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Thu Jan 15, 2015, 07:53 PM

Ben Carson: Founding Fathers, ISIS Both 'Willing to Die For What They Believed In'

Source: NBC

CORONADO, Calif. -- Neurosurgeon Ben Carson on Thursday suggested that Americans can learn from the Islamic State's willingness to die for their cause, comparing ISIS to the Americans who waged the Revolutionary War against the British.

Carson, a conservative who's considering running for president, made the comments at the Republican National Committee's winter meeting.

"A bunch of rag tag militiamen defeated the most powerful and professional military force on the planet. Why? Because they believed in what they were doing. They were willing to die for what they believed in," Carson told a luncheon audience of national committee members. "Fast forward to today. What do we have? You've got ISIS. They've got the wrong philosophy, but they're willing to die for it while we are busily giving away every belief and every value for the sake of political correctness. We have to change that."

Carson then preemptively criticized the press, whom he said would seize on the comments.

Read more: http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/elections/ben-carson-founding-fathers-isis-both-willing-die-what-they-n287211

63 replies, 7483 views

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Reply Ben Carson: Founding Fathers, ISIS Both 'Willing to Die For What They Believed In' (Original post)
IDemo Jan 2015 OP
VanillaRhapsody Jan 2015 #1
randys1 Jan 2015 #2
VanillaRhapsody Jan 2015 #4
randys1 Jan 2015 #6
VanillaRhapsody Jan 2015 #34
daleo Jan 2015 #37
VanillaRhapsody Jan 2015 #41
daleo Jan 2015 #58
VanillaRhapsody Jan 2015 #62
Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #7
Adsos Letter Jan 2015 #33
shenmue Jan 2015 #5
Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #3
randys1 Jan 2015 #11
Cryptoad Jan 2015 #8
bravenak Jan 2015 #16
immoderate Jan 2015 #9
Cryptoad Jan 2015 #10
bravenak Jan 2015 #12
Fred Sanders Jan 2015 #13
bravenak Jan 2015 #15
jtuck004 Jan 2015 #14
KamaAina Jan 2015 #17
tblue37 Jan 2015 #28
KamaAina Jan 2015 #47
Turbineguy Jan 2015 #18
rtracey Jan 2015 #19
pocoloco Jan 2015 #30
rtracey Jan 2015 #53
VanillaRhapsody Jan 2015 #42
Botany Jan 2015 #20
Johnyawl Jan 2015 #22
Moonwalk Jan 2015 #29
VanillaRhapsody Jan 2015 #43
KamaAina Jan 2015 #48
ErikJ Jan 2015 #21
Miles Archer Jan 2015 #23
KeepItReal Jan 2015 #24
FiveGoodMen Jan 2015 #25
Ash_F Jan 2015 #63
Paladin Jan 2015 #26
tblue37 Jan 2015 #27
3catwoman3 Jan 2015 #46
Moonwalk Jan 2015 #31
Fearless Jan 2015 #32
Boomerproud Jan 2015 #35
El Shaman Jan 2015 #36
daleo Jan 2015 #38
MisterP Jan 2015 #40
daleo Jan 2015 #59
MisterP Jan 2015 #60
Iliyah Jan 2015 #39
riversedge Jan 2015 #49
workinclasszero Jan 2015 #44
onehandle Jan 2015 #45
Enrique Jan 2015 #50
Vinca Jan 2015 #51
RationalMan Jan 2015 #52
LibertyLover Jan 2015 #54
booley Jan 2015 #55
sammy750 Jan 2015 #56
red dog 1 Jan 2015 #57
workinclasszero Jan 2015 #61

Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 07:54 PM

1. So lets ask Ben Carson is HE willing to die for whatever it is HE believes in?

 

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Response to VanillaRhapsody (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 07:55 PM

2. This is coded language to the nut-jobs he speaks to

I do believe these teabaggers want war

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Response to randys1 (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 07:57 PM

4. I don't believe I KNOW they do....they believe that America was created by God....

 

to start the culture war that will kill off everyone except for about 100,000 Jews.....whereby Jesus will return and they will all convert or die too...

That is their prophesy....and they are all Fundamentalist Dominionists....

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Response to VanillaRhapsody (Reply #4)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 07:58 PM

6. BUt how does that work for the tens of millions of christians, do they die?

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Response to randys1 (Reply #6)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 09:42 PM

34. no they live in Peace for 1000 yrs ruled by Jesus!

