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Erich Bloodaxe BSN

(14,733 posts)
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:41 PM Apr 2016

My swan song, come get your grave dancing on, if that's your thing.

So I'm leaving. The site and the party. There are some great people here, but I had probably two thirds of the site on ignore, and came to realize that if folks on here are truly representative of the modern Democratic Party, I no longer have much in common with it.

Nearly three decades of voting Democratic by default in every race, only voting third party a handful of times over the years, and now, going forward, if I ever again vote for a Democrat, it will be in spite of them being one, not because of it. I imagine I'll be leaving a lot of races unmarked from here on out. But if I want nothing to do with most of the people who post here in support of foreign wars, undeclared war drone strikes, voter suppression as long as it works in their favour, spying on all Americans, sending those who bring government misdeeds to light to jail, sacrificing the poor in 'grand bargains' or 'reforms', keeping the minimum wage lower than it has to be, fracking all over the world, pushing unlabeled GMO food into every part of the food supply, toppling left wing foreign governments through military coups, and a host of other issues that seem to have been embraced by the modern Democratic Party, well, then, it's time for me to quit 'polluting' the Democratic Party with my presence, in either primary or general elections.

So congrats to all of those who spent their time writing sneering comments about myself and others not being 'real Democrats', who were angry because I and others like me dared to support a candidate who actually believed in the ideals the Democratic Party used to believe in, who wanted to stop all injustices, not just those that won votes. You made it a self-fulfilling prophecy. I'm not a Democrat of any sort any more, and never again will be. Enjoy your ever-shrinking tent.

I expect this to be locked quickly, and my account PPR'ed in a flash, so gravedance fast.

