HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » Editorials & Other Articles (Forum) » RFK Jr: "The fragili...

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 06:35 PM

 

RFK Jr: "The fragility of (JFK's) control over the military" Ellsberg: "Virtually a coup atmosphere"

<snip>

"My father was not exaggerating to Dobrynin the fragility of White House control over the military. During the 13 days, the president's hold on power became increasingly tenuous as spooks and generals, apoplectic at JFK's reluctance to attack Cuba, engaged in dozens of acts of insubordination designed to trigger a nuclear exchange. CIA spymaster William Harvey screamed at the president and my father during a White House meeting: "We wouldn't be in such trouble now if you guys had some balls in the Bay of Pigs."

"Defense analyst Daniel Ellsberg, who years later leaked the Pentagon Papers, reported, "There was virtually a coup atmosphere in Pentagon circles." Incensed brass were in a state of disbelief at what they considered bald treason by the president. Spoiling for a war to end all wars, Gen. Curtis LeMay, the man who pioneered the use of napalm against civilians in Tokyo during World War II, found consolation by allowing himself to believe all was not lost. "Why don't we go in there and make a strike on Monday anyway?" LeMay said, as he watched the crisis subside.

<snip>

"He understood the perils to our Constitution from a national-security state and mistrusted zealots and ideologues. He thought other nations ought to fight their own civil wars and choose their own governments and not ask the U.S. to do it for them. Yet the world he imagined and fought for has receded so far below the horizon that it's no longer even part of the permissible narrative inside the Beltway or in the mainstream press. Critics who endeavor to debate the survival of American democracy within the national-security state risk marginalization as crackpots and kooks. His greatest, most heroic aspirations for a peaceful, demilitarized foreign policy are the forbidden­ debates of the modern political era."

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/john-f-kennedys-vision-of-peace-20131120

22 replies, 4325 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 22 replies Author Time Post
Reply RFK Jr: "The fragility of (JFK's) control over the military" Ellsberg: "Virtually a coup atmosphere" (Original post)
villager Nov 2013 OP
WillyT Nov 2013 #1
villager Nov 2013 #2
WillyT Nov 2013 #5
villager Nov 2013 #14
indepat Nov 2013 #3
newfie11 Nov 2013 #4
orpupilofnature57 Nov 2013 #6
WillyT Nov 2013 #7
northoftheborder Nov 2013 #8
WillyT Nov 2013 #9
orpupilofnature57 Nov 2013 #10
northoftheborder Nov 2013 #11
progressoid Nov 2013 #12
emsimon33 Nov 2013 #13
Name removed Nov 2013 #15
toby jo Nov 2013 #16
MinM Nov 2013 #17
MinM Dec 2013 #22
Doctor_J Nov 2013 #18
villager Nov 2013 #19
Uncle Joe Nov 2013 #20
blkmusclmachine Nov 2013 #21

Response to villager (Original post)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 06:42 PM

1. K & R !!!

 


Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WillyT (Reply #1)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 06:46 PM

2. Just a whole lot more "coincidence" for us to dismiss!

 


Thanks for the K&R, WillyT!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Reply #2)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 07:43 PM

5. Anytime villager, Anytime... And Might I Say...

 

What a "happy coincidence" for the Military Industrial Complex, that Oswald came along at such a perfect time.

What luck, eh ???

Christ... and WE'RE the ones accused of being gullible.







Oh... and Ruby shot Oswald to spare Jackie, the nation, some shit like that.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WillyT (Reply #5)

Tue Nov 26, 2013, 02:19 AM

14. And then two more "lone nuts" also just "happened" to benefit that same MIC

 

...with successfully planned killings.

And in the case of James Earl Ray, he obliged by leaving a hand-printed rifle behind, just like Oswald!

