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Fri Oct 25, 2019, 02:23 PM

A liberal case for Donald Trump: The lesser of two evils is not at all clear in 2016

Salon is one of my go to sites for reporting and editorials. This one has not aged well though...

A Trump presidency needn't be a nightmare for the left. On many issues, Clinton presidency might be

WALKER BRAGMAN

APRIL 29, 2016 2:00PM (UTC)

There are perhaps no three words more jarring to liberals than “President Donald Trump.” The GOP front-runner and presumptive nominee has undoubtedly made enemies with his nativist rhetoric and bellicose persona. That said, now that the race between Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton is effectively over, with the former secretary of state essentially guaranteed the nomination, many liberals and progressives are preparing, once again, to vote for the lesser of two evils. The choice may not be as clear as some Democrats believe -- especially if Democrats can take back the Senate and assure themselves of a check on a GOP House.

Once you've let that sink in, try this: There is a liberal case to be made for Donald Trump. The prospect of Trump defeating Clinton this November is not necessarily the apocalypse that some would lead you to believe. Here are some of the reasons why.

1.) He’ll Change the Conversation

Perhaps the best thing I can say about Trump is that he speaks his mind. This sometimes leads to some pretty outlandish things, but not always. As Shane Ryan of Paste magazine, pointed out in a recent article, Trump has spent much of his time lately, railing against free trade and NAFTA, as well as the gross inequality in our system. Trump often talks about raising taxes on “hedge fund guys,” and he has acknowledged that the primary process is skewed in favor of the establishment...

4.) I’m Not Afraid of Donald Trump

Some of you might be reading this and thinking to yourselves: “That’s all well and good, but Trump is dangerous.” I understand those feelings. Donald Trump’s messages on social policy have been mixed at best, and fascistic at worst. His approach to climate science is frightening considering the dire situation our planet is in. Trump is also the kind of man who would use the office of the president to aggrandize himself, and punish his detractors — well, attempt to do so, like in his many libel and slander suits. Over the last twenty years the powers of the president have expanded considerably as commander-in-chief, and that’s concerning, too. Additionally, there is the matter of the Supreme Court of United States.

But let’s step back for a moment, and address some important points:

Trump will not transform America’s oligarchy into a fascist dictatorship, nor is he the second coming of Hitler. Our political culture precludes such a shift within any one presidency...


https://www.salon.com/2016/04/29/a_liberal_case_for_donald_trump_the_lesser_of_two_evils_is_not_at_all_clear_in_2016/

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Reply A liberal case for Donald Trump: The lesser of two evils is not at all clear in 2016 (Original post)
LessAspin Oct 2019 OP
cos dem Oct 2019 #1
eppur_se_muova Oct 2019 #2
Aristus Oct 2019 #3
LiberalLovinLug Oct 2019 #4
LessAspin Oct 2019 #6
Blue_Tires Oct 2019 #7
Post removed Oct 2019 #10
emulatorloo Oct 2019 #11
muriel_volestrangler Oct 2019 #14
Blue_Tires Oct 2019 #15
GeorgeGist Oct 2019 #5
11cents Oct 2019 #8
Faux pas Oct 2019 #9
Karadeniz Oct 2019 #12
Nitram Oct 2019 #13
lagomorph777 Oct 2019 #16
George Paine Oct 2019 #17

Response to LessAspin (Original post)

Fri Oct 25, 2019, 02:28 PM

1. This is the kind of thinking that got dumbass elected.

Basic competency is a minimum qualification. If the candidate is incompetent, the fact that they occasionally utter words that sound good is meaningless.

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Response to LessAspin (Original post)

Fri Oct 25, 2019, 02:42 PM

2. Wine ages well. Cheese mostly ages well. Toxic waste does not. nt

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Response to LessAspin (Original post)

Fri Oct 25, 2019, 02:43 PM

3. 'Walter Bragman'? Is that a pen-name for Susan Sarandon?

One could fertilize Kansas with this horseshit...

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Response to LessAspin (Original post)

Fri Oct 25, 2019, 02:52 PM

4. Its a bit unfair to drag out old articles of that time

 

I think everyone was in shock. And many of us HAD to be a least a bit hopeful that ....well, the country's leadership didn't devolve into what it is today.

From Feinstein to Van Jones, and this Salon article. It was partly a projection of what they hoped to see happen. It was long before we found out just how unhinged and narcissistic he was. Even more than we had seen. It was all we could cling to at that time.

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #4)

Fri Oct 25, 2019, 03:05 PM

6. Good point...

I thought of that too. Hopefully, going forward, nobody takes for granted that these institutions are foolproof.