379 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
My swan song, come get your grave dancing on, if that's your thing. (Original Post) Erich Bloodaxe BSN Apr 2016 OP
GBCW #1 sharp_stick Apr 2016 #1
K&R jonno99 Apr 2016 #2
Bye Erich MuseRider Apr 2016 #3
This thread should be PINNED as a constant reminder... AmBlue Apr 2016 #157
I'm un-joining the Democratic Party after the elections AikidoSoul Apr 2016 #332
Post removed Post removed Apr 2016 #4
As predicted... n/t xocet Apr 2016 #21
MADem is still chafing about not having gotten bvf Apr 2016 #156
Such a shame. I think I shall shed a tear for him/her.... oh, I do tell a lie! No I wont! Bubzer Apr 2016 #217
When one creates a self-fulfilling prophecy, one should expect it to be fulfilled... LanternWaste Apr 2016 #325
Keep this in mind, the Democratic Party has lost 12% of its base since 2008. THAT is called a self sabrina 1 Apr 2016 #345
Your reply is one reason why the poster is leaving the party and DU. LibDemAlways Apr 2016 #27
+1 narnian60 Apr 2016 #51
+1 zentrum Apr 2016 #123
It's too bad that the poster has to be so negative. R. Daneel Olivaw Apr 2016 #126
They are truly clueless. LibDemAlways Apr 2016 #148
"When Bernie's supporters find something better to do on Election Day ... KPN Apr 2016 #320
I think it's cute we chide others for negativity, then turn around and engage in the same ourselves. LanternWaste Apr 2016 #326
Two things. R. Daneel Olivaw Apr 2016 #333
That one was responsible for my first encounter with nasty on DU. malokvale77 Apr 2016 #155
Certainly doesn't do anything to LibDemAlways Apr 2016 #160
To be honest... malokvale77 Apr 2016 #180
There are no decent arguments for her. I've posted a number LibDemAlways Apr 2016 #273
You get it... malokvale77 Apr 2016 #276
Gee... What does it mean when really rich friends aim to run against the other... MrMickeysMom Apr 2016 #294
I know Sanders supporters are big on conspiracy theories SCantiGOP Apr 2016 #324
No, Sanders' supporters, there are millions of them btw, are not 'big on CTs, that old Sunstein sabrina 1 Apr 2016 #346
This is what I was responding to: SCantiGOP Apr 2016 #355
Their arrogance is over the top. The very reason progressives are leaving here. rhett o rick Apr 2016 #182
Huge +1! Enthusiast Apr 2016 #240
It's always "them." Never "us." Bias forces the mentally lazy to perceive as such. LanternWaste Apr 2016 #327
So, do you agree with the Dem Party position that the 'ideas' of Progressives 'are retarded'? sabrina 1 Apr 2016 #347
Actually they don't matter, speaking for myself. Much bigger issues are the reason why progressives sabrina 1 Apr 2016 #349
All his/her posts are like that.. What must that kind of life be like? pangaia Apr 2016 #194
+1 840high Apr 2016 #198
I wonder passiveporcupine Apr 2016 #237
I'm just befuddled nolawarlock Apr 2016 #282
Can't tell you how many times I've been harassed by Clinton supporters on here. liberalnarb Apr 2016 #308
alerted and bullied myself Sheepshank Apr 2016 #316
Well, that may be so, but as far as who has the majority power here ... nolawarlock Apr 2016 #337
You got 37 votes on a website with thousands of users. liberalnarb Apr 2016 #338
Another +1. A very disgusted +1 sammythecat Apr 2016 #289
Quite the pile-on. pintobean Apr 2016 #221
That was a well deserved hide. The post was rude, arrogant, LibDemAlways Apr 2016 #269
I have seen Sanders supports say so, so much worse nolawarlock Apr 2016 #284
You call this statement knowledgeable? mdbl Apr 2016 #293
Really? nolawarlock Apr 2016 #334
Well, then therein lies the problem mdbl Apr 2016 #364
If you say so. n/t nolawarlock Apr 2016 #365
Singing with your biased broad brush again! Silver_Witch Apr 2016 #312
I said this elsewhere, but ... nolawarlock Apr 2016 #335
Never really known poverty. Mother Of Four Apr 2016 #321
Did you not read my post? nolawarlock Apr 2016 #336
I'm sorry Erich. riderinthestorm Apr 2016 #5
Don't fool yourself..our fate was sealed skepticscott Apr 2016 #145
Yep, they sold the next generations out. Shame on all of them. nt Live and Learn Apr 2016 #265
Two thirds of the site pintobean Apr 2016 #6
Please re-consider NJCher Apr 2016 #7
Hear, hear. forest444 Apr 2016 #26
Referring to people who support Hillary as "Hillistines" does not help and it's just cstanleytech Apr 2016 #107
You've been objecting to names like "Bernie Bros" and "BSers" all along for the same reasons? merrily Apr 2016 #171
Yes. Of course few for either side are able to put their partisanship aside and listen cstanleytech Apr 2016 #191
I agree with Cher Worried senior Apr 2016 #137
+1000 nt Mojorabbit Apr 2016 #267
I am sorry to see you go and I understand completely. redwitch Apr 2016 #8
Best of luck to you dreamnightwind Apr 2016 #9
Ok. Hope you're back in Nov. Politicub Apr 2016 #10
I actually don't think the OP votes in U.S. elections.... LisaM Apr 2016 #19
Or......................... HeartoftheMidwest Apr 2016 #30
Yes, that's true. LisaM Apr 2016 #33
Didn't notice that Politicub Apr 2016 #53
I am a born and raised US citizen GeoWilliam750 Apr 2016 #125
Same. I spell it both ways. Dual citizen. R. Daneel Olivaw Apr 2016 #127
Without getting into a shouting match, please can you tell me.. phazed0 Apr 2016 #93
I voted for Hillary in my state's primary already Politicub Apr 2016 #106
Gee wiz.. phazed0 Apr 2016 #108
I've never seen people as touchy as HRC supporters. Beartracks Apr 2016 #193
I noticed the same zentrum Apr 2016 #299
That's bothered me from the start. Beartracks Apr 2016 #373
What I can't figure out is most Hillary supporters praise her pragmatism for anything A Simple Game Apr 2016 #301
Interesting point. They've used Bernie's pragmatic stance... Beartracks Apr 2016 #374
Well, she's just…. zentrum Apr 2016 #375
Clinton and her supporters winning hearts and minds of voters.. ladyfinger Apr 2016 #254
Majority of my fellow gays are avid Clinton supporters dbackjon Apr 2016 #152
So when you read an article like this.. phazed0 Apr 2016 #159
You don't read dbackjon Apr 2016 #272
By voting for DOMA and advocating marriage as between a man and a woman? n/t eridani Apr 2016 #281
I have a gay relative and know more than a few of his friends. Thor_MN Apr 2016 #173
Don't admit to Politicub that you have gay friends, otherwise: phazed0 Apr 2016 #178
You sold out the future generations and you want us to vote for your continued Live and Learn Apr 2016 #266
Living in a bubble can be preferable to getting things done in the real world anigbrowl Apr 2016 #11
I'm confused. Are you implying that Hillary can, or has truebluegreen Apr 2016 #246
If you tell a lie big enough, and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. Kittycat Apr 2016 #275
Yup. truebluegreen Apr 2016 #311
Oh, you're right. She's never done anything ever. anigbrowl Apr 2016 #339
That's what I thought. Thanks for confirming it. truebluegreen Apr 2016 #368
I will miss you. Liberal Jesus Freak Apr 2016 #12
I understand. Iggo Apr 2016 #13
hope to see you at JPR at least. nt retrowire Apr 2016 #14
Me too. Divernan Apr 2016 #17
There are already many DUers over at JPR. It's a breath of LibDemAlways Apr 2016 #28
What is JPR? sus453 Apr 2016 #44
JPR SandersDem Apr 2016 #48
Thanks. sus453 Apr 2016 #97
Here's a direct link! Bubzer Apr 2016 #115
some jerk actually alerted on this post. navarth Apr 2016 #101
LOL SandersDem Apr 2016 #102
Most of the juries I've been on LibDemAlways Apr 2016 #165
Same here for the juries I've been on... phazed0 Apr 2016 #166
For a while I was getting called to juries Blue_In_AK Apr 2016 #197
That would explain why you don't get called for jury duty for those you've rhett o rick Apr 2016 #350
Mine is still 100%, Blue_In_AK Apr 2016 #352
It looks fishy to me. rhett o rick Apr 2016 #353
No jury duty for a month you say? pintobean Apr 2016 #358
Guilty, I am a strong supporter of Sanders. That makes me a target to the Jr High antics here. rhett o rick Apr 2016 #359
You're not a target. pintobean Apr 2016 #367
That's typical projection. Just because that's one of your tactics doesn't mean it would be rhett o rick Apr 2016 #369
Not me, rick pintobean Apr 2016 #370
Me, too! Duval Apr 2016 #57
Jackpine is an excellent save haven, but Flying Shoe Apr 2016 #244
+1!! /nt RiverLover Apr 2016 #371
If Trump gets in Turbineguy Apr 2016 #15
And we will have earned it. nt silvershadow Apr 2016 #23
So what? One phony or another? broiles Apr 2016 #103
You are not alone. n/t AirmensMom Apr 2016 #16
I suspect the only ones that would dance on your grave are those who you have on ignore liberal N proud Apr 2016 #18
Right behind you. Maedhros Apr 2016 #20
Well please wait until convention at least. Take care. Maybe we will find you silvershadow Apr 2016 #22
Fringy extreme irrelevance is one choice. yallerdawg Apr 2016 #24
I understand. Duppers Apr 2016 #25
I'm starting to wonder if DU has enough bandwidth for my Ignore list. LibDemAlways Apr 2016 #29
Ha, yep. I've no tolerance for them left. Duppers Apr 2016 #40
When the election season started I said that if everyone jwirr Apr 2016 #47
Duppers! My good friend! 20score Apr 2016 #98
Hi, my friend! So that's where you've been! Duppers Apr 2016 #129
Best wishes. onyourleft Apr 2016 #31
Going to miss you, Erich, but understand completely. sarge43 Apr 2016 #32
If you are concerned about all the DUers that support war hughee99 Apr 2016 #34
Shouldn't have to wait long to see PDittie Apr 2016 #70
But she'll definitely have her defenders here. If Trump starts the same war for the same reason, hughee99 Apr 2016 #90
Um - I think Hillary already has the blueprint written for Syria. Or did you miss that part? jillan Apr 2016 #251
If Clinton becomes president, she will find some defenders here no matter what she does. hughee99 Apr 2016 #268
Godspeed XemaSab Apr 2016 #35
I don't see the issue fbc Apr 2016 #36
I agree LiberalLovinLug Apr 2016 #66
I will say this about the "Discuss politics" part of DU. Dustlawyer Apr 2016 #99
I have served on more juries in the last 6 months than the previous 6 years... Moostache Apr 2016 #130
^+1 zentrum Apr 2016 #300
We just had one of the "hosts" of our Bernie Group... malokvale77 Apr 2016 #164
THAT's what she meant? eom LiberalElite Apr 2016 #232
That's what the title of the OP suggests. malokvale77 Apr 2016 #236
At first, I thought you must have been referring to bvf Apr 2016 #259
Yes... malokvale77 Apr 2016 #261
I believe she is. bvf Apr 2016 #264
I hope so. malokvale77 Apr 2016 #271
Thank you. I have no idea why any Sanders supporters here whine about anything given that they stevenleser Apr 2016 #377
hey - don't feel too bad, I only voted ish of the hammer Apr 2016 #37
I dont blame you tularetom Apr 2016 #38
This message was self-deleted by its author dinkytron Apr 2016 #39
Well, I won't miss you, cause I know where you are hanging out, wouldsman Apr 2016 #41
Sorry to hear it. Adrahil Apr 2016 #42
Ahhhh self-deportation. Maybe DU will get back to what it was in 2000? Jitter65 Apr 2016 #43
And you know this how? hobbit709 Apr 2016 #46
I doubt it. DU peaked in 2001. Losing actual progressives will make the site decline further. nt Gore1FL Apr 2016 #56
There's nothing like a classy goodbye Orrex Apr 2016 #45
This. nt msanthrope Apr 2016 #50
Yet your post makes it look classy in context Gore1FL Apr 2016 #58
Meh Orrex Apr 2016 #64
Speaking of ignore PDittie Apr 2016 #72
Thanks for saving me the trouble. Orrex Apr 2016 #76
+1 Ed Suspicious Apr 2016 #77
+2 Bubzer Apr 2016 #118
+3 840high Apr 2016 #205
+4 FlatBaroque Apr 2016 #219
+5 Enthusiast Apr 2016 #242
+6 nt ChisolmTrailDem Apr 2016 #329
+7 Lizzie Poppet Apr 2016 #379
There's nothig classy about 840high Apr 2016 #203
My candidate is the Democrat on the ballot in November Orrex Apr 2016 #224
This is the truth of this election trc Apr 2016 #255
Post removed Post removed Apr 2016 #340
So you'll be voting for Clinton, then? Orrex Apr 2016 #344
understand oldandhappy Apr 2016 #49
I don't get how giving up makes things better for you and the country?? DCBob Apr 2016 #52
Everyone has a right to their feelings. Everyone. Duval Apr 2016 #63
Going to miss you, but I so understand! Duval Apr 2016 #54
Logged in to say goodbye. F4lconF16 Apr 2016 #55
Friend, liberalnarb Apr 2016 #59
Thanks so much for your classy goodbye MissDeeds Apr 2016 #60
Mine did, too. Duval Apr 2016 #65
That's where I went. 20score Apr 2016 #69
Sad to say that it sometimes appears that... afertal Apr 2016 #61
Time to join the Gravedancer's Union! marcopolo63 Apr 2016 #62
+1 glinda Apr 2016 #83
More interested in joining the mob rpannier Apr 2016 #150
There are so many other forums you can participate in. DawgHouse Apr 2016 #67
Excellent! Couldn't agree more. And some toxic douchebags 20score Apr 2016 #68
AMF! MarianJack Apr 2016 #71
don't forget to form a new party. We need one. n/t SleeplessinSoCal Apr 2016 #73
Bye. Indydem Apr 2016 #74
It's not about you BainsBane Apr 2016 #75
I Would Agree With You, But... chwaliszewski Apr 2016 #79
ok, i dont disagree with you, but let's not pretend that these rules were just invented to La Lioness Priyanka Apr 2016 #84
Apples & Oranges... chwaliszewski Apr 2016 #113
no apples to apples. the fact that he switched parties, doesn't make the system unfair La Lioness Priyanka Apr 2016 #114
Hillary deserves the Democratic nomination... chwaliszewski Apr 2016 #119
Switched "parties"? There's an Independent Party? Who knew? truebluegreen Apr 2016 #250
I disagree on a national primary BainsBane Apr 2016 #343
so so so true. nt La Lioness Priyanka Apr 2016 #81
Wow. Orrex Apr 2016 #86
Bravo! NastyRiffraff Apr 2016 #139
Yep, and that doesn't include complaining about the existence of super-delegates after hiring the stevenleser Apr 2016 #310
It's not aboput him, but it is about how terribly far right the party has drifted The Green Manalishi Apr 2016 #328
I don't think you have a clear sense of the party's history BainsBane Apr 2016 #341
Those are some good points, thanks. The Green Manalishi Apr 2016 #351
I didn't always agree with you but I genuinely liked you. Codeine Apr 2016 #78
He would never get anything passed. WinkyDink Apr 2016 #80
Neither will she. zentrum Apr 2016 #132
This is the best analysis of what's LibDemAlways Apr 2016 #153
And with that you are absolutely correct................................. turbinetree Apr 2016 #186
As Dems zentrum Apr 2016 #199
And her tenure zentrum Apr 2016 #195
but she won't sign a bill repealing the ACA treestar Apr 2016 #214
We've never had something like the TPP in the balance before. Bubzer Apr 2016 #223
Eyeroll. darkwing Apr 2016 #330
Pro TPP AND pro fracking? Your totally belong over in freeperville... not here on DU. Bubzer Apr 2016 #331
Those issues are not the clear as to liberal/conservative treestar Apr 2016 #363
Maybe not. But absolutely a corporatist, which, quite frankly, is far worse. Bubzer Apr 2016 #366
I don't agree with that treestar Apr 2016 #361
United Healthcare....................... turbinetree Apr 2016 #248
thinking of not using the ACA? treestar Apr 2016 #362
Brother Erich - TBF Apr 2016 #82
Thanks for your dedication Trajan Apr 2016 #85
I understand exactly where you are coming from... urbuddha Apr 2016 #89
.... nt grasswire Apr 2016 #215
Oh, come on! Hillary isn't in favor of those things you list... HomerRamone Apr 2016 #87
Oh, I hope you will come back. sofa king Apr 2016 #88
Yep. I grok. The diaspora has begun. bbgrunt Apr 2016 #91
I, for one, will miss your posts Depaysement Apr 2016 #92
Not locked yet, and... R. Daneel Olivaw Apr 2016 #94
Hope you like it when the true fascists are in charge because people like you wouldn't vote lark Apr 2016 #95
Honestly it is because of Wall St shareholders. raouldukelives Apr 2016 #313
I will miss your voice here. Half-Century Man Apr 2016 #96
Not voting for the Democratic candidate......... WcoastO Apr 2016 #100
Agreed. snort Apr 2016 #104
If you leave... Helen Borg Apr 2016 #105
I joined the grave dancers' union, I had to file... KamaAina Apr 2016 #109
K&R + 1000s (n/t) bread_and_roses Apr 2016 #110
Oh, Erich! chervilant Apr 2016 #111
A Clinton got me into politics, and a Clinton got me out. liberalmuse Apr 2016 #112
The fight is not over....... WcoastO Apr 2016 #124
You Should Start Your Own Site And Call It... chwaliszewski Apr 2016 #116
Recing before the lock. blackspade Apr 2016 #117
See you in September. nt Chichiri Apr 2016 #120
Green for Me! kadaholo Apr 2016 #121
I came across zentrum Apr 2016 #122
This is a really great article and well worth a read. nt emsimon33 Apr 2016 #163
Taught me a lot. zentrum Apr 2016 #207
I agree emsimon33 Apr 2016 #218
OK! johnp3907 Apr 2016 #128
that's a shame- always is when liberals opt out of the process. always easier if you don't have any bettyellen Apr 2016 #131
Sorry your leaving DI Freighter Watcher Apr 2016 #133
Sorry to hear it, but I understand. closeupready Apr 2016 #134
Many of us will be right behind you. basselope Apr 2016 #135
what's interesting is that i can think of several thousand maxsolomon Apr 2016 #140
Sorry, I am not sure that is true. basselope Apr 2016 #142
Really? Name ONE republican pol maxsolomon Apr 2016 #149
Pretty much any of them. basselope Apr 2016 #185
Are you on the right website, then? maxsolomon Apr 2016 #354
Yes. basselope Apr 2016 #356
you're not right, either. you BELIEVE your prediction will be correct maxsolomon Apr 2016 #357
Well.. I know it is correct. basselope Apr 2016 #360
One of the zentrum Apr 2016 #303
Frankly, today's so-called "Democrats" wouldn't know a REAL Democrat Triana Apr 2016 #136
True! nt Duppers Apr 2016 #141
Dead on perfect. nt malokvale77 Apr 2016 #169
true 840high Apr 2016 #208
+1,000,000 ... BUT ... Trajan Apr 2016 #226
Huge +1! Enthusiast Apr 2016 #243
+10 The heart of the matter. appalachiablue Apr 2016 #322
Awesome pity party! Cary Apr 2016 #138
Don't get your way, you take your ball and go home. Loki Apr 2016 #144
Typical libodem Apr 2016 #146
To which you invited yourself eom LiberalElite Apr 2016 #234
Did the doctor take you off verbs? bvf Apr 2016 #283
Yes, it is awesome to see so many supporters here still for the truth. No pity here, just pragmatic sabrina 1 Apr 2016 #348
I agree with pretty much everything you said Not Sure Apr 2016 #143
I can certainly relate stupidicus Apr 2016 #147
Bye. I am sure the GOP will welcome you with open arms. dbackjon Apr 2016 #151
Good riddance to bad rubbish and a sore loser who won't go with a majority The Second Stone Apr 2016 #154
Congratulations malokvale77 Apr 2016 #172
Thank you. Now keep your promise The Second Stone Apr 2016 #179
Your post makes no sense in reply to my post. malokvale77 Apr 2016 #183
I am no fan of Skinner, who banned my good friend Bartcop The Second Stone Apr 2016 #190
I'll lead, thank you very much. retrowire Apr 2016 #184
Demonstrate some leadership and I will The Second Stone Apr 2016 #188
;) No whining has been done on my part. nt retrowire Apr 2016 #206
Yeah... the New Democrats and a new name added to my ignore list Bubzer Apr 2016 #227
Dear Bubzer malokvale77 Apr 2016 #233
Oh goodness no! I was refering to the person antagonizing you!!! Bubzer Apr 2016 #238
Thank you... malokvale77 Apr 2016 #249
Majority is dead wrong. 840high Apr 2016 #209
That's what a communist says when they reject the majority The Second Stone Apr 2016 #247
I'm not a lemming - used to be. 840high Apr 2016 #252
You are entitled to vote anyway you want The Second Stone Apr 2016 #257
Stick around, if only for the juries. n/t bvf Apr 2016 #158
Thanks for the laugh in this thread. n/t AnotherDreamWeaver Apr 2016 #279
I fear there will be a mass exodus from the un-Democratic Party emsimon33 Apr 2016 #161
Debbie Wasserman-Schultz' record as DNC head is miserable. closeupready Apr 2016 #230
Yes, in their hubris they fail to see the abyss--the end of the Democratic Party emsimon33 Apr 2016 #231
Long ago, I had a friend - he was fond of saying, closeupready Apr 2016 #256
It will be the end of the un-Democratic Party if Hillary is the nominee emsimon33 Apr 2016 #378
You realize elections are more often than 4 years? darkwing Apr 2016 #314
Come on over to Jackpineradicals.com emsimon33 Apr 2016 #162
I get it. I'm having similar thoughts. Arugula Latte Apr 2016 #167
one only has to look at the 1956 Republican Platform to see how far we have fallen Angry Dragon Apr 2016 #168
A big +1 Flying Shoe Apr 2016 #245
+ a brazillion truebluegreen Apr 2016 #253
Toodles philosslayer Apr 2016 #170
See ya. Paladin Apr 2016 #174
Results... Major Nikon Apr 2016 #216
Another one of the most intelligent, thoughtful posters on the board. Fare well, Erich. merrily Apr 2016 #175
Yes he is. nt malokvale77 Apr 2016 #181
It's been an honor Hydra Apr 2016 #176
Goodbye, gelatinous cube Apr 2016 #177
I feel your pain, my friend. Hell Hath No Fury Apr 2016 #187
Can't say I blame you. Chef Eric Apr 2016 #189
Hi Erich TracieLynn Apr 2016 #192
I will miss you. 840high Apr 2016 #196
I'll miss you. I'm pretty much addicted Ilsa Apr 2016 #200
Good luck Erich. I imagine they'll be many joining you in the near future. EndElectoral Apr 2016 #201
Best wishes to you, dear. sister_rosa_refried Apr 2016 #202
Hope to see you at JPR! peacebird Apr 2016 #204
Try out zomgitsjesus Apr 2016 #210
The trolls win! Good luck on a new site until the trolls win enough here and go there instead. eom Festivito Apr 2016 #211
Cya workinclasszero Apr 2016 #212
Hey, Erich... You know the irony here sometimes slaps me right in the friggin face... MrMickeysMom Apr 2016 #213
Oh good grief! What ever! leftofcool Apr 2016 #220
I don't know why this is in the Lounge, but as long as it is, rug Apr 2016 #222
Take it easy. ronnykmarshall Apr 2016 #225
I'll miss you. Be well, and do good things, and enjoy life. DeadLetterOffice Apr 2016 #228
I want to thank all the hillarians who were kind enough to volunteer to be added to my ignore list! Bubzer Apr 2016 #229
voter suppression as long as it works in their favour, passiveporcupine Apr 2016 #235
Peace my friend. Phlem Apr 2016 #239
I'm sure glad most Bernie Sanders followers are not so selfishly entitled.... Moonwalk Apr 2016 #241
Hey gardening friend.... NRaleighLiberal Apr 2016 #258
i get it, and probably getting there myself restorefreedom Apr 2016 #260
Please come back... Califonz Apr 2016 #262
Sorry to see you go, Erich Jack Rabbit Apr 2016 #263
Well, that sucks. OnyxCollie Apr 2016 #270
Another drinking thread I missed. mackerel Apr 2016 #274
Hey, you're still listed as active! JimDandy Apr 2016 #277
The public hasn't had enough of being ruled by the rich. Spitfire of ATJ Apr 2016 #278
I will never understand the way some folks flounce as they leave message boards. nolawarlock Apr 2016 #280
Colorado Dems just kicked 3 Clinton superdelegates out of the state party eridani Apr 2016 #285
This bit of news warms my heart. There's a mighty storm coming. / FlatBaroque Apr 2016 #302
If you have two thirds of the site on ignore.... JohnnyRingo Apr 2016 #286
I disagree with you about the party, there's a good article here PBass Apr 2016 #287
Thank you for this. Amimnoch Apr 2016 #298
See—but that's the problem zentrum Apr 2016 #306
Thanks for everything, I hope you'll mention where you go if you post elsewhere. AnotherDreamWeaver Apr 2016 #288
Take care, Erich. nt MrScorpio Apr 2016 #290
I'm done, too. AngryOldDem Apr 2016 #291
Here's to us, AOD... MrMickeysMom Apr 2016 #292
Bye ! Setsuna1972 Apr 2016 #295
I always found cross-dragging the most annoying JNelson6563 Apr 2016 #296
We'll be seeing a lot of people pintobean Apr 2016 #304
Best of wishes to you mate. Amimnoch Apr 2016 #297
Can't blame you hellofromreddit Apr 2016 #305
Damn! bullsnarfle Apr 2016 #307
Sorry to see you go, Erich. Most of us here still support Democratic values. AllyCat Apr 2016 #309
Not liking the "No We Can't" modern day agenda. Cobalt Violet Apr 2016 #315
Sad state of affairs laserhaas Apr 2016 #317
Sorry to see you go! denvine Apr 2016 #318
When you think about it, if this that you said is true ... KPN Apr 2016 #319
Well, Bye. MyNameGoesHere Apr 2016 #323
I identify completely. I fear it is an irreversible condition. King_Klonopin Apr 2016 #342
I'll miss reading you LWolf Apr 2016 #372
Your voice will be missed. May the road rise with you. myrna minx Apr 2016 #376

