Post a little known fact about a rock song

[red dog 1]

Last edited Mon Apr 25, 2022, 12:10 AM - Edit history (1)

Bob Dylan's "Like a Rolling Stone" was produced in a two-day session, June 15-16, 1965 in Studio A at Columbia Records in New York City by record producer Tom Wilson.

Besides Dylan, The musicians enlisted for the sessions were blues guitarist Mike Bloomfield, Paul Griffin on piano, Joe Macho Jr. on Bass, Bobby Gregg on drums, and Bruce Langhorne on tambourine.

On day 2, Al Cooper joined the proceedings.
Kooper, at that time a 21-year-old session guitarist, was not originally supposed to play but was present at the studio as Tom Wilson's guest.
When Wilson stepped out, Kooper sat down with his guitar, hoping to take part in the recording session.
However, after hearing Mike Bloomfield playing his guitar, Kooper put his guitar back in it's case and returned to the control room.

After a couple of rehearsal takes, Wilson moved Griffin from Hammond organ to piano.
In the control room, Kooper approached Wilson & told him he had a good part for the organ.
Wilson scoffed at him saying "You're not an organist, you're guitar player." but did not forbid him from playing.
Just then, Wilson got a phone call and went to take it.
As Kooper later said, "He didn't say no, so I went out there."
When Wilson returned, he was surprised to see Kooper at the organ and said "Hey, what are you doing out there?"
Kooper just laughed, and Wilson allowed him to play.
When Dylan heard a playback of the song, he asked Wilson to turn up the organ in the mix.
Wilson replied, "That guy's not an organ player, he's a guitar player."
Dylan said, "I don't care what he is, turn it up!"
(Lucky for Al Cooper, the Hammond organ was left on, because it's a difficult process to start a Hammond organ, and Cooper admitted later that he had no idea how to turn it on)

As Al Kooper later said, "That was my first day as a professional organ player."

Later, after the song was recorded, bands approached Al Kooper to ask him to play organ for them, like he did with Bob Dylan.

Dylan & Kooper would go to record stores and buy other bands' versions of "Like a Rolling Stone" and laugh together at the various versions of the song played by the other bands.

[Walleye]

1. This is just my surmise about "Sad Eyed Lady of the Lowlands"

In the song “Sara” Dylan writes that he stayed up all night writing “Sad Eyed Lady of the Lowlands” for her. His wife Sara was from Delaware, so being a Delawarean myself, I figured the lowlands referred to our state. Of course I’ve never confirmed that it was just my own little thing

[dchill]

2. "You're So Vain" is probably about me.

[MerryHolidays]

4. I heard that song in the hardware store yesterday

Mick Jagger sings back-up vocals on it.

Also, the song is terribly ironic: it actually IS about the person who Carly Simon is singing about, so the "vanity" was not misplaced! And I think it was about Warren Beatty?

[dchill]

10. I remember that.

[red dog 1]

16. According to Wikipedia, Carly Simon stated

"that the song refers to three men, only one of whom she has named publicly, actor Warren Beatty."

I wonder who the other two are?

(Another interesting fact about "You're So Vain" is that Klaus Voormann played the bass guitar intro)

[DBoon]

3. Beatles "Martha My Dear" was about an English Sheepdog

"Martha My Dear" is a song by the English rock band the Beatles from their 1968 eponymous double album The Beatles (also known as the "White Album" ). Credited to Lennon–McCartney, the song was written solely by Paul McCartney about his Old English Sheepdog, Martha.

- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martha_My_Dear

[MerryHolidays]

5. John Lennon wrote "Instant Karma!" in an hour and recorded it the same day (January 27, 1970)

It was released just a few days later.

All in, from writing to recording to release, it took 10 days, apparently one of the fastest ever in rock/pop music: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instant_Karma!

[ProfessorGAC]

6. On "Fooled Around & Fell In Love"...

...by Elvin Bishop, Elvin was very unhappy with how he was singing it.
Didn't like his phrasing or flow, and couldn't find melody variations.
One of the techs mentioned that Mickey Thomas was down the hall with Starship in another studio.
The suggestion was to have Mickey drop in, sing it like he would & Elvin might get some ideas & inspiration from his take.
They went through it once! Elvin told the producer to prepare tape, then went to the vocal booth and told Mickey "That really gave me ideas. The best one is that you should just sing it."
That's how Mickey ended up as the lead singer on that song.
That story was originally from a magazine interview of....Elvin Bishop.