 

that's their narrative...

and first they signal to each other Jesus is about to arrive by getting the Jews to rebuild the Temple on the Mount!

That's their other big malfunction with Muslims....the Muslims are preventing them from rebuilding that so they can bring Jesus back....apparently those 104,000 Jews first rebuild that....then they convert or die when Jesus arrives...

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Response to VanillaRhapsody (Reply #34)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 10:58 PM

37. What happens when the thousand years is up?

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Response to daleo (Reply #37)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 11:32 PM

41. Oh then Judgement day comes...

 

Last edited Fri Jan 16, 2015, 12:37 AM - Edit history (1)

and they get sorted out by God.....God reviews all their sins on a big screen TV...every nasty dirty thing they ever did in every closet and every bathroom....and they will have them all displayed to millions of people there...half of whom will be humiliated for them and the other half snickering and chuckling....and then God decides based on their sins whether or not they get to go to heaven or spend an eternity in the pits of hell....with Satan poking them with a burning pitchfork apparently.

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Response to VanillaRhapsody (Reply #41)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 11:00 PM

58. It sounds like 1000 years of paranoia

Then, worse. Why do people concoct such weird stories about a supposedly loving God? If you are going to fantasize about an invisible being, at least make it a pleasant fantasy. This sounds more like a nightmare.

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Response to daleo (Reply #58)

Sat Jan 17, 2015, 02:14 AM

62. they give this supposedly omnipotent old guy who lives in the clouds.....

 

base human emotion like anger and jealousy! Its totally hilarious....he can create the heavens and earth but cannot control his emotions!

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Response to VanillaRhapsody (Reply #4)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 07:58 PM

7. We must fight back with more than pens...something more is needed, but what, they control the media?

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Response to VanillaRhapsody (Reply #4)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 09:40 PM

33. SDA's, of whom Carson is one in good standing, are very, very conservative

...but they are not Fundamentalist Dominionists according to their eschatology. Quite the contrary, they believe that "Dominionism" (I put the term in quotes only because it did not exist in the mid-late-19th century when their eschatology was hammered out) will be part and parcel of persecution in the United States.

This is what really puzzles me about Carson's pandering to the Fundamentalist Dominionists, as you accurately described many Tea Partier's (or even the Religious Right in general).

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Response to randys1 (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 07:58 PM

5. Oh yeah.

They all want a new Civil War. It is not a coincidence that so many of them are from the Southeast.

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Response to VanillaRhapsody (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 07:56 PM

3. He is willing to send others in to die for him...how much further is the line crossed into sedition?

And who is he suggesting be killed in America...for their "beliefs"? Religious beliefs!

Carson is implying America should take it easy on fellow true believers, ISIS?

Carson would face arrest in France.

Code words...Republicans love the code word players. This is barely code any more when they are also meeting with armed eliminationist Sheriffs calling for the overthrow of the President.

He preemptively criticized the press...pre-mature projection?

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Response to Fred Sanders (Reply #3)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:02 PM

11. I can respect a guy who is in it for the money, in one way, at least that person

will not go all the way to war and death, because then money has no meaning.

We can deal with the Scott Walker's and Rick Scott's and so on, they are clearly just greedy thieves who are not benefited by war.

Now Rick Sanitarium, he may be a true believer who would like to kill all the infidels.



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Response to VanillaRhapsody (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 07:59 PM

8. Die for Money?

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Response to Cryptoad (Reply #8)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:08 PM

16. Snap!nt

 

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:00 PM

9. Ben Carson is a WACKO!*

 

*All you need to know.

--imm

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:01 PM

10. I hope he runs for Prez

he will be a great addition to the AssClown contest!

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:04 PM

12. Idiot Savant?

 

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Response to bravenak (Reply #12)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:05 PM

13. As PM Cameron said of a Fox News Islamaphobe, just plain "Idiot".

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Response to Fred Sanders (Reply #13)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:07 PM

15. But he is a DOCTOR dammit!nt

 

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:06 PM

14. Could you demonstrate that please? n/t

 

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:10 PM

17. Holy freakin' crap, Lois!

 



Did Dr. Dunce just compare ISIS to Washington, Jefferson, Franklin et al.?

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Response to KamaAina (Reply #17)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 09:20 PM

28. Well, in his defense, ISIS did print and distribute a pamphlet explaining

how to properly have sex with one's female slaves, so they do have at least something in common with Jefferson.

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #28)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 12:53 AM

47. Oh no you di'int!

 

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:16 PM

18. Ughhhh.... Let's see.....

Founding Fathers = ISIS

Obama = Hitler

OK, got it.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:23 PM

19. This statement

 

I believe this statement just lost him the primary and election. He is attempting to cater to the extreme right wing, but the extreme right loves the constitution, the founding fathers and hates muslims, and groups like ISIS. Carson, who I believe is somewhat a hypocrite, basically compare the founding fathers with ISIS, that along with plagiarizing works for his book, mixes badly for this loon.

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Response to rtracey (Reply #19)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 09:36 PM

30. Why wouldn't everyone love the Constitution?

 

You havn't been talking to * have you?

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Response to pocoloco (Reply #30)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 09:34 AM

53. missed the point

 

Everyone may love the constitution, but the the ultra conservative right wingers Carson is playing to, sleeps with a constitution blanket....(sarcasm)....and comparing the constitution creators to ISIS screwed him...

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Response to rtracey (Reply #19)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 11:38 PM

42. Carson the hypocrite who used every govt program in the book to get his Degrees...

 

but he wants to cut those programs for everyone else!

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:24 PM

20. Should we tell the Dr. about Baron von Steuben being gay?

Before von Steuben Washington never won a battle but afterward
he came over to help Washington never lost a battle.

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Response to Botany (Reply #20)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:29 PM

22. Someone should tell the Dr. about the French...


...Navy that blockaded Chesapeake Bay preventing the British from landing reinforcements at Yorktown, and about the French Army that helped Washington defeat the British army at that battle.

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Response to Botany (Reply #20)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 09:34 PM

29. Does he even know that there were "non-Americans" helping to fight the Revolutionary War? Like...

...Germans and Frenchmen?

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Response to Moonwalk (Reply #29)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 11:39 PM

43. Nope!

 

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Response to Botany (Reply #20)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 12:55 AM

48. Or Alan Turing?

 

Without whom we'd be reading this in Deutsch, on underground BBSes.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:27 PM

21. Stinkin hypocrite

 

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:29 PM

23. CAIN!

Wingnuts have been courting Carson as if he were Cain Mach II.

I'm guessing fewer of them will want him to run if they get wind of his take on "history."

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:30 PM

24. Carson just dissed the ENTIRE AMERICAN NATIONAL SECURITY ESTABLISHMENT

From the Military, to Intelligence Agencies, to even local law enforcement and public safety.

That f@cker is done. Finally.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 08:48 PM

25. Is that supposed to be the measure of who's right?

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Response to FiveGoodMen (Reply #25)

Sat Jan 17, 2015, 06:46 AM

63. I think Ben is trying to say that winning is more important than being right

This is his advice to his base.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 09:14 PM

26. Imagine what would happen if a prominent Democrat said the same thing.

Limbaugh and the Fox "News" bunch would be jumping through their own assholes for months, screaming about it. Just unbelievable that people actually trusted their brains to this guy......

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 09:17 PM

27. RWers love Putin for his toughness, too. nt

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #27)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 12:40 AM

46. This BS did remind me of Rudy Giuliani's...

...admiring comments about Putin.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 09:38 PM

31. I guess the comparison works if you consider that both had sex slaves....

...Ben there might want to remember that's he's probably a descendent of such.

I mean, that is what happens when you ignore political correctness. Just sayin'

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 09:39 PM

32. Founding Fathers didn't kill women and children to make a statement

They dumped tea in a harbor.

So similar!

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 10:00 PM

35. He doesn't know the difference between "willing to die for your beliefs" and "willing to kill those

who do not believe as you"? Then he says it's all a problem of "political correctness"? Get some therapy!!!!

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 10:19 PM

36. Put on your 'reg-tags' Benny

and go to it!! Pick a side , while you are at it.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 11:01 PM

38. And Reagan said the Taliban

We're the moral equivalent of the founding fathers.

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Response to daleo (Reply #38)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 11:10 PM

40. and the Contras--same death toll as ISIS, but without the legitimacy

ISIS can hold land and police it

but that's not fair: not all the mujahedeen were proto-Taliban

some were just plain opium-smugglers

he also praised Pol Pot until they couldn't blame all the deaths on the Vietnamese any more

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Response to MisterP (Reply #40)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 11:01 PM

59. Reagan was a deluded nut

I never could get what people saw in him.

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Response to daleo (Reply #59)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 11:22 PM

60. heck, it's probably only thanks to his astrologer that we're all still breathing, since she tricked

him into detente instead of letting the NORAD false alarms pile up until one of them was "acted on"--it's basically a reverse Rasputin

a hearty round to you, Joan!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joan_Quigley

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 11:08 PM

39. He may be a brillant surgeon

but he's an idiot when it comes to life.

I heard a white lady tell another lady that her child had a heritage day at his pre-school. She claimed that her family's history were American and the only thing he could be is a pilgrim, the lady asked her did her ancestors come from Europe, she said no, they have always lived in America, the lady noticed what she was looking at on her IPhone, it was fox news.

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Response to Iliyah (Reply #39)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 06:28 AM

49. oh come now. Nobody

is that stupid. umm... well maybe they are

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Thu Jan 15, 2015, 11:50 PM

44. Teabaggers equal ISIS

 

Because in their tiny minds they are somehow like the founding fathers

Thanks for the info you right wing loon!

Now the FBI and other federal and state anti-terror groups need to act accordingly.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 12:16 AM

45. Gun culture fights the same fight as ISIS.

Simplistic male fantasy masquerading as faith.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 06:36 AM

50. vote for Ben Carson to restore America

to its ISIS-like glory.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 08:43 AM

51. This guy is crazier than I thought . . . and that's saying something.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 08:47 AM

52. I wouldn't disagree with him on his facial statement......

The Founding Fathers did die because of their belief in and commitment to liberty and independence from Britain. ISIS is dying because of their belief in something - whether that really is Islam or just a power grab, tribal power, etc. is a bit unclear to me. I agree.

But Carson has a more subtle message and that is that American conservatives need to be prepared to die for their beliefs whether that is smaller government, right to deny a woman the right to choose, equality for LGBT persons, right to pollute and destroy the planet, right to give more and more to the wealthy and destroy the middle class and further decimate the poor, etc.

My challenge to Mr. Carson is you don't need to die for those POLITICAL objectives. We have a political system, a system that is increasingly in the control of conservatives.

He seems to be saying if you can't win at the ballot box and the Constitution restrains you from your objectives you should be prepared to have another civil war to achieve those ends.

That, in my mind, is treason.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 10:50 AM

54. I hope that Ben is a better retired neurosurgeon than historian

The American army during the Revolution didn't rack up wins against the British until they had been whipped into shape by von Steuben and given instruction in basic drill, musketry and tactics based on the European system of warfare. Moreover, it wasn't until the French and the Spanish decided to support the US against Britain after the victory at Saratoga, which the US won in large part because of von Steuben's training, that the US had a real hope in hell to prevail against the British army, navy and political system. By the end of the war, the US army was a credible fighting force in the European tradition, not a "bunch of rag tag militiamen".

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 01:03 PM

55. Ok fair enough

Lots of true heroes have been willing to die for a greater cause.

Except that doesn't' mean all beliefs are equally valid.

Are you fighting to make the world better for others or just for yourself?

A bunch of rag tag militiamen defeated the most powerful and professional military force on the planet. Why?


Because that professional army had to fight rebels on the rebels home territory from across an ocean?

Oh and help from the French.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 06:58 PM

56. His message backs up the believes of many conservatives and Republicans. I really think that many

Republicans in both House and Senate are actually acting like ISIL, but doing it through the bills they are passing. They are undermining the nation, states and people with all the bills that are suppose to help the nation and people. Right now both Congress and the Senate are even hiding add on bills to undermine what Obama has done.

And we know since 2010 and Boehner took over the Speakership. Nothing is getting done in congress. This is a plan or agenda of the GOP.

Every so often a conservative speaks out and gives us what they really are thinking.

The voters need to wise and think who they elect. because they are voting for those that will defeat them in many ways.

The GOP is holding a meeting right now, and they are meeting with lobbyist setting the stage for more destruction bills. And now the Koch brothers have issue a warning to the GOP, they had better get on track with the Koch agenda or else.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 08:44 PM

57. "Ben Carson Shilled For Notorious Company That Promoted Quack Aids, Cancer Cures"

http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/ben-carson-shilled-notorious-company-promoted-quack-aids-cancer-cures

Or Google: "Ben Carson Shilled For Notorious Company That Promoted Quack Aids, Cancer Cures"


"Fast forward to today. What do we have?"
.Republican shill who wants to be POTUS

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Response to red dog 1 (Reply #57)

Fri Jan 16, 2015, 11:32 PM

61. Republican shill who wants to be POTUS

 

Or sell more copies of his latest BS book.

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