MuseRider

(34,277 posts)
3. Bye Erich
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:48 PM
Apr 2016

Thanks for all your commentary. I think many of us will be gone soon most likely. Enjoy what you can and keep working for your ideals.

AmBlue

(3,226 posts)
157. This thread should be PINNED as a constant reminder...
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:35 PM
Apr 2016

...of what is happening here. Go in peace, friend. Your voice will be missed here by many of us, as we continue to carry the torch a little longer.

In solidarity!

AikidoSoul

(2,150 posts)
332. I'm un-joining the Democratic Party after the elections
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 01:02 PM
Apr 2016

It's time for a third party... run and joined by real progressives.

There are millions of them out there. Bernie has shown us that.

I wish you wouldn't leave Erich...voices such as yours need to be heard. It makes a difference
even if you can't "feel" it.

I weep when I feel disheartened. I weep when someone who is an intelligent voice decides to take a walk.

Will miss you very, very much.

Response to Erich Bloodaxe BSN (Original post)

 

bvf

(6,604 posts)
156. MADem is still chafing about not having gotten
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:34 PM
Apr 2016

the last word a few days ago.

Poor darling.

Bubzer

(4,211 posts)
217. Such a shame. I think I shall shed a tear for him/her.... oh, I do tell a lie! No I wont!
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 09:42 PM
Apr 2016

It makes me too giddy!

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
325. When one creates a self-fulfilling prophecy, one should expect it to be fulfilled...
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 11:46 AM
Apr 2016

When one creates a petulant, self-absorbed and self-fulfilling prophecy, one should expect it to be fulfilled...

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
345. Keep this in mind, the Democratic Party has lost 12% of its base since 2008. THAT is called a self
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:29 PM
Apr 2016

fulfilling prophecy, since as soon as WE gave them the House, Senate and WH they told us to stfu that our ideas were 'retarded'. Their base now only 30% of registered voters. That is going to decrease even more due to the fact that they are telling those of us who are left,, 'we don't want you'. Well, we don't want them anymore either UNLESS Sanders wins. That is the only hope for the Dem party to maintain any kind of viability as a party.

It's up to them, but they still don't seem to be listening. When all you have is 30% of registered voters, while Independents are now the largest voting bloc in the country, things are not going to continue to go in your favor.

I don't know what your comment means frankly. I do know that the OP is part of a growing number of those Democrats still hanging on to a party that has told them to leave, who are now ready to 'fulfill the prophecy'.

LibDemAlways

(15,139 posts)
27. Your reply is one reason why the poster is leaving the party and DU.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:58 PM
Apr 2016

Keep it up and you'll be in a total echo chamber of delusional people who think all of the reasons the poster cited for leaving are a good thing. Good luck with that come November.

 

R. Daneel Olivaw

(12,606 posts)
126. It's too bad that the poster has to be so negative.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 05:19 PM
Apr 2016

I'm not sure that is what is going to be seen as coming together by camp weathervane, but I don't expect them to understand how disgusted the left is with them presently.

LibDemAlways

(15,139 posts)
148. They are truly clueless.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:05 PM
Apr 2016

Since when was anyone ever won over by being insulted and treated like shit. When Bernie's supporters find something better to do on Election Day than vote for the lesser of two evils, they'll be cluelessly wondering what went wrong.

KPN

(15,842 posts)
320. "When Bernie's supporters find something better to do on Election Day ...
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 10:39 AM
Apr 2016
than vote for the lesser of two evils, they'll be cluelessly wondering what went wrong."

Pot, meet kettle!

My you are on a high horse.
 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
326. I think it's cute we chide others for negativity, then turn around and engage in the same ourselves.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 11:49 AM
Apr 2016

I think it's cute we chide others for negativity, then turn around and engage in the same ourselves.

No doubt, you'll rationalize to yourself, if not others, that "camp weathervane" is a happy, sweet and ice-cream-filled bit of grade school fun.

That very rationalization is expected from people who hold others to a higher standard than they hold themselves to.

malokvale77

(4,879 posts)
155. That one was responsible for my first encounter with nasty on DU.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:33 PM
Apr 2016

I've never seen different from him/her since.

malokvale77

(4,879 posts)
180. To be honest...
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:21 PM
Apr 2016

not a one of them has put forth a "decent" argument for her. Just post after post of bile aimed at Bernie and his supporters.

I see a mass exodus from the Democratic Party in short time.

SMH

LibDemAlways

(15,139 posts)
273. There are no decent arguments for her. I've posted a number
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 01:51 AM
Apr 2016

of times asking Hillary supporters to make the case. Why does she deserve to be elected President? I have yet to receive a single articulate response laying out a good argument. For awhile there it was all fear of Trump. Now it's nothing but bashing Bernie and his supporters.They seem to regard us as peasants blocking the palace doors to prevent the coronation of the queen. It's pathetic.

malokvale77

(4,879 posts)
276. You get it...
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:18 AM
Apr 2016

we're both disgusted by it.

Fear of Trump doesn't work for me. The Clinton's and Trump's have been friends for decades. They all think the same. Trump is nothing more than a fear tactic to get the Clinton's back in the WH.

MrMickeysMom

(20,453 posts)
294. Gee... What does it mean when really rich friends aim to run against the other...
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 06:33 AM
Apr 2016

... I mean, besides a bunch of willfully ignorant people managing to ignore we don't have an oligarchy?

La!La!La!La! Nah!Nah!Nah! It'sHerTime! It'sHerTime! It'sHerTime!...

SCantiGOP

(13,968 posts)
324. I know Sanders supporters are big on conspiracy theories
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 11:42 AM
Apr 2016

But Trump's whole candidacy is a tactic to elect Clinton?
Wow.
What color is the sky on your planet?

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
346. No, Sanders' supporters, there are millions of them btw, are not 'big on CTs, that old Sunstein
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:35 PM
Apr 2016

tactic rears its head again. Just wanted to correct that. Trump and Clinton have been friends for years, he has explained why he has helped finance her three campaigns. Would you like to know what he said? Well, I'll tell you anyhow. He said 'I live in NY and when you live in NY you HAVE to donate to Democrats. IF YOU WANT TO BE ABLE TO PICK UP THE PHONE when you want something done, that is what you have to do'.

CT? Or Fact? He's the donor, she the recipient. I say that it's a fact. Because I live in NY also and we know exactly why wealthy people donate to politicians.

SCantiGOP

(13,968 posts)
355. This is what I was responding to:
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 04:38 PM
Apr 2016

from the post: "Trump is nothing more than a fear tactic to get the Clinton's back in the WH."

If that doesn't qualify as a conspiracy theory I don't know what would.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
182. Their arrogance is over the top. The very reason progressives are leaving here.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:25 PM
Apr 2016

They pretty much run the show here and think they can demean us and still get us to support the Rich Fat Cat's choice. Homey don't play that game.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
327. It's always "them." Never "us." Bias forces the mentally lazy to perceive as such.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 11:51 AM
Apr 2016

It's always "them." Never "us." Bias forces the mentally lazy to perceive as such, regardless of what games you may or may not play with yourself...

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
347. So, do you agree with the Dem Party position that the 'ideas' of Progressives 'are retarded'?
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:38 PM
Apr 2016

Is that 'bias'? Coming from a high ranking Democrat? What would YOU call it?

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
349. Actually they don't matter, speaking for myself. Much bigger issues are the reason why progressives
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:44 PM
Apr 2016

are leaving. There is a lot of work to do and it can't be done here obviously. THAT is why people are moving on.

pangaia

(24,324 posts)
194. All his/her posts are like that.. What must that kind of life be like?
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:58 PM
Apr 2016

...To wake up in the morning and go to sleep like that?
I lose it sometimes as well, but.. jeeze.. it's like 24/7..

passiveporcupine

(8,175 posts)
237. I wonder
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 10:26 PM
Apr 2016

What if we started a movement and all just walked off.

We certainly have the numbers to start a new forum. And I don't mean a forum just for Bernie dems, but for all dems who might feel the atmosphere here is tainted.

nolawarlock

(1,729 posts)
282. I'm just befuddled
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:13 AM
Apr 2016

How this Sanders supporter can even have 2/3 of the site on ignore when I think at least 80% of this site is made up of Sanders supporters I will never know. Talk about difficult math.

As for echo chamber, this is really rich. Sanders supporters on this site alert stalk people, berate people into silence, and are generally just not tolerant of any other view other than their illusory party line. And this goes way beyond this site. Anytime I see something on Facebook, the most vitriolic people are the Trump supporters and the second most vitriolic are easily the Bernie people. I never see Hillary supporters on Facebook ranting and raving and I certainly don't see them on the various social media pages for super delegates threatening them, berating them, and being all around unpleasant.

For this crew to play the victim like this is just so disingenuous.

 

liberalnarb

(4,532 posts)
308. Can't tell you how many times I've been harassed by Clinton supporters on here.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 09:04 AM
Apr 2016

I once posted about how I am now covered by the affordable care act and they filled my DU mail with messages about how I should be thanking Hillary.

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
316. alerted and bullied myself
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 10:04 AM
Apr 2016

...until recently when those bullies have found themselves on time out.

I don't base my political voting habits on anon posers on a web discussion board. I generally don't feel compelled to respond when I don't feel like it and I realize NONE OF US knows the true nature, true motivations, true sell out, buy out or cop out behind any poster. It's the very reason I find the GBCW posts on DU, and specifically because of the posting habits on DU, sort of shallow and maladjusted.

We all suspect there are paid trolls here, we all suspect there are operators that just love to disrupt, cause hurt, division and anger, we all suspect there are those that are here to cause havoc, we don't know if they are red, blue or green...we really don't.

LibDemAlways

(15,139 posts)
269. That was a well deserved hide. The post was rude, arrogant,
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 01:25 AM
Apr 2016

and dismissive. After a mean-spirited comment like that, the poster forfeited any right he or she may have had to respond.

nolawarlock

(1,729 posts)
284. I have seen Sanders supports say so, so much worse
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:23 AM
Apr 2016

... but because this site is anything but 2/3 people the author of the OP would actually be able to ignore, and because it's, in fact, mostly made up of Sanders supporters, they barely ever get hidden and they say far worse. Heck, my just saying this will probably get alert stalked.

It doesn't matter. The admins thankfully refunded the hundred bucks I donated for a Star membership back. I am all for supporting the Dems, but I will not donate to a site that has a jury system that is rigged to favor the majority candidate rather than actually work to reduce abusive behavior.

Madem's post may have been a bit condescending but so what? It's certainly worse than "piece of shit" and "fuck off" and other things I've seen on here that nobody even tries to alert.

Someone said something to me last night in our patio—a pretty left-wing teacher who is incredibly well-educated and knowledgable—that really stuck with me ... and it's that most of these Bernie people have never really known poverty, so they only actually talk about it as some sort of social experiment. Heck, I'm certainly not poor now but I know poor. I know dirt poor. And I know what having one of these Right Wing wahoos mess up the economy can really mean for people. I don't know if he was really right about his assertions but it does explain this cognitive dissonance that allows the harshest of the Bernie supporters to casually toss off how they'll just sit this one out. I have to wonder if they have at stake what many women, minorities, gays, and the poor actually have at stake. I don't want to go back the days of more homophobia and I certainly don't want to be poor again. I know what's at stake and it's why, even though I find Bernie repugnant (at first because of the Pope thing but now because I see the hatred he inspires), I will still vote for him in November. Many of us don't have the luxury to sit these things out. I applaud those who do, but don't act all high and mighty like you're not participating in the nasty behavior because I've only ever seen the kind of behavior I've seen from Bernie supporters on this website and in the social media from Trump people. It does give quite a bit of weight to that old Horseshoe theory.

mdbl

(4,984 posts)
293. You call this statement knowledgeable?
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 06:21 AM
Apr 2016
and it's that most of these Bernie people have never really known poverty, so they only actually talk about it as some sort of social experiment


That's so wrong from so many angles. Tell your well educated friend that most of the Bernie supporters I know came from poverty and have spent the last 50 years fighting for good wages and safe working conditions only to see it thrown down the toilet over that last thirty years. Has your knowledgeable friend ever been on strike? Give me a break. IMO, only those that have never known struggle could even consider voting for a corporate candidate.

nolawarlock

(1,729 posts)
334. Really?
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 01:21 PM
Apr 2016

I am certainly not someone who has never known struggle but then I don't believe the lie that Hillary is a "corporate candidate."

 

Silver_Witch

(1,820 posts)
312. Singing with your biased broad brush again!
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 09:33 AM
Apr 2016

I am a women and grew up poor and for a good portion of my life have been poor and a mother. For a time I scavenged from dumpsters to feed myself and my son. I know the struggle of whether to keep working and paying more than half my pay for daycare back when men who didn't pay child support suffered no consequence but their children suffered!

I support Bernie. I don't support Hillary and if the only democratic candidate the DNC could run is Hillary there is no hope for the party of which I have been a loyal member for 40+ years. Yes a republican would be horrible for this country so would another war or giving away woman's right to healthcare that is right for her or fracking or the TPP all of which we will have under Clinton.

nolawarlock

(1,729 posts)
335. I said this elsewhere, but ...
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 01:24 PM
Apr 2016

Why is it nearly always 40 years? It's almost a template. Just once I want to see someone on here say they've been a Democrat for 23 years or something. It's why I question how many of these folks really are Democrats and not just plants.

Mother Of Four

(1,718 posts)
321. Never really known poverty.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 10:44 AM
Apr 2016

.... Social experiment.

I was literally sitting here looking at the blank square trying to figure out a way to answer this without turning the flame thrower on high. Then I realized you probably didn't understand just how offensive that was to someone who had pulled themselves out of it.

Suffice it to say, I won't. Just be very clear, more than you realize have known poverty. In my experience the ones who have broken that prison tend not to talk about it much. I can only speak on myself because I don't know their motivation. Personally I don't like to remember it.

nolawarlock

(1,729 posts)
336. Did you not read my post?
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 01:29 PM
Apr 2016

I have pulled myself out of severe poverty. I grew up on welfare and I am a pretty damned successful entrepreneur now. How long I'll remain one with Bernie in office is anyone's guess since it seems that he would sacrifice every small business in America if it allows him to hurt the corporations. Of course the corporations can weather this so once half the small businesses are gone, all we'll end up with are ... more corporations. I have broken that prison and I am more than happy to talk about it because I actually still believe in the power of action and change. If Bill Clinton's record is any indication to go by, I'm sure Hillary will make it easier for a lot more people to take that action and change their lives for the better. I never, ever forget where I came from nor do I ever try to hide it. I'd rather appear as a motivation story than a silver spoon.

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
5. I'm sorry Erich.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:57 PM
Apr 2016

The vote last night has sealed our fate on climate change. I'm unsurprised that many will leave the Democratic party when its now clear that a vote for the status quo ensures our destruction.

Good luck in your future travels.

 

skepticscott

(13,029 posts)
145. Don't fool yourself..our fate was sealed
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:00 PM
Apr 2016

a long time ago. In all honesty, it was probably sealed when Jimmy Carter lost to Ronald Reagan. Nothing that Clinton or Sanders could do will stop the rise of global temperatures beyond our ability to cope. The recent foibles of the Democratic Party have nothing to do with it, and last night's primary certainly doesn't.

NJCher

(36,587 posts)
7. Please re-consider
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:18 PM
Apr 2016

You've been around DU a long time and have contributed much. DU will be the poorer without you.

You are a valued poster, despite what some of the callous comments upthread indicate. Not only are your posts thoughtful and often well-researched, you are able to comment on a wide variety of aspects of life, not just politics. You're a creative guy, interested in so much. You taught me about growing saffron!

I do understand your point with the numbers of people being on ignore, but hope you still reconsider. Let things settle down a bit.

If you don't, please let us know where we can touch base with you. Are you at JPR? Got a Facebook?

I sure hope this isn't my last contact with you.


Cher

forest444

(5,902 posts)
26. Hear, hear.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:58 PM
Apr 2016

Leaving would be only be giving the Hillistines what they want, and why would a man of conscience want to do that.

Erich merely needs a short vacation from all this, that's all. But he'll be back; people like us can't go too long without the give-and-take.

cstanleytech

(26,586 posts)
107. Referring to people who support Hillary as "Hillistines" does not help and it's just
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 04:30 PM
Apr 2016

as wrong as when people who support Hillary use a term to try and insult Bernie supporters.

cstanleytech

(26,586 posts)
191. Yes. Of course few for either side are able to put their partisanship aside and listen
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:48 PM
Apr 2016

but I keep trying even though it seems next to impossible to reason with such people who seem to wallow in showing how much they hate x candidate more than the next person.

Worried senior

(1,328 posts)
137. I agree with Cher
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 06:18 PM
Apr 2016

I've enjoyed reading your posts.

Please reconsider otherwise you will be missed by me and many others I'm sure.

redwitch

(14,985 posts)
8. I am sorry to see you go and I understand completely.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:28 PM
Apr 2016

I have been a Democrat for over 50 years and I am struggling with it lately. Be well.

dreamnightwind

(4,775 posts)
9. Best of luck to you
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:44 PM
Apr 2016

Not sure what I'll be doing, working to subvert the corporate captors either from within the party or from without, waiting to see how this all shakes out.