[ms liberty]

11. How really weird, because it's not true and Elvin Bishop should know it

His album, Strutting My Stuff, is the one Fooled Around is on. I'm holding my copy of it that I bought when new, in my hand right now. I have it because I fell for his voice, way back then...one of the truly memorable voices, vocally everything you could ever want. Anyway, copyright is 1975, which jibes with my memory; I was in high school. Fooled Around went to #3 on the charts in 76. Mickey Thomas was with him for two albums before that one, and for two after that one (I remember the one after Struttin, because of it's title - Hometown Boy Makes Good). Mickey first joined Jefferson Starship in 1979 according to Wiki. That jibes with my memory too, because I worked in a record store when the first Starship album with Mickey Thomas on it came out, and that (my working in that particular record store) was from about 1979 until about 1982. It stayed in rotation on our turntable for a while.
So is it that he's at the forgetting phase of life or does he think it just makes a better story?

[ProfessorGAC]

14. Could Be Embellished

But, that is Mickey singing and he wasn't actually in Elvin's Band anymore.
Perhaps being pals made it much easier to have Mickey drop by.
I always liked the song because it's a really cool set of chord changes. And, Elvin's solo is terrifically melodic.

[LakeArenal]

7. Jeff Lynne wound up in Traveling Wilburys after stopping to pick up a guitar at George Harrison's.

🎶🎶🎶The group was getting together to do “something” in the studio. Said Lynn should stop in…..

He did. Voila. 🎶🎶🎶

[red dog 1]

17. Actually, George Harrison went to pick up his guitar at Tom Petty's house.

Last edited Tue Apr 26, 2022, 12:04 AM - Edit history (4)

(I remember that from reading about it a while ago)

My guess is that George was staying at Tom Petty's house while he was in L.A.

[Tikki]

8. Richard Berry's "Louie, Louie" (1957) was supposedly influenced by Chuck Berry's

song "Havana Moon" from (1956)..also released as "Jamaica Moon."

There always has been a bit of controversy over who heard what song first.

Tikki

[They_Live]

9. "Seasons in the Sun" was based on the song "Le Moribond"(The Dying Man)

by Belgian Jacques Brel that he wrote in a brothel in Tangiers in 1961. Rod McKuen translated the lyrics to English in 1963, and other bands recorded the new version, including the Kingston Trio, but it was a big hit for Terry Jacks in 1974.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

12. The Beatles' "Baby You're a Rich Man" includes backing vocals by...

...Mick Jagger as well as Brian Jones playing the oboe.

[highplainsdem]

13. Some more details on recording "Like A Rolling Stone" here:

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/bob-dylan-recorded-like-a-rolling-stone-50-years-ago-today-65422/


I have to admit I'm not sure how to interpret "little known facts" in the thread title, since it's likely that all of the little known facts posted here were published somewhere or included in a broadcast interview. Unless someone here is posting about details heard directly from the artist(s) or someone else involved in the writing or recording of that song. And if the details are about something written and recorded long ago, memories might not always be 100% accurate, and you might also get different accounts from different people who were there.

I have noticed that Wikipedia often includes some interesting details on specific songs. Which is useful at least for jogging the memory -- especially if, like me, you got rid of a lot of old music magazines that took up way too much space (Rolling Stone in partcular) and were never indexed properly anyway for finding something later.

[red dog 1]

18. "Little known facts" in the thread title seems Ok to me

What term might you have used?

(Just curious)

[highplainsdem]

23. What term would I have used?

Probably "music trivia" -- especially those posts about facts that can be explained in just a paragraph. Your OP was more background on a recording session (though partial background focused on one person in particular). Part of the story behind the music.

Some people don't like the "trivia" label, though. So I've sometimes seen these sorts of facts called "fun facts" or "random facts."

Most facts on ANY subject are "little known facts" to the general public. To the people particularly interested in that subject, for professional or personal reasons, they'll most likely be commonly known facts.

You're not likely to see anything here that's really a little known fact, at least to fans of a particular artist or song, unless it's something new that hasn't been widely publicized yet.