Happy happy times for our domestic right wing!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Original post)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 06:46 PM

3. Whether a military/MIC/CIA/RW/SC coup has occurred is found in the pudding each has been cooking

up for we the people.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Original post)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 07:39 PM

4. K&R K&R K&R

If RFK isn't trustworthy I don't know who is.
This is an eye opener coming from him.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Original post)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 07:58 PM

6. This was the 'Grassy Knoll ' and We were warned

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to orpupilofnature57 (Reply #6)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 08:02 PM

7. Yes We Were...

 


Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Original post)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 08:38 PM

8. Rivetting. A lot of history filled in with this writing.

Only intensifies my wondering about the real story of the murder of JFK. Intensifies my admiration of the man. How different the history of this country might have been.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to northoftheborder (Reply #8)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 09:06 PM

9. Yep... And One Has To Wonder If There Would Have Been A Country Now...

 

And if the Generals were willing to initiate nuclear Armaggeden...

Shooting a President looks easy.


Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to northoftheborder (Reply #8)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 09:55 PM

10. Less secretive .

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to orpupilofnature57 (Reply #10)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 09:59 PM

11. chilling

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Original post)

Mon Nov 25, 2013, 11:29 PM

12. Rec

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Original post)

Tue Nov 26, 2013, 01:45 AM

13. K&R

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Original post)


Response to villager (Original post)

Tue Nov 26, 2013, 10:45 AM

16. Annual US military spending: $653,110,000,000. That's $1.2 million per minute. AFSC

 

American Friends Service Committee.

I've been thinking lately that the best route might be to actually get a general in the white house. But is there anybody left who isn't drunk and bloated on all that power? Any Eisenhowers out there?

I don't think any president who isn't military can take these guys down anymore. Either they get intimidated, or they get bit by the lust of it all.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Original post)

Tue Nov 26, 2013, 12:10 PM

17. General Curtis Lemay's open hostility towards JFK is on tape.

The White House tapes disclosed a few years ago recorded General Lemay's open hostility towards JFK:

General Curtis LeMay: You're in a pretty bad fix, Mr. President.

President Kennedy: What did you say?

General Curtis LeMay: You're in a pretty bad fix.

President Kennedy: Well, maybe you haven't noticed: You're in it with me.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0146309/quotes

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021414805#post12

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MinM (Reply #17)

Mon Dec 2, 2013, 10:33 AM

22. nytimes: Enemies, Abroad and at Home

NY Times movie review of "JFK: A President Betrayed"

Movie Review

Enemies, Abroad and at Home

‘JFK: A President Betrayed’ Recounts Kennedy’s Opposition

The New York Times

November 21, 2013

Excellent documentary. Makes clear the extent to which Kennedy faced serious opposition from his own military and other high national security officials.

I agree with Theodore Sorensen that JFK kept us out of at least one nuclear war during his brief time in office.

One great clip in the film: Senator Kennedy, about 1954, after a trip to Vietnam, cogently arguing why we shouldn't attempt to make a military stand there, because the opposition was basically nationalists, even if they were left of enter. Aside from all the documentation that Kennedy had no intention of putting in the merican Army, or escalating beyond "advisors," its clear that the military was chafing at the bit to escalate--and they got their wish when JFK was assassinated and Johnson became president.


DSL
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=20815

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Original post)

Tue Nov 26, 2013, 03:02 PM

18. Wait, what?

 

I heard that a dim-witted commie spy, who was a lousy shot, got a cheap rifle and managed a feat of marksmanship that the nation's top riflemen couldn't match with high-performance rifles. that the commie spy was admitted back into the country without incident after defecting to the USSR and presumably spilling secrets. And that no 1963 right winger had anything whatsoever to do with the murder.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doctor_J (Reply #18)

Tue Nov 26, 2013, 03:06 PM

19. And it happened *exactly the way we were told it happened* by those in power!

 

In fact, it became a kind of template for subsequent "lone nuts," who also "coincidentally" killed those who were standing in the way of those also in power.

And those killings happened exactly the way were told, too!

What, you one of those fuzzy-heads who think that asking questions... has some kind of role in a democracy!!?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Original post)

Tue Nov 26, 2013, 06:38 PM

20. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, villager.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to villager (Original post)

Wed Nov 27, 2013, 03:02 AM

21. Operation Northwoods is all you need to know:

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread