Exclusive: Japan nuclear body says radioactive water at Fukushima an 'emergency'
Source: Reuters
Highly radioactive water seeping into the ocean from Japan's crippled Fukushima nuclear plant is creating an "emergency" that the operator is struggling to contain, an official from the country's nuclear watchdog said on Monday.
This contaminated groundwater has breached an underground barrier, is rising toward the surface and is exceeding legal limits of radioactive discharge, Shinji Kinjo, head of a Nuclear Regulatory Authority (NRA) task force, told Reuters.
Countermeasures planned by Tokyo Electric Power Co are only a temporary solution, he said.
Tepco's "sense of crisis is weak," Kinjo said. "This is why you can't just leave it up to Tepco alone" to grapple with the ongoing disaster.
<snip>
Read more: http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/05/us-japan-fukushima-panel-idUSBRE97408V20130805
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Harmony Blue
(3,978 posts)uninhabitable we were accused of being tin foil hat wearers. Reality is that this is the direction this disaster is moving and most of the governments of the world are trying to play it off as nothing has happened. 
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)heaven05
(18,124 posts)haven't suggested a damn thing. Mostly silent on what's going on. We know very little about this situation and the length of time this incident has been poisoning our world, irreparably
geez
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)And the world is never poisoned irreparably. Just for human consumption, is all. On a long enough timeline, without humans in the picture, the earth is fine and dandy. Even from long lived isotopes. No worries. The earth is fine.
*we're fucked*
closeupready
(29,503 posts)
lark
(24,689 posts)Don't think so, but I'm not a nuclear scientist so not 100% sure. Don't think radioactive poisoning is something we can fix. That's why nuclear power should be shut down all over the world, IMMEDIATELY.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)along with focusing on things like family planning and energy conservation, then we can isolate problems like Fukushima.
If, on other hand, we simply walk away from Fukushima, then we KNOW the problems will get worse.
Kind of like how Elizabeth Warren responded to that news reader who asked her how she could be sponsoring legislation which, the news reader claimed, her colleagues indicated had little chance of passage. "Well we do know one thing for certain," Warren responded, "we know its chances of passing are ZERO if we do nothing."
lark
(24,689 posts)Nuclear power needs to be stopped entirely! All government guarantees need to be stopped this second. If the companies knew they would be held responsible for the damage their products caused, every one would be shut down in days - the risk is just too high. Of course when the consumer takes all the risk, we get Fukushima's.
former9thward
(33,424 posts)And what exactly would replace it immediately? Not in five years or ten years but immediately?
FBaggins
(28,049 posts)It implies that the ocean water isn't "safe" because of the radioactivity - which isn't the case. Despite all the attention paid to the situation, most people still don't understand that the ocean was already radioactive and mandkind's activities don't make much of a difference. The radioactivity of the Pacific hasn't changed by even a single percentage point.
As for getting radioactivity out of water... yes, of course humans can do that (with the exception of tritium). There's just no point.
NickB79
(19,813 posts)The belief that humans are all-powerful, almost Godlike in their ability to control the world around them, is what's pushed us to the point of near-ecological collapse.
As it stands, we are looking at a carbon bomb brewing in the Arctic as the ice and soil thaw. Methane is already being released at incredible rates in many areas, and methane is 20X more powerful a greenhouse gas as CO2. Even if we stopped burning ALL fossil fuels today (and that means no more oil, no more nat. gas, no more coal), we've already locked in several degrees of warming to the planet's atmosphere just based upon our CO2 levels. Throw in the addition of Arctic methane, and you see a few MORE degrees on top of that due to a positive feedback cycle that's impossible to break without massive geoengineering methods that would likely cause OTHER ecological disasters of their own.
Saying we can fix any problems we create is like saying we can hit the brakes on a speeding car and slow down any time we like, AFTER WE'VE DRIVEN OFF A CLIFF. Stomp those brakes all you like, it won't change the trajectory you've put yourself on....
closeupready
(29,503 posts)
NickB79
(19,813 posts)
While you roll your eyes and bury your head in the sand at the damage we've done, I get to lie awake at night worrying about the world my 3-yr old little girl will get to inherit from me and my generation.
Must be nice to not give a fuck.
Response to NickB79 (Reply #43)
closeupready This message was self-deleted by its author.
chervilant
(8,267 posts)anti-nukes for the past 40 years! THIS person (and the vast majority of humans on this planet) has no idea how to "fix" toxic radioactive waste!
Your glib response is offensive, and absurd.
closeupready
(29,503 posts)Ignoring.
Safetykitten
(5,162 posts)closeupready
(29,503 posts)with your hair on fire.
I guess if you enjoy being depressed, I'm today's pinata. So fine with me, enjoy yourselves, all.
Lucky Luciano
(11,593 posts)heaven05
(18,124 posts)we can agree on "we're fucked".
okieinpain
(9,397 posts)fuck up the earth and not just for mankind.
Android3.14
(5,402 posts)The evidence is rather compelling that it is more than an accusation. I remember when folks were buying bottled water in California because of similar utterances from those who wear aluminum chapeaus.
The Stranger
(11,297 posts)situation which continues to be fraudulently downplayed is nothing less than denial on an extraordinary level.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)'denying' it.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)Safetykitten
(5,162 posts)okieinpain
(9,397 posts)one of the messed up countries in africa, that way africa could finally get some respect from the rest of the countries.
MindMover
(5,016 posts)bulldoze entire complex, cement everything over with thousands of tons of concrete much like Chernobyl ....
and they better get the best nuclear scientists in the world involved NOW ....
Flaxbee
(13,661 posts)quickly.
Japan and TEPCO have been sitting and spinning; there is so much contamination spread about now, probably into the water table and is now contaminating Japan's fresh water for --- ever, so far as habitation goes. I do believe that if they're talking about this, there is much they are not talking about.
A family member was part of Chernobyl remediation. Japan is in very, very, very, very bad shape.
The Stranger
(11,297 posts)and Fukushima is quite literally on the largest ocean in the world.
localroger
(3,747 posts)The only reason that worked at Chernobyl is that it is not at sea level with a high water table. One of the biggest challenges (and one on which they got lucky in the end) was preventing the core from melting through the basement of the building. They had to tunnel under and plant a thick layer of boron-laced concrete in the hope of stopping this, and had they were not sure even that would work. Also the large size of the exclusion zone necessary due to airborne contamination gave some hope that if the core did reach groundwater the problem would still remain within the zone.
Fukushima is at sea level; you can't tunnel under it and the ocean is right there to carry the pollution far and wide. Although the ocean is huge some of the worst contaminants are biologically concentrated which could lead to serious problems for the food supply in that part of the world.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)Fukushima was operating, which means it was hot, but it wasn't as hot as Chernobyl by a mile.
Before everything exploded, the last reading of the indicated thermal output of Chernobyl's core was 33gwe thermal, on a 1.5gwe max rated reactor.
Fukishima on the other hand, while it had 3 operating cores, only went from normal operating heat, to 'whoops you don't have any coolant', partial scram, etc.
No runaway, prompt critical excursion type failure. Lot less heat to deal with. Bad that the cores are leaking, but fortunately it doesn't look like the cores themselves will ever manage to bore their way through to the water table.
Flaxbee
(13,661 posts)and I would be very surprised if the cores had not gone through the containments.
I think you have to take everything that is being said by Tepco with a grain of salt, a giant grain of salt. I don't think we know the half of what has happened...
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)Like, bigtime, we'd know.
It's just decay heat now. Not hard to deal with.
The biggest problem is that the containments are no longer water tight, so corium sediment is getting out, water is getting out, carrying all sorts of material. But no, the mass of corium is still inside the containment, and there is no credible evidence otherwise.
Flaxbee
(13,661 posts)(NaturalNews) The battle to save the Fukushima nuclear power plant now appears lost as the radioactive core from Reactor No. 2 has melted through the containment vessel and dropped into the concrete basement of the reactor structure. This is "raising fears of a major release of radiation at the site," reports The Guardian, which broke the story (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/29/japan-lost-race-save-nucl...). A former General Electric nuclear expert told The Guardian that Japan appears to have "lost the race" to save the reactor.
Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/031894_Fukushima_meltdown.html#ixzz2b9vh3CIe
That was two years ago - you really don't think it's gone beyond the concrete basement?
I think perhaps you're buying into the "don't worry, nuclear power is safe" arguments, when that is the farthest thing from the truth.
What would be the credible evidence of which you speak? Tepco telling us?
What about this?
It's Official: "Nuclear Fuel Has Melted Through Base Of Fukushima Plant" ... "Far Worse than a Core Meltdown"
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/its-official-nuclear-fuel-has-melted-through-base-fukushima-plant-far-worse-core-meltdown-0
These reports were from over two years ago. Do you think things have gotten better? Do you think Tepco and the government of Japan have made any progress in the last 24+ months?
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)"
NaturalNews) The battle to save the Fukushima nuclear power plant now appears lost as the radioactive core from Reactor No. 2 has melted through the containment vessel and dropped into the concrete basement of the reactor structure."
What the hyperventilating idiot that wrote this MEANT was, the core of Reactor 2 has melted through the REACTOR PRESSURE VESSEL, not the containment. The RPV isn't the containment. The catchment floor it is talking about is actually part of the containment of a GE Mark I BWR reactor.
Anyone who can't tell the difference between the RPV and the Containment is not qualified to speak on these matters.
The RPV is the yellow bit. Guess what the orange steel and grey concrete are?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/22/Reaktor.svg
The catchment on the floor of the containment is geometrically designed to separate the fuel so criticality is over, and there are criticality poisons sitting there, waiting for corium to land on it. It is no longer critical (2 years now, be serious) therefore it is simply decay heat.
As you can see, Zerohedge at least correctly copied and pasted the Telegraph article:
"The nuclear fuel in three of the reactors at the Fukushima Dai-Ichi nuclear plant has melted through the base of the pressure vessels and is pooling in the outer containment vessels, according to a report by the Japanese government."
And then it completely botches the shit out of the headline.
"It's Official: "Nuclear Fuel Has Melted Through Base Of Fukushima Plant" ... "Far Worse than a Core Meltdown""
The bottom of the RPV is not the bottom of the plant. And a core meltdown can't actually BE worse than a core meltdown. That's just ridiculous. This was written by an 8 year old.
Safetykitten
(5,162 posts)AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)NaturalNews CLEARLY munged the message. Their OWN QUOTE doesn't say what the lead says.
Its right there in front of your face.
Sometimes the messenger is an idiot/cannot faithfully relay the message.
There are independent monitoring groups that could tell us if the cores had bored through, because the contamination releases would still be airborne, and would be of a particular makeup. They are not. They haven't been since 2011.
The cores are still inside, and not going anywhere.
Harmony Blue
(3,978 posts)but their failure to act swiftly has ensured that Japan will soon become a wasteland. The problem is we can't quantify exactly how bad this is until this is 'contained". And if it isn't contained, then this catastrophe is being severely underscored. Most of the Japanese citizens are in grave danger over the long haul.
eggplant
(4,039 posts)AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)A problem with the water issue is, every time it RAINS right now, the buildings get water in that then flows out.
There's a fucking backhoe sitting on top of reactor 2 right now. Construction and debris removal is ongoing.
bananas
(27,509 posts)BBC: Flow of radioactive water into Pacific could ‘accelerate rapidly’ now that barrier is breached at Fukushima plant — Tepco clearly in ‘deep trouble’
Published: August 5th, 2013 at 5:14 pm ET
By ENENews
Email Article Email Article
4 comments
BBC News, August 5, 2013: [...] A barrier built to contain the water has already been breached, the Nuclear Regulatory Authority warned. This means the amount of contaminated water seeping into the Pacific Ocean could accelerate rapidly, it said. ... It has been clear for months now that the operators of the Fukushima plant are in deep trouble, says the BBC’s Rupert Wingfield-Hayes. [...]
Radio New Zealand, August 5, 2013: [...] The Nuclear Regulatory Authority said on Monday that a barrier built to contain the water has already been breached. It said this means the amount of contaminated water seeping into the Pacific Ocean could accelerate rapidly. [...]