As I said, Wikipedia, with multiple sources for articles, has lots of this sort of music trivia. Googling a song title and artist's name will turn up a lot of trivia (fun facts, random facts) on other websites as well, along with more comprehensive info on the creation of a track or album.

And if you want more info from sources in other countries, particularly on artists from other countries, you can always google the keywords along with site: followed immediately, no gap, by an asterisk, then a period, then the two-letter ccTLD or country code (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Country_code_top-level_domain ). For instance, googling

rory gallagher site: *.ie

with the gap or space removed from between the colon and asterisk (I added that gap to keep DU from turning it into a smilie) will get you very different initial results pages than simply googling

rory gallagher

without specifying the country. (I'd better add that if that other country uses another language, Google Translate isn't always as dependable a friend as you might want it to be. LOL. But it can still be a good way to turn up "fun facts" that sometimes weren't published in the US.)

I'll sometimes include a bit of music trivia with a video I'm posting, or maybe link to an article about the song or artist...though I know that the people most interested in that music have probably already run across what I'm posting. So those bits of music trivia, or background, are for the newer fans or casual fans who might want to learn a bit more.

That choice of trivia is guided by the music, which is chosen first.

But if you just want rock-music trivia in general, as you requested here, I have no idea where I'd start. There's so much of it. Especially if you also look at what's been published in other countries. And for most people, it'll either be something that isn't interesting, or something that's already known. Unless it's some brand new and especially interesting info about a very popular artist, in which case it'll be entertainment news very soon, if it isn't already.

[red dog 1]

29. Yeah, I could have used "music trivia" I guess

I also like "random facts"

As far as people who don't like the label "trivia"...my answer to them is;
"Different strokes for different folks"

[highplainsdem]

36. I think some fans resent the word "trivia" when it's applied to facts that are really important

to them. Especially details that have a lot to do with how music's created, how something turns out. They don't like the implication from the word "trivia" that something doesn't matter very much, when changing any one of those details might be the creative equivalent of removing the wrong piece of wood in a game of Jenga. So many great songs are the result of just perfect -- and often very temporary -- chemistry, usually with a number of people involved. Even when artists are labeled "hit-making machines," as sometimes happens (especially early in a career when the first albums might have songs put together over a fairly long period of time, as was the case with the Stone Roses), there are always a lot of variables in the creation of those songs and the recording sessions that made them hits.

I personally find the details fascinating. At least when I really like the artists and songs. But I know a lot of people don't.

And the facts often get relayed incorrectly, like a game of telephone. I sometimes see interesting details posted in YouTube comments on a video, for instance, but I always double-check those before repeating. Someone here on DU recently posted that Justin Hayward was only 15 when "Nights In White Satin" was recorded, which was wrong. That came from a YouTube comment on a video. I didn't search for that particular comment, don't know if that person had claimed any other source for that wrong information. But since I already knew that Justin first worked as a professional musician when he was 15, I guessed that someone had heard that and didn't know that the Moodies weren't the first band he was with, and made the mistake there.

You could fill warehouses of books with details on rock songs that are interesting to various fans.

[Harker]

39. A Boulder, Colorado politician once suggested to me that

The University of Colorado would better serve the needs of the community by hosting a "Significa Bowl" rather than their annual Trivia Bowl.

He was a smart and thoughtful fellow, but I doubt that he knew the license plate number of Kowalski's Dodge Challenger in "Vanishing Point" was Colorado OA-5599.

[Marthe48]

15. Mellow Yellow Donovan

Paul McCartney whispered "That's right" in the song. The Beatles liked Donovan's phrase 'Elecrtrical Banana' and used it in the movie Yellow Submarine. McCartney's contribution to the song was Donvan's reward


I heard this recently from Scott Shannon the DJ on True Oldies Channel.

[red dog 1]

19. That's very interesting

I think Donovan is vastly underrated as a musician, compared to others.

(The movie "Zodiac" ends with "Hurdy Gurdy Man" playing over the closing credits, a spooky song to end a very spooky movie, imo)

[Marthe48]

22. I loved him when I was a teen

when he came out with Atlantis. My sister bought his album, and I would just hold it and stare at the picture. He had a diverse handful of hits. I liked every one, b ut he could have sung the ABC song and I would have been rapt.