Agree with you re climate change, the status quo candidate is truly not going to get us where we need to go in time. Our future is well and truly fracked. Tragic.

We've made a lot of progress this election, maybe the seed will grow somehow. Your posts were a good part of it, peace.

Politicub

(12,199 posts)
10. Ok. Hope you're back in Nov.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:45 PM
Apr 2016

Many of us have a lot at stake come November. Perhaps you feel like your lot in life will be the same - dem or GOP regardless.

As a gay man, I know my life will not.

But you gotta do what feels right for you. Just don't expect a pat on the back for it.

LisaM

(28,042 posts)
19. I actually don't think the OP votes in U.S. elections....
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:53 PM
Apr 2016

I noticed that he or she spelled "favour" with a "u" in it. So, just saying.

HeartoftheMidwest

(309 posts)
30. Or.........................
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:04 PM
Apr 2016

.........he or she could have been born or raised abroad ( educated abroad )....moved to the States and become a citizen.
Just sayin'.


LisaM

(28,042 posts)
33. Yes, that's true.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:08 PM
Apr 2016

I just noticed it. I am not a fan of this sort of grandstanding email, so there's that.

 

phazed0

(745 posts)
93. Without getting into a shouting match, please can you tell me..
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:42 PM
Apr 2016

.. as a Gay man, why the hell are you voting Hillary? Is it not "the" issue that compels your vote? Is there another issue that you are voting for that makes Hillary your pick?

Living in Richmond, VA (Large gay/bi population) I have a few Gay friends and they pretty much lambaste Clinton constantly and despise her.

Serious question, no BS or judgement here.

Thanks for your time!

Politicub

(12,199 posts)
106. I voted for Hillary in my state's primary already
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 04:29 PM
Apr 2016

I admire her pragmatism, gun control advocacy and devoting her life to public service to make a society that works better for everyone.

I'm not going to get into a back and forth. I'm voting for the dem nominee come Nov.

You don't get extra points or more ally cred for throwing out a line akin to "some of my best friends are gay"

Good day to you.

 

phazed0

(745 posts)
108. Gee wiz..
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 04:33 PM
Apr 2016

Sorry for asking. Just wanted a 'different' perspective from what I see personally.

Good day!

Beartracks

(12,984 posts)
193. I've never seen people as touchy as HRC supporters.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:52 PM
Apr 2016

They can't tell honest questions from sarcastic, mocking ones. I see it time and again here. I guess part of it is "the internet problem" where tone, inflection and facial expression can't be heard/seen -- but the other part of it is that, in that lack of aural/visual cues, they automatically assume the worst.



==============

zentrum

(9,866 posts)
299. I noticed the same
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 07:53 AM
Apr 2016

……thing. I'd get s sarcastic insult in return. Very unpleasant and echoed my impression of her attitude about us, actually.

Also felt that they loved using his acronym—"BS"—because of what it means culturally. The most baffling of it was the tendency to equate progressive ideas—such as single payer—with said acronym, BS—so it was all Bull S&*t.

Actually, Bernie's policies are basic Democratic policies. So her followers seemed furious that we're Democrats instead of Rockefeller Republicans.

Beartracks

(12,984 posts)
373. That's bothered me from the start.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 11:53 PM
Apr 2016

Given a roster of Democrats, I'll go for the most progressive. I was okay with Hillary running... and then Bernie threw his hat in the ring, and I was ecstatic. But the Hillary supporters were like "What?? Who the f*** does he think he is??" and immediately set about dismissing him, chastising his supporters, and eventually doing Rovian attacks on him and all that. And the policy ideas that he espouses are pretty much the kind of things I thought *all* DUers were in favor of not too long ago, but now Hillary supporters claim it's all pie-in-the-sky unicorn fart-dust. Like they always thought single-payer was stupid, money doesn't corrupt, or centrism is the perfect form of liberalism -- instead of only recently coming to these conclusions... around the time Hillary started to have to defend herself against Bernie.

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
301. What I can't figure out is most Hillary supporters praise her pragmatism for anything
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 08:17 AM
Apr 2016

that could benefit large majority of people but then also praise her all or nothing stance on gun control. I say this as a strong advocate for gun control but also a person that sees nothing wrong with Bernie's approach to gun control.

Beartracks

(12,984 posts)
374. Interesting point. They've used Bernie's pragmatic stance...
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 11:55 PM
Apr 2016

.. as a "weak point," when it is precisely her own pragmatism that they hail as THE REASON to vote for her: a.k.a. the "she's a Dem who can actually WIN" argument.

=================

zentrum

(9,866 posts)
375. Well, she's just….
Fri Apr 22, 2016, 06:28 AM
Apr 2016

……rolled out the biggest attack on this gun issue than ever.

Yesterday she said "The NRA is the most powerful lobbyist in Washington DC". I'm trying to quote her exactly—but was so shocked at this underhanded smear against Bernie. She's attempting to taint him with some of the gun-lobby sleaze trying tacitly to link it to his stance about guns. "The most powerful."

So I looked up the top lobbyists in DC. The NRA isn't even in the top 15. It's mostly health insurance companies and oil and tech. Some of the folks that donate to her, in fact.

I hate the NRA—but she uses tactics like a good acolyte of Rove.

 

ladyfinger

(8 posts)
254. Clinton and her supporters winning hearts and minds of voters..
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 11:35 PM
Apr 2016

[font size="5"][font color="brown"]NOT[/font]

 

dbackjon

(6,578 posts)
152. Majority of my fellow gays are avid Clinton supporters
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:28 PM
Apr 2016

We remember all the great work the Clintons have done for us.

Not perfect by any means, but they were a breathe of fresh air in the 90's.




Sanders, while he may have been supportive, was unknown, and frankly has not done anything for the community outside of Vermont.

 

phazed0

(745 posts)
159. So when you read an article like this..
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:39 PM
Apr 2016
Stop Straight-Splaining Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton to LGBT Voters - HuffPost

How do you square that away with your logic of "the 90's" when Hillary only recently (2014, maybe 2011) has become the "champion of LGBT".


Sanders has been on your side for Decades. I'm surprised you think he is supposed to have some far reaching authority beyond his state. Just because you weren't listening to him and fail to educate about it, blaming him for your actions (or lack of), is ridiculous.

Vote against your own interests or at the very least take a chance on the person who has only recently supported LGBT (arguably only for an election), Hillary... I don't get it.
 

Thor_MN

(11,843 posts)
173. I have a gay relative and know more than a few of his friends.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:08 PM
Apr 2016

They are Clinton supporters... I don't think any group is a monolithic supporter of any candidate.

 

phazed0

(745 posts)
178. Don't admit to Politicub that you have gay friends, otherwise:
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:14 PM
Apr 2016

you get this:

"You don't get extra points or more ally cred for throwing out a line akin to "some of my best friends are gay".

As with anything it's not so much a gay = Hillary supporter, It's just people.. and the same Political Geography we all deal with (Red state, blue state, etc) and who you know and how they identify politically, etc.

For god's sake, there are Gay Republicans.. perplexing.

Live and Learn

(12,769 posts)
266. You sold out the future generations and you want us to vote for your continued
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 12:54 AM
Apr 2016

happiness? No shame! nt

 

truebluegreen

(9,033 posts)
246. I'm confused. Are you implying that Hillary can, or has
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 11:15 PM
Apr 2016

"gotten things done in the real world?" If so, what things are you referring to?

Kittycat

(10,493 posts)
275. If you tell a lie big enough, and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:13 AM
Apr 2016

I think she's managed to do that with GREAT success. Along with senseless war for profit.

 

anigbrowl

(13,889 posts)
339. Oh, you're right. She's never done anything ever.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 02:33 PM
Apr 2016

What was I thinking.

True this isn't much of a reply but it's all you deserve.

Liberal Jesus Freak

(1,453 posts)
12. I will miss you.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:48 PM
Apr 2016

I always enjoyed your posts, especially in cooking and baking. The way you write makes me feel as though I'm helping you garden. Take care

LibDemAlways

(15,139 posts)
28. There are already many DUers over at JPR. It's a breath of
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:01 PM
Apr 2016

fresh air. Hope you join up. You have many valuable insights to contribute.

LibDemAlways

(15,139 posts)
165. Most of the juries I've been on
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:47 PM
Apr 2016

recently are for completely innocuous posts that have Hillary supporters' panties twisted in knots. It's become laughable.

 

phazed0

(745 posts)
166. Same here for the juries I've been on...
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:53 PM
Apr 2016

Like they forgot they are on a political forum of ideas.

I'm off to JPR as well. This place is for Democratic Party die-hards that think the 'party' can't do wrong. Fanaticism is always a bad thing.

Blue_In_AK

(46,436 posts)
197. For a while I was getting called to juries
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 09:01 PM
Apr 2016

every day, sometimes twice, but since I've expanded my "ignore" list, I seldom get called. There must be a correlation, although I don't know what it is. Whatever, I like it.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
350. That would explain why you don't get called for jury duty for those you've
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 04:06 PM
Apr 2016

put on ignore but you still should get called for the many, many alerts made by the Clinton supporters. But I believe Skinner warned that he would be removing some from the jury pools for disciplinary actions or other. I haven't been on a jury for close to a month and my percentage is 80% likely to serve.

Blue_In_AK

(46,436 posts)
352. Mine is still 100%,
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 04:24 PM
Apr 2016

but I'm actually glad to be let off the hook for a while. For weeks there, every time I would open my iPad, there was a jury call. I hardly ever hid anyone's posts unless there was serious bullying behavior going on or someone was an obvious troll. Maybe someone decided I was too lenient.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
359. Guilty, I am a strong supporter of Sanders. That makes me a target to the Jr High antics here.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 05:01 PM
Apr 2016

Mocking, gloating, and ridiculing really says who you are.

 

pintobean

(18,101 posts)
367. You're not a target.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 06:22 PM
Apr 2016

You get treated the way you treat people. But whatever you did to get kept off of juries, you did it as a juror. Been taking anonymous cheap shots?

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
369. That's typical projection. Just because that's one of your tactics doesn't mean it would be
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 06:53 PM
Apr 2016

mine. Don't pretend that your tactics are not known. But it's cool. You guys are defined by your actions, just like Clinton is defined by hers. Side with the Wealthy like in Jr High.

 

pintobean

(18,101 posts)
370. Not me, rick
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 07:45 PM
Apr 2016

I'm serving twice a day. Maybe you missed this:

Going forward if we see anyone voting to leave the worst-of-the-worst posts, or voting in a nakedly partisan fashion to hide posts which are clearly legitimate, then we will remove that person's ability to serve on juries. (We are not going to provide any notification to members who lose their jury privileges, because under the messed-up values of primary season we think many of you would see it as some kind of badge of honor.)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1013&pid=5098

Flying Shoe

(23 posts)
244. Jackpine is an excellent save haven, but
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 11:06 PM
Apr 2016

When this primary ends, win or lose, we are going to need a place to carry on this incredible energy. I hope Jackpine can evolve into a base for this movement that Bernie is only a standard-bearer of, and not just be a meeting ground for Bernie supporters.

liberal N proud

(60,531 posts)
18. I suspect the only ones that would dance on your grave are those who you have on ignore
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:53 PM
Apr 2016

Most of us that remain, understand, its politics and take the punches and get back in the game again.

Hope things work out for you in the long run. Good luck.

 

silvershadow

(10,336 posts)
22. Well please wait until convention at least. Take care. Maybe we will find you
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:57 PM
Apr 2016

on that other site? On edit: I'm right behind you but I'm waiting until convention.

Duppers

(28,180 posts)
25. I understand.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:58 PM
Apr 2016

My ignore list is now probably pages long.

There are others here including myself who support the ideas the Dems once supported. The party has moved, not us.

Sorry to know you're leaving.

LibDemAlways

(15,139 posts)
29. I'm starting to wonder if DU has enough bandwidth for my Ignore list.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:03 PM
Apr 2016

Last night it grew by half again. Hillary supporters are nothing if not completely off-putting and obnoxious.

Duppers

(28,180 posts)
40. Ha, yep. I've no tolerance for them left.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:22 PM
Apr 2016

For peace of mind, this old gal has had to limit all rationalizing types irl.


jwirr

(39,215 posts)
47. When the election season started I said that if everyone
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:40 PM
Apr 2016

else was putting as many people on ignore as I was Skinner and Earl G would find themselves on this site talking to themselves. I may have come close to accomplishing that myself.

Hope to see you on JPR. I understand your leaving. I will be also but I would like to stay until the convention.

Duppers

(28,180 posts)
129. Hi, my friend! So that's where you've been!
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 05:32 PM
Apr 2016

I am registered there! However DU is easier to navigate on my phone which I've been stuck with using since hubs is working full-time (60hrs per wk) on our home computer.
I plan to switch soon.

to you and Mrs. 20score.

hughee99

(16,113 posts)
34. If you are concerned about all the DUers that support war
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:08 PM
Apr 2016

Drone strikes, invasions of privacy, jailing govt whistleblowers, etc...

Just wait until we have a republican president. Then just about all DUers will be against it again.

PDittie

(8,322 posts)
70. Shouldn't have to wait long to see
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:09 PM
Apr 2016

If she starts a war with Iran like she's said she would, then she's a one-termer.

hughee99

(16,113 posts)
90. But she'll definitely have her defenders here. If Trump starts the same war for the same reason,
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:38 PM
Apr 2016

he won't find anyone here trying to defend him.

jillan

(39,451 posts)
251. Um - I think Hillary already has the blueprint written for Syria. Or did you miss that part?
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 11:30 PM
Apr 2016

Here - let the Security Advisor for the Obama administration educate you...

http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/18/politics/axelrod-axe-files-ben-rhodes-syria/

Even the Obama administration is telling her to knock it off.

hughee99

(16,113 posts)
268. If Clinton becomes president, she will find some defenders here no matter what she does.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 01:19 AM
Apr 2016

If a republican implements the exact same plan, they will find no defenders here.

 

fbc

(1,668 posts)
36. I don't see the issue
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:16 PM
Apr 2016

DU has been overwhelmingly in favor of Bernie Sanders over Hillary Clinton. Sure there is a small minority of people here that support Hillary Clinton over Bernie Sanders, but it's not exactly like this is an unsafe place for Bernie supporters.

Whatever the site owner's original intentions, this is the Democratic Underground, a place where people who actually pay attention discuss politics, and the majority of posters here are true progressives.

LiberalLovinLug

(14,251 posts)
66. I agree
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:04 PM
Apr 2016

Most of the stories that are rec'd to the top are pro-Bernie stories. Its pretty obvious that a large majority are Sanders supporters. But having others whose choices are different actually gives one the opportunity to argue ones points, IMO. That's why I will stay, and I never have anyone on ignore.

So its going to be interesting around here, now that it seems like the tide is truly turning toward the corporate candidate. Well that's not a good analogy. If anything the tide is turning towards the brave bold vision that Bernie introduced...its just that he won't catch up. Even though polls now show they are almost even amongst Democrat voters, and many of those early States voters now regret their vote. Its completely possible that Bernie may overtake Hillary as the Democrats top choice in the next couple of months, in polling. But his fate was sealed pretty much from the get go with the Super Delegates, Payday Debbie and the DNC, and MSM putting Bernie on ignore. The more Democrats got to know him the more his message hit home. DU is a microcosm of what would have happened as we here are ahead of the news.

Personally, I will stay and stick to my beliefs and work to drag the party kicking and screaming back to its FDR roots. The Political Revolution is not over. Hillary may just be primaried in 4 years if she ignores the reality that half of the party wants REAL progressive change, and instead follows Obama's pro-corporate lead in things like the TPP...then she will do so at her own peril. Because millions of Americans have woken up to the possibilities of what COULD be accomplished, we have seen that there is popular support for Democratic Socialism..if it is only explained to us, as the MSM will never do it otherwise.

I'd suggest Eric stay and stick to his progressive traditional Democratic principles. And if he happens to get tombstoned because of making some OP or comment in support of that..........at least he'll go out on principle. That's what I will do. If DU transforms further into a Republican-lite site that, if Hillary is President, with those that are left scrambling over themselves to see who will be the biggest excuse maker for her latest anti-99% policy...then that shouldn't be too hard.

Dustlawyer

(10,505 posts)
99. I will say this about the "Discuss politics" part of DU.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:58 PM
Apr 2016

In a post about Obama being one of the all time greatest Presidents, I lamented that you could not point out any flaw or disagreement about Obama without being labeled an "Obama Hater." I said that he had done many great things socially, but sided with the financial industry, NSA spying, "Look forward, not back" when referring to Bush/Cheney and Iraq... I said he didn't make my top 10. For this I was banned from the Obama Group. As usual, I clicked on an interesting post on the front page without looking at the group it was from.

Are we so thin skinned that we cannot even offer opinions now? I too am frustrated with the hyper-purity evolving here. I don't do snark or dance on graves(but a few rare times I lost my cool and responded before calming down) and I have never put anyone on ignore. I can say this though, when you stop listening objectively and only want to hear like minded views, you have become like the RW nut jobs that are too angry to listen to reason.

I believe much of this OP, but I take hope that Bernie will not stop organizing and leading us to pressure our government to clean up its act. Bernie losing makes it much harder without the Bully Pulpit, but we can continue to grow and apply pressure. Climate Change and removing the root cause of our government corruption are too important to give up!

Moostache

(9,975 posts)
130. I have served on more juries in the last 6 months than the previous 6 years...
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 05:36 PM
Apr 2016

I know that is a terribly non-scientific sampling, but the increase in jury service requests dovetails with the increasing loss of discussion on the forums and increase in tribalism and lack of discourse.

I feel the website AND our country Balkanizing around me and I do not like it one bit. Being stuck in the Midwest (work and family situations will not permit me to move to the coasts or other regions I find more agreeable in temper and climate...), this is particularly depressing because the sharp divide precludes compromise and makes every issue a fight to the death as the cycle perpetuates itself and intensifies with each round.

The right wing lunatics tearing apart the GOP was one thing, but to see the DLC/Third Way/Corporatists and Progressives parting ways so sharply on the left has me wondering what the future holds as the current system grinds itself into oblivion. The US House and Senate and even the current SCOTUS (because of the Senate) are already broken and badly in need of repair. The two dominant parties in the national political system seem to be following suit rapidly. That is essentially our entire Federal Government and a large reason for the lack of real reform on long range fiscal and regulatory issues.

We need to break the cycle and reform from the ground up. The checks and balances were not meant to be sabots for the gears! (OK...that's maybe a bit too arcane of a reference...lol).

Sorry to see the OP go, but hoping the now inevitable can be shaped into something more than "vote for me because the alternative is too depressing to consider"...I'll be sticking around to find out, just a lot more morose than I had hoped to be.

malokvale77

(4,879 posts)
164. We just had one of the "hosts" of our Bernie Group...
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:45 PM
Apr 2016

call on Skinner to shut us down. How quaint.

I see exactly where Erich is coming from.

malokvale77

(4,879 posts)
236. That's what the title of the OP suggests.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 10:25 PM
Apr 2016

It was the same as the one from the Hillary supporter.

I have yet to see her say different.

 

bvf

(6,604 posts)
259. At first, I thought you must have been referring to
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 12:33 AM
Apr 2016

the sarcastic OP with the mention of "Heidi." Now that I see the one you're talking about, I am speechless.


malokvale77

(4,879 posts)
261. Yes...
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 12:42 AM
Apr 2016

and could Skinner please set BMUS free?

It's sick to see the shit that is allowed here while some of the finest minds are being silenced or outright booted.

SMH

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
377. Thank you. I have no idea why any Sanders supporters here whine about anything given that they
Fri Apr 22, 2016, 04:43 PM
Apr 2016

have 80-85% support here and control of the juries. If that's not enough you will ultimately never be happy anywhere.

ish of the hammer

(444 posts)
37. hey - don't feel too bad, I only voted
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:18 PM
Apr 2016

for Gore to offset my wife's Nader vote. The Dem Party left you a long time a ago. The height of American civilization and
middle class was at the end of Johnson's admin. The Vietnam War and rolling back the progressive tax (with the Dem's help)
made sure we would wind up in the fix we are in now.

Response to Erich Bloodaxe BSN (Original post)

wouldsman

(94 posts)
41. Well, I won't miss you, cause I know where you are hanging out,
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:23 PM
Apr 2016

along with a bunch of other wonderful pro democracy pro justice folks. So I won't miss out on your views and comments.
But all the same, it is sad to see that a sight like this has become hostile territory to someone who holds views like you (and I) do.
I don't comment enough that there will ever be need for me to write a GBCW diary, but I will have already dramatically changed my browsing and website visits this year.
I am a person to take to the streets in search of creating change. In the last decades you may have seen me out there toting a sign and shouting for:
war opposition
pipeline expansion (Keystone, Clipper, et al)
bank/finance reform
TPP, TTIP, and other "free" trade agreements.
single payer- not for profit healthcare

It is a sad day to realize that the party (and its support system- like this site) that you once wanted to work with/through has become your opposition. I mean, full on opposition. Not on just a few issues, I am a pragmatic person, no need to be a purity troll, but on the bulk of the things that I feel strongly about that I need government and political power structures to help sway the outcomes of.

See you over where our kindred spirits hang out.

 

Adrahil

(13,340 posts)
42. Sorry to hear it.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:27 PM
Apr 2016

In the end, even if we don't agree 100% (or even 75%), we have a common enemy with whom we assuredly agree is dangerous.

I hope you consider that as you move forward.

Orrex

(63,574 posts)
64. Meh
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:01 PM
Apr 2016

Due to chronic butt-hurt he's had me on Ignore for a long time, so it's not like he'll see my comment anyway.

Further, I have no respect for look-at-me GBCW posts, especially when they're transparent attempts to generate sympathy, praise, and weepy requests to stay.

Maybe we can go through it all again when he makes his triumphant return in a few weeks, the way most GBCW-ers do.


If you're going to leave, then leave, but spare us the crass and grandiose displays.

Orrex

(63,574 posts)
224. My candidate is the Democrat on the ballot in November
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 10:00 PM
Apr 2016

Last edited Thu Apr 21, 2016, 07:21 AM - Edit history (1)

Who is yours?

See, because I'm a grown-up, I recognize that there is more at stake in this (and every) election than my own personal BFF candidate, and because I haven't attached my ego to either nominee, I don't take it as a personal insult when people choose not to vote for "my" candidate.

I do not "feel" either candidate, nor do I drape either in sappy messianic imagery. I will vote for whichever candidate keeps the Republican out of office, because (much like Sanders) I am easily able to distinguish between Clinton and Trump/Cruz, so she'll get my vote if she's on the ballot, just as Sanders will if he's the nominee.

To judge by the many insults thrown at me, it appears that some of Sanders' more spirited cheerleaders can't accept anything less than a wholehearted embrace of Sanders. They've imagined thselves as the only true Democrats, the lifeblood of the Democratic party, and the mechanism for ushering their imagined Savior onto his fitting pedestal.

If he's on the ballot, then hell yes I'll vote for him, and I won't post some fit of public GBCW onanism to congratulate myself for my unique and precious wisdom.

Because I understand that it's not all about me.

trc

(823 posts)
255. This is the truth of this election
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 11:36 PM
Apr 2016

a democrat must win, the democratic party must carry both houses of Congress and we must force our leadership to respond to us as a group. I used to teach 8th grade US history and one of the things I would stress with my kids was responsibility, both to themselves and to others. I would tell them that the way our system of representative government works and is held accountable is by voting for what you believe and working to direct those you elect to do what you want them to do. And then I would tell them that if they do not vote they allow others to assume control that was surrendered by not voting. I would then finish with a simple thought, if you don't vote, sit down and shut up because you have abdicated your responsibility and get what you deserve...no representation at all. If your candidate does not win the primary that is difficult, if a republican wins the presidency and gets to set the Supreme Court for the next 20 years that is a travesty. I am a democrat by choice and I understand there are many flaws in the party and many flawed candidates, but their ideology is so far closer to mine than any republican running that I cannot envision the moment when I say "I do not agree with this democrat so I am willing to let a republican be elected instead." To me that is the ultimate selfish act of irresponsibility to my fellow citizens.

Response to Orrex (Reply #45)

DCBob

(24,689 posts)
52. I don't get how giving up makes things better for you and the country??
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:51 PM
Apr 2016

If you really want to make things better get more involved in the party and work to change it if its so horrible or start working on finding a candidate to challenge Hillary in 2020. Your attitude is completely futile, childish and immature.

 

Duval

(4,280 posts)
63. Everyone has a right to their feelings. Everyone.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:00 PM
Apr 2016

Your response was immature, childish, and down right ugly. I believe I know whom you support.

F4lconF16

(3,747 posts)
55. Logged in to say goodbye.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:53 PM
Apr 2016

PM me if you care to keep in touch, let me know if you're elsewhere on the internet.

I've greatly enjoyed your posts over the years. Thanks.

 

liberalnarb

(4,532 posts)
59. Friend,
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:54 PM
Apr 2016

Don't leave the party because of sneery comments on a website. Look, not all Democrats are perfect but we're a hell of a lot better than that clown car on the right. As of now, the Democratic Party is our only hope for fighting climate change, raising the minimum wage, making college more affordable, and so much more. Bernie's not done. We've got work to do for the upcoming primary states. We must ignore the regressive DLC and Third Wayers and look to the Progressive wing of the party to help this nation, not abandon the party all together.

 

MissDeeds

(7,499 posts)
60. Thanks so much for your classy goodbye
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:56 PM
Apr 2016

and explanation of why you're leaving. I agree with all you said. I've always enjoyed your posts and have found them to be civil and insightful.

Please join us at JPR. There are good people there and you will feel very much at home.

BTW - My ignore list has grown just reading this thread.

 

afertal

(148 posts)
61. Sad to say that it sometimes appears that...
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:57 PM
Apr 2016

...independence/independents is/are not welcome here.

Best wishes moving forward!

marcopolo63

(64 posts)
62. Time to join the Gravedancer's Union!
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:57 PM
Apr 2016

I am new to the site and have rarely replied to any posts, and aren't even allowed to post an OP myself yet. I do see the vitriol though that is shared between us "Democrats" and find it hard to take. Where the left used to be a more fact-based community than the right - although not as far gone as the right, things have devolved on our side too.

Fare thee well and I hope you find some online solace! If you do - let us know where to look! Your post made me think of the Soul Asylum record from the early 90's - hence the title to my reply - songs at the link...


BainsBane

(53,432 posts)
75. It's not about you
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:16 PM
Apr 2016

anymore than it's about any other individual. It's about the will of the majority of the Democratic electorate. Your vote counts the same as mine or anyone else's, but it doesn't count more. That ultimately is what you can't come to terms with. This election broke down alone race and gender lines. As one Sanders supporter announced in GD-P, if not for women and people of color, Sanders would have won. Yeah, and if not for women and people of color there would be no Democratic office holders anywhere in this nation. But this is no longer the America of the minority, where white men alone decide the political future of the nation, and especially not of the Democratic Party. I'm sorry you find that so objectionable.

Much of what you list above is supported by the candidate who you have let define your entire political consciousness. He supports drones. He has voted for virtually every defense appropriation bill and military deployment that has come before him as a member of the Senate or House. His supporters have denounced same day-voter registration in Nevada, and elderly and disabled voting in Wyoming, and his campaign has openly declared a strategy that relies on overturning the results of elections and seizing the nomination against the will of the electorate. Suddenly closed primaries are an issue ONLY because Sanders doesn't perform well in them, whereas the far more restrictive caucus system is championed because he benefits from low voter turnout. I never heard him once mention GMOs. You can project whatever you want, but when your articulation of issues bears little resemblance to differences in actual policy positions, it isn't exactly convincing.

The sense of self-importance reflected in your post is a microcosm of what the Sanders campaign has been about. Too many of his supporters believe they matter more than the rest of us, that the electoral will of the majority. So be angry all you want, but what you are angry at is electoral democracy and the notion that your vote doesn't take precedence over everyone else's.

So by all means, contribute to the GOP victories by leaving spaces empty. Doing so only shows the issues you list above really aren't what matters to you.

chwaliszewski

(1,515 posts)
79. I Would Agree With You, But...
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:22 PM
Apr 2016

not everyone's voice was represented this season, even registered Democrats. That's what stinks. The fair way of having this is to hold every primary for every state on the same day, like a general election. Every registered voter gets a say in who they would like to run in the general election, not just Democrats and Republicans.

 

La Lioness Priyanka

(53,866 posts)
84. ok, i dont disagree with you, but let's not pretend that these rules were just invented to
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:28 PM
Apr 2016

accommodate Clinton. We had similarly distributed primaries when she lost to Obama in 08. The narrative she is winning unfairly, is just inaccurate.

chwaliszewski

(1,515 posts)
113. Apples & Oranges...
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 04:49 PM
Apr 2016

Obama was a Democrat running for the Dem Nomination. Bernie is an Indy running for the Dem Nom. Difference being, many more of Bernie's supporters are Indies themselves and can't vote in closed primaries. Advantage, Hillary. Obama won the Dem Nom with registered Dems voting for him in the closed primaries. Point being, unless Independents start their own party (which I think they should and probably will after this year), they will continue to be on the outside looking in, with their vote only being of use to either party during the general election. I think if Bernie would've just ran as an Indy this year, he not only would've won the Indy Party Nom, but also the general election. You can't deny that he gets his supporters enthused like no candidate has in a long time.

 

La Lioness Priyanka

(53,866 posts)
114. no apples to apples. the fact that he switched parties, doesn't make the system unfair
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 04:51 PM
Apr 2016

he was just deliberately not engaged in the system.

chwaliszewski

(1,515 posts)
119. Hillary deserves the Democratic nomination...
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 04:59 PM
Apr 2016

as evidenced by the delegates won by her. This doesn't make her the best candidate in many peoples minds, though. It will be interesting to see how Hillary tries to get Bernie supporters to back her after she gets the nomination, even when Bernie suggests they should. There are more 'Bernie or Bust' voters out there than you may realize.

 

truebluegreen

(9,033 posts)
250. Switched "parties"? There's an Independent Party? Who knew?
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 11:27 PM
Apr 2016

Now, saying he changed his policies or positions, that would be a "switch."

BainsBane

(53,432 posts)
343. I disagree on a national primary
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:10 PM
Apr 2016

for the principle reason that it would only enhance the role of money in the process.

You say you want the primaries open now because it benefits Bernie, but you should give some thought about the long-term consequences of that move. It is far more likely to make the parties more centrist.

The Constitution gives states the authority to run their own elections. Changes need to be made through the state legislature, which takes time, and it can't be about the political prospects of any particular individual.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
310. Yep, and that doesn't include complaining about the existence of super-delegates after hiring the
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 09:17 AM
Apr 2016

architect of super-delegates, and then later implementing a strategy that is focused on using super-delegates.

Wherever you look, this holier-than-thou persona that is attributed to Sanders and his campaign doesn't stand up to scrutiny.

The Green Manalishi

(1,054 posts)
328. It's not aboput him, but it is about how terribly far right the party has drifted
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 12:25 PM
Apr 2016

When even the most progressive candidate supports our war machine and fails to decry GMO's why SHOULDN'T we genuine progressives be disgusted. Actually, anyone who could even consider Bernie as 'too liberal' should have a copy of Mein Kampf shoved up a random orifice, tarred, feathered and deported.

Hillary in no way shape or form resembles anything other than what *I* consider a moderate neo-con republican. And quite frankly I am baffled as to how POC and GLBT folks can support her. It just makes no sense, not that I judge anyone who disagrees with me, but it makes no sense. Gender or color should not matter, hell anyone stupid enough to vote for someone on the basis of Gender must never have heard of Margaret Thatcher.

the above said, of course she's orders of magnitude better than any of the evil idiots on the right and I'll vote for the nominee, but holding my nose, picking the lesser of two evils and just unable to understand how anyone could actually be enthused about her.

BainsBane

(53,432 posts)
341. I don't think you have a clear sense of the party's history
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 03:04 PM
Apr 2016

or your nation's history. The presidents most celebrated by progressives, FDR and JFK, led the expansion of American empire and were both far wealthier than Clinton. FDR also presided over Jim Crow and implemented the New Deal in ways the left people of color out in the cold. 25% of his campaign was funded by Wall Street. JFK slashed taxes on the wealthy, attempted a failed coup in Cuba, and was a rabid Cold Warrior more generally.

I can't begin to understand why you think the GMO issue rests on the presidency. People are organizing around that across party lines, and Sanders defeat does nothing to deter that effort.

As for why people of color support Hillary, she has worked to cultivate personal relationships in communities of color throughout this nation over a period of years. She knew that she had to make up for past mistakes, and the reason why criminal justice reform was her first policy proposal was because she learned, through conversations with community leaders, how important it was.

Sanders never cultivated relationships. He depended on people being drawn to his speeches. I have heard some African Americans say they are long accustomed to white folks coming in at election time and making lots of promises, and it doesn't impress them. Clinton has been there when the cameras aren't running, developed relationships over decades. That sort of thing matters.

The Green Manalishi

(1,054 posts)
351. Those are some good points, thanks.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 04:13 PM
Apr 2016

I do think that the Hillary is far more 'rightist' than Carter, but true, compared to the foreign policy of JFK and FDR even her neocon (IMHO) interventionist stance is better.
I like Bernie a great deal more because I care more about speeches than schmoozing and firmly believe that economic inequality is, if not the root cause of the racial problems, the single factor causing them to be as harmful as they are, and that Bernie's policies are much better in that regard; however I'll vote the nominee

Regards

zentrum

(9,866 posts)
132. Neither will she.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 05:43 PM
Apr 2016

The Republican base despises her and their Reps will tie her up in endless investigations and impeachment threats from day one. It's an utterly predictable dance between the Reps, Clinton and the media.