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #4)

Fri Oct 25, 2019, 03:16 PM

7. No fuckin' way... Bragman is not only a piece of Putinist shit

he's a key member in Glenn Greenwald's emoprog twitter mutual masturbation circle and it's not like three years of living under the Trump has made his ass smart all of a sudden.

Nevermind the fact that he's been wrong about literally everything he's penned since.

Some things I do not forgive, and I'd said at the time any supposed "liberal" who stood idly by (or in some cases actively helped) as Trump came to power was going to be dead to me. The stakes are too high... Not only should these Quislings be purged from the left, they should face reprisals -- But that is a discussion for another time...

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Response to Blue_Tires (Reply #7)

Fri Oct 25, 2019, 05:26 PM

11. Yeah and he's still at it on Twitter. Bragman has learned absolutely nothing and seems determined

to repeat his fucked up propaganda act he did in 2016.

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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #4)

Sat Oct 26, 2019, 02:13 PM

14. In what way were you in shock, in April 2016?

I don't think DU was. I don't think the USA was. I truly have no idea what you could be talking about. Anyone writing like the Salon article was an illiberal arsehole. We knew it then, and we know it now. He hates Hillary Clinton, and did all he could to stop her being elected. Look at this hit piece from Nov 2015: https://www.salon.com/2015/11/30/more_like_reagan_than_fdr_im_a_millennial_and_ill_never_vote_for_hillary_clinton/

It was obvious to anyone that Trump would be a disaster; we knew he loved killing people (look at his wish for the Central Park Five to be executed, even after their exoneration). There was no area in which he'd be better for anyone (apart from millionaires and despots) than Hillary.

It's not 'unfair' to drag it out; the question is just whether it's worth it. Since Bragman's still an apologist for Trump, despite claiming to be a Sanders supporter, I think it is, so that we're reminded what a piece of shit he is, and know to never trust him:


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Response to LiberalLovinLug (Reply #4)

Mon Oct 28, 2019, 10:21 AM

15. I'll just leave this here:

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Response to LessAspin (Original post)

Fri Oct 25, 2019, 03:03 PM

5. His LAST piece for Salon.

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Response to LessAspin (Original post)

Fri Oct 25, 2019, 03:18 PM

8. Ages and ages ago, Salon was excellent.

It sported real investigative journalism by the likes of Murray Waas.

It's long since devolved into an ugly click-farm with zero editorial judgement. In 2016 it not only featured this trust-fund dilettante Walker Bragman, but HA Goodman and Michael Tracey. Months and months of them -- and Goodman in particular was and is obviously mentally disturbed. Like others of their ilk, they've since emerged as white-nationalist-curious Trump supporters.

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Response to LessAspin (Original post)

Fri Oct 25, 2019, 04:14 PM

9. WTFF???

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Response to LessAspin (Original post)

Fri Oct 25, 2019, 07:01 PM

12. That didn't age well.

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Response to LessAspin (Original post)

Sat Oct 26, 2019, 01:07 PM

13. I don't buy your assumption that "Trump will not transform America's oligarchy into a fascist

dictatorship, nor is he the second coming of Hitler. Our political culture precludes such a shift within any one presidency..." Yes, our institutions have more depth than Trump realizes, and, yes, the system is fairly robust and resilient. But one need only look at the damage Trump has already done, the things he does and says with impunity, to realize how very dangerous he is. There are thousands of children who have been taken from their immigrant parents and may never be reunited. We've just ceded the Middle East to Russian and Iran. But for the loyalty of patriotic civil servants and Democratic Congress members, we would have to take seriously Trump's threats too stay on office for 20 years, to muzzle the press and imprison journalists, and deuce Congress to an impotent branch off government.

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Response to LessAspin (Original post)

Mon Oct 28, 2019, 11:55 AM

16. What is the point of this post? It was balderdash then and it's balderdash now.

Isn't it a violation of DU TOS to post RW talking points?

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Response to LessAspin (Original post)

Mon Oct 28, 2019, 02:50 PM

17. Wow! That was so wrong in so many ways.

That was so stunningly a bad assessment of Trump, it takes one's breath away.

Trump speaks his mind. Why was this supposed to be a good thing? Abusers, liars, con-men, bullies, sociopaths, narcissists, psychopaths, dictators and murderers all speak their minds.

It's the content of one's mind that counts. Garbage within, garbage out.

"A tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury..." is one way to speak your mind.

"This is a terrific investment. You'll make 10% per month, every month, forever!"

"I'm going to murder your children before your eyes. See how you like that!"

It's the content of the mind that is speaking, not the mere fact of speaking.

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