[red dog 1]

30. I forget which Bob Dylan documentary he was in

It may have been the 4 hour long PBS special or it may have been "Don't Look Back"

But Donovan was, and may still be, one of Dylan's friends.

(I love the guy)

[Marthe48]

35. His personal life was inspiring to me

If founding a commune was true. Oddly, I didn't read about his life past the headlines.

[VGNonly]

20. L' Angelo Mysterioso

was the pseudonym used by George Harrison by Eric Clapton on the Cream song Badge. George helped write it and also played some guitar. Legal issues concealed his involvement.

[red dog 1]

21. Now THAT should definitely qualify as a "little known fact" about a rock song.

Good one!

[VGNonly]

24. Harrison had written down "bridge"

as in a bridge to the song. Clapton misunderstand George handwriting as the songs title as Badge.

[highplainsdem]

28. Wikipedia has Harrison's explanation, that Clapton was reading his writing upside down:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Badge_(song) - but since DU breaks up links with parentheses, that won't take you to the correct page; it'll take you to a page on badges, which has a link at the top for Badge (disambiguation) which takes you to another page where you'll find the link to the page on the song....or you can just google the words Cream and Badge and click the link on Google for the Wikipedia page.

Anyway, this is from Wikipedia:

Harrison remembered the story thus:

I helped Eric write "Badge" you know. Each of them had to come up with a song for that Goodbye Cream album and Eric didn't have his written. We were working across from each other and I was writing the lyrics down and we came to the middle part so I wrote 'Bridge.' Eric read it upside down and cracked up laughing – 'What's BADGE?' he said. After that, Ringo [Starr] walked in drunk and gave us that line about the swans living in the park.[5]

-snip-

The Wikipedia contributor got that from the Beatlesbible.com website. Not sure where they got it, since that fan site doesn't say.

This is trivia I've found especially interesting because this is my favorite Cream song.

There's a slightly different, longer story in Harrison's book I, Me, Mine, and you can find that quote (which you can also find on Google Books) and other background info on the song here

https://medium.com/the-riff/cream-says-goodbye-with-badge-6806d1c35288

in a piece by journalist Frank Mastropolo:

https://www.rockcellarmagazine.com/author/mastropolo/

Huh. Just noticed that the section visible on Google Books includes photos of the lyrics in George's handwriting, with corrections and the word "Bridge." Go to

https://books.google.com/books?id=0S-BW0YJQ-0C&pg=PA148&lpg=PA148&dq=%22eric+was+sitting+opposite+me+and+he+looked+at+the+paper%22+%22i,+me,+mine%22&source=bl&ots=Q_51CIpdbM&sig=ACfU3U01y2COcXeWjvA9CB4ykEUqSbSv2w&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjCl--rgrH3AhVshOAKHfHkDZYQ6AF6BAgCEAM#v=onepage&q=%22eric%20was%20sitting%20opposite%20me%20and%20he%20looked%20at%20the%20paper%22%20%22i%2C%20me%2C%20mine%22&f=false

and page down a bit below the quote on page 148 of Harrison's book. There's an image on the next page of Harrison's handwritten lyrics, continuing on to the next page with the word "Bridge" at the top. Even looking at that word right side up, I can see how it was misread as "Badge."

LOL. TMI, I know. But this topic is about music trivia. And seeing that word in Harrison's handwriting really explains the misreading that led to the title.

That was one very interesting songwriting session -- especially with Ringo showing up drunk and inspiring some lyrics.

And an absolutely amazing song came out of it.

[red dog 1]

25. The Beach Boys "Pet Songs" is called this because of an insult between Brian Wilson & Mike Love

When Brian showed Mike Love the lyrics, Mike Love said "Who the hell is going to listen to this?...the ears of a dog?"

[highplainsdem]

26. See this HuffPost article on the album:

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/beach-boys-pet-sounds_n_5730fcd5e4b096e9f09258e4

Jardine claimed that it wasn't until the band was heading to the San Diego Zoo that he realized he had misinterpreted the album name. "I thought it was about making out. You know, petting in high school, I don't know what they call it now," Jardine said, laughing. At the zoo, he recalled thinking, "What is it about?!"