The Republican base actually respects Bernie and understands that he's for ordinary people and so are not ruled by the same hatred that fuels them to thwart Clinton. If she wins, it will four years of Reality Politics. She'll concede more and more to the right just to survive. So much for getting anything passed. (Oh—not to mention she isn't deeply impassioned by any program. She would never go to bat for single payer for example.)

I understand this poster completely. The Democratic Party has left us and yet may have sown the seeds of their own undoing, because now, they've finally picked a candidate that Independents, the Democratic base, and Republicans all distrust and dislike. That is not a recipe for a successful presidency. I wouldn't want a person who already had so much enmity in the ranks to be even the president of the local PTA.

Bernie would have gotten a lot done for us.

LibDemAlways

(15,139 posts)
153. This is the best analysis of what's
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:29 PM
Apr 2016

in store should Hillary somehow manage to get elected -- which, frankly, I don't see happening. Why the establishment thinks running an enormously detested candidate with voluminous amounts of baggage in an election year in which the public is hungry for change is beyond me.

They are so desperate to help her fulfill her lifelong ambition that they've completely lost sight of political reality. If she somehow pulls it off, prepare to see the Repukes immediately impeach her or create gridlock that makes the gridlock under Obama look like child's play. If they do work with her on anything, you can be sure it will be horrific for the middle class.

turbinetree

(24,849 posts)
186. And with that you are absolutely correct.................................
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:36 PM
Apr 2016

the spiral of using the public as fodder in this gambit is going to be horrible...........................but people don't want to believe it,
The Congress is gerrymandered until 2020 censuses and the senate was the last bit of hope and that went out the window when the "meeting" was held in that restaurant in 2008, and the Supreme Court damage for the last thirty -five plus years is just unbelievable.

And this comment below from you pretty much nails it.......................................

"Why the establishment thinks running an enormously detested candidate with voluminous amounts of baggage in an election year in which the public is hungry for change is beyond me."

Me also............................................



zentrum

(9,866 posts)
199. As Dems
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 09:03 PM
Apr 2016

….I know we're really struggling over what to do.



Hope I haven't subverted this thread.

Erich—maybe you'll give DU another shot.

zentrum

(9,866 posts)
195. And her tenure
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:59 PM
Apr 2016

…..will twist what feminism is really capable of giving the country. After all, that's an aspect of "revolution" too. Here's what I mean:

One, is that as the first female President, she'll look or be rendered incompetent, because of constantly having to defend against those investigations into her bad judgements. So much for breaking the glass ceiling. And secondly, the result of this, will be her doing what she always does—she'll play the victim card and say that she's being persecuted because she's a woman. Both of these are bad for feminism.

We need someone like Elizabeth Warren, who really is impassioned, truly competent, and who never uses her gender as a victim ploy. (I speak as a woman here.)

Short of that, we need Bernie.


treestar

(82,383 posts)
214. but she won't sign a bill repealing the ACA
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 09:31 PM
Apr 2016

I am one of many that benefits from it - I'd be back to my old situation of high deductibles and paying medical bills outright. Which was OK when I was younger.

Pre-existing conditions would come back.

Not worth it over Bernie. People have run in primaries and lost before.

Bubzer

(4,211 posts)
223. We've never had something like the TPP in the balance before.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 10:00 PM
Apr 2016

There's absolutely no doubt she will get it passed... and it will destroy this country.

darkwing

(33 posts)
330. Eyeroll.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 12:45 PM
Apr 2016

The TPP will not destroythe country. It will strengthen US exports.

Fracking is our way of reducing our dependency on the Middle East for our oil. Hillary is right. It should be regulated so it doesn't hurt our water supply. But in and of itself it is not a bad thing. You can claim we use too much oil but that is a different debate and America is a car country so any big changes will take generations.

You can not ignore economics.

Bubzer

(4,211 posts)
331. Pro TPP AND pro fracking? Your totally belong over in freeperville... not here on DU.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 01:01 PM
Apr 2016

Money means nothing if you're not alive to spend it. Sorry, got not time for people like you. Straight to ignore you go! Enjoy your oil-laced water.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
363. Those issues are not the clear as to liberal/conservative
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 05:18 PM
Apr 2016

I don't think we need to label someone as a freeper for not buying the insistence that the TPP will destroy this country and that our leaders deliberately want to do that to us.

Bubzer

(4,211 posts)
366. Maybe not. But absolutely a corporatist, which, quite frankly, is far worse.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 05:45 PM
Apr 2016

The TPP will grant corporations privilege over sovereign countries. Which means they externalize all costs... and will not bother with environmental controls, and so, will dramatically increase pollutants into the environment. That is absolutely a pro corporatist movement.

Fracking has long been identified by scientists and environmental groups as incredibly destructive to the environment, and as having cause earthquakes. Energy companies don't care... they just want money... and they wont have to pay a dime for the consequence. Effectively making that a real world example of what externalizing costs look like. It's all more pro corporate bullshit.

Especially the part where the focus was on profits, and supposedly strengthening exports, and oh, we need to embrace incremental change... and blah blah blah... it's all corporatist bullshit talking points. Not buying it.

Lastly, I didn't mention "our leaders"... those are YOUR bullshit words... not mine. Corporations want the TPP to pass... they see all the benefits they can get through it's thousands upon thousands of pages. Obama didn't lead the TPP's creation... Hillary did. Her and all the corporations standing to benefit from it. Obama only knows what he's been told... he's been given a misrepresentation of the agreement... not the ugly reality of it. So, no, Obama is not trying to deliberately destroy the country. He's being lied into it.

turbinetree

(24,849 posts)
248. United Healthcare.......................
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 11:21 PM
Apr 2016

just the name of this oligarchy is just wrong.

Today United Healthcare, said that they were thinking of not using the Affordable Care Act, because they were not making enough moola.

This means that the people in that system will be forced into what-----------state run Medicaid if you under 62 and if you live in I don't know Kentucky, then what do you do, what is she going to do about that.............................that is the issue in the room, that was not being discussed..............................Sanders said Universal coverage, or a single payer, public option, she said what on this issue.................this is what she said ..................




http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2016/02/11/hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders-debate-health-care/80265646/
 

Trajan

(19,089 posts)
85. Thanks for your dedication
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:30 PM
Apr 2016

I'm nearly there myself

I want to see what Bernie does ... He encapsulates what being a Democrat means to me ...

DWS and ... That other right wing lady? ... They are moderate conservatives, at best ... I will not tolerate them ... Not one bit ....

#StillSanders

sofa king

(10,857 posts)
88. Oh, I hope you will come back.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:36 PM
Apr 2016

I've been here long enough to see several primary cycles, and I have seen a lot of bad blood in those times. But most of us actually live by our ideals of tolerance and inclusiveness... most of the time.

Except in the primaries, when we turn against ourselves and then have to learn to forgive.

When this election is in the books, as usual to the total satisfaction of no one at all, perhaps you will consider returning. We need your voice and your influence.

Depaysement

(1,835 posts)
92. I, for one, will miss your posts
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:41 PM
Apr 2016

Even the passionate ones were usually well reasoned.

I may be following you out the door soon, leaving both this website and the Democratic Party.

Good luck to you, wherever you are and whatever you do.

lark

(23,598 posts)
95. Hope you like it when the true fascists are in charge because people like you wouldn't vote
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 03:52 PM
Apr 2016

for less bad.

It may not be satisfying, it may not be perfect, but I want to keep choice for any of my future granddaughters. I don't want the SCOTUS to go back to being controlled by the RW and I don't want our Clean Water act or Endangered Species Acts to end. I also don't want minimum wage ended and unions ended too. I don't want the rich to have their taxes cut even more. I hope you can live with the horror than a Repug president would bring. Look at the last one, 2 wars of choice, massive job losses and the rich raped every one else and stole our money. That's what you will and other progressives who won't vote for HRC will be enabling. HRC isn't my candidate of choice, but she is way better than any of the other alternatives if Bernie isn't our general election candidate. Yes, Bernie is far, far superior, but don't think he'll be allowed to win, so sad.

raouldukelives

(5,178 posts)
313. Honestly it is because of Wall St shareholders.
Thu Apr 21, 2016, 09:38 AM
Apr 2016

It matters little who someone votes for if they have money in Wall St. That money is already doing the yeoman labor for elevating fascism as our national pastime. From lobbyists who act on their behalf to corrupt politicians willing to look the other way for one of their dollars.

We live in the most progress they cannot personally fund the blocking of. One of the reasons I get a big chuckle when I read someone who I had previously thought claimed to stand for democracy for all people is actually a participant in Wall St. Maybe someday they will grow up and start taking responsibility for what they do. Until then, they are the downfall of our society, and perhaps all society.

WcoastO

(55 posts)
100. Not voting for the Democratic candidate.........
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 04:02 PM
Apr 2016

is giving an easier pathway to the Presidency for Trump or Cruz......and no matter how you look at it, Cruz, Trump, Kasich, Ryan, et. al. would be worse than W, far worse....and with the possibility of several SCOTUS vacancies, and the possibility of a GOP controlled Congress......recovering from the potential damage would take a generation if recovery was possible....look at the draconian policies enacted in Kansas, Wisconsin, N. Carolina, Indiana, Michigan, Louisiana, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Maine, Oklahoma.......that's what the GOP wants for the US.......sitting out an election is basically ceding power to the racists, nationalists, theocrats, and the 1%.

chervilant

(8,267 posts)
111. Oh, Erich!
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 04:46 PM
Apr 2016

So many of us are on the same page, it seems.

I will not vote for "the lesser of two evils" ever again.

AND, I think the people who keep interjecting that "you can't write Bernie in; he can't win that way!" are among those who see just how very popular is Bernie Sanders!

AND, what if he CAN win that way?!? I am with Bernie all the way!!! ALL THE WAY!!!

Voters will know--it will be quite evident how the corporate megalomaniacs cheat to steal the nomination. Why isn't Hi11ary commenting on the voter irregularities that keep happening?!? Might it be because she APPROVES?!?

I no longer recognize the "democratic party" du jour that supports a dishonest corporate shill like Hi11ary.

Hope I'll still see you at JPR.



liberalmuse

(18,775 posts)
112. A Clinton got me into politics, and a Clinton got me out.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 04:47 PM
Apr 2016

I'm done, too. The Democratic Party is a sham and has nothing to offer real people with real struggles. Just empty words. The party leaders have spoken, and I'm no longer listening. Buh-Bye!

On edit: I'm a long time liberal who's fought the good fight. I'm sick and tired after energetically participating in a political system that turned out to be a total waste of time. I won't be voting for the first time in decades. My vote doesn't matter, and the people who pretend to listen to "We The People" are too busy shilling for dollars from the very people responsible for destroying our Democracy. They joke about us behind closed doors, and then pander for our votes when they're out of "The Room Where It Happens".

WcoastO

(55 posts)
124. The fight is not over.......
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 05:13 PM
Apr 2016

they are fighting.......the GOP is fighting to take the US back, way back......not voting is ceding power to them......SCOTUS, reproductive rights (including birth control), even more voter suppression and gerrymandering,...........

blackspade

(10,056 posts)
117. Recing before the lock.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 04:57 PM
Apr 2016

Sorry to see you go Erich, but I understand the feeling.
All the things you listed seem to be fine by the Democratic authoritarians among us...
Because, Democrats.

I long for the day that neoliberalism dies.

Chichiri

(4,667 posts)
120. See you in September. nt