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Fri Sep 8, 2017, 01:26 PM

 

I wish Hillary would stop bashing Bernie and talk about one topic in particular on her tour.

What is that issue?

THE VOTING MACHINES!!!!!!!! With voter suppression coming in a close second.

I personally believe that Bernie won MA during the primaries and a RECOUNT using hand-counted ballots would have shown this to be true. And by the way, the paper ballots were available since MA uses opti-scan and keeps the paper in case a recount is called for.

I also believe strongly that Hillary won the election if the votes had been counted fairly in the northern states. If PA, for example, or WI or OH or any of the northern states which supposedly went for Trump had been required to VERIFY THE VOTE thru a hand-counting of the paper we'd have a different president now and it would be Hillary. And she would have made a very good prez as well and would already have done way more than what Trump has done.

Why O why won't the politicians talk about the obvious??? In MA e.g. in the primaries if the figures I've seen are correct, in the 3% of the precincts that hand-counted the paper, Bernie won by 17%, but in the state as a whole he lost by about 3% or so. Any statisticians want to figure the chances of this happening? And by the way according to Jon Simon, the 3% sample in the state is perhaps slightly more CONSERVATIVE than the rest of the state so don't claim that the sample isn't a good one.

Also in the election as a whole I believe now PA doesn't even use paper. I could be wrong, but I believe they voted this time on completely unverifiable touch screen computers. WI's election officials are crooked and have been for a couple decades now. I'd bet plenty of money that Hillary won WI if it were possible to have a hand count of paper in WI. There's a good chance she won in OH as well if the vote could be recounted using paper.

But not a peep from Hillary OR ANY OTHER POLITICIAN about our absolutely unverifiable election system and the fact that these computers are "trivially easy" to hack or rig or maliciously program or what not. I have no doubt at all that the vote count in a number of states was rigged or hacked, maybe by the Russians but potentially by anybody with a little computer savvy as hackers proved just recently when they hacked into a number of voting systems during a convention of hackers using information publicly available about the machines being used to count the vote in specific states.

But don't hold your breath about this happening in our lifetime.

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Reply I wish Hillary would stop bashing Bernie and talk about one topic in particular on her tour. (Original post)
stevepal Sep 2017 OP
bearsfootball516 Sep 2017 #1
johnsonsnap Sep 2017 #5
babylonsister Sep 2017 #7
stevepal Sep 2017 #8
monmouth4 Sep 2017 #2
Jarqui Sep 2017 #3
bettyellen Sep 2017 #4
progressoid Sep 2017 #6
sheshe2 Sep 2017 #9

Response to stevepal (Original post)

Fri Sep 8, 2017, 01:44 PM

1. There's basically no evidence that voting machines were hacked

There IS a little evidence that Russia tried, but failed.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/12/26/us/2016-presidential-campaign-hacking-fast-facts/index.html

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Response to bearsfootball516 (Reply #1)

Fri Sep 8, 2017, 02:14 PM

5. Exactly. As Obama said, "No serious person thinks..."

 

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Response to bearsfootball516 (Reply #1)

Fri Sep 8, 2017, 04:01 PM

7. That's not Bloomberg's conclusion:


Russia hacked voting systems in 39 states before the 2016 presidential election
This goes way deeper than we first thought.
Updated by Alex [email protected]@vox.com Jun 13, 2017, 2:00pm EDT


Russia’s efforts to hack the 2016 presidential election were much more widespread than originally thought. The Russian campaign hit 39 states — twice as many as originally reported — and in one case hackers tried to delete and alter voter data.

That’s the startling revelation from a Bloomberg report this morning. The extent of the cyber intrusion was so widespread that Obama administration officials used the infamous “red phone” — which is really a digital communications channel that allows the countries to send information back and forth — to show Kremlin leaders what they had discovered. It remains unclear, though, if these intrusions had any direct effect on the election’s outcome.

Still, this is another example of Russia taking advantage of the many online vulnerabilities in America’s voting network, which is comprised of software companies, online registration sites, and vital information that election officials willingly send to each other over email.

All of them play an important part in obtaining and safeguarding sensitive voter information, but it appears the Russians have figured out how to get that data.

more...

https://www.vox.com/world/2017/6/13/15791744/russia-election-39-states-hack-putin-trump-sessions

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Response to bearsfootball516 (Reply #1)

Fri Sep 8, 2017, 08:29 PM

8. So you're telling me that even though the machines have been shown to be easily hacked

 

that nobody hacked them?

Here's an article recently published where some hackers were able to hack into machines quite easily.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/hackers-crack-voting-machines-within-minutes-at-def-con-in-vegas_us_597ca139e4b02a4ebb75c134

You're telling me that even though the machines are easily hacked, etc., because there's no evidence of hacking, they weren't hacked? For one thing, how can you even know if they're hacked or not? Is the hacker going to tell you? The vote is NEVER verified in this country. With some machines it's impossible to verify them (touch screens where there's no paper). In the others they're just never verified as far as I've been able to find.

I live in Wichita KS and a statistician here at Wichita State, Beth Clarkson, working for the Natl Institute of Aviation Research, NIAR, decided to do her own exit polling and compare the exit poll results with the machine results and statistically analyze these results to find out the odds of any discrepancies happening. Kris Kobach would never let her look at any of the paper to see why certain unusual results were happening here and around the country. She set up her own exit polling in 6 precincts in KS during the 2016 election and the title of her first article after she'd analyzed the results was this: "Our Vote is being rigged. What are we going to do about it?"

I would venture to say that if any competent statistician did exactly what Beth did anywhere in the country he/she would find out exactly what Beth did. The vote is being rigged. Here in KS it seems to favor the libertarians more than the Repubs. It's probably different in different areas of the country, but the rigging is taking place and has been since at least 2002. And now with the Russians, whose hackers are at least as good as ours and maybe better, people still won't even consider HAND-COUNTED PAPER BALLOTS, which would solve everything, would be cheaper in the long run, and would negate any possible hacking from anybody, including Russia.

Go Figure.

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Response to stevepal (Original post)

Fri Sep 8, 2017, 01:58 PM

2. I hear she also bashes Joe Biden. n/t

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Response to stevepal (Original post)

Fri Sep 8, 2017, 02:02 PM

3. I'm a Bernie supporter who supported Hillary in the general election

I'll never be accused of being Hillary's biggest fan but ...

The increasing stench from the ever growing mound of evidence that she got ripped off in this election (and so did America) needs to be front and center.

There are moments when it seems like we're supposed to sit there politely and be good sports about the way we got this result. The 'political correctness' of it feels something like reminding the burglar who is cleaning out my house to not forget the TV.

We protested Nixon's "I have nothing to hide" (I was there). Why do we have to sit on our hands while democracy is stolen from Americans by the 1% wealthy and the Russians?

I hope Hillary does not mince her words with respect to voting machines, scams to disenfranchise, campaign finance, gerrymandering, the Russians, etc. What has transpired is a sick joke which resulted in a dangerously, mentally deranged, racist scumbag in the Oval office who worries most rational Americans.

Obviously, more needs to be done. Hillary should bluntly call them out to help get people "fired up and ready to go"

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Response to Jarqui (Reply #3)

Fri Sep 8, 2017, 02:06 PM

4. It's not wise for her to politicize this investigation while we're in its midst. She warned us ...

 

But now is bad timing for her to talk about it further.

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Response to stevepal (Original post)

Fri Sep 8, 2017, 02:14 PM

6. The problem with this line of thinking is that it's inconsistent.

A lot of people on the left complained about this after the 2000 election too. Tons of time and energy was given to this.

But when Obama won in 08, and again in 12, it wasn't such a big deal for us (but it was for some RWers who thought the system was rigged against the GOP)

Now, when we lose again, it's suddenly a problem again.



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Response to stevepal (Original post)

Fri Sep 8, 2017, 09:10 PM

9. She already has.

Hillary Clinton lays out sweeping voting rights vision

In a major speech on voting rights Thursday, Hillary Clinton laid out a far-reaching vision for expanding access to the ballot box, and denounced Republican efforts to make voting harder.

Speaking at Texas Southern University in Houston, Clinton called for every American to be automatically registered to vote when they turn 18 unless they choose not to be. She backed a nationwide standard of at least 20 days of early voting. She urged Congress to pass legislation strengthening the Voting Rights Act, which was gravely weakened by a 2013 Supreme Court ruling. And she slammed restrictive voting laws imposed by the GOP in Texas, North Carolina, Ohio, and Wisconsin, which she said affect minorities and students in particular.

“We have a responsibility to say clearly and directly what’s really going on in our country,” Clinton said, “because what is happening is a sweeping effort to dis-empower and disenfranchise people of color, poor people, and young people from one end of our country to the other.”

“We should be clearing the way for more people to vote, not putting up every road-block anyone can imagine,” Clinton added.

“What is happening is a sweeping effort to dis-empower and disenfranchise people of color, poor people, and young people from one end of our country to the other.”
Hillary Clinton


More: http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/hillary-clinton-early-voting-nationwide

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