After making more inquiries, Jardine found out that another Beach Boy, Mike Love, had claimed Wilson could hear things only a dog could hear -- due to the amount of takes Wilson would require of the band to get things right in his mind. Since the album also featured Wilson's dogs barking, Love further joked that the band should call the record "Pet Sounds."

From there, Wilson attached an additional, more romantic idea to the origins of the name, saying it was a reference to a belief that everyone has their own favorite sounds, or their "pet sounds," and this album was a collection of Wilson's favorite sounds at the time.

[red dog 1]

31. Interesting, thanks for that

I'm a HUGE Beach Boys fan

[DFW]

27. I'm not sure how obscure this is

“Light My Fire” was not written by Jim Morrison. It was composed by Doors guitarist Robbie Krieger. Keyboardist Ray Manzarek added the iconic intro, and voilá, instant rock classic.

[red dog 1]

32. If my memory is correct, Robbie wrote the lyrics, and Manzarek pretty much "finished"

writing the music.

[highplainsdem]

37. Morrison did write the second verse, which Robby Krieger wasn't crazy about initially. I'm

not really a Doors fan, except for "L.A. Woman" (the song, not the entire album), which I love, so I had to google this.

https://www.songwritingmagazine.co.uk/how-i-wrote/light-my-fire-the-doors

How I wrote ‘Light My Fire’ by The Doors’ Robby Krieger

-snip-

“I had the idea of writing about the four elements – earth, air, fire and water – and I picked fire because I liked the Stones song Play With Fire. I wanted to make this song a really good one, so I said, ‘I’m gonna use every chord I know.’ If you listen to the song it sounds fairly simple, but it really has a lot of chord changes in it, starting with the intro. I always thought there were a lot of chords that didn’t really get used in rock ’n’ roll and I kind of felt sorry for them, so I said, ‘I’ll use E flat and A flat and all those crazy chords’. So you’ve got G, D, F, B flat, E flat, A flat, A and then it goes to A minor, so that’s a whole bunch of chords right there.

“I wrote it at my parent’s house, in the room where the piano was, although I wrote in on the guitar. My first idea was that I wanted it to be something like Hey Joe. I really liked that song by The Leaves, before Hendrix had done it, but when I brought it to the guys they said, ‘Folk rock is going out.’ John had the idea to do a Latin beat on it and then Ray went crazy on that middle part, which eventually became the beginning.

“Jim also told me to write something that people can interpret in their own minds, so Light My Fire could be taken as a drug reference or a love interest. One guy even came up to me and said he knew it was about the fire in the third eye! I had all the lyrics except for the second verse, which Jim came up with about the funeral pyre. I said, ‘Jim, do you always have to talk about death?’! But he wanted that funeral pyre in there and it worked out pretty well. The melody I had was a little different to how Jim sang it, but then again he always changed my melodies a little bit, which was fine and is what a band is supposed to do. When you work up a song, everybody has their own two cents in there. He was pretty amazing for a guy that never had voice lessons – he could sing anything.

“We worked it out in a rehearsal space where Ray lived, down by the beach in Venice. Once we started playing it live, it started getting longer and changing, the same as The End. We started to stretch out the middle part: originally it was just a little transition thing, but then as we played it we kept making that part longer and longer, so that’s how it became a six-minute song. The intro wasn’t the intro at first: the organ part was actually in the middle of the song when we first used to do it, and it wasn’t until we recorded it that Paul Rothchild had the great idea to start the song off with it. And then we put it at the end too, so it comes up three times.

-snip-

[VGNonly]

33. Old Man by Neil Young

was about the caretaker/foreman of his ranch.

[highplainsdem]

38. Yep. And "Long May You Run" was a tribute to the 1948 Pontiac hearse Neil had owned,

nicknamed Mort,

[red dog 1]

49. Thanks, I didn't know that.

[red dog 1]

40. That's true

When he first bought his Woodside, CA ranch, an elderly couple we're the caretakers
Right after escrow closed, and the ranch was his, the old man drove Neil Young around the ranch (in a jeep. I think) and, at one point, he asked Neil how someone so young could afford to buy such a costly ranch.

