17, 2016, 03:37 AM

26. Amen. eom

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Response to CrowCityDem (Reply #7)

Fri Jun 17, 2016, 03:57 AM

27. +10

well said!

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 05:25 PM

8. It appears to me that the entire "Revolution" smells like sexism from the head down.

But I think Hillary is smart and tough enough to win this game in the end as well. Plus, she has a team behind her who all play hardball too. Bernie has been treated like a spoiled kid by the Democrats so far. He did exactly what Trump did and played on hatred, bigotry and greed to whip up millions of bitter white men (both of their biggest demographics).

He better make his deal and stick to it or he will be shut out and down.

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Response to Walk away (Reply #8)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 06:02 PM

12. There seems to be at least a couple 'isms" in the so-called revolution, I think.

Last edited Thu Jun 16, 2016, 06:34 PM - Edit history (1)

Edited to add; it definitely smells like something, that's for sure.

Where are my clothespins?





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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 05:37 PM

9. Spot on!

I too have said this more than once - although not nearly as well.

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 06:20 PM

15. Great OP.

It is spot on.

Thanks, Maru~

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Response to sheshe2 (Reply #15)

Fri Jun 17, 2016, 01:09 AM

22. Thank you sheshe :-)

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 06:49 PM

16. Awesome OP, Maru.. Thank you!

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Response to Cha (Reply #16)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 11:30 PM

20. Thanks Cha !

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Reply #20)

Fri Jun 17, 2016, 12:58 AM

21. ..

You're Maru~

Thank you!

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 09:19 PM

18. I'd give this many many recs if I could

You'll have to settle for just one though Bernie's misogyny is becoming more and more evident.

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Response to NastyRiffraff (Reply #18)

Thu Jun 16, 2016, 11:29 PM

19. Thanks. Now that he's had his big toodle-oo I think I'll post it in GDP, while

I still can.

Think I'll do it tomorrow morning when a certain segment are usually sleeping in.

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Fri Jun 17, 2016, 01:25 AM

23. Massive K & R. Thanks for posting. So spot on.

 

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Fri Jun 17, 2016, 02:50 AM

25. wonderul post

Great insights and you said it all so eloquently. I think regardless of whether or not he would do the same with a man, his ridiculous behavior simply wouldn't be tolerated from outside and he would be laughed or shamed out of the room if he tried. But women are expected to appease men, she's won it but BS feels entitled to her massaging his ego. She won but the status quo as it is means his absurd entitlement is tolerated and the victor is encouraged to appease the Burned Out One (to borrow someone else's pet name).

Maybe he ought to try eating more fiber because he seems to be full of something.

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Fri Jun 17, 2016, 03:59 AM

28. K & R!

I

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Response to Maru Kitteh (Original post)

Fri Jun 17, 2016, 05:04 AM

29. Huge K&R!

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