See also: Reuters Exclusive: Barrier is breached at Fukushima says official -- 'Highly radioactive' water entering ocean -- Will flow 'extremely fast' if it reaches surface -- Tepco sorry for trouble
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)That's kinda cold.
When people sign up for national defense, they aren't signing up to expose themselves to some shitbag corporation's toxic waste.
Soldiers are not simply soulless, disposable automatons.
MindMover
(5,016 posts)"Tenno Heika Banzai!"
oldbanjo
(690 posts)highest radioactive areas.
MindMover
(5,016 posts)ya think????
geez
malthaussen
(18,027 posts)... err, except where it's glowing. Or burning, like it does next to the fracking grounds.
-- Mal
Hubert Flottz
(37,726 posts)"Legal limits, which the limiters kind of make up as the game goes on. In poker you might get shot for that!"
And in other News *****
"A large Monster is approaching the city."
A nuclear power plant built right on the seashore that massive waves have repeatedly devastated, since millions of years ago?
A nuclear power plant built in an area where there is volcanic and seismic activity historically?
Sounds like Tokyo Electric Power Co needs to hire some sharp third graders for their "Team of Experts." You know, the same "Experts" that dreamed up this global disaster still unfolding and probably will still be unfolding after the half life of plutonium.
Hubert Flottz
(37,726 posts)simply means, the time it takes for plutonium to decay to a point where it gives you cancer in just one lung, instead of both.
Even little Johnny on the front row could have told the "Experts," that when you play around with fire, the odds are that you or someone else, are going the get burned.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)(And you know why I posted such)
bananas
(27,509 posts)BBC: Flow of radioactive water into Pacific could ‘accelerate rapidly’ now that barrier is breached at Fukushima plant — Tepco clearly in ‘deep trouble’
Published: August 5th, 2013 at 5:14 pm ET
By ENENews
Email Article Email Article
4 comments
BBC News, August 5, 2013: [...] A barrier built to contain the water has already been breached, the Nuclear Regulatory Authority warned. This means the amount of contaminated water seeping into the Pacific Ocean could accelerate rapidly, it said. ... It has been clear for months now that the operators of the Fukushima plant are in deep trouble, says the BBC’s Rupert Wingfield-Hayes. [...]
Radio New Zealand, August 5, 2013: [...] The Nuclear Regulatory Authority said on Monday that a barrier built to contain the water has already been breached. It said this means the amount of contaminated water seeping into the Pacific Ocean could accelerate rapidly. [...]
See also: Reuters Exclusive: Barrier is breached at Fukushima says official -- 'Highly radioactive' water entering ocean -- Will flow 'extremely fast' if it reaches surface -- Tepco sorry for trouble
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)Some of us warned of this
PearliePoo2
(7,768 posts)
Right when it happened, you were on it. I remember!
No more of a problem than flying at altitude or eating bananas they said.
Bull-fucking-shit.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)How much is 'accelerate rapidly'? From what level to what new higher level?
Obviously not good, obviously exceeds the legal limits, but how much are we talking here?
Safetykitten
(5,162 posts)nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)
chervilant
(8,267 posts)So, we're supposed to believe TEPCO and Japan (and whoever else) can undertake meaningful measures to mitigate the crisis at Fukushima!?!?
So, where's my pony with rainbows shooting out its butt?
Safetykitten
(5,162 posts)Safetykitten
(5,162 posts)okieinpain
(9,397 posts)abortions we can stop, because that is far more important then doing something about contaminating the ocean.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)Three in GD. I usually do not note this...but the experts...that told us none of what has transpired would ever happen...hug your reactors, they are safe and cuddly after all, have not shown their typing fingers. It is very curious in my mind, very.
Just an observation on this curious development. Given a reactor was recently cancelled and the renaissance seems to be on...cold start up best case, and San Onofre...perhaps the industry has given up...for the moment And industry does pay some shills...
Octafish
(55,745 posts)
truthisalie
(4 posts)keep in mind I said MIGHT.