[jcgoldie]

34. Probably not little known but... Willin'

When Frank Zappa heard Lowell George sing Willin' with the Mothers of Invention he suggested he form his own band... thus was born my late dad's favorite rock n roll band Little Feat.

[red dog 1]

41. The song "Denise" by Randy & the Rainbows

had a "boom, boom, boom, boom," as part of the song.
It came from the fact that they were rehearsing in a garage, and some kids outside were playing with a ball that occasionally hit the side of the garage wall, sounding like a "boom, boom, boom"

[red dog 1]

42. Led Zeppelin's "Stairway To Heaven" was the most requested rock song of the 70's

Last edited Sat Apr 30, 2022, 01:13 AM - Edit history (3)

Yet Zeppelin singer/lyricist Robert Plant once pledged $1,000 to a public radio station if they promised to never play it again.
[I've heard it before," he later said]

[highplainsdem]

43. I could post some little details about "Me and Bobby McGee," one of my

all-time-favorite songs...but instead I'm just going to link to a thread with a video about the writing and recording of the song, which I posted in Music Appreciation after running across it recently. The background video has a lot of fascinating details.

https://democraticunderground.com/103475089

[red dog 1]

44. Angelina Jolie's uncle, Chip Taylor, wrote the song "Wild Thing"

[Mister Ed]

47. Didn't he also write and/or produce...

...Merrilee Rush's hit single, "Angel of the Morning"?

Beautiful song.

[Boomerproud]

48. Yes he did. That was the hairbrush in the hand singing harmony

at slumber parties at my besties and my house. Way back in the day.

[red dog 1]

45. Both Bill Medley and Bobby Hatfield (The Righteous Brothers) wanted to sing "Unchained Melody"

as a solo for their fourth album, so they tossed a coin to see who would sing it, and Hatfield won the coin toss.

[red dog 1]

46. Lynyrd Skynyrd's "Freebird" is dedicated to Duane Allman of The Allman Brothers Band

[red dog 1]

50. Queen's "Bohemian Rhapsody" stayed on the charts at number 1 for nine weeks

[red dog 1]

51. The last song John Lennon ever performed for a paid audience was

"I Saw Her Standing There"

[red dog 1]

52. The Clash's "Rock The Casbah" was written after rock music was banned in Iran

[red dog 1]

53. Am I the only one who wants to post on this thread?

(If so, I guess I'll just let it die

[Marthe48]

54. Just heard this yesterday

In the original version of My Boy Lollipop, Rod Stewart played the harmonica. He was 18 at the time.

I heard this on True Oldies Channel, Scott Shannon dj.

If you want to listen to True Oldies Channel, it is on IHeart Radio. I was at my neighbor's the other day and asked Alexa to play it, and it came right up.

[red dog 1]

55. Thanks for that

[Marthe48]

56. I googled Scott Shannon

He is almost 75, lifelong radio personality. I like most of the music, and his rock and roll tidbits, but his opinions on current events kind of show he's set in his ways--the kindest way I can put it

[red dog 1]

57. The song "Rockett 88" was borrowed from another blues song about a car

Jimmie Liggins' "Cadillac Boogie"

[Marthe48]

58. Peter Asher of Peter and Gordon

Has a sister named Jane. She and Paul McCartney were engaged to be married, but she broke it off when she discovered him in bed with a groupie named Francie Schwartz, which was kind of the icing on the cake.

[red dog 1]

59. The Clash's "Rock the Casbah" was written after the banning of rock music in Iran

[red dog 1]

60. Lynyrd Skynyrd's "Freebird" is dedicated to Duane Allman of The Allman Brothers

[red dog 1]

61. What Civil War ballad was the song "Love Me Tender" based upon?

(The Civil War ballad was the tune itself)

[red dog 1]

62. The lyrics of what classic rock song tell the story of the burning down of the Montreux Casino

in Switzerland in 1971?

[red dog 1]

63. The "bud a lup bump" drum beat in the song "Denise" by Randy & The Rainbows

came from the fact that they were practicing in a garage and soccer balls from neighborhood kids kept hitting the garage door.

[red dog 1]

64. The iconic whistle in (Sittin' On) "The Dock of the Bay" was improvised when Otis Redding

forgot what he was supposed to sing during the outro.

[red dog 1]

65. Well, I guess this thread is dead.